Halifax does his research.

oftenreading · December 2015

BS44325 said:

oftenreading said:

BS44325 said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

brianlux said:

HughFreakingDillon said:
I need to stay away from AMT for a while. I understand what Halifax is doing, but reliving all these at the same time is too much.
I can appreciate how you feel in that regard, HFD, but at the same time, the insanity of gun related violence is super well illustrated by H2M's digging up these post here and it serves well as a reminder. I think we do need this kind of reminder. I think American society needs to look closely in the mirror and see how dysfunctional and sick in some ways it is. Thinking about that bugs me so much I can't even make the grammar work correctly.
it bothers me so much, and not just when these shootings happen. I honestly don't need the reminder. I understand some do, but I don't. I'm not faulting Halifax for doing it, just saying it can be tough for me to take. I've got young girls in school and it terrifies me to think that maybe one day this will happen in Canada. I certainly hope not, but it might. they do lockdown drills at school, but given our culture I don't think it would do much. The school doors are open to anyone during school hours, and all that is stopping anyone is a polite sign asking visitors to sign in at the office.

And my kids talk about it to us. "in case bad guys come". breaks my heart.

Unfortunately it has already happened in our country. One of the most famous cases was the Montreal Massacre by Marc Lepine

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marc_Lépine

It is that tragedy which led to the Canadian Long Gun Registry which was a massive boondoggle that only target law abiding Canadian gun owners. It did nothing to reduce crime and/or gun related deaths.
There's a reason why you had to go back to Lepine in 1989 for an example. Since then there have only been 8 mass shootings in Canada. There were none between 2006 and 2014. It would be difficult to accurately measure a significant reduction anyway, given that frequency, regardless of the action taken. Posting about the long gun registry is just obfuscation of the essential issue of the relative availability of guns and its relation to gun homicides (and suicides).
Fair but in actuality gun violence has decreased significantly in the US over the last twenty years even though the relative availability of guns has for the most part stayed the same or even increased since then. Relative availability certainly plays a roll in difference between the two countries but clearly it is not a direct cause of gun violence as a whole.

No, that's not "clear" to me at all. Relative availability plays a huge role. It is the one consistent difference between all other countries and the US. The US has a huge percentage of the world's civilian owned guns, far outstripping any other country. Gun violence overall has declined, just like violent crime over much of the world has declined, but specific types of gun violence in the US have increased. There are intervening factors but the common denominator is the easy availability of guns.

mickeyrat · December 2015

oftenreading said:

BS44325 said:

oftenreading said:

BS44325 said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

brianlux said:

HughFreakingDillon said:
I need to stay away from AMT for a while. I understand what Halifax is doing, but reliving all these at the same time is too much.
I can appreciate how you feel in that regard, HFD, but at the same time, the insanity of gun related violence is super well illustrated by H2M's digging up these post here and it serves well as a reminder. I think we do need this kind of reminder. I think American society needs to look closely in the mirror and see how dysfunctional and sick in some ways it is. Thinking about that bugs me so much I can't even make the grammar work correctly.
it bothers me so much, and not just when these shootings happen. I honestly don't need the reminder. I understand some do, but I don't. I'm not faulting Halifax for doing it, just saying it can be tough for me to take. I've got young girls in school and it terrifies me to think that maybe one day this will happen in Canada. I certainly hope not, but it might. they do lockdown drills at school, but given our culture I don't think it would do much. The school doors are open to anyone during school hours, and all that is stopping anyone is a polite sign asking visitors to sign in at the office.

And my kids talk about it to us. "in case bad guys come". breaks my heart.

