Afghanistan

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  • JB16057JB16057 Posts: 861
    Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021? lol Gee, if only that coup would've worked out like they planned it. Too bad we still have democratic elections in this country. 

    The Trump admin let 5,000 Taliban fighters out of prison in 2020, they set up a really short time frame of which for us to leave, and then did not cooperate fully during the transition period with the incoming administration. So Biden's choices were to start fighting the Taliban again and prolong this two decade war or rip the fucking band aid off and get out. Of those two choices, I think he made the correct one.

    But hindsight being 2020, I don't see the problem with leaving a small troop presence there moving forward. Trump was the one who surrendered to the Taliban and took that possibility off the table. The Biden admin clearly could've handled things better, but it was a lose lose proposition for them. 
    i agree. this was a war we decided to stop fighting. it is a loss because we did not win, and we could not win. we stopped fighting and withdrew. 

    hopefully the government learned something from this. but given the short memory of americans, we will be in another 10 year war over there within the next 5 years.
    I just love the "Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021" line as if there was no way he could lose. Like he just ignored all public and internal polling and just assumed his coup would work if he actually did lose the election.

    Scary stuff. 
    You just love that line? How many other politicians running for any office believe they are going to win? Do you find that funny every time that happens? Hillary thought she was going to win in 2016. Did you laugh at her when she lost?

    If Trump called for an actual coup, insurrection, whatever you want to call it, it would've happened. If Trump told his supporters to take their guns to the Capitol on January 6th and take it over, it would've happened. If Trump called for violence on January 6 at the Capitol, millions upon millions of his followers would've shown up and they would've ripped the Capitol apart. If Trump told his followers to go the Capitol today, it could still happen but it hasn't and it won't.

    Sounds to me like you scare way too easy. Lucky for you, Trump didn't do what I said above and he won't. Everything is going to be OK!
  • JB16057 said:
    Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021? lol Gee, if only that coup would've worked out like they planned it. Too bad we still have democratic elections in this country. 

    The Trump admin let 5,000 Taliban fighters out of prison in 2020, they set up a really short time frame of which for us to leave, and then did not cooperate fully during the transition period with the incoming administration. So Biden's choices were to start fighting the Taliban again and prolong this two decade war or rip the fucking band aid off and get out. Of those two choices, I think he made the correct one.

    But hindsight being 2020, I don't see the problem with leaving a small troop presence there moving forward. Trump was the one who surrendered to the Taliban and took that possibility off the table. The Biden admin clearly could've handled things better, but it was a lose lose proposition for them. 
    i agree. this was a war we decided to stop fighting. it is a loss because we did not win, and we could not win. we stopped fighting and withdrew. 

    hopefully the government learned something from this. but given the short memory of americans, we will be in another 10 year war over there within the next 5 years.
    I just love the "Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021" line as if there was no way he could lose. Like he just ignored all public and internal polling and just assumed his coup would work if he actually did lose the election.

    Scary stuff. 
    You just love that line? How many other politicians running for any office believe they are going to win? Do you find that funny every time that happens? Hillary thought she was going to win in 2016. Did you laugh at her when she lost?

    If Trump called for an actual coup, insurrection, whatever you want to call it, it would've happened. If Trump told his supporters to take their guns to the Capitol on January 6th and take it over, it would've happened. If Trump called for violence on January 6 at the Capitol, millions upon millions of his followers would've shown up and they would've ripped the Capitol apart. If Trump told his followers to go the Capitol today, it could still happen but it hasn't and it won't.

    Sounds to me like you scare way too easy. Lucky for you, Trump didn't do what I said above and he won't. Everything is going to be OK!
    Passive aggressive much?
    09/15/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/29/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield, MA; 08/18/08, O2 London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA;

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  • The JugglerThe Juggler Behind that bush over there.Posts: 42,746
    JB16057 said:
    Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021? lol Gee, if only that coup would've worked out like they planned it. Too bad we still have democratic elections in this country. 

    The Trump admin let 5,000 Taliban fighters out of prison in 2020, they set up a really short time frame of which for us to leave, and then did not cooperate fully during the transition period with the incoming administration. So Biden's choices were to start fighting the Taliban again and prolong this two decade war or rip the fucking band aid off and get out. Of those two choices, I think he made the correct one.

    But hindsight being 2020, I don't see the problem with leaving a small troop presence there moving forward. Trump was the one who surrendered to the Taliban and took that possibility off the table. The Biden admin clearly could've handled things better, but it was a lose lose proposition for them. 
    i agree. this was a war we decided to stop fighting. it is a loss because we did not win, and we could not win. we stopped fighting and withdrew. 

    hopefully the government learned something from this. but given the short memory of americans, we will be in another 10 year war over there within the next 5 years.
    I just love the "Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021" line as if there was no way he could lose. Like he just ignored all public and internal polling and just assumed his coup would work if he actually did lose the election.

    Scary stuff. 
    You just love that line? How many other politicians running for any office believe they are going to win? Do you find that funny every time that happens? Hillary thought she was going to win in 2016. Did you laugh at her when she lost?

    If Trump called for an actual coup, insurrection, whatever you want to call it, it would've happened. If Trump told his supporters to take their guns to the Capitol on January 6th and take it over, it would've happened. If Trump called for violence on January 6 at the Capitol, millions upon millions of his followers would've shown up and they would've ripped the Capitol apart. If Trump told his followers to go the Capitol today, it could still happen but it hasn't and it won't.

    Sounds to me like you scare way too easy. Lucky for you, Trump didn't do what I said above and he won't. Everything is going to be OK!
    If Trump, if Trump if Trump...yada yada yada

    If Trump has nothing to hide, he'll cooperate with the investigation right? Right? lol


    chinese-happy.jpg
  • dankinddankind I am not your foot. Posts: 20,647
    dankind said:
    I'm not scared. 

    There are other countries.
    Passport valid?
    Ours and the kids' valid and up to date.
    I SAW PEARL JAM
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon WinnipegPosts: 32,299
    JB16057 said:
    Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021? lol Gee, if only that coup would've worked out like they planned it. Too bad we still have democratic elections in this country. 

    The Trump admin let 5,000 Taliban fighters out of prison in 2020, they set up a really short time frame of which for us to leave, and then did not cooperate fully during the transition period with the incoming administration. So Biden's choices were to start fighting the Taliban again and prolong this two decade war or rip the fucking band aid off and get out. Of those two choices, I think he made the correct one.

    But hindsight being 2020, I don't see the problem with leaving a small troop presence there moving forward. Trump was the one who surrendered to the Taliban and took that possibility off the table. The Biden admin clearly could've handled things better, but it was a lose lose proposition for them. 
    i agree. this was a war we decided to stop fighting. it is a loss because we did not win, and we could not win. we stopped fighting and withdrew. 

    hopefully the government learned something from this. but given the short memory of americans, we will be in another 10 year war over there within the next 5 years.
    I just love the "Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021" line as if there was no way he could lose. Like he just ignored all public and internal polling and just assumed his coup would work if he actually did lose the election.

    Scary stuff. 
    You just love that line? How many other politicians running for any office believe they are going to win? Do you find that funny every time that happens? Hillary thought she was going to win in 2016. Did you laugh at her when she lost?

    If Trump called for an actual coup, insurrection, whatever you want to call it, it would've happened. If Trump told his supporters to take their guns to the Capitol on January 6th and take it over, it would've happened. If Trump called for violence on January 6 at the Capitol, millions upon millions of his followers would've shown up and they would've ripped the Capitol apart. If Trump told his followers to go the Capitol today, it could still happen but it hasn't and it won't.

    Sounds to me like you scare way too easy. Lucky for you, Trump didn't do what I said above and he won't. Everything is going to be OK!
    If Trump, if Trump if Trump...yada yada yada

    If Trump has nothing to hide, he'll cooperate with the investigation right? Right? lol


    not "if trump yadda yadda yadda". the idea that he set up the next admin for failure by making that deal flies directly in the face of his narcissism that he thought he was a shoe in to win reelection. I'm not sure how this can be denied. 
    I think I'll move to Australia


  • The JugglerThe Juggler Behind that bush over there.Posts: 42,746
    JB16057 said:
    Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021? lol Gee, if only that coup would've worked out like they planned it. Too bad we still have democratic elections in this country. 

    The Trump admin let 5,000 Taliban fighters out of prison in 2020, they set up a really short time frame of which for us to leave, and then did not cooperate fully during the transition period with the incoming administration. So Biden's choices were to start fighting the Taliban again and prolong this two decade war or rip the fucking band aid off and get out. Of those two choices, I think he made the correct one.

