The Golf Thread

bootlegger10 · June 2022

No brainer for Reed. Nobody likes him anyway. What the hell happened to Fowler's game? Complacency?

Funny to see all these people scatter after Phil's comments and then come right back two months later.

mrussel1 · June 2022

Indifference71 said:

The Juggler said:

I bet we're eventually going to see a lot of others jump over, especially if they're still able to play in majors.

I think the biggest thing is going to be if these LIV tournaments are offered OWGR points. If they can't get world ranking points then these guys won't stay ranked high enough to qualify for the majors unless they're exempt as past winners.

I think this is exactly right. And why would the Euro or Asia tour award any points? And wouldn't all the established tours pressure the majors to not accept LIV points? One would think. The real issue with the LIV is that it encroaches on the territory of everyone. They have tourneys in Europe, US and Asia. There's no reason for the tours to play nice here. They need to do everything in their power to box out the LIV.

bootlegger10 · June 2022

I think they should get OWGR points. A tour is a tour. I imagine the points though are pretty small compared to the major tours. Maybe there is an argument that the LIV format shouldn't be provided points though. I could see that if it is a team event (I don't know if it is like college where it is a team but still track individual scoring).

Indifference71 · June 2022

I think what's going to happen here is we're going to end up with 2 mediocre tours with PGA and LIV and the only tourneys with great fields will be the majors.

Ledbetterman10 · June 2022

bootlegger10 said:

I think they should get OWGR points. A tour is a tour. I imagine the points though are pretty small compared to the major tours. Maybe there is an argument that the LIV format shouldn't be provided points though. I could see that if it is a team event (I don't know if it is like college where it is a team but still track individual scoring).

I think an argument against LIV counting towards OWGR points might be that the tournaments are only 54 holes, with no cut. I’m not positive but I assume that every other tour that counts towards OWGR are 72-hole tournaments. I could be wrong though. I know there’s small tours that have 36-hole tournaments…but I don’t know if they count towards OWGR.

mrussel1 · June 2022

bootlegger10 said:

I think they should get OWGR points. A tour is a tour. I imagine the points though are pretty small compared to the major tours. Maybe there is an argument that the LIV format shouldn't be provided points though. I could see that if it is a team event (I don't know if it is like college where it is a team but still track individual scoring).

But why wouldn't the PGA, European and Asian tours exert extreme pressure on the majors, with whom they've had a long and fruitful relationship, to deny points? Not doing so would be total breach of fiduciary duty and a strategic disaster. The tours have to do it.

bootlegger10 · June 2022

mrussel1 said:

bootlegger10 said:

I think they should get OWGR points. A tour is a tour. I imagine the points though are pretty small compared to the major tours. Maybe there is an argument that the LIV format shouldn't be provided points though. I could see that if it is a team event (I don't know if it is like college where it is a team but still track individual scoring).

But why wouldn't the PGA, European and Asian tours exert extreme pressure on the majors, with whom they've had a long and fruitful relationship, to deny points? Not doing so would be total breach of fiduciary duty and a strategic disaster. The tours have to do it.

I don’t know all the rules or structures and which current tours provide points or not. If all the levels of tours provide some amount of points then don’t see how LIV should be excluded except for the format. If it is selective then it is a different story.

I agree from the PGA, DP World, and Asia tours perspective they would want to fight it as hard as they can.

Cliffy6745 · June 2022

Ams are in the OWGR, so I don't think 72 holes is a requirement.

Bryson and Reed hurt.

mrussel1 · June 2022

bootlegger10 said:

mrussel1 said:

bootlegger10 said:

I think they should get OWGR points. A tour is a tour. I imagine the points though are pretty small compared to the major tours. Maybe there is an argument that the LIV format shouldn't be provided points though. I could see that if it is a team event (I don't know if it is like college where it is a team but still track individual scoring).

But why wouldn't the PGA, European and Asian tours exert extreme pressure on the majors, with whom they've had a long and fruitful relationship, to deny points? Not doing so would be total breach of fiduciary duty and a strategic disaster. The tours have to do it.

I don’t know all the rules or structures and which current tours provide points or not. If all the levels of tours provide some amount of points then don’t see how LIV should be excluded except for the format. If it is selective then it is a different story.

But why wouldn't the existing tours pressure the Majors to exclude any LIV points? It would be insanity to let the Saudis just pick off players without any attempt at repercussions. These are agreements between business partners. There are no 'rights' or 'fairness' about it. If I was the PGA, I would ensure that I and the Euro tour (with whom PGA has a long and positive relationship) turned the screws as hard as I could on the majors.

bootlegger10 · June 2022

mrussel1 said:

bootlegger10 said:

mrussel1 said:

bootlegger10 said:

I think they should get OWGR points. A tour is a tour. I imagine the points though are pretty small compared to the major tours. Maybe there is an argument that the LIV format shouldn't be provided points though. I could see that if it is a team event (I don't know if it is like college where it is a team but still track individual scoring).

But why wouldn't the PGA, European and Asian tours exert extreme pressure on the majors, with whom they've had a long and fruitful relationship, to deny points? Not doing so would be total breach of fiduciary duty and a strategic disaster. The tours have to do it.

I don’t know all the rules or structures and which current tours provide points or not. If all the levels of tours provide some amount of points then don’t see how LIV should be excluded except for the format. If it is selective then it is a different story.

But why wouldn't the existing tours pressure the Majors to exclude any LIV points? It would be insanity to let the Saudis just pick off players without any attempt at repercussions. These are agreements between business partners. There are no 'rights' or 'fairness' about it. If I was the PGA, I would ensure that I and the Euro tour (with whom PGA has a long and positive relationship) turned the screws as hard as I could on the majors.