Unfortunately it has already happened in our country. One of the most famous cases was the Montreal Massacre by Marc Lepine

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marc_Lépine

It is that tragedy which led to the Canadian Long Gun Registry which was a massive boondoggle that only target law abiding Canadian gun owners. It did nothing to reduce crime and/or gun related deaths.
There's a reason why you had to go back to Lepine in 1989 for an example. Since then there have only been 8 mass shootings in Canada. There were none between 2006 and 2014. It would be difficult to accurately measure a significant reduction anyway, given that frequency, regardless of the action taken. Posting about the long gun registry is just obfuscation of the essential issue of the relative availability of guns and its relation to gun homicides (and suicides).
Fair but in actuality gun violence has decreased significantly in the US over the last twenty years even though the relative availability of guns has for the most part stayed the same or even increased since then. Relative availability certainly plays a roll in difference between the two countries but clearly it is not a direct cause of gun violence as a whole.
No, that's not "clear" to me at all. Relative availability plays a huge role. It is the one consistent difference between all other countries and the US. The US has a huge percentage of the world's civilian owned guns, far outstripping any other country. Gun violence overall has declined, just like violent crime over much of the world has declined, but specific types of gun violence in the US have increased. There are intervening factors but the common denominator is the easy availability of guns.

42% of the civilian owned guns worldwide are possessed by Americans. With roughly 5% of the worlds population.

brianlux · December 2015

BS44325 said:

brianlux said:

jnimhaoileoin said:

mickeyrat said:

PJ_Soul said:
Maybe the American education system can step it up. Like develop an actual curriculum aimed at raising future generations to not buy into the American gun culture and also how to deal with problems in non-violent ways. Again, while gun laws are a problem, the main issue is culture IMO (the gun culture and otherwise). That isn't exactly an easy thing to confront... how to change major flaws in a culture???? I don't know... But focusing more on community rather than the individual might help. America is VERY into the individual. I doubt the overwhelming fixation on money and fame doesn't help either.
Its cultural but beyond simply the gun culture. We as a society seem to have done a poor job of teaching civility, particularly as the internet has proliferated, incivility has gotten way beyond worse.

Put simply, we as a nation are frustrated and cant deal with it.
And you don't trust your government, to me that plays a huge part in it. You're all so removed from your representatives and the relationship with them seems wholly adversarial
A lot of this has to do with the fact that too many of us have little or no education about government and even less participation.
I fully understand your government and what you are discussing is how difficult it is to make real change due to electoral barriers. What you are all avoiding on this thread though is what actual legislative change you are seeking? In 2008 the Democrats had a total majority and could have pushed through any law on guns they wanted. Where was that law? Where were all of you with your legislative proposals? The truth is there are no laws you can write that would have stopped any of these shootings. Deep down I think you all know this hence the constant exasperation.

Oh hell no, man. That is not what I think on the surface, in the gut, or deep down (actually, deep down right now is that extra helping of broccoli and cheese on toast that's talking back). No, not even close. In my own small way I've participated in helping make laws pass. I've seen it work. I don't buy your negative take, not at all and with absolutely no exasperation. With a little humor maybe, but that's about it.

rollings · February 2016

mickeyrat said:

oftenreading said:

BS44325 said:

oftenreading said:

BS44325 said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

brianlux said:

HughFreakingDillon said:
I need to stay away from AMT for a while. I understand what Halifax is doing, but reliving all these at the same time is too much.
I can appreciate how you feel in that regard, HFD, but at the same time, the insanity of gun related violence is super well illustrated by H2M's digging up these post here and it serves well as a reminder. I think we do need this kind of reminder. I think American society needs to look closely in the mirror and see how dysfunctional and sick in some ways it is. Thinking about that bugs me so much I can't even make the grammar work correctly.
it bothers me so much, and not just when these shootings happen. I honestly don't need the reminder. I understand some do, but I don't. I'm not faulting Halifax for doing it, just saying it can be tough for me to take. I've got young girls in school and it terrifies me to think that maybe one day this will happen in Canada. I certainly hope not, but it might. they do lockdown drills at school, but given our culture I don't think it would do much. The school doors are open to anyone during school hours, and all that is stopping anyone is a polite sign asking visitors to sign in at the office.

And my kids talk about it to us. "in case bad guys come". breaks my heart.

