Shut out once again. Ten Club, I would like an explanation

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  • amethgr8
    amethgr8 Posts: 766
    I read that the odds indicated demand regardless of all priority combined.

    Moses name was not selected. It's messed up, disappointing and a devasting sinking feeling when you feel rejected for something we love so much.

    The times I got shut out I would have never thought I would go and end up with public seats, but I'm glad I did. But it stung for a day or,week.
    Amy The Great #74594
    New Orleans LA 7/4/95 reschedule 9/17/95
    Chicago IL 1998, 10/9/00, 06/18/03, 05/16/06, 05/17/06
    08/23/09, 08/24/09, Lolla 08/05/07
    Champaign IL 4/23/03
    Grand Rapids MI VFC 10/03/04
    Grand Rapids MI 19May06
    Noblesville IN 05/07/10 Cleveland OH 05/09/10
    PJ 20 2011
    Baltimore MD, Charlottesville VA, Seattle WA 2013
    St. Louis MO, Milwaukee WI 2014
    Tampa FL, Chicago IL, Lexington KY 2016
    Missoula MT 2018
  • myoung321
    myoung321 Posts: 2,855
    edited January 2020
    Definitely not a “fair” process. When the odds are 99% for reserved tickets for most shows, and there are this many upset 10c members, it’s obvious they (Ticketmaster and 10c) messed up. What a shame. 
    Just because the odds were 99% when entered does not mean it stayed at 99% - a majority were much much lower as the lottery ended.

    3 hours before lottery ended MSG - TOR - BAL were like 60% Res & 10% GA 
    "The heart and mind are the true lens of the camera." - Yusuf Karsh
     


  • OceansJenny
    OceansJenny Manhattan, NY Posts: 3,409
    Argue till the sun comes down... isn’t going to get you tickets!
    DC '03 - Reading '04 - Philly '05 - Camden 1 '06 - DC '06 - E. Rutherford '06 - The Vic '07 - Lollapalooza '07 - DC '08 - EV DC 1 & 2 '08 (Met Ed!!) - EV Baltimore 1 & 2 '09 - EV NYC 1 '11 (Met Ed!) - Hartford '13 - GCF '15 - MSG 2 '16 - TOTD MSG '16 - Boston 1 & 2 '18 - SHN '21 - EV NYC 1 & 2 '22 - MSG '22
  • mace1229
    mace1229 Posts: 9,824
    myoung321 said:
    Definitely not a “fair” process. When the odds are 99% for reserved tickets for most shows, and there are this many upset 10c members, it’s obvious they (Ticketmaster and 10c) messed up. What a shame. 
    Just because the odds were 99% when entered does not mean it stayed at 99% - a majority were much much lower as the lottery ended.

    3 hours before lottery ended MSG - TOR - BAL were like 60% Res & 10% GA 
    All but Baltimore and MSG were still 99% for reserve at the last update.
  • mace1229
    mace1229 Posts: 9,824
    I’ll be more interested in several days to see how many got shut out and how many got in. There seems to already be a few who go a CC issue email, not sure if they were declined or confirmed at first though.
    There was definitely some shenanigans going on today. But from most of what I read it still seems like most who didn’t get tickets either got shut out on everything or never heard so they assume it was a no.

    With the exception on Bal and MSG, did anyone get confirmed for pick 1 and actually get an email denied for pick 2? If it was really due to high demand that should be the case, but I haven’t heard many with that. It’s either “I got denied for my first pick” or “I never heard anything.”
  • rider10
    rider10 Posts: 41
    Kevinman said:
    Definitely not a “fair” process. When the odds are 99% for reserved tickets for most shows, and there are this many upset 10c members, it’s obvious they (Ticketmaster and 10c) messed up. What a shame. 
    From what I understood the 99% was for those who selected that as their 1st choice.  Not for someone who selected BA or GA then Res.
    I've already said it in other threads but I requested only for reserved seats in STL and got declined. Other people have pointed out that people with that show as their second choice got tickets though. I'm disappointed but mostly confused by what happened.
  • I am fairly certain that Kevinman has nailed it on two counts. The first is that 99% odds are relative to first choice only. I believe this is how it has been since we could put in for unlimited shows. He is also correct that it could have been explained more clearly for newer members. That being said, those who are complaining/threatening to leave Tenclub because Best Available does not supersede Reserved need to get a grip. Why should you have an equal shot to someone's first choice when you already had a shot at GA? Doesn't make sense at all and wouldn't be fair.