    But hindsight being 2020, I don't see the problem with leaving a small troop presence there moving forward. Trump was the one who surrendered to the Taliban and took that possibility off the table. The Biden admin clearly could've handled things better, but it was a lose lose proposition for them. 
    i agree. this was a war we decided to stop fighting. it is a loss because we did not win, and we could not win. we stopped fighting and withdrew. 

    hopefully the government learned something from this. but given the short memory of americans, we will be in another 10 year war over there within the next 5 years.
    I just love the "Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021" line as if there was no way he could lose. Like he just ignored all public and internal polling and just assumed his coup would work if he actually did lose the election.

    Scary stuff. 
    You just love that line? How many other politicians running for any office believe they are going to win? Do you find that funny every time that happens? Hillary thought she was going to win in 2016. Did you laugh at her when she lost?

    If Trump called for an actual coup, insurrection, whatever you want to call it, it would've happened. If Trump told his supporters to take their guns to the Capitol on January 6th and take it over, it would've happened. If Trump called for violence on January 6 at the Capitol, millions upon millions of his followers would've shown up and they would've ripped the Capitol apart. If Trump told his followers to go the Capitol today, it could still happen but it hasn't and it won't.

    Sounds to me like you scare way too easy. Lucky for you, Trump didn't do what I said above and he won't. Everything is going to be OK!
    If Trump, if Trump if Trump...yada yada yada

    If Trump has nothing to hide, he'll cooperate with the investigation right? Right? lol


    not "if trump yadda yadda yadda". the idea that he set up the next admin for failure by making that deal flies directly in the face of his narcissism that he thought he was a shoe in to win reelection. I'm not sure how this can be denied. 

    "I just want to find 11,780 votes."

    He thought he was a shoe-in because assumed he could cheat his way to re-election and not get caught...then he wrongly thought he could delay the certification of the election on 1/6 with his failed insurrection long enough to convince Pence to do something he constitutionally could not. 
    chinese-happy.jpg
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon WinnipegPosts: 32,299
    edited October 2021
    JB16057 said:
    Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021? lol Gee, if only that coup would've worked out like they planned it. Too bad we still have democratic elections in this country. 

    The Trump admin let 5,000 Taliban fighters out of prison in 2020, they set up a really short time frame of which for us to leave, and then did not cooperate fully during the transition period with the incoming administration. So Biden's choices were to start fighting the Taliban again and prolong this two decade war or rip the fucking band aid off and get out. Of those two choices, I think he made the correct one.

    But hindsight being 2020, I don't see the problem with leaving a small troop presence there moving forward. Trump was the one who surrendered to the Taliban and took that possibility off the table. The Biden admin clearly could've handled things better, but it was a lose lose proposition for them. 
    i agree. this was a war we decided to stop fighting. it is a loss because we did not win, and we could not win. we stopped fighting and withdrew. 

    hopefully the government learned something from this. but given the short memory of americans, we will be in another 10 year war over there within the next 5 years.
    I just love the "Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021" line as if there was no way he could lose. Like he just ignored all public and internal polling and just assumed his coup would work if he actually did lose the election.

    Scary stuff. 
    You just love that line? How many other politicians running for any office believe they are going to win? Do you find that funny every time that happens? Hillary thought she was going to win in 2016. Did you laugh at her when she lost?

    If Trump called for an actual coup, insurrection, whatever you want to call it, it would've happened. If Trump told his supporters to take their guns to the Capitol on January 6th and take it over, it would've happened. If Trump called for violence on January 6 at the Capitol, millions upon millions of his followers would've shown up and they would've ripped the Capitol apart. If Trump told his followers to go the Capitol today, it could still happen but it hasn't and it won't.

    Sounds to me like you scare way too easy. Lucky for you, Trump didn't do what I said above and he won't. Everything is going to be OK!
    If Trump, if Trump if Trump...yada yada yada

    If Trump has nothing to hide, he'll cooperate with the investigation right? Right? lol


    not "if trump yadda yadda yadda". the idea that he set up the next admin for failure by making that deal flies directly in the face of his narcissism that he thought he was a shoe in to win reelection. I'm not sure how this can be denied. 

    "I just want to find 11,780 votes."

    He thought he was a shoe-in because assumed he could cheat his way to re-election and not get caught...then he wrongly thought he could delay the certification of the election on 1/6 with his failed insurrection long enough to convince Pence to do something he constitutionally could not. 
    he made the deal with the taliban way before the election. 

    It's irrelevant why he thought he was a shoe in. the point is he did think he was a shoe in. 

    now, i'm not saying he made this deal with the taliban in good faith. he probably thought he could fuck with the timeline and just threaten to blow Afghanistan to smithereens in a tweet if he wanted to if the taliban pushed back. that's actually likely. but to suggest he made this deal, 3 months prior to an election he thought he'd win in a landslide, to fuck with the next admin, is patently absurd. 

    edit: fact check: I don't know where I got the 3 months from. I think it was over a year prior. 
    Post edited by HughFreakingDillon on
    I think I'll move to Australia


  • The JugglerThe Juggler Behind that bush over there.Posts: 42,746
    JB16057 said:
    Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021? lol Gee, if only that coup would've worked out like they planned it. Too bad we still have democratic elections in this country. 

    The Trump admin let 5,000 Taliban fighters out of prison in 2020, they set up a really short time frame of which for us to leave, and then did not cooperate fully during the transition period with the incoming administration. So Biden's choices were to start fighting the Taliban again and prolong this two decade war or rip the fucking band aid off and get out. Of those two choices, I think he made the correct one.

    But hindsight being 2020, I don't see the problem with leaving a small troop presence there moving forward. Trump was the one who surrendered to the Taliban and took that possibility off the table. The Biden admin clearly could've handled things better, but it was a lose lose proposition for them. 
    i agree. this was a war we decided to stop fighting. it is a loss because we did not win, and we could not win. we stopped fighting and withdrew. 

    hopefully the government learned something from this. but given the short memory of americans, we will be in another 10 year war over there within the next 5 years.
    I just love the "Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021" line as if there was no way he could lose. Like he just ignored all public and internal polling and just assumed his coup would work if he actually did lose the election.

    Scary stuff. 
    You just love that line? How many other politicians running for any office believe they are going to win? Do you find that funny every time that happens? Hillary thought she was going to win in 2016. Did you laugh at her when she lost?

    If Trump called for an actual coup, insurrection, whatever you want to call it, it would've happened. If Trump told his supporters to take their guns to the Capitol on January 6th and take it over, it would've happened. If Trump called for violence on January 6 at the Capitol, millions upon millions of his followers would've shown up and they would've ripped the Capitol apart. If Trump told his followers to go the Capitol today, it could still happen but it hasn't and it won't.

    Sounds to me like you scare way too easy. Lucky for you, Trump didn't do what I said above and he won't. Everything is going to be OK!
    If Trump, if Trump if Trump...yada yada yada

    If Trump has nothing to hide, he'll cooperate with the investigation right? Right? lol


    not "if trump yadda yadda yadda". the idea that he set up the next admin for failure by making that deal flies directly in the face of his narcissism that he thought he was a shoe in to win reelection. I'm not sure how this can be denied. 

    "I just want to find 11,780 votes."

    He thought he was a shoe-in because assumed he could cheat his way to re-election and not get caught...then he wrongly thought he could delay the certification of the election on 1/6 with his failed insurrection long enough to convince Pence to do something he constitutionally could not. 
    he made the deal with the taliban way before the election. 

    It's irrelevant why he thought he was a shoe in. the point is he did think he was a shoe in. 

    now, i'm not saying he made this deal with the taliban in good faith. he probably thought he could fuck with the timeline and just threaten to blow Afghanistan to smithereens in a tweet if he wanted to if the taliban pushed back. that's actually likely. but to suggest he made this deal, 3 months prior to an election he thought he'd win in a landslide, to fuck with the next admin, is patently absurd. 
    I didn't say that. I said he made a bad deal to begin with like a year and a half ago (maybe two years now?) when he initially surrendered to the Taliban and had their 5,000 fighters released. Then after he lost the election, his administration offered hardly any help to the incoming administration since he was losing his mind over his election loss and was focused on cheating his way into four more years.

    Trump's initial bad deal with the Taliban and subsequent lack of help during the transition is what put the Biden admin into a lose-lose proposition. This is not take any blame away from Biden's mishaps, but in my opinion, the biggest mistake was Trump's deal with the Taliban that set all those wheels in motion. I think they should've just left a small contingent of troops over there. 
    chinese-happy.jpg
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon WinnipegPosts: 32,299
    JB16057 said:
    Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021? lol Gee, if only that coup would've worked out like they planned it. Too bad we still have democratic elections in this country. 

    The Trump admin let 5,000 Taliban fighters out of prison in 2020, they set up a really short time frame of which for us to leave, and then did not cooperate fully during the transition period with the incoming administration. So Biden's choices were to start fighting the Taliban again and prolong this two decade war or rip the fucking band aid off and get out. Of those two choices, I think he made the correct one.