Unfortunately it has already happened in our country. One of the most famous cases was the Montreal Massacre by Marc Lepine

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marc_Lépine

It is that tragedy which led to the Canadian Long Gun Registry which was a massive boondoggle that only target law abiding Canadian gun owners. It did nothing to reduce crime and/or gun related deaths.
There's a reason why you had to go back to Lepine in 1989 for an example. Since then there have only been 8 mass shootings in Canada. There were none between 2006 and 2014. It would be difficult to accurately measure a significant reduction anyway, given that frequency, regardless of the action taken. Posting about the long gun registry is just obfuscation of the essential issue of the relative availability of guns and its relation to gun homicides (and suicides).
Fair but in actuality gun violence has decreased significantly in the US over the last twenty years even though the relative availability of guns has for the most part stayed the same or even increased since then. Relative availability certainly plays a roll in difference between the two countries but clearly it is not a direct cause of gun violence as a whole.
No, that's not "clear" to me at all. Relative availability plays a huge role. It is the one consistent difference between all other countries and the US. The US has a huge percentage of the world's civilian owned guns, far outstripping any other country. Gun violence overall has declined, just like violent crime over much of the world has declined, but specific types of gun violence in the US have increased. There are intervening factors but the common denominator is the easy availability of guns.
42% of the civilian owned guns worldwide are possessed by Americans. With roughly 5% of the worlds population.

Wow! Source?

mickeyrat · February 2016

rollings said:

mickeyrat said:

oftenreading said:

BS44325 said:

oftenreading said:

BS44325 said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

brianlux said:

HughFreakingDillon said:
I need to stay away from AMT for a while. I understand what Halifax is doing, but reliving all these at the same time is too much.
I can appreciate how you feel in that regard, HFD, but at the same time, the insanity of gun related violence is super well illustrated by H2M's digging up these post here and it serves well as a reminder. I think we do need this kind of reminder. I think American society needs to look closely in the mirror and see how dysfunctional and sick in some ways it is. Thinking about that bugs me so much I can't even make the grammar work correctly.
it bothers me so much, and not just when these shootings happen. I honestly don't need the reminder. I understand some do, but I don't. I'm not faulting Halifax for doing it, just saying it can be tough for me to take. I've got young girls in school and it terrifies me to think that maybe one day this will happen in Canada. I certainly hope not, but it might. they do lockdown drills at school, but given our culture I don't think it would do much. The school doors are open to anyone during school hours, and all that is stopping anyone is a polite sign asking visitors to sign in at the office.

And my kids talk about it to us. "in case bad guys come". breaks my heart.

Unfortunately it has already happened in our country. One of the most famous cases was the Montreal Massacre by Marc Lepine

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marc_Lépine

It is that tragedy which led to the Canadian Long Gun Registry which was a massive boondoggle that only target law abiding Canadian gun owners. It did nothing to reduce crime and/or gun related deaths.
There's a reason why you had to go back to Lepine in 1989 for an example. Since then there have only been 8 mass shootings in Canada. There were none between 2006 and 2014. It would be difficult to accurately measure a significant reduction anyway, given that frequency, regardless of the action taken. Posting about the long gun registry is just obfuscation of the essential issue of the relative availability of guns and its relation to gun homicides (and suicides).
Fair but in actuality gun violence has decreased significantly in the US over the last twenty years even though the relative availability of guns has for the most part stayed the same or even increased since then. Relative availability certainly plays a roll in difference between the two countries but clearly it is not a direct cause of gun violence as a whole.
No, that's not "clear" to me at all. Relative availability plays a huge role. It is the one consistent difference between all other countries and the US. The US has a huge percentage of the world's civilian owned guns, far outstripping any other country. Gun violence overall has declined, just like violent crime over much of the world has declined, but specific types of gun violence in the US have increased. There are intervening factors but the common denominator is the easy availability of guns.
42% of the civilian owned guns worldwide are possessed by Americans. With roughly 5% of the worlds population.
Wow! Source?

Number of sources that draw from data collected in the small arms survey.

