---President Elect Musk and Convicted Felon Donald J Trump---

BF25394 · October 2024

Lerxst1992 said:

mrussel1 said:

Get_Right said:

mrussel1 said:

Get_Right said:

Go Beavers said:

Get_Right said:

I do not endorse or know very much about this site, but it is clear to me that shenanigans are happening in every state and in both parties. Even if only half of it is true.

https://www.heritage.org/voterfraud/#choose-a-state

Criminal convictions and judicial findings of fact on both sides, and in almost every state. The system is broken.

And yet I get criticized for being disenfranchised with the entire process. Politics is the dirtiest of businesses in the US. Maybe used car sales is first. It has become a battle of slinging dirt and special interests on both sides. I do not hate the players, I hate the game. I will vote, but I don't really feel it will make a difference one way or the other. And that is sad.

The Heritage Foundation’s goal is to make you feel disenfranchised and apathetic.

And the Washington Post and other liberal media's goal is to make me feel like I should hate Trump as a Nazi dictator. Who should I beleive?

Are you being serious? You are incapable of listening to his words, understanding history and drawing your own conclusions?

Serious about not believing everything the media or a candidate says. It is just another sales pitch to get the job. Frankly the comparisons to Nazi Germany make me sick.

The question isn't whether you believe we are down a Nazi path. Hyperbole runs rampant in an election. The question is whether he is a threat to it institutions and allies. Or is Harris. In that, you should be able to draw your own conclusions simply by listening both of them speak and listening to their surrogates

Direct information is actually available to you.

There is simply no way to reach the other side on this. When 45 says he will be a dictator on day 1, his defense is he was joking and the believers believe

He gets the votes from the traditional gop voters and a new breed of macho tough guys who never used to vote.

Which is why he is tough to beat, when also considering the gop electoral college advantage

The forum hasn't been discussing the polling as much as previous election. Have you been following the cross tabs? This seems to be trumps best polling in his 3 elections?

It is puzzling that he could be polling better after all the shit he's pulled. It's amazing the level of amnesia among the electorate and how people forget how terrible things were four years ago. They seem to forget that Trump was president when the pandemic hit, and that his failures of leadership made the situation much worse. Having said that, the bar is low as Trump did not even get 47 percent of the vote in either of his two prior presidential elections. He won the first one because he drew an inside straight in the electoral college against perhaps the only opponent who was nearly as unpopular as he was. The candidates he endorsed did terribly in 2018 and 2022 and, of course, Trump lost in 2020. He has a high floor that keeps him competitive, but he also has a low ceiling because he's an objectively terrible candidate who doesn't do anything to try to appeal to more voters beyond his base and similarly disaffected, underinformed people who don't always vote. In a two-party system in a closely divided country, even a terrible candidate stands a really good chance of winning.

Halifax2TheMax · October 2024

2023

Get_Right said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

Get_Right said:

Merkin Baller said:

Get_Right said:

I do not endorse or know very much about this site, but it is clear to me that shenanigans are happening in every state and in both parties. Even if only half of it is true.

https://www.heritage.org/voterfraud/#choose-a-state

Criminal convictions and judicial findings of fact on both sides, and in almost every state. The system is broken.

And yet I get criticized for being disenfranchised with the entire process. Politics is the dirtiest of businesses in the US. Maybe used car sales is first. It has become a battle of slinging dirt and special interests on both sides. I do not hate the players, I hate the game. I will vote, but I don't really feel it will make a difference one way or the other. And that is sad.

You might want to vet your sources before you go off.

Just a thought.

I take it all in from both sides. And my conclusion is that it is all hyperbole designed to push one agenda over another. It is the same discussion over and over, the red raises tariffs and wants tougher immigration enforcement, while the blue touts a stronger economy and wants to restore women's rights.

In what way does a percentage higher or lower taxes or whatever matter for the upcoming four years VS voting in a normal human being with normal competent human beings around her and Trump and his gang of PARDON MY FRENCH racist and women-hating freaks ?

For better or worse, I am stuck in the middle. Neither candidate will change my taxes in a significant way. And tariffs will not impact my cost of living unless there is a tariff on fuel. Yes there are strong character issues with Trump, but is Kamala demonstrating any strong characteristics that are inspiring? Nothing is moving me in either direction, it may come down to the lesser of two evils, which sucks.