I corrected my earlier post to indicate that I agree from those tours' perspective they would fight it as much as possible.

I would need to know more about what is required currently to be allowed points for a specific tour. If LIV meets the requirements then I think they should get points, if they don't then they shouldn't.

tempo_n_groove · June 2022

Question for you guys on here as I have been trying to follow.

Didn't Tiger Woods get paid some exuberant amounts to play in non sanctioned PGA games? Nobody said a woot about it.

Is this because so many players would jump ship from the PGA for certain LIV tournaments?

Indifference71 · June 2022

tempo_n_groove said:

Question for you guys on here as I have been trying to follow.

Didn't Tiger Woods get paid some exuberant amounts to play in non sanctioned PGA games? Nobody said a woot about it.

Is this because so many players would jump ship from the PGA for certain LIV tournaments?

A one-off event is different than an entire tour. Anytime a PGA tour member plays in a non-tour event they need to get a release from the tour.

And yeah the concern is players just popping in and out of the tour....the PGA Tour business model isn't sustainable with players doing that.

tempo_n_groove · June 2022

Indifference71 said:

tempo_n_groove said:

Question for you guys on here as I have been trying to follow.

Didn't Tiger Woods get paid some exuberant amounts to play in non sanctioned PGA games? Nobody said a woot about it.

Is this because so many players would jump ship from the PGA for certain LIV tournaments?

A one-off event is different than an entire tour. Anytime a PGA tour member plays in a non-tour event they need to get a release from the tour.

And yeah the concern is players just popping in and out of the tour....the PGA Tour business model isn't sustainable with players doing that.

So this is an Indy league(IRL)/CART type thing. Got it.

Indifference71 · June 2022

tempo_n_groove said:

Indifference71 said:

tempo_n_groove said:

Question for you guys on here as I have been trying to follow.

Didn't Tiger Woods get paid some exuberant amounts to play in non sanctioned PGA games? Nobody said a woot about it.

Is this because so many players would jump ship from the PGA for certain LIV tournaments?

A one-off event is different than an entire tour. Anytime a PGA tour member plays in a non-tour event they need to get a release from the tour.

And yeah the concern is players just popping in and out of the tour....the PGA Tour business model isn't sustainable with players doing that.

So this is an Indy league(IRL)/CART type thing. Got it.

Yeah something like that. Either way, this isn't going to be "good for the game" like that dipshit Greg Norman keeps saying.

tempo_n_groove · June 2022

Indifference71 said:

tempo_n_groove said:

Indifference71 said:

tempo_n_groove said:

Question for you guys on here as I have been trying to follow.

Didn't Tiger Woods get paid some exuberant amounts to play in non sanctioned PGA games? Nobody said a woot about it.

Is this because so many players would jump ship from the PGA for certain LIV tournaments?

A one-off event is different than an entire tour. Anytime a PGA tour member plays in a non-tour event they need to get a release from the tour.

And yeah the concern is players just popping in and out of the tour....the PGA Tour business model isn't sustainable with players doing that.

So this is an Indy league(IRL)/CART type thing. Got it.

Yeah something like that. Either way, this isn't going to be "good for the game" like that dipshit Greg Norman keeps saying.

It's good for the players so they can get paid is what I see it as.

Phil getting 200Mil for this is amazing. He won't make that with his advertising money in 10 years on tour.

bootlegger10 · June 2022

Let’s view it from a non-Saudi Arabia lens. It is good for less prominent players as they get guaranteed money like other sports. The format could be more interesting for fans. We’ll have to wait and see. I like the shotgun start. You can watch all the competitors at one time vs. a 9 hour window.

We’ll have to wait and see.

mrussel1 · June 2022

bootlegger10 said:

Let’s view it from a non-Saudi Arabia lens. It is good for less prominent players as they get guaranteed money like other sports. The format could be more interesting for fans. We’ll have to wait and see. I like the shotgun start. You can watch all the competitors at one time vs. a 9 hour window.

We’ll have to wait and see.

As the great philosopher "Wobbie" once said, "Fuck the Saudis"

Indifference71 · June 2022

bootlegger10 said:

Let’s view it from a non-Saudi Arabia lens. It is good for less prominent players as they get guaranteed money like other sports. The format could be more interesting for fans. We’ll have to wait and see. I like the shotgun start. You can watch all the competitors at one time vs. a 9 hour window.

We’ll have to wait and see.

Even from a non-Saudi lens, the format really doesn't do much for me. The field is pretty bad and the whole team aspect of it seems extremely lame. With all the money in the world, those were the team names and logos they came up with??? And not sure about the shotgun start....some guys get to finish on easy holes and some on hard holes?

Ledbetterman10 · June 2022

Indifference71 said:

tempo_n_groove said:

Question for you guys on here as I have been trying to follow.

Didn't Tiger Woods get paid some exuberant amounts to play in non sanctioned PGA games? Nobody said a woot about it.

Is this because so many players would jump ship from the PGA for certain LIV tournaments?

A one-off event is different than an entire tour. Anytime a PGA tour member plays in a non-tour event they need to get a release from the tour.

And yeah the concern is players just popping in and out of the tour....the PGA Tour business model isn't sustainable with players doing that.

Plus, Tiger’s cameo appearances on the Japanese and Asian tours helped grow the game worldwide. Which is basically what Norman and Mickelson claim the LIV Tour will do….but won’t.

The Juggler · June 2022

Maybe they work something out where the LIV tour starts when the PGA tour ends?

It's only 8 tournaments.

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