Google gun ownership worldwide. Choose any link you like.

rollings · February 2016

mickeyrat said:

rollings said:

mickeyrat said:

oftenreading said:

BS44325 said:

oftenreading said:

BS44325 said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

brianlux said:

HughFreakingDillon said:
I need to stay away from AMT for a while. I understand what Halifax is doing, but reliving all these at the same time is too much.
I can appreciate how you feel in that regard, HFD, but at the same time, the insanity of gun related violence is super well illustrated by H2M's digging up these post here and it serves well as a reminder. I think we do need this kind of reminder. I think American society needs to look closely in the mirror and see how dysfunctional and sick in some ways it is. Thinking about that bugs me so much I can't even make the grammar work correctly.
it bothers me so much, and not just when these shootings happen. I honestly don't need the reminder. I understand some do, but I don't. I'm not faulting Halifax for doing it, just saying it can be tough for me to take. I've got young girls in school and it terrifies me to think that maybe one day this will happen in Canada. I certainly hope not, but it might. they do lockdown drills at school, but given our culture I don't think it would do much. The school doors are open to anyone during school hours, and all that is stopping anyone is a polite sign asking visitors to sign in at the office.

And my kids talk about it to us. "in case bad guys come". breaks my heart.

Unfortunately it has already happened in our country. One of the most famous cases was the Montreal Massacre by Marc Lepine

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marc_Lépine

It is that tragedy which led to the Canadian Long Gun Registry which was a massive boondoggle that only target law abiding Canadian gun owners. It did nothing to reduce crime and/or gun related deaths.
There's a reason why you had to go back to Lepine in 1989 for an example. Since then there have only been 8 mass shootings in Canada. There were none between 2006 and 2014. It would be difficult to accurately measure a significant reduction anyway, given that frequency, regardless of the action taken. Posting about the long gun registry is just obfuscation of the essential issue of the relative availability of guns and its relation to gun homicides (and suicides).
Fair but in actuality gun violence has decreased significantly in the US over the last twenty years even though the relative availability of guns has for the most part stayed the same or even increased since then. Relative availability certainly plays a roll in difference between the two countries but clearly it is not a direct cause of gun violence as a whole.
No, that's not "clear" to me at all. Relative availability plays a huge role. It is the one consistent difference between all other countries and the US. The US has a huge percentage of the world's civilian owned guns, far outstripping any other country. Gun violence overall has declined, just like violent crime over much of the world has declined, but specific types of gun violence in the US have increased. There are intervening factors but the common denominator is the easy availability of guns.
42% of the civilian owned guns worldwide are possessed by Americans. With roughly 5% of the worlds population.
Wow! Source?
Number of sources that draw from data collected in the small arms survey.

Google gun ownership worldwide. Choose any link you like.

NAWWWT! too lazy. that's why I askedt you!

mickeyrat · February 2016

rollings said:

mickeyrat said:

rollings said:

mickeyrat said:

oftenreading said:

BS44325 said:

oftenreading said:

BS44325 said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

brianlux said:

HughFreakingDillon said:
I need to stay away from AMT for a while. I understand what Halifax is doing, but reliving all these at the same time is too much.
I can appreciate how you feel in that regard, HFD, but at the same time, the insanity of gun related violence is super well illustrated by H2M's digging up these post here and it serves well as a reminder. I think we do need this kind of reminder. I think American society needs to look closely in the mirror and see how dysfunctional and sick in some ways it is. Thinking about that bugs me so much I can't even make the grammar work correctly.
it bothers me so much, and not just when these shootings happen. I honestly don't need the reminder. I understand some do, but I don't. I'm not faulting Halifax for doing it, just saying it can be tough for me to take. I've got young girls in school and it terrifies me to think that maybe one day this will happen in Canada. I certainly hope not, but it might. they do lockdown drills at school, but given our culture I don't think it would do much. The school doors are open to anyone during school hours, and all that is stopping anyone is a polite sign asking visitors to sign in at the office.