    But hindsight being 2020, I don't see the problem with leaving a small troop presence there moving forward. Trump was the one who surrendered to the Taliban and took that possibility off the table. The Biden admin clearly could've handled things better, but it was a lose lose proposition for them. 
    i agree. this was a war we decided to stop fighting. it is a loss because we did not win, and we could not win. we stopped fighting and withdrew. 

    hopefully the government learned something from this. but given the short memory of americans, we will be in another 10 year war over there within the next 5 years.
    I just love the "Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021" line as if there was no way he could lose. Like he just ignored all public and internal polling and just assumed his coup would work if he actually did lose the election.

    Scary stuff. 
    You just love that line? How many other politicians running for any office believe they are going to win? Do you find that funny every time that happens? Hillary thought she was going to win in 2016. Did you laugh at her when she lost?

    If Trump called for an actual coup, insurrection, whatever you want to call it, it would've happened. If Trump told his supporters to take their guns to the Capitol on January 6th and take it over, it would've happened. If Trump called for violence on January 6 at the Capitol, millions upon millions of his followers would've shown up and they would've ripped the Capitol apart. If Trump told his followers to go the Capitol today, it could still happen but it hasn't and it won't.

    Sounds to me like you scare way too easy. Lucky for you, Trump didn't do what I said above and he won't. Everything is going to be OK!
    If Trump, if Trump if Trump...yada yada yada

    If Trump has nothing to hide, he'll cooperate with the investigation right? Right? lol


    not "if trump yadda yadda yadda". the idea that he set up the next admin for failure by making that deal flies directly in the face of his narcissism that he thought he was a shoe in to win reelection. I'm not sure how this can be denied. 

    "I just want to find 11,780 votes."

    He thought he was a shoe-in because assumed he could cheat his way to re-election and not get caught...then he wrongly thought he could delay the certification of the election on 1/6 with his failed insurrection long enough to convince Pence to do something he constitutionally could not. 
    he made the deal with the taliban way before the election. 

    It's irrelevant why he thought he was a shoe in. the point is he did think he was a shoe in. 

    now, i'm not saying he made this deal with the taliban in good faith. he probably thought he could fuck with the timeline and just threaten to blow Afghanistan to smithereens in a tweet if he wanted to if the taliban pushed back. that's actually likely. but to suggest he made this deal, 3 months prior to an election he thought he'd win in a landslide, to fuck with the next admin, is patently absurd. 
    I didn't say that. I said he made a bad deal to begin with like a year and a half ago (maybe two years now?) when he initially surrendered to the Taliban and had their 5,000 fighters released. Then after he lost the election, his administration offered hardly any help to the incoming administration since he was losing his mind over his election loss and was focused on cheating his way into four more years.

    Trump's initial bad deal with the Taliban and subsequent lack of help during the transition is what put the Biden admin into a lose-lose proposition. This is not take any blame away from Biden's mishaps, but in my opinion, the biggest mistake was Trump's deal with the Taliban that set all those wheels in motion. I think they should've just left a small contingent of troops over there. 
    fair, but then what was this about? to me this was clearly stating that you disagreed with the assertion he could not have intentionally fucked over the next admin, thinking HE was going to be the next admin. 

    Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021? lol Gee, if only that coup would've worked out like they planned it. Too bad we still have democratic elections in this country. 
    I think I'll move to Australia


  • gimmesometruth27gimmesometruth27 St. Fuckin LouisPosts: 20,051
    the fact is trump tied the hands of the biden administration.

    but do you hear biden complaining about it? no. because leaders deal with the situation that is is their hands.

    remember trump blaming obama about the "covid testing cuboards being bare" and that "obama did not leave me anything that would help in a pandemic" on twitter and in nationally televised speeches? it was all bullshit because 1. covid-19 was not discovered until 2019 while trump was president and 2. trump tore up the 70 plus page document on pandemic plan and response that obama left him.

    the cold hard fact is the guy that dictated the book "the art of the deal" makes the worst deals of all time.
    There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self.- Hemingway

    "Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
  • the fact is trump tied the hands of the biden administration.

    but do you hear biden complaining about it? no. because leaders deal with the situation that is is their hands.

    remember trump blaming obama about the "covid testing cuboards being bare" and that "obama did not leave me anything that would help in a pandemic" on twitter and in nationally televised speeches? it was all bullshit because 1. covid-19 was not discovered until 2019 while trump was president and 2. trump tore up the 70 plus page document on pandemic plan and response that obama left him.

    the cold hard fact is the guy that dictated the book "the art of the deal" makes the worst deals of all time.
    POOTWH isn’t savvy enough to have come up with the Afghanistan clusterfuck plan on his own. It was a page out of the Shrub playbook where the Shrub Administration negotiated a full troop withdrawal WITH THE IRAQI GOVERNMENT, a government duly elected in free and fair elections no less, to begin 3 years after leaving office and to begin during an election year 2012. Did Obama complain? No, he called their bluff and pulled the troops and was re-elected anyway.

    The repub politicization of war and using service members as pawns as a political act as opposed to a strategic act is quite disgusting. And then to never own it is even more disgusting. Remember when they cared about the troops?
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  • The JugglerThe Juggler Behind that bush over there.Posts: 42,746
    JB16057 said:
    Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021? lol Gee, if only that coup would've worked out like they planned it. Too bad we still have democratic elections in this country. 

    The Trump admin let 5,000 Taliban fighters out of prison in 2020, they set up a really short time frame of which for us to leave, and then did not cooperate fully during the transition period with the incoming administration. So Biden's choices were to start fighting the Taliban again and prolong this two decade war or rip the fucking band aid off and get out. Of those two choices, I think he made the correct one.

    But hindsight being 2020, I don't see the problem with leaving a small troop presence there moving forward. Trump was the one who surrendered to the Taliban and took that possibility off the table. The Biden admin clearly could've handled things better, but it was a lose lose proposition for them. 
    i agree. this was a war we decided to stop fighting. it is a loss because we did not win, and we could not win. we stopped fighting and withdrew. 

    hopefully the government learned something from this. but given the short memory of americans, we will be in another 10 year war over there within the next 5 years.
    I just love the "Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021" line as if there was no way he could lose. Like he just ignored all public and internal polling and just assumed his coup would work if he actually did lose the election.

    Scary stuff. 
    You just love that line? How many other politicians running for any office believe they are going to win? Do you find that funny every time that happens? Hillary thought she was going to win in 2016. Did you laugh at her when she lost?

    If Trump called for an actual coup, insurrection, whatever you want to call it, it would've happened. If Trump told his supporters to take their guns to the Capitol on January 6th and take it over, it would've happened. If Trump called for violence on January 6 at the Capitol, millions upon millions of his followers would've shown up and they would've ripped the Capitol apart. If Trump told his followers to go the Capitol today, it could still happen but it hasn't and it won't.

    Sounds to me like you scare way too easy. Lucky for you, Trump didn't do what I said above and he won't. Everything is going to be OK!
    If Trump, if Trump if Trump...yada yada yada

    If Trump has nothing to hide, he'll cooperate with the investigation right? Right? lol


    not "if trump yadda yadda yadda". the idea that he set up the next admin for failure by making that deal flies directly in the face of his narcissism that he thought he was a shoe in to win reelection. I'm not sure how this can be denied. 

    "I just want to find 11,780 votes."

    He thought he was a shoe-in because assumed he could cheat his way to re-election and not get caught...then he wrongly thought he could delay the certification of the election on 1/6 with his failed insurrection long enough to convince Pence to do something he constitutionally could not. 
    he made the deal with the taliban way before the election. 

    It's irrelevant why he thought he was a shoe in. the point is he did think he was a shoe in. 

    now, i'm not saying he made this deal with the taliban in good faith. he probably thought he could fuck with the timeline and just threaten to blow Afghanistan to smithereens in a tweet if he wanted to if the taliban pushed back. that's actually likely. but to suggest he made this deal, 3 months prior to an election he thought he'd win in a landslide, to fuck with the next admin, is patently absurd. 
    I didn't say that. I said he made a bad deal to begin with like a year and a half ago (maybe two years now?) when he initially surrendered to the Taliban and had their 5,000 fighters released. Then after he lost the election, his administration offered hardly any help to the incoming administration since he was losing his mind over his election loss and was focused on cheating his way into four more years.

    Trump's initial bad deal with the Taliban and subsequent lack of help during the transition is what put the Biden admin into a lose-lose proposition. This is not take any blame away from Biden's mishaps, but in my opinion, the biggest mistake was Trump's deal with the Taliban that set all those wheels in motion. I think they should've just left a small contingent of troops over there. 
    fair, but then what was this about? to me this was clearly stating that you disagreed with the assertion he could not have intentionally fucked over the next admin, thinking HE was going to be the next admin. 

    Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021? lol Gee, if only that coup would've worked out like they planned it. Too bad we still have democratic elections in this country. 
    That was just about the other guy saying Trump just assumed he was going to still be president. If Trump thought that way, it would likely be because he thought he could get away with stealing it or having his January 6 plan work out. I don't think any normal president thinks that way, especially when they had internal and external polling indicating he would lose well before election day like Trump did.
    chinese-happy.jpg
  • gimmesometruth27gimmesometruth27 St. Fuckin LouisPosts: 20,051
    JB16057 said:
    Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021? lol Gee, if only that coup would've worked out like they planned it. Too bad we still have democratic elections in this country. 

    The Trump admin let 5,000 Taliban fighters out of prison in 2020, they set up a really short time frame of which for us to leave, and then did not cooperate fully during the transition period with the incoming administration. So Biden's choices were to start fighting the Taliban again and prolong this two decade war or rip the fucking band aid off and get out. Of those two choices, I think he made the correct one.

    But hindsight being 2020, I don't see the problem with leaving a small troop presence there moving forward. Trump was the one who surrendered to the Taliban and took that possibility off the table. The Biden admin clearly could've handled things better, but it was a lose lose proposition for them. 
    i agree. this was a war we decided to stop fighting. it is a loss because we did not win, and we could not win. we stopped fighting and withdrew. 

    hopefully the government learned something from this. but given the short memory of americans, we will be in another 10 year war over there within the next 5 years.
    I just love the "Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021" line as if there was no way he could lose. Like he just ignored all public and internal polling and just assumed his coup would work if he actually did lose the election.

    Scary stuff. 
    You just love that line? How many other politicians running for any office believe they are going to win? Do you find that funny every time that happens? Hillary thought she was going to win in 2016. Did you laugh at her when she lost?

    If Trump called for an actual coup, insurrection, whatever you want to call it, it would've happened. If Trump told his supporters to take their guns to the Capitol on January 6th and take it over, it would've happened. If Trump called for violence on January 6 at the Capitol, millions upon millions of his followers would've shown up and they would've ripped the Capitol apart. If Trump told his followers to go the Capitol today, it could still happen but it hasn't and it won't.

    Sounds to me like you scare way too easy. Lucky for you, Trump didn't do what I said above and he won't. Everything is going to be OK!
    If Trump, if Trump if Trump...yada yada yada

    If Trump has nothing to hide, he'll cooperate with the investigation right? Right? lol


    not "if trump yadda yadda yadda". the idea that he set up the next admin for failure by making that deal flies directly in the face of his narcissism that he thought he was a shoe in to win reelection. I'm not sure how this can be denied. 

    "I just want to find 11,780 votes."

    He thought he was a shoe-in because assumed he could cheat his way to re-election and not get caught...then he wrongly thought he could delay the certification of the election on 1/6 with his failed insurrection long enough to convince Pence to do something he constitutionally could not. 
    he made the deal with the taliban way before the election. 

    It's irrelevant why he thought he was a shoe in. the point is he did think he was a shoe in. 

    now, i'm not saying he made this deal with the taliban in good faith. he probably thought he could fuck with the timeline and just threaten to blow Afghanistan to smithereens in a tweet if he wanted to if the taliban pushed back. that's actually likely. but to suggest he made this deal, 3 months prior to an election he thought he'd win in a landslide, to fuck with the next admin, is patently absurd. 
    I didn't say that. I said he made a bad deal to begin with like a year and a half ago (maybe two years now?) when he initially surrendered to the Taliban and had their 5,000 fighters released. Then after he lost the election, his administration offered hardly any help to the incoming administration since he was losing his mind over his election loss and was focused on cheating his way into four more years.

    Trump's initial bad deal with the Taliban and subsequent lack of help during the transition is what put the Biden admin into a lose-lose proposition. This is not take any blame away from Biden's mishaps, but in my opinion, the biggest mistake was Trump's deal with the Taliban that set all those wheels in motion. I think they should've just left a small contingent of troops over there. 
    fair, but then what was this about? to me this was clearly stating that you disagreed with the assertion he could not have intentionally fucked over the next admin, thinking HE was going to be the next admin. 

    Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021? lol Gee, if only that coup would've worked out like they planned it. Too bad we still have democratic elections in this country. 
    That was just about the other guy saying Trump just assumed he was going to still be president. If Trump thought that way, it would likely be because he thought he could get away with stealing it or having his January 6 plan work out. I don't think any normal president thinks that way, especially when they had internal and external polling indicating he would lose well before election day like Trump did.
    he had the polls and he called them fake polls. every week that they came out he called them fake polls. even the rasmussen poll, a conservative poll, had him losing badly most of the time.
    There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self.- Hemingway

    "Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
  • The JugglerThe Juggler Behind that bush over there.Posts: 42,746
    JB16057 said:
    Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021? lol Gee, if only that coup would've worked out like they planned it. Too bad we still have democratic elections in this country. 

    The Trump admin let 5,000 Taliban fighters out of prison in 2020, they set up a really short time frame of which for us to leave, and then did not cooperate fully during the transition period with the incoming administration. So Biden's choices were to start fighting the Taliban again and prolong this two decade war or rip the fucking band aid off and get out. Of those two choices, I think he made the correct one.

    But hindsight being 2020, I don't see the problem with leaving a small troop presence there moving forward. Trump was the one who surrendered to the Taliban and took that possibility off the table. The Biden admin clearly could've handled things better, but it was a lose lose proposition for them. 
    i agree. this was a war we decided to stop fighting. it is a loss because we did not win, and we could not win. we stopped fighting and withdrew. 

    hopefully the government learned something from this. but given the short memory of americans, we will be in another 10 year war over there within the next 5 years.
    I just love the "Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021" line as if there was no way he could lose. Like he just ignored all public and internal polling and just assumed his coup would work if he actually did lose the election.

    Scary stuff. 
    You just love that line? How many other politicians running for any office believe they are going to win? Do you find that funny every time that happens? Hillary thought she was going to win in 2016. Did you laugh at her when she lost?

    If Trump called for an actual coup, insurrection, whatever you want to call it, it would've happened. If Trump told his supporters to take their guns to the Capitol on January 6th and take it over, it would've happened. If Trump called for violence on January 6 at the Capitol, millions upon millions of his followers would've shown up and they would've ripped the Capitol apart. If Trump told his followers to go the Capitol today, it could still happen but it hasn't and it won't.

    Sounds to me like you scare way too easy. Lucky for you, Trump didn't do what I said above and he won't. Everything is going to be OK!
    If Trump, if Trump if Trump...yada yada yada

    If Trump has nothing to hide, he'll cooperate with the investigation right? Right? lol


    not "if trump yadda yadda yadda". the idea that he set up the next admin for failure by making that deal flies directly in the face of his narcissism that he thought he was a shoe in to win reelection. I'm not sure how this can be denied. 

    "I just want to find 11,780 votes."

    He thought he was a shoe-in because assumed he could cheat his way to re-election and not get caught...then he wrongly thought he could delay the certification of the election on 1/6 with his failed insurrection long enough to convince Pence to do something he constitutionally could not. 
    he made the deal with the taliban way before the election. 

    It's irrelevant why he thought he was a shoe in. the point is he did think he was a shoe in. 

    now, i'm not saying he made this deal with the taliban in good faith. he probably thought he could fuck with the timeline and just threaten to blow Afghanistan to smithereens in a tweet if he wanted to if the taliban pushed back. that's actually likely. but to suggest he made this deal, 3 months prior to an election he thought he'd win in a landslide, to fuck with the next admin, is patently absurd. 
    I didn't say that. I said he made a bad deal to begin with like a year and a half ago (maybe two years now?) when he initially surrendered to the Taliban and had their 5,000 fighters released. Then after he lost the election, his administration offered hardly any help to the incoming administration since he was losing his mind over his election loss and was focused on cheating his way into four more years.

    Trump's initial bad deal with the Taliban and subsequent lack of help during the transition is what put the Biden admin into a lose-lose proposition. This is not take any blame away from Biden's mishaps, but in my opinion, the biggest mistake was Trump's deal with the Taliban that set all those wheels in motion. I think they should've just left a small contingent of troops over there. 
    fair, but then what was this about? to me this was clearly stating that you disagreed with the assertion he could not have intentionally fucked over the next admin, thinking HE was going to be the next admin. 

    Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021? lol Gee, if only that coup would've worked out like they planned it. Too bad we still have democratic elections in this country. 
    That was just about the other guy saying Trump just assumed he was going to still be president. If Trump thought that way, it would likely be because he thought he could get away with stealing it or having his January 6 plan work out. I don't think any normal president thinks that way, especially when they had internal and external polling indicating he would lose well before election day like Trump did.
    he had the polls and he called them fake polls. every week that they came out he called them fake polls. even the rasmussen poll, a conservative poll, had him losing badly most of the time.
    Its like what he told Leslie Stahl a few years ago

    https://www.cnbc.com/2018/05/22/trump-told-lesley-stahl-he-bashes-press-to-discredit-negative-stories.html

    chinese-happy.jpg
  • Meltdown99Meltdown99 None Of Your Business...Posts: 10,739
    Too bad for the afghani woman and children…if only they had oil…
    Give Peas A Chance…
  • The JugglerThe Juggler Behind that bush over there.Posts: 42,746
    Too bad for the afghani woman and children…if only they had oil…
    Like the Saudis?
    chinese-happy.jpg
  • mace1229mace1229 Posts: 7,338
    JB16057 said:
    Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021? lol Gee, if only that coup would've worked out like they planned it. Too bad we still have democratic elections in this country. 

    The Trump admin let 5,000 Taliban fighters out of prison in 2020, they set up a really short time frame of which for us to leave, and then did not cooperate fully during the transition period with the incoming administration. So Biden's choices were to start fighting the Taliban again and prolong this two decade war or rip the fucking band aid off and get out. Of those two choices, I think he made the correct one.

    But hindsight being 2020, I don't see the problem with leaving a small troop presence there moving forward. Trump was the one who surrendered to the Taliban and took that possibility off the table. The Biden admin clearly could've handled things better, but it was a lose lose proposition for them. 
    i agree. this was a war we decided to stop fighting. it is a loss because we did not win, and we could not win. we stopped fighting and withdrew. 

    hopefully the government learned something from this. but given the short memory of americans, we will be in another 10 year war over there within the next 5 years.
    I just love the "Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021" line as if there was no way he could lose. Like he just ignored all public and internal polling and just assumed his coup would work if he actually did lose the election.

    Scary stuff. 
    You just love that line? How many other politicians running for any office believe they are going to win? Do you find that funny every time that happens? Hillary thought she was going to win in 2016. Did you laugh at her when she lost?

    If Trump called for an actual coup, insurrection, whatever you want to call it, it would've happened. If Trump told his supporters to take their guns to the Capitol on January 6th and take it over, it would've happened. If Trump called for violence on January 6 at the Capitol, millions upon millions of his followers would've shown up and they would've ripped the Capitol apart. If Trump told his followers to go the Capitol today, it could still happen but it hasn't and it won't.

    Sounds to me like you scare way too easy. Lucky for you, Trump didn't do what I said above and he won't. Everything is going to be OK!
    A few thousand maybe, but not millions and millions. Millions and millions of people who voted for him are not willing to lay their lives down, commit treason and start a full out civil war.
  • The JugglerThe Juggler Behind that bush over there.Posts: 42,746
    mace1229 said:
    JB16057 said:
    Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021? lol Gee, if only that coup would've worked out like they planned it. Too bad we still have democratic elections in this country. 

    The Trump admin let 5,000 Taliban fighters out of prison in 2020, they set up a really short time frame of which for us to leave, and then did not cooperate fully during the transition period with the incoming administration. So Biden's choices were to start fighting the Taliban again and prolong this two decade war or rip the fucking band aid off and get out. Of those two choices, I think he made the correct one.

    But hindsight being 2020, I don't see the problem with leaving a small troop presence there moving forward. Trump was the one who surrendered to the Taliban and took that possibility off the table. The Biden admin clearly could've handled things better, but it was a lose lose proposition for them. 
    i agree. this was a war we decided to stop fighting. it is a loss because we did not win, and we could not win. we stopped fighting and withdrew. 

    hopefully the government learned something from this. but given the short memory of americans, we will be in another 10 year war over there within the next 5 years.
    I just love the "Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021" line as if there was no way he could lose. Like he just ignored all public and internal polling and just assumed his coup would work if he actually did lose the election.

    Scary stuff. 
    You just love that line? How many other politicians running for any office believe they are going to win? Do you find that funny every time that happens? Hillary thought she was going to win in 2016. Did you laugh at her when she lost?

    If Trump called for an actual coup, insurrection, whatever you want to call it, it would've happened. If Trump told his supporters to take their guns to the Capitol on January 6th and take it over, it would've happened. If Trump called for violence on January 6 at the Capitol, millions upon millions of his followers would've shown up and they would've ripped the Capitol apart. If Trump told his followers to go the Capitol today, it could still happen but it hasn't and it won't.

    Sounds to me like you scare way too easy. Lucky for you, Trump didn't do what I said above and he won't. Everything is going to be OK!
    A few thousand maybe, but not millions and millions. Millions and millions of people who voted for him are not willing to lay their lives down, commit treason and start a full out civil war.
    Millions and millions and millions and millions of his supporters believe he won the election though. And that is incredibly damaging to our democracy. 
    chinese-happy.jpg
  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 25,698
    mace1229 said:
    JB16057 said:
    Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021? lol Gee, if only that coup would've worked out like they planned it. Too bad we still have democratic elections in this country. 

    The Trump admin let 5,000 Taliban fighters out of prison in 2020, they set up a really short time frame of which for us to leave, and then did not cooperate fully during the transition period with the incoming administration. So Biden's choices were to start fighting the Taliban again and prolong this two decade war or rip the fucking band aid off and get out. Of those two choices, I think he made the correct one.

    But hindsight being 2020, I don't see the problem with leaving a small troop presence there moving forward. Trump was the one who surrendered to the Taliban and took that possibility off the table. The Biden admin clearly could've handled things better, but it was a lose lose proposition for them. 
    i agree. this was a war we decided to stop fighting. it is a loss because we did not win, and we could not win. we stopped fighting and withdrew. 

    hopefully the government learned something from this. but given the short memory of americans, we will be in another 10 year war over there within the next 5 years.
    I just love the "Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021" line as if there was no way he could lose. Like he just ignored all public and internal polling and just assumed his coup would work if he actually did lose the election.

    Scary stuff. 
    You just love that line? How many other politicians running for any office believe they are going to win? Do you find that funny every time that happens? Hillary thought she was going to win in 2016. Did you laugh at her when she lost?

    If Trump called for an actual coup, insurrection, whatever you want to call it, it would've happened. If Trump told his supporters to take their guns to the Capitol on January 6th and take it over, it would've happened. If Trump called for violence on January 6 at the Capitol, millions upon millions of his followers would've shown up and they would've ripped the Capitol apart. If Trump told his followers to go the Capitol today, it could still happen but it hasn't and it won't.

    Sounds to me like you scare way too easy. Lucky for you, Trump didn't do what I said above and he won't. Everything is going to be OK!
    A few thousand maybe, but not millions and millions. Millions and millions of people who voted for him are not willing to lay their lives down, commit treason and start a full out civil war.
    100%.  The thought that millions would participate in a coup and throw it all away is lunacy. 
  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 25,698
    Especially now,  after they read about these idiots languishing in jail. 
  • mace1229mace1229 Posts: 7,338
    mace1229 said:
    JB16057 said:
    Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021? lol Gee, if only that coup would've worked out like they planned it. Too bad we still have democratic elections in this country. 

    The Trump admin let 5,000 Taliban fighters out of prison in 2020, they set up a really short time frame of which for us to leave, and then did not cooperate fully during the transition period with the incoming administration. So Biden's choices were to start fighting the Taliban again and prolong this two decade war or rip the fucking band aid off and get out. Of those two choices, I think he made the correct one.

    But hindsight being 2020, I don't see the problem with leaving a small troop presence there moving forward. Trump was the one who surrendered to the Taliban and took that possibility off the table. The Biden admin clearly could've handled things better, but it was a lose lose proposition for them. 
    i agree. this was a war we decided to stop fighting. it is a loss because we did not win, and we could not win. we stopped fighting and withdrew. 

    hopefully the government learned something from this. but given the short memory of americans, we will be in another 10 year war over there within the next 5 years.
    I just love the "Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021" line as if there was no way he could lose. Like he just ignored all public and internal polling and just assumed his coup would work if he actually did lose the election.

    Scary stuff. 
    You just love that line? How many other politicians running for any office believe they are going to win? Do you find that funny every time that happens? Hillary thought she was going to win in 2016. Did you laugh at her when she lost?

    If Trump called for an actual coup, insurrection, whatever you want to call it, it would've happened. If Trump told his supporters to take their guns to the Capitol on January 6th and take it over, it would've happened. If Trump called for violence on January 6 at the Capitol, millions upon millions of his followers would've shown up and they would've ripped the Capitol apart. If Trump told his followers to go the Capitol today, it could still happen but it hasn't and it won't.