And there it is, rolling out the “lesser of two evils” excuse. I thought you were Indy and have 5 or so alternatives that aren’t “evil?” Like this guy?

mrussel1 · October 2024

Lerxst1992 said:

mrussel1 said:

Get_Right said:

mrussel1 said:

Get_Right said:

Go Beavers said:

Get_Right said:

I do not endorse or know very much about this site, but it is clear to me that shenanigans are happening in every state and in both parties. Even if only half of it is true.

https://www.heritage.org/voterfraud/#choose-a-state

Criminal convictions and judicial findings of fact on both sides, and in almost every state. The system is broken.

And yet I get criticized for being disenfranchised with the entire process. Politics is the dirtiest of businesses in the US. Maybe used car sales is first. It has become a battle of slinging dirt and special interests on both sides. I do not hate the players, I hate the game. I will vote, but I don't really feel it will make a difference one way or the other. And that is sad.

The Heritage Foundation’s goal is to make you feel disenfranchised and apathetic.

And the Washington Post and other liberal media's goal is to make me feel like I should hate Trump as a Nazi dictator. Who should I beleive?

Are you being serious? You are incapable of listening to his words, understanding history and drawing your own conclusions?

Serious about not believing everything the media or a candidate says. It is just another sales pitch to get the job. Frankly the comparisons to Nazi Germany make me sick.

The question isn't whether you believe we are down a Nazi path. Hyperbole runs rampant in an election. The question is whether he is a threat to it institutions and allies. Or is Harris. In that, you should be able to draw your own conclusions simply by listening both of them speak and listening to their surrogates

Direct information is actually available to you.

There is simply no way to reach the other side on this. When 45 says he will be a dictator on day 1, his defense is he was joking and the believers believe

He gets the votes from the traditional gop voters and a new breed of macho tough guys who never used to vote.

Which is why he is tough to beat, when also considering the gop electoral college advantage

The forum hasn't been discussing the polling as much as previous election. Have you been following the cross tabs? This seems to be trumps best polling in his 3 elections?

I have been watching. I won't go so far as saying I'm not worried, but I'm not super worried. Everything in the cross tabs and polling in general is based on what a pollster believes is the electoral makeup. If they get that wrong, the results are wrong. I think after 2020 they over- weighted the GOP vote and we saw that in 2022. The one thing that makes me a little nervous is the movement in the last month. If your methodology is consistent, even if wrong, you have to honor movement. But I've been saying for a few weeks that's it's all turnout and I think the Ds have a better ground game.

benjs · October 2024

Get_Right said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

Get_Right said:

Merkin Baller said:

Get_Right said:

I do not endorse or know very much about this site, but it is clear to me that shenanigans are happening in every state and in both parties. Even if only half of it is true.

https://www.heritage.org/voterfraud/#choose-a-state

Criminal convictions and judicial findings of fact on both sides, and in almost every state. The system is broken.

And yet I get criticized for being disenfranchised with the entire process. Politics is the dirtiest of businesses in the US. Maybe used car sales is first. It has become a battle of slinging dirt and special interests on both sides. I do not hate the players, I hate the game. I will vote, but I don't really feel it will make a difference one way or the other. And that is sad.

You might want to vet your sources before you go off.

Just a thought.

I take it all in from both sides. And my conclusion is that it is all hyperbole designed to push one agenda over another. It is the same discussion over and over, the red raises tariffs and wants tougher immigration enforcement, while the blue touts a stronger economy and wants to restore women's rights.

In what way does a percentage higher or lower taxes or whatever matter for the upcoming four years VS voting in a normal human being with normal competent human beings around her and Trump and his gang of PARDON MY FRENCH racist and women-hating freaks ?

For better or worse, I am stuck in the middle. Neither candidate will change my taxes in a significant way. And tariffs will not impact my cost of living unless there is a tariff on fuel. Yes there are strong character issues with Trump, but is Kamala demonstrating any strong characteristics that are inspiring? Nothing is moving me in either direction, it may come down to the lesser of two evils, which sucks.

I just showed you a clear example of the Republican side attempting to lie to you to make you believe that there's an abundance of voter fraud. In reality, there's not nearly enough voter fraud to make any material difference.

Then you switch to "both sides are bad" because both engage in hyperbole, although one side focuses on hyperbole whereas the other focuses on beneficial lies, and truth is an afterthought.