And my kids talk about it to us. "in case bad guys come". breaks my heart.

Unfortunately it has already happened in our country. One of the most famous cases was the Montreal Massacre by Marc Lepine

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marc_Lépine

It is that tragedy which led to the Canadian Long Gun Registry which was a massive boondoggle that only target law abiding Canadian gun owners. It did nothing to reduce crime and/or gun related deaths.
There's a reason why you had to go back to Lepine in 1989 for an example. Since then there have only been 8 mass shootings in Canada. There were none between 2006 and 2014. It would be difficult to accurately measure a significant reduction anyway, given that frequency, regardless of the action taken. Posting about the long gun registry is just obfuscation of the essential issue of the relative availability of guns and its relation to gun homicides (and suicides).
Fair but in actuality gun violence has decreased significantly in the US over the last twenty years even though the relative availability of guns has for the most part stayed the same or even increased since then. Relative availability certainly plays a roll in difference between the two countries but clearly it is not a direct cause of gun violence as a whole.
No, that's not "clear" to me at all. Relative availability plays a huge role. It is the one consistent difference between all other countries and the US. The US has a huge percentage of the world's civilian owned guns, far outstripping any other country. Gun violence overall has declined, just like violent crime over much of the world has declined, but specific types of gun violence in the US have increased. There are intervening factors but the common denominator is the easy availability of guns.
42% of the civilian owned guns worldwide are possessed by Americans. With roughly 5% of the worlds population.
Wow! Source?
Number of sources that draw from data collected in the small arms survey.

Google gun ownership worldwide. Choose any link you like.
NAWWWT! too lazy. that's why I askedt you!

My answer is I didnt want to skew what was found.

So the source is the small arms survey. It states , as of 2015 that the US has 270,000,000 guns in private hands. That equates to 89 weapons per 100 people.

brianlux · February 2016

mickeyrat said:

rollings said:

mickeyrat said:

rollings said:

mickeyrat said:

oftenreading said:

BS44325 said:

oftenreading said:

BS44325 said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

brianlux said:

HughFreakingDillon said:
I need to stay away from AMT for a while. I understand what Halifax is doing, but reliving all these at the same time is too much.
I can appreciate how you feel in that regard, HFD, but at the same time, the insanity of gun related violence is super well illustrated by H2M's digging up these post here and it serves well as a reminder. I think we do need this kind of reminder. I think American society needs to look closely in the mirror and see how dysfunctional and sick in some ways it is. Thinking about that bugs me so much I can't even make the grammar work correctly.
it bothers me so much, and not just when these shootings happen. I honestly don't need the reminder. I understand some do, but I don't. I'm not faulting Halifax for doing it, just saying it can be tough for me to take. I've got young girls in school and it terrifies me to think that maybe one day this will happen in Canada. I certainly hope not, but it might. they do lockdown drills at school, but given our culture I don't think it would do much. The school doors are open to anyone during school hours, and all that is stopping anyone is a polite sign asking visitors to sign in at the office.

And my kids talk about it to us. "in case bad guys come". breaks my heart.

Unfortunately it has already happened in our country. One of the most famous cases was the Montreal Massacre by Marc Lepine

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marc_Lépine

It is that tragedy which led to the Canadian Long Gun Registry which was a massive boondoggle that only target law abiding Canadian gun owners. It did nothing to reduce crime and/or gun related deaths.
There's a reason why you had to go back to Lepine in 1989 for an example. Since then there have only been 8 mass shootings in Canada. There were none between 2006 and 2014. It would be difficult to accurately measure a significant reduction anyway, given that frequency, regardless of the action taken. Posting about the long gun registry is just obfuscation of the essential issue of the relative availability of guns and its relation to gun homicides (and suicides).
Fair but in actuality gun violence has decreased significantly in the US over the last twenty years even though the relative availability of guns has for the most part stayed the same or even increased since then. Relative availability certainly plays a roll in difference between the two countries but clearly it is not a direct cause of gun violence as a whole.
No, that's not "clear" to me at all. Relative availability plays a huge role. It is the one consistent difference between all other countries and the US. The US has a huge percentage of the world's civilian owned guns, far outstripping any other country. Gun violence overall has declined, just like violent crime over much of the world has declined, but specific types of gun violence in the US have increased. There are intervening factors but the common denominator is the easy availability of guns.
42% of the civilian owned guns worldwide are possessed by Americans. With roughly 5% of the worlds population.
Wow! Source?
Number of sources that draw from data collected in the small arms survey.