    I feel for those who did not get tickets, but keep in mind that this has happened to nearly all of us at some point. I have been a member since the '90s, and I was shut out for the 2016 Boston and Chicago shows and the Temple of the Dog shows. It was a bummer, but so it goes (KV).     
  • JimmyV
    JimmyV Boston's MetroWest Posts: 19,597
    rider10 said:
    Kevinman said:
    Definitely not a “fair” process. When the odds are 99% for reserved tickets for most shows, and there are this many upset 10c members, it’s obvious they (Ticketmaster and 10c) messed up. What a shame. 
    From what I understood the 99% was for those who selected that as their 1st choice.  Not for someone who selected BA or GA then Res.
    I've already said it in other threads but I requested only for reserved seats in STL and got declined. Other people have pointed out that people with that show as their second choice got tickets though. I'm disappointed but mostly confused by what happened.
    Write and call 10c and keep writing and calling until they give you an actual explanation. That shouldn't have happened to anyone. Hope you make it into the show.
    ___________________________________________

    "...I changed by not changing at all..."
  • hedonist
    hedonist Posts: 24,524
    Argue till the sun comes down... isn’t going to get you tickets!
    :no_mouth:

    =)
  • mace1229
    mace1229 Posts: 9,824
    I am fairly certain that Kevinman has nailed it on two counts. The first is that 99% odds are relative to first choice only. I believe this is how it has been since we could put in for unlimited shows. He is also correct that it could have been explained more clearly for newer members. That being said, those who are complaining/threatening to leave Tenclub because Best Available does not supersede Reserved need to get a grip. Why should you have an equal shot to someone's first choice when you already had a shot at GA? Doesn't make sense at all and wouldn't be fair.

    I feel for those who did not get tickets, but keep in mind that this has happened to nearly all of us at some point. I have been a member since the '90s, and I was shut out for the 2016 Boston and Chicago shows and the Temple of the Dog shows. It was a bummer, but so it goes (KV).     
    The % in previous lotteries has always been based on overall picks, not just your first pick  to my knowledge.

    And Reserved over BA makes nonsense. They should be equal. Who says reserved was a second choice? Many just want the best chance at a ticket so to selected either-or as the option. Some prefer a seat, some prefer GA, most just want a ticket. Sure, most probably prefer GA, but also probably wouldn’t have chosen BA if they knew it lessened their chances of getting in.
    I assumed it worked this way. If your name was pulled and you selected GA only you got GA, unless that was filled then you got rejected. If you picked Reserved then you got Reserved, unless it was filled. If you picked BA it considered GA then moved to Reserved if none was available. Why should it not work like that?
  • rider10
    rider10 Posts: 41
    JimmyV said:
    rider10 said:
    I've already said it in other threads but I requested only for reserved seats in STL and got declined. Other people have pointed out that people with that show as their second choice got tickets though. I'm disappointed but mostly confused by what happened.
    Write and call 10c and keep writing and calling until they give you an actual explanation. That shouldn't have happened to anyone. Hope you make it into the show.
    I appreciate it. I've never worked with 10 club customer service before. Obviously I don't expect that they can fix my ticket situation but are they generally pretty helpful and response to inquiries like this?
  • tubes10s
    tubes10s Posts: 543
    Just my opinion, but this is how I see this lottery system working with the descriptions we were all given before we all made our selections:

    All 1st Priority BA, 1st Priority GA-only, and 1st Priority Reserved-only names are thrown into the pool.  Names are drawn.  Names drawn with BA as their choice get GA until GA tickets are gone, and then names drawn with BA as their choice get Reserved tickets.  Names drawn with GA-only get GA tickets when they get picked as long as there are GA tickets remaining.  Names drawn with Reserved-only get Reserved tickets when they get picked as long as there are Reserved tickets remaining.  This continues until all tickets are gone.  If all 1st Priority names are drawn and there are still tickets left, then repeat this process with 2nd Priority, etc.  