Then you claim that neither will really affect your day to day, and switch to "lesser of two evils" after saying there are "strong character issues with Trump" but that Kamala isn't "inspiring" you.

If nothing is moving you in either direction, you are choosing not to be moved.

BF25394 · October 2024

JeBurkhardt said:

BF25394 said:

mrussel1 said:
Trump said he's going to disband the FBI, kill the DOE, and make the Fed under the Executive Branch, effectively politicizing it. He also threatens to leave NATO, the agreement that has delivered intercontinental peace for 80 years now. He also routinely sides with Russia, with he and Musk maintaining contact for the last four years. This is while Russia is a sanctioned state who is allies with China, NK and Iran.

His solution to end the war in Ukraine is to give Russia the Eastern Oblasts. That will give Russia control of the largest grain supply in the world and cut Ukraine off from the Dnipro.

It's very frustrating when people choose to remain ignorant and then claim they don't know what to believe. It's especially frustrating that we have listen to them brag about their ignorance every four years-- which only further reflects their ignorance because there are elections every year but they don't pay attention or vote in the ones that don't involve a choice for president.

It's a strange thing. There are a lot of topics where I'm not particularly informed. Opera. Soccer. Fine dining. Quantum mechanics. Something I generally don't do when it comes to those subjects is opine publicly on them. But people who pay no attention to politics most of the time, and who make no real effort to be engaged citizens-- to keep up with news from around the country and around the world from sources other than their Facebook feeds-- come out of the woodwork every four years to tell us how they can't make sense of things that more informed people figured out a long time ago. Or how the parties are the same even though they have completely different approaches to and philosophies of governing and have been demonstrating this consistently for well over a generation, and in a particularly acute way in the nine years since Trump came down the escalator. I am a lifelong independent and yet the stark difference between the two parties as they are constituted in 2024 and their presidential candidates could not be plainer to see.

Ignorance is only an excuse when you haven't been informed. Once you have been informed and still ignore it, then it moves to stupidity.

I wasn't excusing it.

mrussel1 · October 2024

BF25394 said:

mrussel1 said:
Trump said he's going to disband the FBI, kill the DOE, and make the Fed under the Executive Branch, effectively politicizing it. He also threatens to leave NATO, the agreement that has delivered intercontinental peace for 80 years now. He also routinely sides with Russia, with he and Musk maintaining contact for the last four years. This is while Russia is a sanctioned state who is allies with China, NK and Iran.

His solution to end the war in Ukraine is to give Russia the Eastern Oblasts. That will give Russia control of the largest grain supply in the world and cut Ukraine off from the Dnipro.

It's very frustrating when people choose to remain ignorant and then claim they don't know what to believe. It's especially frustrating that we have listen to them brag about their ignorance every four years-- which only further reflects their ignorance because there are elections every year but they don't pay attention or vote in the ones that don't involve a choice for president.

It's a strange thing. There are a lot of topics where I'm not particularly informed. Opera. Soccer. Fine dining. Quantum mechanics. Something I generally don't do when it comes to those subjects is opine publicly on them. But people who pay no attention to politics most of the time, and who make no real effort to be engaged citizens-- to keep up with news from around the country and around the world from sources other than their Facebook feeds-- come out of the woodwork every four years to tell us how they can't make sense of things that more informed people figured out a long time ago. Or how the parties are the same even though they have completely different approaches to and philosophies of governing and have been demonstrating this consistently for well over a generation, and in a particularly acute way in the nine years since Trump came down the escalator. I am a lifelong independent and yet the stark difference between the two parties as they are constituted in 2024 and their presidential candidates could not be plainer to see.

Great post, totally agree. Every example I put forth to Get Right is both factual and common knowledge for those that pay attention. I'm sure nothing i wrote surprised most of the people here. Hopefully he just didn't put it all together before now.

pjl44 · October 2024

Get_Right said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

Get_Right said:

Merkin Baller said:

Get_Right said:

I do not endorse or know very much about this site, but it is clear to me that shenanigans are happening in every state and in both parties. Even if only half of it is true.

https://www.heritage.org/voterfraud/#choose-a-state

Criminal convictions and judicial findings of fact on both sides, and in almost every state. The system is broken.