Google gun ownership worldwide. Choose any link you like.
NAWWWT! too lazy. that's why I askedt you!
My answer is I didnt want to skew what was found.

So the source is the small arms survey. It states , as of 2015 that the US has 270,000,000 guns in private hands. That equates to 89 weapons per 100 people.

Thems a lotta guns!

Halifax2TheMax · September 2019

And nothing has changed except it’s gotten worse, more frequent. Nice.

brianlux · September 2019

Halifax2TheMax said:

And nothing has changed except it’s gotten worse, more frequent. Nice.

Sad but mostly true.

josevolution · September 2019

Everyday we are risking our lives just by going to work ! Shootings happen in every scenario possible...

bbiggs · September 2019

josevolution said:

Everyday we are risking our lives just by going to work ! Shootings happen in every scenario possible...

Actually it’s every time we leave the house. I’m always on some level of alert, no matter where I go. It’s sad it has come to that.

josevolution · September 2019

bbiggs said:

josevolution said:

Everyday we are risking our lives just by going to work ! Shootings happen in every scenario possible...

Actually it’s every time we leave the house. I’m always on some level of alert, no matter where I go. It’s sad it has come to that.

Sad indeed ..

tempo_n_groove · September 2019

josevolution said:

Everyday we are risking our lives just by going to work ! Shootings happen in every scenario possible...

Don't you have a better chance of being killed in a car crash than getting shot?

OnWis97 · September 2019

tempo_n_groove said:

josevolution said:

Everyday we are risking our lives just by going to work ! Shootings happen in every scenario possible...

Don't you have a better chance of being killed in a car crash than getting shot?

Over 30,000 every year in the US since the 1940s.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motor_vehicle_fatality_rate_in_U.S._by_year

It is the most dangerous thing most of us do on a daily basis. I don't think that lessens the trouble of our gun culture, but the drive is far more dangerous than what may happen at the destination. We're just so desensitized to it and accept it. The gun crowd probably wants us to get that point with mass shootings.

Halifax2TheMax · September 2019

OnWis97 said:

tempo_n_groove said:

josevolution said:

Everyday we are risking our lives just by going to work ! Shootings happen in every scenario possible...

Don't you have a better chance of being killed in a car crash than getting shot?

Over 30,000 every year in the US since the 1940s.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motor_vehicle_fatality_rate_in_U.S._by_year

It is the most dangerous thing most of us do on a daily basis. I don't think that lessens the trouble of our gun culture, but the drive is far more dangerous than what may happen at the destination. We're just so desensitized to it and accept it. The gun crowd probably wants us to get that point with mass shootings.

We don’t just “accept” it. We’re constantly making roads, cars and drivers safer, passing and enforcing laws to get a desired result. Compare that 30,000 deaths per year to vehicle miles driven, number of cars on the road and number of licensed drivers and you’ll see progress on reducing automobile deaths. With guns, it seems the opposite. Less gun owners, more guns, less restrictions and the numbers of deaths have stayed constant. And mass shootings have increased.

In my lifetime I’ve seen the following regarding making driving safer:

speedlimits set to road conditions
drinking age raised to 21 nationally
curfews for new drivers
DUI laws implemented and enforced
mandatory seat belt laws
seat belts going from non-existence to lap belts to three point and car seats for babies and kids
technology in cars like lane departure warnings
delayed traffic signaling
airbags
road & highway design standards

And the list goes on and on. The assault weapons ban expired in 2004. What other “safety” laws as they relate to guns has been passed since then?

tempo_n_groove · September 2019

Halifax2TheMax said:

OnWis97 said:

tempo_n_groove said:

josevolution said:

Everyday we are risking our lives just by going to work ! Shootings happen in every scenario possible...