    I tend to believe that this is how it worked... or is at least this is how it was intended to work based on the emails we received before signing up for tickets.  To think that Reserved-only or GA-only were going to give precedence over BA in any scenario at all just doesn't make sense.  Choosing BA says "just get me in the building."  It gives you access to 100% of the available tickets.  Every ticket in the building is the Best Available at some point in the process.  Choosing GA-only or Reserved-only is of course going to lower your chances compared to BA.  Those choices give you access to some percentage LESS THAN 100% of the available tickets.  
    8-31-98 - Raleigh
    8-3-00 - Virginia Beach
    4-16-03 - Charlotte
    5-27-06 - Camden 1
    5-28-06 - Camden 2
    5-30-06 - DC
    6-17-08 - Virginia Beach
    6-22-08 - DC
    5-13-10 - Bristow
    10-27-13 - Baltimore
    10-29-13 - Charlottesville
    4-18-16 - Hampton
  • djsmoot
    djsmoot Posts: 126
    Same thing happened to me.

    i put in for Stl and Nash... both Best Available and both at 99%. My wife then entered for GA only for the same shows... 0 for 4. 


  • tubes10s
    tubes10s Posts: 543
    Kevinman said:

    I’m pretty sure BA is the same as 1st choice GA, 2nd choice Res.  Haven’t seen anything to tell me this is wrong.
    I don't think that's it at all.  BA says "any ticket will do."  BA is not 2 choices.  It's just one choice without section restrictions.  At some point in the drawing process, every ticket in the building is the Best Available.  Even when there is only 1 Reserved ticket in the last row remaining... that ticket is still the Best Available.  
    8-31-98 - Raleigh
    8-3-00 - Virginia Beach
    4-16-03 - Charlotte
    5-27-06 - Camden 1
    5-28-06 - Camden 2
    5-30-06 - DC
    6-17-08 - Virginia Beach
    6-22-08 - DC
    5-13-10 - Bristow
    10-27-13 - Baltimore
    10-29-13 - Charlottesville
    4-18-16 - Hampton
  • mace1229 said:
    I am fairly certain that Kevinman has nailed it on two counts. The first is that 99% odds are relative to first choice only. I believe this is how it has been since we could put in for unlimited shows. He is also correct that it could have been explained more clearly for newer members. That being said, those who are complaining/threatening to leave Tenclub because Best Available does not supersede Reserved need to get a grip. Why should you have an equal shot to someone's first choice when you already had a shot at GA? Doesn't make sense at all and wouldn't be fair.

    I feel for those who did not get tickets, but keep in mind that this has happened to nearly all of us at some point. I have been a member since the '90s, and I was shut out for the 2016 Boston and Chicago shows and the Temple of the Dog shows. It was a bummer, but so it goes (KV).     
    The % in previous lotteries has always been based on overall picks, not just your first pick  to my knowledge.

    And Reserved over BA makes nonsense. They should be equal. Who says reserved was a second choice? Many just want the best chance at a ticket so to selected either-or as the option. Some prefer a seat, some prefer GA, most just want a ticket. Sure, most probably prefer GA, but also probably wouldn’t have chosen BA if they knew it lessened their chances of getting in.
    I assumed it worked this way. If your name was pulled and you selected GA only you got GA, unless that was filled then you got rejected. If you picked Reserved then you got Reserved, unless it was filled. If you picked BA it considered GA then moved to Reserved if none was available. Why should it not work like that?