And yet I get criticized for being disenfranchised with the entire process. Politics is the dirtiest of businesses in the US. Maybe used car sales is first. It has become a battle of slinging dirt and special interests on both sides. I do not hate the players, I hate the game. I will vote, but I don't really feel it will make a difference one way or the other. And that is sad.

You might want to vet your sources before you go off.

Just a thought.

I take it all in from both sides. And my conclusion is that it is all hyperbole designed to push one agenda over another. It is the same discussion over and over, the red raises tariffs and wants tougher immigration enforcement, while the blue touts a stronger economy and wants to restore women's rights.

In what way does a percentage higher or lower taxes or whatever matter for the upcoming four years VS voting in a normal human being with normal competent human beings around her and Trump and his gang of PARDON MY FRENCH racist and women-hating freaks ?

For better or worse, I am stuck in the middle. Neither candidate will change my taxes in a significant way. And tariffs will not impact my cost of living unless there is a tariff on fuel. Yes there are strong character issues with Trump, but is Kamala demonstrating any strong characteristics that are inspiring? Nothing is moving me in either direction, it may come down to the lesser of two evils, which sucks.

I'm sure the replies you're getting are very persuasive lol

JeBurkhardt · October 2024

BF25394 said:

JeBurkhardt said:

BF25394 said:

mrussel1 said:
Trump said he's going to disband the FBI, kill the DOE, and make the Fed under the Executive Branch, effectively politicizing it. He also threatens to leave NATO, the agreement that has delivered intercontinental peace for 80 years now. He also routinely sides with Russia, with he and Musk maintaining contact for the last four years. This is while Russia is a sanctioned state who is allies with China, NK and Iran.

His solution to end the war in Ukraine is to give Russia the Eastern Oblasts. That will give Russia control of the largest grain supply in the world and cut Ukraine off from the Dnipro.

It's very frustrating when people choose to remain ignorant and then claim they don't know what to believe. It's especially frustrating that we have listen to them brag about their ignorance every four years-- which only further reflects their ignorance because there are elections every year but they don't pay attention or vote in the ones that don't involve a choice for president.

It's a strange thing. There are a lot of topics where I'm not particularly informed. Opera. Soccer. Fine dining. Quantum mechanics. Something I generally don't do when it comes to those subjects is opine publicly on them. But people who pay no attention to politics most of the time, and who make no real effort to be engaged citizens-- to keep up with news from around the country and around the world from sources other than their Facebook feeds-- come out of the woodwork every four years to tell us how they can't make sense of things that more informed people figured out a long time ago. Or how the parties are the same even though they have completely different approaches to and philosophies of governing and have been demonstrating this consistently for well over a generation, and in a particularly acute way in the nine years since Trump came down the escalator. I am a lifelong independent and yet the stark difference between the two parties as they are constituted in 2024 and their presidential candidates could not be plainer to see.

Ignorance is only an excuse when you haven't been informed. Once you have been informed and still ignore it, then it moves to stupidity.

I wasn't excusing it.

I am not saying that you did, my point is that someone can't claim ignorance after they have been informed.

Spiritual_Chaos · October 2024

Halifax2TheMax · October 2024

2023

Spiritual_Chaos said:

Does Sweden ban guns at polling places? Asking for a friend.

Go Beavers · October 2024

pjl44 said:

Get_Right said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

Get_Right said:

Merkin Baller said:

Get_Right said:

I do not endorse or know very much about this site, but it is clear to me that shenanigans are happening in every state and in both parties. Even if only half of it is true.

https://www.heritage.org/voterfraud/#choose-a-state

Criminal convictions and judicial findings of fact on both sides, and in almost every state. The system is broken.

And yet I get criticized for being disenfranchised with the entire process. Politics is the dirtiest of businesses in the US. Maybe used car sales is first. It has become a battle of slinging dirt and special interests on both sides. I do not hate the players, I hate the game. I will vote, but I don't really feel it will make a difference one way or the other. And that is sad.

You might want to vet your sources before you go off.

Just a thought.

I take it all in from both sides. And my conclusion is that it is all hyperbole designed to push one agenda over another. It is the same discussion over and over, the red raises tariffs and wants tougher immigration enforcement, while the blue touts a stronger economy and wants to restore women's rights.

In what way does a percentage higher or lower taxes or whatever matter for the upcoming four years VS voting in a normal human being with normal competent human beings around her and Trump and his gang of PARDON MY FRENCH racist and women-hating freaks ?