Don't you have a better chance of being killed in a car crash than getting shot?

Over 30,000 every year in the US since the 1940s.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motor_vehicle_fatality_rate_in_U.S._by_year

It is the most dangerous thing most of us do on a daily basis. I don't think that lessens the trouble of our gun culture, but the drive is far more dangerous than what may happen at the destination. We're just so desensitized to it and accept it. The gun crowd probably wants us to get that point with mass shootings.

We don’t just “accept” it. We’re constantly making roads, cars and drivers safer, passing and enforcing laws to get a desired result. Compare that 30,000 deaths per year to vehicle miles driven, number of cars on the road and number of licensed drivers and you’ll see progress on reducing automobile deaths. With guns, it seems the opposite. Less gun owners, more guns, less restrictions and the numbers of deaths have stayed constant. And mass shootings have increased.

In my lifetime I’ve seen the following regarding making driving safer:

speedlimits set to road conditions
drinking age raised to 21 nationally
curfews for new drivers
DUI laws implemented and enforced
mandatory seat belt laws
seat belts going from non-existence to lap belts to three point and car seats for babies and kids
technology in cars like lane departure warnings
delayed traffic signaling
airbags
road & highway design standards

And the list goes on and on. The assault weapons ban expired in 2004. What other “safety” laws as they relate to guns has been passed since then?

Make all cars have a governed speed of 60MPH and I will listen to this further. While cars have triple digits still on the dashboard this is rather moot.

Halifax2TheMax · September 2019

tempo_n_groove said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

OnWis97 said:

tempo_n_groove said:

josevolution said:

Everyday we are risking our lives just by going to work ! Shootings happen in every scenario possible...

Don't you have a better chance of being killed in a car crash than getting shot?

Over 30,000 every year in the US since the 1940s.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motor_vehicle_fatality_rate_in_U.S._by_year

It is the most dangerous thing most of us do on a daily basis. I don't think that lessens the trouble of our gun culture, but the drive is far more dangerous than what may happen at the destination. We're just so desensitized to it and accept it. The gun crowd probably wants us to get that point with mass shootings.

We don’t just “accept” it. We’re constantly making roads, cars and drivers safer, passing and enforcing laws to get a desired result. Compare that 30,000 deaths per year to vehicle miles driven, number of cars on the road and number of licensed drivers and you’ll see progress on reducing automobile deaths. With guns, it seems the opposite. Less gun owners, more guns, less restrictions and the numbers of deaths have stayed constant. And mass shootings have increased.

In my lifetime I’ve seen the following regarding making driving safer:

speedlimits set to road conditions
drinking age raised to 21 nationally
curfews for new drivers
DUI laws implemented and enforced
mandatory seat belt laws
seat belts going from non-existence to lap belts to three point and car seats for babies and kids
technology in cars like lane departure warnings
delayed traffic signaling
airbags
road & highway design standards

And the list goes on and on. The assault weapons ban expired in 2004. What other “safety” laws as they relate to guns has been passed since then?

Make all cars have a governed speed of 60MPH and I will listen to this further. While cars have triple digits still on the dashboard this is rather moot.

Preposterous. That’s like saying, “make all guns single shot muskets with powder and musket ball,” and I’ll listen to your gun rights argument.

tempo_n_groove · September 2019

Halifax2TheMax said:

tempo_n_groove said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

OnWis97 said:

tempo_n_groove said:

josevolution said:

Everyday we are risking our lives just by going to work ! Shootings happen in every scenario possible...

Don't you have a better chance of being killed in a car crash than getting shot?

