North Korea Sentences 2 US Journalists

Byrnzie

prfctlefts wrote:

that was real dirty for you to do that I'll make sure to report that one to the mods for you ok.

Yep, the truth hurts.

And don't pretend to be offended by these photos. Everyone's seen them already. They've been posted all over the U.S mainstream media. If someone was to show photo's of Americans being mistreated you'd all scream bloody murder, but when photo's of Iraqi's being mistreated by Americans are shown you dismiss it as a dirty tactic....which is exactly the point of this discussion.

Like I said, America has lost it's moral high ground due to it's behaviour these past 6 years.

You reap what you sow.

Edit: Though it actually goes back a lot longer than 6 years.

flywallyfly

prfctlefts wrote:

that was real dirty for you to do that I'll make sure to report that one to the mods for you ok.

Do you seriously not see the irony of the situation after the way we've behaved with Gitmo? Just think about it. Hell, they even gave the two women a trial already (a idiotic show trial but a trial nonetheless) while we stuck people in a foreign country with no charges whatsoever. That is why our government is trying to work this out behind the scenes because we have no way of demanding their release without being laughed at publicly.

NoK

From an outsiders perspective it looks like she was trying to follow in her sisters footsteps and publish a piece about NK and has nothing to do with espionage. Now the question here is why would you come close to NK if one of your family members have published a piece bad-mouthing their government?

There have been documented cases of execution of dissidents and cases of PARTY LEADERS being sentenced to 10-15 years of hard labour because of exactly this. Even those SUSPECTED of it are sentenced. The sentence they got is actually a common sentence for those who speak ill of the NK government. Its usually 10 years of hard labour in a camp so it has nothing to do with them being Americans but its all to do with her sister publishing a piece about the government

For all those interested in the subject you should read "The Aquariums of Pyongyang". I've mentioned this book before on the website, its a worthwhile read and its not too long.

WaveCameCrashin

flywallyfly wrote:

prfctlefts wrote:

that was real dirty for you to do that I'll make sure to report that one to the mods for you ok.

Do you seriously not see the irony of the situation after the way we've behaved with Gitmo? Just think about it. Hell, they even gave the two women a trial already (a idiotic show trial but a trial nonetheless) while we stuck people in a foreign country with no charges whatsoever. That is why our government is trying to work this out behind the scenes because we have no way of demanding their release without being laughed at publicly.

Are you serious??? what the hell does N.k. have to do with gitmo? do you not realize how ridiculous you sound ? Are there any North Koreans in gitmo ? I didnt think so !!!! WTF man??? you guys are delirious.. These girls are Journalists they don't work for the U.S. Govt. If they did then you might have a leg to stand on . Jesus man you guys got some serious screws loose.

g under p

prfctlefts wrote:

flywallyfly wrote:

prfctlefts wrote:

that was real dirty for you to do that I'll make sure to report that one to the mods for you ok.

Do you seriously not see the irony of the situation after the way we've behaved with Gitmo? Just think about it. Hell, they even gave the two women a trial already (a idiotic show trial but a trial nonetheless) while we stuck people in a foreign country with no charges whatsoever. That is why our government is trying to work this out behind the scenes because we have no way of demanding their release without being laughed at publicly.

Are you serious??? what the hell does N.k. have to do with gitmo? do you not realize how ridiculous you sound ? Are there any North Koreans in gitmo ? I didnt think so !!!! WTF man??? you guys are delirious.. These girls are Journalists they don't work for the U.S. Govt. If they did then you might have a leg to stand on . Jesus man you guys got some serious screws loose.

Well we did imprison several people there who turned out to be innocent just like these reporters whom I believe are innocent too.

Peace

flywallyfly

prfctlefts wrote:

flywallyfly wrote:

prfctlefts wrote:

that was real dirty for you to do that I'll make sure to report that one to the mods for you ok.