For better or worse, I am stuck in the middle. Neither candidate will change my taxes in a significant way. And tariffs will not impact my cost of living unless there is a tariff on fuel. Yes there are strong character issues with Trump, but is Kamala demonstrating any strong characteristics that are inspiring? Nothing is moving me in either direction, it may come down to the lesser of two evils, which sucks.

I'm sure the replies you're getting are very persuasive lol

When someone is deep into false equivalencies, it can be difficult for them to come out if. Or they’re just a republican, using the same false equivalencies as your typical Trump voter, but they’re coming to AMT to try and present otherwise just for poops and giggles.

Spiritual_Chaos · October 2024

Halifax2TheMax said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

Does Sweden ban guns at polling places? Asking for a friend.

Get_Right · October 2024

benjs said:

Get_Right said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

Get_Right said:

Merkin Baller said:

Get_Right said:

I do not endorse or know very much about this site, but it is clear to me that shenanigans are happening in every state and in both parties. Even if only half of it is true.

https://www.heritage.org/voterfraud/#choose-a-state

Criminal convictions and judicial findings of fact on both sides, and in almost every state. The system is broken.

And yet I get criticized for being disenfranchised with the entire process. Politics is the dirtiest of businesses in the US. Maybe used car sales is first. It has become a battle of slinging dirt and special interests on both sides. I do not hate the players, I hate the game. I will vote, but I don't really feel it will make a difference one way or the other. And that is sad.

You might want to vet your sources before you go off.

Just a thought.

I take it all in from both sides. And my conclusion is that it is all hyperbole designed to push one agenda over another. It is the same discussion over and over, the red raises tariffs and wants tougher immigration enforcement, while the blue touts a stronger economy and wants to restore women's rights.

In what way does a percentage higher or lower taxes or whatever matter for the upcoming four years VS voting in a normal human being with normal competent human beings around her and Trump and his gang of PARDON MY FRENCH racist and women-hating freaks ?

For better or worse, I am stuck in the middle. Neither candidate will change my taxes in a significant way. And tariffs will not impact my cost of living unless there is a tariff on fuel. Yes there are strong character issues with Trump, but is Kamala demonstrating any strong characteristics that are inspiring? Nothing is moving me in either direction, it may come down to the lesser of two evils, which sucks.

I just showed you a clear example of the Republican side attempting to lie to you to make you believe that there's an abundance of voter fraud. In reality, there's not nearly enough voter fraud to make any material difference.

Then you switch to "both sides are bad" because both engage in hyperbole, although one side focuses on hyperbole whereas the other focuses on beneficial lies, and truth is an afterthought.

Then you claim that neither will really affect your day to day, and switch to "lesser of two evils" after saying there are "strong character issues with Trump" but that Kamala isn't "inspiring" you.

If nothing is moving you in either direction, you are choosing not to be moved.

No not true. I am looking for a leader to move me. Neither candidate has done so. Should I be moved by default because Trump is a NYC slumlord with bad values? Or that Kamala is a lame duck just following the typical democratic path of entitlement? And that is sad. Stuff and nonsense. It is all just white noise. One may be more sympathetic to human rights while the other may have objectives that focus on money without much regard to human rights. It is a no win situation.

Spiritual_Chaos · October 2024

Get_Right said:

One may be more sympathetic to human rights while the other may have objectives that focus on money without much regard to human rights. It is a no win situation.

Seems you just described a clear winner in the situation you have in front of you

Get_Right · October 2024

pjl44 said:

Get_Right said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

Get_Right said:

Merkin Baller said:

Get_Right said:

I do not endorse or know very much about this site, but it is clear to me that shenanigans are happening in every state and in both parties. Even if only half of it is true.

https://www.heritage.org/voterfraud/#choose-a-state

Criminal convictions and judicial findings of fact on both sides, and in almost every state. The system is broken.

And yet I get criticized for being disenfranchised with the entire process. Politics is the dirtiest of businesses in the US. Maybe used car sales is first. It has become a battle of slinging dirt and special interests on both sides. I do not hate the players, I hate the game. I will vote, but I don't really feel it will make a difference one way or the other. And that is sad.

You might want to vet your sources before you go off.

Just a thought.