    Respectfully, I can't fathom how the % would be based on overall picks, because that percentage would then include sixth, seventh, eighth choices. There is no way mathematically any show could be 99% under those terms, particularly when the number of available tickets has always been fewer, according to the Tenclub presale information/summary itself.

    Regarding the BA/Reserved question, I can see your perspective and understand why people are confused, but there is no logical way the two are equal. Assuming first choices for both, BA can't have two shots while Reserved has only one. If that were the case, it would be pure foolishness for anyone to request Reserved unless they absolutely wanted the ability to sit down or they hated open spaces. I would say the solution to that uncertainty is to eliminate Best Available altogether, which has proven to be a less than ideal addition.   
  • pulling69
    pulling69 KBTL Posts: 1,005

    "Populated with every reject and cutthroat from Bombay to Calcutta. It's worse than Detroit."
  • tubes10s said:
    Just my opinion, but this is how I see this lottery system working with the descriptions we were all given before we all made our selections:

    All 1st Priority BA, 1st Priority GA-only, and 1st Priority Reserved-only names are thrown into the pool.  Names are drawn.  Names drawn with BA as their choice get GA until GA tickets are gone, and then names drawn with BA as their choice get Reserved tickets.  Names drawn with GA-only get GA tickets when they get picked as long as there are GA tickets remaining.  Names drawn with Reserved-only get Reserved tickets when they get picked as long as there are Reserved tickets remaining.  This continues until all tickets are gone.  If all 1st Priority names are drawn and there are still tickets left, then repeat this process with 2nd Priority, etc.  

    I tend to believe that this is how it worked... or is at least this is how it was intended to work based on the emails we received before signing up for tickets.  To think that Reserved-only or GA-only were going to give precedence over BA in any scenario at all just doesn't make sense.  Choosing BA says "just get me in the building."  It gives you access to 100% of the available tickets.  Every ticket in the building is the Best Available at some point in the process.  Choosing GA-only or Reserved-only is of course going to lower your chances compared to BA.  Those choices give you access to some percentage LESS THAN 100% of the available tickets.  

    If this were accurate, then all tickets would be BA and Tenclub wouldn't bother with GA or Reserved options. You are still giving BA two chances at tickets to one chance for those who requested Reserved, and even those who requested GA! That is inherently unfair. There would be no GA tickets for those who requested GA, which would be kind of odd. This is not at all how it was intended to work, and there is nothing in the emails that says or implies that this would be the case.     
  • tubes10s
    tubes10s Posts: 543
    edited January 2020
    tubes10s said:
    Just my opinion, but this is how I see this lottery system working with the descriptions we were all given before we all made our selections:

    All 1st Priority BA, 1st Priority GA-only, and 1st Priority Reserved-only names are thrown into the pool.  Names are drawn.  Names drawn with BA as their choice get GA until GA tickets are gone, and then names drawn with BA as their choice get Reserved tickets.  Names drawn with GA-only get GA tickets when they get picked as long as there are GA tickets remaining.  Names drawn with Reserved-only get Reserved tickets when they get picked as long as there are Reserved tickets remaining.  This continues until all tickets are gone.  If all 1st Priority names are drawn and there are still tickets left, then repeat this process with 2nd Priority, etc.  

    I tend to believe that this is how it worked... or is at least this is how it was intended to work based on the emails we received before signing up for tickets.  To think that Reserved-only or GA-only were going to give precedence over BA in any scenario at all just doesn't make sense.  Choosing BA says "just get me in the building."  It gives you access to 100% of the available tickets.  Every ticket in the building is the Best Available at some point in the process.  Choosing GA-only or Reserved-only is of course going to lower your chances compared to BA.  Those choices give you access to some percentage LESS THAN 100% of the available tickets.  