Do you seriously not see the irony of the situation after the way we've behaved with Gitmo? Just think about it. Hell, they even gave the two women a trial already (a idiotic show trial but a trial nonetheless) while we stuck people in a foreign country with no charges whatsoever. That is why our government is trying to work this out behind the scenes because we have no way of demanding their release without being laughed at publicly.

Are you serious??? what the hell does N.k. have to do with gitmo? do you not realize how ridiculous you sound ? Are there any North Koreans in gitmo ? I didnt think so !!!! WTF man??? you guys are delirious.. These girls are Journalists they don't work for the U.S. Govt. If they did then you might have a leg to stand on . Jesus man you guys got some serious screws loose.

You are right, what was I thinking. How we treat the citizens of other nations has no bearing on the way other nations will treat our citizens.

I like ur argument immensely -- "We dont have any North Koreans in Gitmo so release our citizens !!!!".

Byrnzie

flywallyfly wrote:

You are right, what was I thinking. How we treat the citizens of other nations has no bearing on the way other nations will treat our citizens.

I like ur argument immensely -- "We dont have any North Koreans in Gitmo so release our citizens !!!!".

Don't you know that it's impossible for Americans to apply to themselves the same standards that they apply to others?
It's o.k for the U.S to torture and execute foreign nationals on U.S soil without due legal process and outside of the limits set down by the Geneva Convention, but if others do it to U.S nationals them it's barbaric and obscene.

WaveCameCrashin

whatever you say it sounds to me like you want these women to be in jail ,I really don't understand your logic behind this. Like I said I think you got some serious issues you need to deal with. What about all the american citizens that have been wrongly accused and sentenced and in some cases put to death. I don't hear you crying out for them.

Underground Ear

Just curious but has anyone taken the time to look into the subject and stories that Laura Ling has done in the past? This was Euna Lees first assignment in the field but she worked at Current previous to this project.

If journalists didn't take risks there would be so much information for decades that we wouldn't have. Laura Ling has always done stories that bring attention to an areas suffering. It's only through knowledge that we can proceed intelligently towards our next endeavor.

Here's one where I half expected her to get shot- but NO ONE has given an account like this of the drug wars in Mexico. This is one of her more recent stories but she has many.. I don't know many people that would brave the efforts she's gone to, just to deliver the truth about situations.

Long video but I've seen it a few times on Current:
http://current.com/items/89845362_narco-war-next-door.htm

Her link at Current http://current.com/users/lauraling.htm

WaveCameCrashin

please byrnzie Im not even gonna waste my energy on you. your not worth it because you only see what you want to see and hear what you want to hear. You want to Blame america for everything why dont you go take a look at that shit hole you live in. Hell you can barely even breath when you walk outside in china. why dont you go clean up your own back yard before you tell us how to clean ours.

WaveCameCrashin

Astra wrote:

Just curious but has anyone taken the time to look into the subject and stories that Laura Ling has done in the past? This was Euna Lees first assignment in the field but she worked at Current previous to this project.

If journalists didn't take risks there would be so much information for decades that we wouldn't have. Laura Ling has always done stories that bring attention to an areas suffering. It's only through knowledge that we can proceed intelligently towards our next endeavor.

Here's one where I half expected her to get shot- but NO ONE has given an account like this of the drug wars in Mexico. This is one of her more recent stories but she has many.. I don't know many people that would brave the efforts she's gone to, just to deliver the truth about situations.

Long video but I've seen it a few times on Current:
http://current.com/items/89845362_narco-war-next-door.htm

Her link at Current http://current.com/users/lauraling.htm

what about the story she did on MS-13 ? that took alot of guts to go in those prisons down in mexico and central america.

flywallyfly

prfctlefts wrote:

whatever you say it sounds to me like you want these women to be in jail ,I really don't understand your logic behind this. Like I said I think you got some serious issues you need to deal with. What about all the american citizens that have been wrongly accused and sentenced and in some cases put to death. I don't hear you crying out for them.