I take it all in from both sides. And my conclusion is that it is all hyperbole designed to push one agenda over another. It is the same discussion over and over, the red raises tariffs and wants tougher immigration enforcement, while the blue touts a stronger economy and wants to restore women's rights.

In what way does a percentage higher or lower taxes or whatever matter for the upcoming four years VS voting in a normal human being with normal competent human beings around her and Trump and his gang of PARDON MY FRENCH racist and women-hating freaks ?

For better or worse, I am stuck in the middle. Neither candidate will change my taxes in a significant way. And tariffs will not impact my cost of living unless there is a tariff on fuel. Yes there are strong character issues with Trump, but is Kamala demonstrating any strong characteristics that are inspiring? Nothing is moving me in either direction, it may come down to the lesser of two evils, which sucks.

I'm sure the replies you're getting are very persuasive lol

Just having a conversation. I welcome all views and any comments that are not disparaging or insultive. Please do not dismiss what I am trying to say objectively because you feel strongly on one side or the other. Not directed at you.

Gern Blansten · October 2024

2023

Get_Right said:

benjs said:

Get_Right said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

Get_Right said:

Merkin Baller said:

Get_Right said:

I do not endorse or know very much about this site, but it is clear to me that shenanigans are happening in every state and in both parties. Even if only half of it is true.

https://www.heritage.org/voterfraud/#choose-a-state

Criminal convictions and judicial findings of fact on both sides, and in almost every state. The system is broken.

And yet I get criticized for being disenfranchised with the entire process. Politics is the dirtiest of businesses in the US. Maybe used car sales is first. It has become a battle of slinging dirt and special interests on both sides. I do not hate the players, I hate the game. I will vote, but I don't really feel it will make a difference one way or the other. And that is sad.

You might want to vet your sources before you go off.

Just a thought.

I take it all in from both sides. And my conclusion is that it is all hyperbole designed to push one agenda over another. It is the same discussion over and over, the red raises tariffs and wants tougher immigration enforcement, while the blue touts a stronger economy and wants to restore women's rights.

In what way does a percentage higher or lower taxes or whatever matter for the upcoming four years VS voting in a normal human being with normal competent human beings around her and Trump and his gang of PARDON MY FRENCH racist and women-hating freaks ?

For better or worse, I am stuck in the middle. Neither candidate will change my taxes in a significant way. And tariffs will not impact my cost of living unless there is a tariff on fuel. Yes there are strong character issues with Trump, but is Kamala demonstrating any strong characteristics that are inspiring? Nothing is moving me in either direction, it may come down to the lesser of two evils, which sucks.

I just showed you a clear example of the Republican side attempting to lie to you to make you believe that there's an abundance of voter fraud. In reality, there's not nearly enough voter fraud to make any material difference.

Then you switch to "both sides are bad" because both engage in hyperbole, although one side focuses on hyperbole whereas the other focuses on beneficial lies, and truth is an afterthought.

Then you claim that neither will really affect your day to day, and switch to "lesser of two evils" after saying there are "strong character issues with Trump" but that Kamala isn't "inspiring" you.

If nothing is moving you in either direction, you are choosing not to be moved.

No not true. I am looking for a leader to move me. Neither candidate has done so. Should I be moved by default because Trump is a NYC slumlord with bad values? Or that Kamala is a lame duck just following the typical democratic path of entitlement? And that is sad. Stuff and nonsense. It is all just white noise. One may be more sympathetic to human rights while the other may have objectives that focus on money without much regard to human rights. It is a no win situation.

Sorry but that makes no sense. Virtually no one of significance from trump's administration supports him. That should be enough for anyone.

pjl44 · October 2024

Hell yeah. Triumph at the MSG rally.

https://youtu.be/-yN0Pru9fNQ

Get_Right · October 2024

Gern Blansten said:

Get_Right said:

benjs said:

Get_Right said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

Get_Right said:

Merkin Baller said:

Get_Right said:

I do not endorse or know very much about this site, but it is clear to me that shenanigans are happening in every state and in both parties. Even if only half of it is true.

https://www.heritage.org/voterfraud/#choose-a-state

Criminal convictions and judicial findings of fact on both sides, and in almost every state. The system is broken.

And yet I get criticized for being disenfranchised with the entire process. Politics is the dirtiest of businesses in the US. Maybe used car sales is first. It has become a battle of slinging dirt and special interests on both sides. I do not hate the players, I hate the game. I will vote, but I don't really feel it will make a difference one way or the other. And that is sad.

