Vaccinate your kids?

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  • brianluxbrianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain.Posts: 26,561
    They have an Alzheimer's vaccination out now. I think I may have gotten that one but I can't remember for certain.
    "Love and only love will break it down"
    -Neil Young
    ***********
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  • whispering handswhispering hands Under your skinPosts: 13,527
    brianlux said:

    They have an Alzheimer's vaccination out now. I think I may have gotten that one but I can't remember for certain.

    HahAhaha! Love ya B!
    D1B50013-8BB5-4861-B9BC-AA0D88D58DF4.jpg

    The first rule of the ten club fight club is you don't talk about the ten club fight club!
  • jeffbrjeffbr SeattlePosts: 6,368
    JS81606 said:
    As a psychologist who works with a ton of autistic kids, I find it disgusting people believe this research (that was falsified) and continue to spread the absurd belief that vaccination has anything remotely To do with autism. The guy deserves to be in prison for the irreparable harm he has caused. VACCINATE YOUR KIDS!!!!!!!
    Dr Wakefield has been vindicated, if one reads the research on pub med, you will find 24 studies showing what he found has been demonstrated beyond a shadow of a doubt. 
    I had to revisit this statement. Dr. Wakefield has not been vindicated at all as far as I can tell. Did he have his medical license reinstated? Did all of the chicanery that was exposed regarding his "study" get proven false? http://www.bmj.com/content/342/bmj.c5347.full
    Did all of the studies showing no causal relationship between vaccines and autism get debunked or disproven? https://www.healthychildren.org/English/safety-prevention/immunizations/Pages/Vaccine-Studies-Examine-the-Evidence.aspx

    Wakefield was a quack and a huckster and has absolutely no credibility. Very surprised you even dared bring his name into the conversation and still hold out any hope that you'd be taken seriously.
    "I'll use the magic word - let's just shut the fuck up, please." EV, 04/13/08
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon WinnipegPosts: 17,490
    jeffbr said:
    JS81606 said:
    As a psychologist who works with a ton of autistic kids, I find it disgusting people believe this research (that was falsified) and continue to spread the absurd belief that vaccination has anything remotely To do with autism. The guy deserves to be in prison for the irreparable harm he has caused. VACCINATE YOUR KIDS!!!!!!!
    Dr Wakefield has been vindicated, if one reads the research on pub med, you will find 24 studies showing what he found has been demonstrated beyond a shadow of a doubt. 
    I had to revisit this statement. Dr. Wakefield has not been vindicated at all as far as I can tell. Did he have his medical license reinstated? Did all of the chicanery that was exposed regarding his "study" get proven false? http://www.bmj.com/content/342/bmj.c5347.full
    Did all of the studies showing no causal relationship between vaccines and autism get debunked or disproven? https://www.healthychildren.org/English/safety-prevention/immunizations/Pages/Vaccine-Studies-Examine-the-Evidence.aspx

    Wakefield was a quack and a huckster and has absolutely no credibility. Very surprised you even dared bring his name into the conversation and still hold out any hope that you'd be taken seriously.
    +1
  • oftenreadingoftenreading Victoria, BCPosts: 9,682
    And here Wakefield pops up again, stirring the pot and fouling the waters.

    Somali immigrants were encouraged not to vaccinate their kids by Wakefield and others, and now are being blamed by right wing wretches like Coulter when their kids get infectious diseases like measles.

    http://www.slate.com/blogs/xx_factor/2017/05/09/the_right_should_blame_trump_s_anti_vaxxer_pals_not_islam_for_a_measles.html

    my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
  • oftenreadingoftenreading Victoria, BCPosts: 9,682
    The highest court of the European Union ruled Wednesday that courts can consider whether a vaccination led to someone developing an illness even when there is no scientific proof.

    The article below describes that the EU's top court has ruled that a vaccine maker can be held liable for someone developing an illness later, even when there's no proof that the vaccination led to the illness (and indeed where there is proof that the vaccination does not lead to that illness). Basically, their criteria seem to be if you were healthy before, if you developed the illness after, if there's no family history of that illness, and if other people also make similar claims, then that's good enough for them. The lack of scientific rigour is maddening.

    http://www.cbc.ca/news/health/eu-court-vaccine-ruling-1.4170837


    my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
  • jeffbrjeffbr SeattlePosts: 6,368
    The highest court of the European Union ruled Wednesday that courts can consider whether a vaccination led to someone developing an illness even when there is no scientific proof.

    The article below describes that the EU's top court has ruled that a vaccine maker can be held liable for someone developing an illness later, even when there's no proof that the vaccination led to the illness (and indeed where there is proof that the vaccination does not lead to that illness). Basically, their criteria seem to be if you were healthy before, if you developed the illness after, if there's no family history of that illness, and if other people also make similar claims, then that's good enough for them. The lack of scientific rigour is maddening.

    http://www.cbc.ca/news/health/eu-court-vaccine-ruling-1.4170837


    So you can be convicted in Europe based on evidence that isn't actually evidence.  Sounds like the EU is as ass backwards as the Trump administration. Fuck science. Fuck law. Let's adjudicate based on emotion! European courts will probably now allow "evidence" from Young Earth creationists, and Flat Earthers too, I imagine. That's twisted.
    "I'll use the magic word - let's just shut the fuck up, please." EV, 04/13/08
  • oftenreadingoftenreading Victoria, BCPosts: 9,682
    The misinformation about vaccinations from alternative health practitioners continues. Two cases that I've seen in the last couple of days have really irked me. Both twist science and prey on vulnerable people to enrich themselves.