    Sounds to me like you scare way too easy. Lucky for you, Trump didn't do what I said above and he won't. Everything is going to be OK!
    A few thousand maybe, but not millions and millions. Millions and millions of people who voted for him are not willing to lay their lives down, commit treason and start a full out civil war.
    Millions and millions and millions and millions of his supporters believe he won the election though. And that is incredibly damaging to our democracy. 
    Maybe. But you think they’re willing to lay down their lives for it? I don’t.
  • gimmesometruth27gimmesometruth27 St. Fuckin LouisPosts: 20,051
    mrussel1 said:
    mace1229 said:
    JB16057 said:
    Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021? lol Gee, if only that coup would've worked out like they planned it. Too bad we still have democratic elections in this country. 

    The Trump admin let 5,000 Taliban fighters out of prison in 2020, they set up a really short time frame of which for us to leave, and then did not cooperate fully during the transition period with the incoming administration. So Biden's choices were to start fighting the Taliban again and prolong this two decade war or rip the fucking band aid off and get out. Of those two choices, I think he made the correct one.

    But hindsight being 2020, I don't see the problem with leaving a small troop presence there moving forward. Trump was the one who surrendered to the Taliban and took that possibility off the table. The Biden admin clearly could've handled things better, but it was a lose lose proposition for them. 
    i agree. this was a war we decided to stop fighting. it is a loss because we did not win, and we could not win. we stopped fighting and withdrew. 

    hopefully the government learned something from this. but given the short memory of americans, we will be in another 10 year war over there within the next 5 years.
    I just love the "Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021" line as if there was no way he could lose. Like he just ignored all public and internal polling and just assumed his coup would work if he actually did lose the election.

    Scary stuff. 
    You just love that line? How many other politicians running for any office believe they are going to win? Do you find that funny every time that happens? Hillary thought she was going to win in 2016. Did you laugh at her when she lost?

    If Trump called for an actual coup, insurrection, whatever you want to call it, it would've happened. If Trump told his supporters to take their guns to the Capitol on January 6th and take it over, it would've happened. If Trump called for violence on January 6 at the Capitol, millions upon millions of his followers would've shown up and they would've ripped the Capitol apart. If Trump told his followers to go the Capitol today, it could still happen but it hasn't and it won't.

    Sounds to me like you scare way too easy. Lucky for you, Trump didn't do what I said above and he won't. Everything is going to be OK!
    A few thousand maybe, but not millions and millions. Millions and millions of people who voted for him are not willing to lay their lives down, commit treason and start a full out civil war.
    100%.  The thought that millions would participate in a coup and throw it all away is lunacy. 
    do not ever forget that it is the stupid people who are always full of confidence.

    i would not dismiss these proud boys, boogaloo bois, and 3 percenters so easily. especially when they have 3 networks dedicated to their cause, fox, oann, and newsmax, and several trumpists in congress and the senate. i mean some of the congressmen, gosar, gaetz, maggie 3 names, are actually speaking on behalf of them and defending them and calling them political prisoners instead of felons.
    There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self.- Hemingway

    "Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
  • The JugglerThe Juggler Behind that bush over there.Posts: 42,746
    mace1229 said:
    mace1229 said:
    JB16057 said:
    Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021? lol Gee, if only that coup would've worked out like they planned it. Too bad we still have democratic elections in this country. 

    The Trump admin let 5,000 Taliban fighters out of prison in 2020, they set up a really short time frame of which for us to leave, and then did not cooperate fully during the transition period with the incoming administration. So Biden's choices were to start fighting the Taliban again and prolong this two decade war or rip the fucking band aid off and get out. Of those two choices, I think he made the correct one.

    But hindsight being 2020, I don't see the problem with leaving a small troop presence there moving forward. Trump was the one who surrendered to the Taliban and took that possibility off the table. The Biden admin clearly could've handled things better, but it was a lose lose proposition for them. 
    i agree. this was a war we decided to stop fighting. it is a loss because we did not win, and we could not win. we stopped fighting and withdrew. 

    hopefully the government learned something from this. but given the short memory of americans, we will be in another 10 year war over there within the next 5 years.
    I just love the "Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021" line as if there was no way he could lose. Like he just ignored all public and internal polling and just assumed his coup would work if he actually did lose the election.

    Scary stuff. 
    You just love that line? How many other politicians running for any office believe they are going to win? Do you find that funny every time that happens? Hillary thought she was going to win in 2016. Did you laugh at her when she lost?

    If Trump called for an actual coup, insurrection, whatever you want to call it, it would've happened. If Trump told his supporters to take their guns to the Capitol on January 6th and take it over, it would've happened. If Trump called for violence on January 6 at the Capitol, millions upon millions of his followers would've shown up and they would've ripped the Capitol apart. If Trump told his followers to go the Capitol today, it could still happen but it hasn't and it won't.

    Sounds to me like you scare way too easy. Lucky for you, Trump didn't do what I said above and he won't. Everything is going to be OK!
    A few thousand maybe, but not millions and millions. Millions and millions of people who voted for him are not willing to lay their lives down, commit treason and start a full out civil war.
    Millions and millions and millions and millions of his supporters believe he won the election though. And that is incredibly damaging to our democracy. 
    Maybe. But you think they’re willing to lay down their lives for it? I don’t.
    Out of 43 million people? Yeah, I am sure some of them would.
    https://www.newsweek.com/59-gop-voters-say-believing-trump-won-2020-important-being-republican-poll-1628281

    chinese-happy.jpg
  • The JugglerThe Juggler Behind that bush over there.Posts: 42,746
    mrussel1 said:
    mace1229 said:
    JB16057 said:
    Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021? lol Gee, if only that coup would've worked out like they planned it. Too bad we still have democratic elections in this country. 

    The Trump admin let 5,000 Taliban fighters out of prison in 2020, they set up a really short time frame of which for us to leave, and then did not cooperate fully during the transition period with the incoming administration. So Biden's choices were to start fighting the Taliban again and prolong this two decade war or rip the fucking band aid off and get out. Of those two choices, I think he made the correct one.

    But hindsight being 2020, I don't see the problem with leaving a small troop presence there moving forward. Trump was the one who surrendered to the Taliban and took that possibility off the table. The Biden admin clearly could've handled things better, but it was a lose lose proposition for them. 
    i agree. this was a war we decided to stop fighting. it is a loss because we did not win, and we could not win. we stopped fighting and withdrew. 

    hopefully the government learned something from this. but given the short memory of americans, we will be in another 10 year war over there within the next 5 years.
    I just love the "Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021" line as if there was no way he could lose. Like he just ignored all public and internal polling and just assumed his coup would work if he actually did lose the election.

    Scary stuff. 
    You just love that line? How many other politicians running for any office believe they are going to win? Do you find that funny every time that happens? Hillary thought she was going to win in 2016. Did you laugh at her when she lost?

    If Trump called for an actual coup, insurrection, whatever you want to call it, it would've happened. If Trump told his supporters to take their guns to the Capitol on January 6th and take it over, it would've happened. If Trump called for violence on January 6 at the Capitol, millions upon millions of his followers would've shown up and they would've ripped the Capitol apart. If Trump told his followers to go the Capitol today, it could still happen but it hasn't and it won't.

    Sounds to me like you scare way too easy. Lucky for you, Trump didn't do what I said above and he won't. Everything is going to be OK!
    A few thousand maybe, but not millions and millions. Millions and millions of people who voted for him are not willing to lay their lives down, commit treason and start a full out civil war.
    100%.  The thought that millions would participate in a coup and throw it all away is lunacy. 
    do not ever forget that it is the stupid people who are always full of confidence.

    i would not dismiss these proud boys, boogaloo bois, and 3 percenters so easily. especially when they have 3 networks dedicated to their cause, fox, oann, and newsmax, and several trumpists in congress and the senate. i mean some of the congressmen, gosar, gaetz, maggie 3 names, are actually speaking on behalf of them and defending them and calling them political prisoners instead of felons.
    There were 19 hijackers on 9/11. The idea that you need millions and millions is lunacy.

    All it takes is a few brainwashed wackjobs. Lord knows there are tons of those people in our country right now. 

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  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 25,698
    mrussel1 said:
    mace1229 said:
    JB16057 said:
    Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021? lol Gee, if only that coup would've worked out like they planned it. Too bad we still have democratic elections in this country. 

    The Trump admin let 5,000 Taliban fighters out of prison in 2020, they set up a really short time frame of which for us to leave, and then did not cooperate fully during the transition period with the incoming administration. So Biden's choices were to start fighting the Taliban again and prolong this two decade war or rip the fucking band aid off and get out. Of those two choices, I think he made the correct one.