Over 30,000 every year in the US since the 1940s.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motor_vehicle_fatality_rate_in_U.S._by_year

It is the most dangerous thing most of us do on a daily basis. I don't think that lessens the trouble of our gun culture, but the drive is far more dangerous than what may happen at the destination. We're just so desensitized to it and accept it. The gun crowd probably wants us to get that point with mass shootings.

We don’t just “accept” it. We’re constantly making roads, cars and drivers safer, passing and enforcing laws to get a desired result. Compare that 30,000 deaths per year to vehicle miles driven, number of cars on the road and number of licensed drivers and you’ll see progress on reducing automobile deaths. With guns, it seems the opposite. Less gun owners, more guns, less restrictions and the numbers of deaths have stayed constant. And mass shootings have increased.

In my lifetime I’ve seen the following regarding making driving safer:

speedlimits set to road conditions
drinking age raised to 21 nationally
curfews for new drivers
DUI laws implemented and enforced
mandatory seat belt laws
seat belts going from non-existence to lap belts to three point and car seats for babies and kids
technology in cars like lane departure warnings
delayed traffic signaling
airbags
road & highway design standards

And the list goes on and on. The assault weapons ban expired in 2004. What other “safety” laws as they relate to guns has been passed since then?

Make all cars have a governed speed of 60MPH and I will listen to this further. While cars have triple digits still on the dashboard this is rather moot.

Preposterous. That’s like saying, “make all guns single shot muskets with powder and musket ball,” and I’ll listen to your gun rights argument.

No quite different. No mention of muskets in the constitution.

No mention of cars in the constitution either now that I think of it?

My argument is if you want to stop cars from killing people limit them in speed. I can use the same argument on cars and guns though. Why do I need a car that can do 120mph? Because it's fun.

mickeyrat · September 2019

tempo_n_groove said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

tempo_n_groove said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

OnWis97 said:

tempo_n_groove said:

josevolution said:

Everyday we are risking our lives just by going to work ! Shootings happen in every scenario possible...

Don't you have a better chance of being killed in a car crash than getting shot?

Over 30,000 every year in the US since the 1940s.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motor_vehicle_fatality_rate_in_U.S._by_year

It is the most dangerous thing most of us do on a daily basis. I don't think that lessens the trouble of our gun culture, but the drive is far more dangerous than what may happen at the destination. We're just so desensitized to it and accept it. The gun crowd probably wants us to get that point with mass shootings.

We don’t just “accept” it. We’re constantly making roads, cars and drivers safer, passing and enforcing laws to get a desired result. Compare that 30,000 deaths per year to vehicle miles driven, number of cars on the road and number of licensed drivers and you’ll see progress on reducing automobile deaths. With guns, it seems the opposite. Less gun owners, more guns, less restrictions and the numbers of deaths have stayed constant. And mass shootings have increased.

In my lifetime I’ve seen the following regarding making driving safer:

speedlimits set to road conditions
drinking age raised to 21 nationally
curfews for new drivers
DUI laws implemented and enforced
mandatory seat belt laws
seat belts going from non-existence to lap belts to three point and car seats for babies and kids
technology in cars like lane departure warnings
delayed traffic signaling
airbags
road & highway design standards

And the list goes on and on. The assault weapons ban expired in 2004. What other “safety” laws as they relate to guns has been passed since then?

Make all cars have a governed speed of 60MPH and I will listen to this further. While cars have triple digits still on the dashboard this is rather moot.

Preposterous. That’s like saying, “make all guns single shot muskets with powder and musket ball,” and I’ll listen to your gun rights argument.

No quite different. No mention of muskets in the constitution.

No mention of cars in the constitution either now that I think of it?

My argument is if you want to stop cars from killing people limit them in speed. I can use the same argument on cars and guns though. Why do I need a car that can do 120mph? Because it's fun.

crash mitagation is standard now on all commercial trucks. its coming to cars too......PITA but it works. dramatically increasd the number of miles driven before an incident at my work. in fact they are still counting. we get video played off certain crash avoidances. it also displays dumbfucks in cars pulling stupid shit.

Halifax does his research.

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