    The first is a homeopath who claims that 70% of cases of autism are caused by vaccination and 25% by "medications". She claims that her homeopathic treatment can "completely eliminate" autism. Of course, you have to pay her, and in another article she stated that it might take up to four years of regular consultations and the purchase of her products to reach a cure....

    http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/homeopathy-for-autism-certainly-not-based-on-science-b-c-health-official-says-1.4677128?cmp=rss

    And then there's this one - a chiropractor who has already been sanctioned by her college, which requested she remove misinformation on vaccination from her website. She did not comply. I also note that her blog is apparently entitled "Dr. Sexy Mom" - great professional boundaries there.

    https://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2018/05/25/halifax-chiropractor-dena-churchill-anti-vaccination-posts_a_23443852/?utm_hp_ref=ca-homepage
    my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
  • Thoughts_ArriveThoughts_Arrive Melbourne, AustraliaPosts: 13,168
    Antivaxxers make me sick.
    They believe pseudoscience over hard scientific evidence and put other children and the community at a whole at risk.
    Adelaide 17/11/2009, Melbourne 20/11/2009, Sydney 22/11/2009, Melbourne (Big Day Out Festival) 24/01/2014
  • mookieblalockmookieblalock Posts: 2,278
    Many vaccinated people don’t get autism.

    Many unvaccinated people do get autism.

    Many vaccinated people get autism.

    Many unvaccinated people do not get autism.


    Only one side claims they know what causes autism. Weird.
  • mookieblalockmookieblalock Posts: 2,278
    JS81606 said:
     I will not reveal where I work, nor anything regarding me personally until my research is published and out there as fair fodder for all to do what they please. 
    It’s been well over a year, let me guess, you haven’t been published yet? 
  • JS81606 said:
     I will not reveal where I work, nor anything regarding me personally until my research is published and out there as fair fodder for all to do what they please. 
    It’s been well over a year, let me guess, you haven’t been published yet? 

  • mookieblalockmookieblalock Posts: 2,278
    JS81606 said:I will not reveal where I work, nor anything regarding me personally until my research is published and out there as fair fodder for all to do what they please. I also am an advocate for dialogue, but please give reasons as to your point as I find emotional rant, which I am guilty myself, to be drivel. This is how I see the world.
    Apparently the National Enquirer was not accepting research proposals.
  • MayDay10MayDay10 Posts: 9,757
    mad magazine
  • PJ_SoulPJ_Soul Vancouver, BCPosts: 46,351
    edited February 13
    I just want to know how in the hell these idiots can live with the fact that they'd apparently rather put their kids lives at risk than have a kid on the spectrum (in their minds - of course we know vaccinations don't cause autism). Talk about a fucking slap in the face to anyone on the spectrum. What kind of shitty parent prefers a dead kid and/or kill other people's kids over having an autistic kid?????
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • Meltdown99Meltdown99 None Of Your Business...Posts: 5,298
    brianlux said:
    They have an Alzheimer's vaccination out now. I think I may have gotten that one but I can't remember for certain.
    lol
  • tbergstbergs Posts: 5,648
    PJ_Soul said:
    I just want to know how in the hell these idiots can live with the fact that they'd apparently rather put their kids lives at risk than have a kid on the spectrum (in their minds - of course we know vaccinations don't cause autism). Talk about a fucking slap in the face to anyone on the spectrum. What kind of shitty parent prefers a dead kid and/or kill other people's kids over having an autistic kid?????
    I guess if that's the only reason they don't vaccinate then they must really believe it is the cause and better to endure other possible diseases than a self-inflicted man made one, but I don't think that's a main reason for most. I don't know enough about what influences those who don't get some or all vaccinations and neither do you. It's easy to pigeon hole it to one item because it gets the most attention though. 
    It's a hopeless situation...
  • PJ_SoulPJ_Soul Vancouver, BCPosts: 46,351
    edited February 13
    tbergs said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    I just want to know how in the hell these idiots can live with the fact that they'd apparently rather put their kids lives at risk than have a kid on the spectrum (in their minds - of course we know vaccinations don't cause autism). Talk about a fucking slap in the face to anyone on the spectrum. What kind of shitty parent prefers a dead kid and/or kill other people's kids over having an autistic kid?????
    I guess if that's the only reason they don't vaccinate then they must really believe it is the cause and better to endure other possible diseases than a self-inflicted man made one, but I don't think that's a main reason for most. I don't know enough about what influences those who don't get some or all vaccinations and neither do you. It's easy to pigeon hole it to one item because it gets the most attention though. 
    Yeah, I'm just talking about the ones who don't vaccinate because they think it causes autism... I do think you might be underestimating how many anti-vaxxers don't do it mainly because of this reason though.