    But hindsight being 2020, I don't see the problem with leaving a small troop presence there moving forward. Trump was the one who surrendered to the Taliban and took that possibility off the table. The Biden admin clearly could've handled things better, but it was a lose lose proposition for them. 
    i agree. this was a war we decided to stop fighting. it is a loss because we did not win, and we could not win. we stopped fighting and withdrew. 

    hopefully the government learned something from this. but given the short memory of americans, we will be in another 10 year war over there within the next 5 years.
    I just love the "Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021" line as if there was no way he could lose. Like he just ignored all public and internal polling and just assumed his coup would work if he actually did lose the election.

    Scary stuff. 
    You just love that line? How many other politicians running for any office believe they are going to win? Do you find that funny every time that happens? Hillary thought she was going to win in 2016. Did you laugh at her when she lost?

    If Trump called for an actual coup, insurrection, whatever you want to call it, it would've happened. If Trump told his supporters to take their guns to the Capitol on January 6th and take it over, it would've happened. If Trump called for violence on January 6 at the Capitol, millions upon millions of his followers would've shown up and they would've ripped the Capitol apart. If Trump told his followers to go the Capitol today, it could still happen but it hasn't and it won't.

    Sounds to me like you scare way too easy. Lucky for you, Trump didn't do what I said above and he won't. Everything is going to be OK!
    A few thousand maybe, but not millions and millions. Millions and millions of people who voted for him are not willing to lay their lives down, commit treason and start a full out civil war.
    100%.  The thought that millions would participate in a coup and throw it all away is lunacy. 
    do not ever forget that it is the stupid people who are always full of confidence.

    i would not dismiss these proud boys, boogaloo bois, and 3 percenters so easily. especially when they have 3 networks dedicated to their cause, fox, oann, and newsmax, and several trumpists in congress and the senate. i mean some of the congressmen, gosar, gaetz, maggie 3 names, are actually speaking on behalf of them and defending them and calling them political prisoners instead of felons.
    There were 19 hijackers on 9/11. The idea that you need millions and millions is lunacy.

    All it takes is a few brainwashed wackjobs. Lord knows there are tons of those people in our country right now. 

    To take over the political and military apparatus in this country? You need more than 19.
  • The JugglerThe Juggler Behind that bush over there.Posts: 42,746
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mace1229 said:
    JB16057 said:
    Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021? lol Gee, if only that coup would've worked out like they planned it. Too bad we still have democratic elections in this country. 

    The Trump admin let 5,000 Taliban fighters out of prison in 2020, they set up a really short time frame of which for us to leave, and then did not cooperate fully during the transition period with the incoming administration. So Biden's choices were to start fighting the Taliban again and prolong this two decade war or rip the fucking band aid off and get out. Of those two choices, I think he made the correct one.

    But hindsight being 2020, I don't see the problem with leaving a small troop presence there moving forward. Trump was the one who surrendered to the Taliban and took that possibility off the table. The Biden admin clearly could've handled things better, but it was a lose lose proposition for them. 
    i agree. this was a war we decided to stop fighting. it is a loss because we did not win, and we could not win. we stopped fighting and withdrew. 

    hopefully the government learned something from this. but given the short memory of americans, we will be in another 10 year war over there within the next 5 years.
    I just love the "Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021" line as if there was no way he could lose. Like he just ignored all public and internal polling and just assumed his coup would work if he actually did lose the election.

    Scary stuff. 
    You just love that line? How many other politicians running for any office believe they are going to win? Do you find that funny every time that happens? Hillary thought she was going to win in 2016. Did you laugh at her when she lost?

    If Trump called for an actual coup, insurrection, whatever you want to call it, it would've happened. If Trump told his supporters to take their guns to the Capitol on January 6th and take it over, it would've happened. If Trump called for violence on January 6 at the Capitol, millions upon millions of his followers would've shown up and they would've ripped the Capitol apart. If Trump told his followers to go the Capitol today, it could still happen but it hasn't and it won't.

    Sounds to me like you scare way too easy. Lucky for you, Trump didn't do what I said above and he won't. Everything is going to be OK!
    A few thousand maybe, but not millions and millions. Millions and millions of people who voted for him are not willing to lay their lives down, commit treason and start a full out civil war.
    100%.  The thought that millions would participate in a coup and throw it all away is lunacy. 
    do not ever forget that it is the stupid people who are always full of confidence.

    i would not dismiss these proud boys, boogaloo bois, and 3 percenters so easily. especially when they have 3 networks dedicated to their cause, fox, oann, and newsmax, and several trumpists in congress and the senate. i mean some of the congressmen, gosar, gaetz, maggie 3 names, are actually speaking on behalf of them and defending them and calling them political prisoners instead of felons.
    There were 19 hijackers on 9/11. The idea that you need millions and millions is lunacy.

    All it takes is a few brainwashed wackjobs. Lord knows there are tons of those people in our country right now. 

    To take over the political and military apparatus in this country? You need more than 19.
    No. I'm saying it just takes a few people willing to lay down their lives to defend Trump's lies.

    So whether it's a few people, a few hundred people, or a few thousand people like mace said, they could cause an incredible amount of damage. Those 19 hijackers basically changed the trajectory of the entire world in the span of a few hours. 
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  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 25,698
    edited October 2021
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mace1229 said:
    JB16057 said:
    Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021? lol Gee, if only that coup would've worked out like they planned it. Too bad we still have democratic elections in this country. 

    The Trump admin let 5,000 Taliban fighters out of prison in 2020, they set up a really short time frame of which for us to leave, and then did not cooperate fully during the transition period with the incoming administration. So Biden's choices were to start fighting the Taliban again and prolong this two decade war or rip the fucking band aid off and get out. Of those two choices, I think he made the correct one.

    But hindsight being 2020, I don't see the problem with leaving a small troop presence there moving forward. Trump was the one who surrendered to the Taliban and took that possibility off the table. The Biden admin clearly could've handled things better, but it was a lose lose proposition for them. 
    i agree. this was a war we decided to stop fighting. it is a loss because we did not win, and we could not win. we stopped fighting and withdrew. 

    hopefully the government learned something from this. but given the short memory of americans, we will be in another 10 year war over there within the next 5 years.
    I just love the "Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021" line as if there was no way he could lose. Like he just ignored all public and internal polling and just assumed his coup would work if he actually did lose the election.

    Scary stuff. 
    You just love that line? How many other politicians running for any office believe they are going to win? Do you find that funny every time that happens? Hillary thought she was going to win in 2016. Did you laugh at her when she lost?

    If Trump called for an actual coup, insurrection, whatever you want to call it, it would've happened. If Trump told his supporters to take their guns to the Capitol on January 6th and take it over, it would've happened. If Trump called for violence on January 6 at the Capitol, millions upon millions of his followers would've shown up and they would've ripped the Capitol apart. If Trump told his followers to go the Capitol today, it could still happen but it hasn't and it won't.

    Sounds to me like you scare way too easy. Lucky for you, Trump didn't do what I said above and he won't. Everything is going to be OK!
    A few thousand maybe, but not millions and millions. Millions and millions of people who voted for him are not willing to lay their lives down, commit treason and start a full out civil war.
    100%.  The thought that millions would participate in a coup and throw it all away is lunacy. 
    do not ever forget that it is the stupid people who are always full of confidence.

    i would not dismiss these proud boys, boogaloo bois, and 3 percenters so easily. especially when they have 3 networks dedicated to their cause, fox, oann, and newsmax, and several trumpists in congress and the senate. i mean some of the congressmen, gosar, gaetz, maggie 3 names, are actually speaking on behalf of them and defending them and calling them political prisoners instead of felons.
    There were 19 hijackers on 9/11. The idea that you need millions and millions is lunacy.

    All it takes is a few brainwashed wackjobs. Lord knows there are tons of those people in our country right now. 

    To take over the political and military apparatus in this country? You need more than 19.
    No. I'm saying it just takes a few people willing to lay down their lives to defend Trump's lies.

    So whether it's a few people, a few hundred people, or a few thousand people like mace said, they could cause an incredible amount of damage. Those 19 hijackers basically changed the trajectory of the entire world in the span of a few hours. 
    That's fine, I'm not arguing that.  JB said if Trump called for a coup then millions and millions have torn the Capitol apart and the coup would have happened.  I'm saying... no... millions and millions would not have thrown away their lives and got mowed down by the military.
  • The JugglerThe Juggler Behind that bush over there.Posts: 42,746
    edited October 2021
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mace1229 said:
    JB16057 said:
    Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021? lol Gee, if only that coup would've worked out like they planned it. Too bad we still have democratic elections in this country. 

    The Trump admin let 5,000 Taliban fighters out of prison in 2020, they set up a really short time frame of which for us to leave, and then did not cooperate fully during the transition period with the incoming administration. So Biden's choices were to start fighting the Taliban again and prolong this two decade war or rip the fucking band aid off and get out. Of those two choices, I think he made the correct one.