Yes, i have serious issues because I can compare two situations to see action/reaction. I never came close to saying i want these women in jail. All i said was that the U.S. has lost any moral ground on demanding their release after what we have done to other people of nations around the world but you just dont want to admit that we fucked up big time with our "detainee" policy.

This thread was about these two women but if you want to start one about "all the american citizens that have been wrongly accused and sentenced and in some cases put to death" then i will definitely "cry out for them". Seems rather sad that it appears only wronged Americans affect you.

flywallyfly

Byrnzie wrote:

flywallyfly wrote:

You are right, what was I thinking. How we treat the citizens of other nations has no bearing on the way other nations will treat our citizens.

I like ur argument immensely -- "We dont have any North Koreans in Gitmo so release our citizens !!!!".

Don't you know that it's impossible for Americans to apply to themselves the same standards that they apply to others?
It's o.k for the U.S to torture and execute foreign nationals on U.S soil without due legal process and outside of the limits set down by the Geneva Convention, but if others do it to U.S nationals them it's barbaric and obscene.

I know, sometimes I let reasoning and common sense take over my brain.

WaveCameCrashin

Do you not realize we are fighting a war on terrorism. There are mistakes made in every war that has ever been fought. These two have nothing to do with what you are referring to. and either does north Korea for that matter. If you didnt want these two to be imprisoned you would say so. but you haven't .

WaveCameCrashin

flywallyfly wrote:

Byrnzie wrote:

flywallyfly wrote:

You are right, what was I thinking. How we treat the citizens of other nations has no bearing on the way other nations will treat our citizens.

I like ur argument immensely -- "We dont have any North Koreans in Gitmo so release our citizens !!!!".

Don't you know that it's impossible for Americans to apply to themselves the same standards that they apply to others?
It's o.k for the U.S to torture and execute foreign nationals on U.S soil without due legal process and outside of the limits set down by the Geneva Convention, but if others do it to U.S nationals them it's barbaric and obscene.

I know, sometimes I let reasoning and common sense take over my brain.

Well It's pretty fuckin simple either you want them released or you dont and I think you dont.

Commy

prfctlefts wrote:

Do you not realize we are fighting a war on terrorism. There are mistakes made in every war that has ever been fought. These two have nothing to do with what you are referring to. and either does north Korea for that matter. If you didnt want these two to be imprisoned you would say so. but you haven't .

how many times does a village have to be completely wiped out "on accident" or "as collateral" before you realize the village was the target all along.


the "mistakes" don't seem like such an accident when they continue to repeat them.

flywallyfly

prfctlefts wrote:

Do you not realize we are fighting a war on terrorism. There are mistakes made in every war that has ever been fought. These two have nothing to do with what you are referring to. and either does north Korea for that matter. If you didnt want these two to be imprisoned you would say so. but you haven't .

I do not want or believe these two should be imprisoned.

The truth of my previous statements remains -- because of the recent policies of our country we no longer can stand on a soapbox and demand treatment for our citizens that we dont give citizens of other nations. It's a pretty simple concept.

flywallyfly

prfctlefts wrote:

Well It's pretty fuckin simple either you want them released or you dont and I think you dont.

No, that's pretty fuckin simpleton.

WaveCameCrashin

well guess what? those policies aren't in play any more since Obama took office, Gitmo is going to be closed with no plans on where the hell they are going to put these people, and now we are going to have miranda rights read to the terrorist on the battlefields. And it's going to be our tax dollars defending these scumbags, people that want us all dead . I hope you're happy

flywallyfly

prfctlefts wrote:

well guess what? those policies aren't in play any more since Obama took office, Gitmo is going to be closed with no plans on where the hell they are going to put these people, and now we are going to have miranda rights read to the terrorist on the battlefields. And it's going to be our tax dollars defending these scumbags, people that want us all dead . I hope you're happy

I'm terribly sad that people will have access to legal rights to determine if they are innocent or guilty. Just downright sad. What has this nation become??!!