You might want to vet your sources before you go off.

Just a thought.

I take it all in from both sides. And my conclusion is that it is all hyperbole designed to push one agenda over another. It is the same discussion over and over, the red raises tariffs and wants tougher immigration enforcement, while the blue touts a stronger economy and wants to restore women's rights.

In what way does a percentage higher or lower taxes or whatever matter for the upcoming four years VS voting in a normal human being with normal competent human beings around her and Trump and his gang of PARDON MY FRENCH racist and women-hating freaks ?

For better or worse, I am stuck in the middle. Neither candidate will change my taxes in a significant way. And tariffs will not impact my cost of living unless there is a tariff on fuel. Yes there are strong character issues with Trump, but is Kamala demonstrating any strong characteristics that are inspiring? Nothing is moving me in either direction, it may come down to the lesser of two evils, which sucks.

I just showed you a clear example of the Republican side attempting to lie to you to make you believe that there's an abundance of voter fraud. In reality, there's not nearly enough voter fraud to make any material difference.

Then you switch to "both sides are bad" because both engage in hyperbole, although one side focuses on hyperbole whereas the other focuses on beneficial lies, and truth is an afterthought.

Then you claim that neither will really affect your day to day, and switch to "lesser of two evils" after saying there are "strong character issues with Trump" but that Kamala isn't "inspiring" you.

If nothing is moving you in either direction, you are choosing not to be moved.

No not true. I am looking for a leader to move me. Neither candidate has done so. Should I be moved by default because Trump is a NYC slumlord with bad values? Or that Kamala is a lame duck just following the typical democratic path of entitlement? And that is sad. Stuff and nonsense. It is all just white noise. One may be more sympathetic to human rights while the other may have objectives that focus on money without much regard to human rights. It is a no win situation.

Sorry but that makes no sense. Virtually no one of significance from trump's administration supports him. That should be enough for anyone.

They are all being paid so of course they will dance the dance. But you must be talking about people that are no longer being paid. Of course those are unbiased opinions.

BF25394 · October 2024

Get_Right said:

benjs said:

Get_Right said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

Get_Right said:

Merkin Baller said:

Get_Right said:

I do not endorse or know very much about this site, but it is clear to me that shenanigans are happening in every state and in both parties. Even if only half of it is true.

https://www.heritage.org/voterfraud/#choose-a-state

Criminal convictions and judicial findings of fact on both sides, and in almost every state. The system is broken.

And yet I get criticized for being disenfranchised with the entire process. Politics is the dirtiest of businesses in the US. Maybe used car sales is first. It has become a battle of slinging dirt and special interests on both sides. I do not hate the players, I hate the game. I will vote, but I don't really feel it will make a difference one way or the other. And that is sad.

You might want to vet your sources before you go off.

Just a thought.

I take it all in from both sides. And my conclusion is that it is all hyperbole designed to push one agenda over another. It is the same discussion over and over, the red raises tariffs and wants tougher immigration enforcement, while the blue touts a stronger economy and wants to restore women's rights.

In what way does a percentage higher or lower taxes or whatever matter for the upcoming four years VS voting in a normal human being with normal competent human beings around her and Trump and his gang of PARDON MY FRENCH racist and women-hating freaks ?

For better or worse, I am stuck in the middle. Neither candidate will change my taxes in a significant way. And tariffs will not impact my cost of living unless there is a tariff on fuel. Yes there are strong character issues with Trump, but is Kamala demonstrating any strong characteristics that are inspiring? Nothing is moving me in either direction, it may come down to the lesser of two evils, which sucks.

I just showed you a clear example of the Republican side attempting to lie to you to make you believe that there's an abundance of voter fraud. In reality, there's not nearly enough voter fraud to make any material difference.

Then you switch to "both sides are bad" because both engage in hyperbole, although one side focuses on hyperbole whereas the other focuses on beneficial lies, and truth is an afterthought.

Then you claim that neither will really affect your day to day, and switch to "lesser of two evils" after saying there are "strong character issues with Trump" but that Kamala isn't "inspiring" you.

If nothing is moving you in either direction, you are choosing not to be moved.