    If this were accurate, then all tickets would be BA and Tenclub wouldn't bother with GA or Reserved options. You are still giving BA two chances at tickets to one chance for those who requested Reserved, and even those who requested GA! That is inherently unfair. There would be no GA tickets for those who requested GA, which would be kind of odd. This is not at all how it was intended to work, and there is nothing in the emails that says or implies that this would be the case.     
    No, BA does not get two chances.  Every name has an equal chance to be drawn ONE TIME.  Once a name is drawn, then you check to see if they chose BA, GA, or Reserved, and award the ticket accordingly.  There is no two chances.  
    Post edited by tubes10s on
    8-31-98 - Raleigh
    8-3-00 - Virginia Beach
    4-16-03 - Charlotte
    5-27-06 - Camden 1
    5-28-06 - Camden 2
    5-30-06 - DC
    6-17-08 - Virginia Beach
    6-22-08 - DC
    5-13-10 - Bristow
    10-27-13 - Baltimore
    10-29-13 - Charlottesville
    4-18-16 - Hampton
  • William Rae
    William Rae Posts: 119
    edited January 2020
    the 2 things I’ve learned after reading this entire thread is that now I’m even more confused and hate math.
    seen em at: 08/31/98 - Raleigh : 05/10/00 - Mnt Baker Theatre, Wa : 11/02/00 - PDX  : 11/05/00 & 11/06/00 - SEA : 4/3/03 - OKC : 10/03/04 - Grand Rapids : 05/03/10 - KC : 11/15/13 - Dallas : 11/16/13 - OKC  : 10/09/14 - Tulsa : 11/20/2016 - ToTD Seattle : 08/10/2018 - SEA : 09/20/2022 - OKC
  • tubes10s
    tubes10s Posts: 543
    tubes10s said:
    Just my opinion, but this is how I see this lottery system working with the descriptions we were all given before we all made our selections:

    All 1st Priority BA, 1st Priority GA-only, and 1st Priority Reserved-only names are thrown into the pool.  Names are drawn.  Names drawn with BA as their choice get GA until GA tickets are gone, and then names drawn with BA as their choice get Reserved tickets.  Names drawn with GA-only get GA tickets when they get picked as long as there are GA tickets remaining.  Names drawn with Reserved-only get Reserved tickets when they get picked as long as there are Reserved tickets remaining.  This continues until all tickets are gone.  If all 1st Priority names are drawn and there are still tickets left, then repeat this process with 2nd Priority, etc.  

    I tend to believe that this is how it worked... or is at least this is how it was intended to work based on the emails we received before signing up for tickets.  To think that Reserved-only or GA-only were going to give precedence over BA in any scenario at all just doesn't make sense.  Choosing BA says "just get me in the building."  It gives you access to 100% of the available tickets.  Every ticket in the building is the Best Available at some point in the process.  Choosing GA-only or Reserved-only is of course going to lower your chances compared to BA.  Those choices give you access to some percentage LESS THAN 100% of the available tickets.  

    If this were accurate, then all tickets would be BA and Tenclub wouldn't bother with GA or Reserved options. You are still giving BA two chances at tickets to one chance for those who requested Reserved, and even those who requested GA! That is inherently unfair. There would be no GA tickets for those who requested GA, which would be kind of odd. This is not at all how it was intended to work, and there is nothing in the emails that says or implies that this would be the case.     
    I see your point of view if the sections were drawn in some sort of order, which they very well may have been.  I don't think they were, but again, this is all just my opinion.  I don't believe that the intention was to fill GA before moving on to Reserved.  I think that all 1st priority names were thrown in a hat.  As each name was drawn, then I think they were checked to see which choice they made (BA, GA, Res) and awarded the ticket that fit their choice.    
    8-31-98 - Raleigh
    8-3-00 - Virginia Beach
    4-16-03 - Charlotte
    5-27-06 - Camden 1
    5-28-06 - Camden 2
    5-30-06 - DC
    6-17-08 - Virginia Beach
    6-22-08 - DC
    5-13-10 - Bristow
    10-27-13 - Baltimore
    10-29-13 - Charlottesville
    4-18-16 - Hampton