    But hindsight being 2020, I don't see the problem with leaving a small troop presence there moving forward. Trump was the one who surrendered to the Taliban and took that possibility off the table. The Biden admin clearly could've handled things better, but it was a lose lose proposition for them. 
    i agree. this was a war we decided to stop fighting. it is a loss because we did not win, and we could not win. we stopped fighting and withdrew. 

    hopefully the government learned something from this. but given the short memory of americans, we will be in another 10 year war over there within the next 5 years.
    I just love the "Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021" line as if there was no way he could lose. Like he just ignored all public and internal polling and just assumed his coup would work if he actually did lose the election.

    Scary stuff. 
    You just love that line? How many other politicians running for any office believe they are going to win? Do you find that funny every time that happens? Hillary thought she was going to win in 2016. Did you laugh at her when she lost?

    If Trump called for an actual coup, insurrection, whatever you want to call it, it would've happened. If Trump told his supporters to take their guns to the Capitol on January 6th and take it over, it would've happened. If Trump called for violence on January 6 at the Capitol, millions upon millions of his followers would've shown up and they would've ripped the Capitol apart. If Trump told his followers to go the Capitol today, it could still happen but it hasn't and it won't.

    Sounds to me like you scare way too easy. Lucky for you, Trump didn't do what I said above and he won't. Everything is going to be OK!
    A few thousand maybe, but not millions and millions. Millions and millions of people who voted for him are not willing to lay their lives down, commit treason and start a full out civil war.
    100%.  The thought that millions would participate in a coup and throw it all away is lunacy. 
    do not ever forget that it is the stupid people who are always full of confidence.

    i would not dismiss these proud boys, boogaloo bois, and 3 percenters so easily. especially when they have 3 networks dedicated to their cause, fox, oann, and newsmax, and several trumpists in congress and the senate. i mean some of the congressmen, gosar, gaetz, maggie 3 names, are actually speaking on behalf of them and defending them and calling them political prisoners instead of felons.
    There were 19 hijackers on 9/11. The idea that you need millions and millions is lunacy.

    All it takes is a few brainwashed wackjobs. Lord knows there are tons of those people in our country right now. 

    To take over the political and military apparatus in this country? You need more than 19.
    No. I'm saying it just takes a few people willing to lay down their lives to defend Trump's lies.

    So whether it's a few people, a few hundred people, or a few thousand people like mace said, they could cause an incredible amount of damage. Those 19 hijackers basically changed the trajectory of the entire world in the span of a few hours. 
    That's fine, I'm not arguing that.  JB said if Trump called for a coup then millions and millions have torn the Capitol apart and the coup would have happened.  I'm saying... no... millions and millions would not have thrown away their lives and got mowed down by the military.
    Yeah, to me, that kind of talk is nonsense and meant to try and minimize what actually happened on 1/6.
    Post edited by The Juggler on
    chinese-happy.jpg
  • mace1229mace1229 Posts: 7,338
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mace1229 said:
    JB16057 said:
    Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021? lol Gee, if only that coup would've worked out like they planned it. Too bad we still have democratic elections in this country. 

    The Trump admin let 5,000 Taliban fighters out of prison in 2020, they set up a really short time frame of which for us to leave, and then did not cooperate fully during the transition period with the incoming administration. So Biden's choices were to start fighting the Taliban again and prolong this two decade war or rip the fucking band aid off and get out. Of those two choices, I think he made the correct one.

    But hindsight being 2020, I don't see the problem with leaving a small troop presence there moving forward. Trump was the one who surrendered to the Taliban and took that possibility off the table. The Biden admin clearly could've handled things better, but it was a lose lose proposition for them. 
    i agree. this was a war we decided to stop fighting. it is a loss because we did not win, and we could not win. we stopped fighting and withdrew. 

    hopefully the government learned something from this. but given the short memory of americans, we will be in another 10 year war over there within the next 5 years.
    I just love the "Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021" line as if there was no way he could lose. Like he just ignored all public and internal polling and just assumed his coup would work if he actually did lose the election.

    Scary stuff. 
    You just love that line? How many other politicians running for any office believe they are going to win? Do you find that funny every time that happens? Hillary thought she was going to win in 2016. Did you laugh at her when she lost?

    If Trump called for an actual coup, insurrection, whatever you want to call it, it would've happened. If Trump told his supporters to take their guns to the Capitol on January 6th and take it over, it would've happened. If Trump called for violence on January 6 at the Capitol, millions upon millions of his followers would've shown up and they would've ripped the Capitol apart. If Trump told his followers to go the Capitol today, it could still happen but it hasn't and it won't.

    Sounds to me like you scare way too easy. Lucky for you, Trump didn't do what I said above and he won't. Everything is going to be OK!
    A few thousand maybe, but not millions and millions. Millions and millions of people who voted for him are not willing to lay their lives down, commit treason and start a full out civil war.
    100%.  The thought that millions would participate in a coup and throw it all away is lunacy. 
    do not ever forget that it is the stupid people who are always full of confidence.

    i would not dismiss these proud boys, boogaloo bois, and 3 percenters so easily. especially when they have 3 networks dedicated to their cause, fox, oann, and newsmax, and several trumpists in congress and the senate. i mean some of the congressmen, gosar, gaetz, maggie 3 names, are actually speaking on behalf of them and defending them and calling them political prisoners instead of felons.
    There were 19 hijackers on 9/11. The idea that you need millions and millions is lunacy.

    All it takes is a few brainwashed wackjobs. Lord knows there are tons of those people in our country right now. 

    To take over the political and military apparatus in this country? You need more than 19.
    No. I'm saying it just takes a few people willing to lay down their lives to defend Trump's lies.

    So whether it's a few people, a few hundred people, or a few thousand people like mace said, they could cause an incredible amount of damage. Those 19 hijackers basically changed the trajectory of the entire world in the span of a few hours. 
    That's fine, I'm not arguing that.  JB said if Trump called for a coup then millions and millions have torn the Capitol apart and the coup would have happened.  I'm saying... no... millions and millions would not have thrown away their lives and got mowed down by the military.
    Yup, my thoughts exactly. Just disagreed with the comment that “millions and millions” would show up, armed and ready to fight for Trump. 

  • mace1229mace1229 Posts: 7,338
    mace1229 said:
    mace1229 said:
    JB16057 said:
    Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021? lol Gee, if only that coup would've worked out like they planned it. Too bad we still have democratic elections in this country. 

    The Trump admin let 5,000 Taliban fighters out of prison in 2020, they set up a really short time frame of which for us to leave, and then did not cooperate fully during the transition period with the incoming administration. So Biden's choices were to start fighting the Taliban again and prolong this two decade war or rip the fucking band aid off and get out. Of those two choices, I think he made the correct one.

    But hindsight being 2020, I don't see the problem with leaving a small troop presence there moving forward. Trump was the one who surrendered to the Taliban and took that possibility off the table. The Biden admin clearly could've handled things better, but it was a lose lose proposition for them. 
    i agree. this was a war we decided to stop fighting. it is a loss because we did not win, and we could not win. we stopped fighting and withdrew. 

    hopefully the government learned something from this. but given the short memory of americans, we will be in another 10 year war over there within the next 5 years.
    I just love the "Trump thought he was going to be president in 2021" line as if there was no way he could lose. Like he just ignored all public and internal polling and just assumed his coup would work if he actually did lose the election.

    Scary stuff. 
    You just love that line? How many other politicians running for any office believe they are going to win? Do you find that funny every time that happens? Hillary thought she was going to win in 2016. Did you laugh at her when she lost?

    If Trump called for an actual coup, insurrection, whatever you want to call it, it would've happened. If Trump told his supporters to take their guns to the Capitol on January 6th and take it over, it would've happened. If Trump called for violence on January 6 at the Capitol, millions upon millions of his followers would've shown up and they would've ripped the Capitol apart. If Trump told his followers to go the Capitol today, it could still happen but it hasn't and it won't.

    Sounds to me like you scare way too easy. Lucky for you, Trump didn't do what I said above and he won't. Everything is going to be OK!
    A few thousand maybe, but not millions and millions. Millions and millions of people who voted for him are not willing to lay their lives down, commit treason and start a full out civil war.
    Millions and millions and millions and millions of his supporters believe he won the election though. And that is incredibly damaging to our democracy. 
    Maybe. But you think they’re willing to lay down their lives for it? I don’t.
    Out of 43 million people? Yeah, I am sure some of them would.
    https://www.newsweek.com/59-gop-voters-say-believing-trump-won-2020-important-being-republican-poll-1628281

    Yeah, some I’m sure would. Just don’t agree that millions and millions would, like JB said. That’s all I said, Trump won’t get millions and millions to die for him. If you agree with that, then I’m not sure what we’re arguing about?
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