No not true. I am looking for a leader to move me. Neither candidate has done so. Should I be moved by default because Trump is a NYC slumlord with bad values? Or that Kamala is a lame duck just following the typical democratic path of entitlement? And that is sad. Stuff and nonsense. It is all just white noise. One may be more sympathetic to human rights while the other may have objectives that focus on money without much regard to human rights. It is a no win situation.

There really is a difference between the two. It isn't just white noise. I wonder if Eddie Vedder regrets stumping for Ralph Nader in 2000 because he thought that Al Gore and George W. Bush were "two evils." Ralph Nader is a great American whose advocacy saved tens of thousands of lives. He's also a mule whose political stubbornness indirectly cost hundreds of thousands of lives as a result of an invasion and war that wouldn't have happened if a different candidate had been elected president in 2000. This is why I've always had a little trouble swallowing "Bu$hleaguer." Eddie helped to give us Bush.

One of the parties (the Rs) wants to keep people from legally voting, and they target people whom they consider more likely to vote for the other party (see, e.g., military IDs as acceptable voter ID but not college IDs). They try to claim that they're trying to prevent people from illegally voting, but that's a pretext. Illegal votes are virtually non-existent; they're trying to stop people from voting legally for the other party. Some Republican politicians have even said this out loud. Meanwhile, the other party (the Ds) doesn't try to prevent anyone from voting legally, even the people who are more likely to vote for their opponents. Anyone who has paid attention for the last 20 years should see this disparity and recognize it for what it is. It's just one of many examples of how the parties are not equally bad. And, again, I'm not a Democrat.

Spiritual_Chaos · October 2024

Get_Right said:

Gern Blansten said:

Get_Right said:

benjs said:

Get_Right said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

Get_Right said:

Merkin Baller said:

Get_Right said:

I do not endorse or know very much about this site, but it is clear to me that shenanigans are happening in every state and in both parties. Even if only half of it is true.

https://www.heritage.org/voterfraud/#choose-a-state

Criminal convictions and judicial findings of fact on both sides, and in almost every state. The system is broken.

And yet I get criticized for being disenfranchised with the entire process. Politics is the dirtiest of businesses in the US. Maybe used car sales is first. It has become a battle of slinging dirt and special interests on both sides. I do not hate the players, I hate the game. I will vote, but I don't really feel it will make a difference one way or the other. And that is sad.

You might want to vet your sources before you go off.

Just a thought.

I take it all in from both sides. And my conclusion is that it is all hyperbole designed to push one agenda over another. It is the same discussion over and over, the red raises tariffs and wants tougher immigration enforcement, while the blue touts a stronger economy and wants to restore women's rights.

In what way does a percentage higher or lower taxes or whatever matter for the upcoming four years VS voting in a normal human being with normal competent human beings around her and Trump and his gang of PARDON MY FRENCH racist and women-hating freaks ?

For better or worse, I am stuck in the middle. Neither candidate will change my taxes in a significant way. And tariffs will not impact my cost of living unless there is a tariff on fuel. Yes there are strong character issues with Trump, but is Kamala demonstrating any strong characteristics that are inspiring? Nothing is moving me in either direction, it may come down to the lesser of two evils, which sucks.

I just showed you a clear example of the Republican side attempting to lie to you to make you believe that there's an abundance of voter fraud. In reality, there's not nearly enough voter fraud to make any material difference.

Then you switch to "both sides are bad" because both engage in hyperbole, although one side focuses on hyperbole whereas the other focuses on beneficial lies, and truth is an afterthought.

Then you claim that neither will really affect your day to day, and switch to "lesser of two evils" after saying there are "strong character issues with Trump" but that Kamala isn't "inspiring" you.

If nothing is moving you in either direction, you are choosing not to be moved.

No not true. I am looking for a leader to move me. Neither candidate has done so. Should I be moved by default because Trump is a NYC slumlord with bad values? Or that Kamala is a lame duck just following the typical democratic path of entitlement? And that is sad. Stuff and nonsense. It is all just white noise. One may be more sympathetic to human rights while the other may have objectives that focus on money without much regard to human rights. It is a no win situation.

Sorry but that makes no sense. Virtually no one of significance from trump's administration supports him. That should be enough for anyone.

They are all being paid so of course they will dance the dance. But you must be talking about people that are no longer being paid. Of course those are unbiased opinions.

What are you even doing

---President Elect Musk and Convicted Felon Donald J Trump---

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