    Anyway, to be blunt, I think anti-vaxxers are fucking idiots, and selfish jerks too. I think vaccinations should be legally required no matter what, since this is a huge public safety issue, and public safety is always put before individual rights normally. If parents refuse to do it, I think the state should be able to temporarily remove the children from the home and have them vaccinated against the parents' wills. These fools have proven themselves a real and growing threat to the public, and extraordinary measures now need to be taken.
    Post edited by PJ_Soul on
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • oftenreadingoftenreading Victoria, BCPosts: 9,682
    PJ_Soul said:
    tbergs said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    I just want to know how in the hell these idiots can live with the fact that they'd apparently rather put their kids lives at risk than have a kid on the spectrum (in their minds - of course we know vaccinations don't cause autism). Talk about a fucking slap in the face to anyone on the spectrum. What kind of shitty parent prefers a dead kid and/or kill other people's kids over having an autistic kid?????
    I guess if that's the only reason they don't vaccinate then they must really believe it is the cause and better to endure other possible diseases than a self-inflicted man made one, but I don't think that's a main reason for most. I don't know enough about what influences those who don't get some or all vaccinations and neither do you. It's easy to pigeon hole it to one item because it gets the most attention though. 
    Yeah, I'm just talking about the ones who don't vaccinate because they think it causes autism... I do think you might be underestimating how many anti-vaxxers don't do it mainly because of this reason though.

    Anyway, to be blunt, I think anti-vaxxers are fucking idiots, and selfish jerks too. I think vaccinations should be legally required no matter what, since this is a huge public safety issue, and public safety is always put before individual rights normally. If parents refuse to do it, I think the state should be able to temporarily remove the children from the home and have them vaccinated against the parents' wills. These fools have proven themselves a real and growing threat to the public, and extraordinary measures now need to be taken.

    People tend to have much more fear about doing something that will lead to harm, compared to not doing something that will lead to harm by inaction. It is really the same in the end, but the responsibility of taking action weighs more heavily on humans than not taking action and just letting things unfold "naturally" or "with god's will" or however you view it. Just one of those quirks of human psychology. 
    my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
  • PJ_SoulPJ_Soul Vancouver, BCPosts: 46,351
    PJ_Soul said:
    tbergs said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    I just want to know how in the hell these idiots can live with the fact that they'd apparently rather put their kids lives at risk than have a kid on the spectrum (in their minds - of course we know vaccinations don't cause autism). Talk about a fucking slap in the face to anyone on the spectrum. What kind of shitty parent prefers a dead kid and/or kill other people's kids over having an autistic kid?????
    I guess if that's the only reason they don't vaccinate then they must really believe it is the cause and better to endure other possible diseases than a self-inflicted man made one, but I don't think that's a main reason for most. I don't know enough about what influences those who don't get some or all vaccinations and neither do you. It's easy to pigeon hole it to one item because it gets the most attention though. 
    Yeah, I'm just talking about the ones who don't vaccinate because they think it causes autism... I do think you might be underestimating how many anti-vaxxers don't do it mainly because of this reason though.

    Anyway, to be blunt, I think anti-vaxxers are fucking idiots, and selfish jerks too. I think vaccinations should be legally required no matter what, since this is a huge public safety issue, and public safety is always put before individual rights normally. If parents refuse to do it, I think the state should be able to temporarily remove the children from the home and have them vaccinated against the parents' wills. These fools have proven themselves a real and growing threat to the public, and extraordinary measures now need to be taken.

    People tend to have much more fear about doing something that will lead to harm, compared to not doing something that will lead to harm by inaction. It is really the same in the end, but the responsibility of taking action weighs more heavily on humans than not taking action and just letting things unfold "naturally" or "with god's will" or however you view it. Just one of those quirks of human psychology. 
    You seem to be a lot more forgiving of these people than I am, lol.
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • oftenreadingoftenreading Victoria, BCPosts: 9,682
    PJ_Soul said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    tbergs said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    I just want to know how in the hell these idiots can live with the fact that they'd apparently rather put their kids lives at risk than have a kid on the spectrum (in their minds - of course we know vaccinations don't cause autism). Talk about a fucking slap in the face to anyone on the spectrum. What kind of shitty parent prefers a dead kid and/or kill other people's kids over having an autistic kid?????
    I guess if that's the only reason they don't vaccinate then they must really believe it is the cause and better to endure other possible diseases than a self-inflicted man made one, but I don't think that's a main reason for most. I don't know enough about what influences those who don't get some or all vaccinations and neither do you. It's easy to pigeon hole it to one item because it gets the most attention though. 
    Yeah, I'm just talking about the ones who don't vaccinate because they think it causes autism... I do think you might be underestimating how many anti-vaxxers don't do it mainly because of this reason though.

    Anyway, to be blunt, I think anti-vaxxers are fucking idiots, and selfish jerks too. I think vaccinations should be legally required no matter what, since this is a huge public safety issue, and public safety is always put before individual rights normally. If parents refuse to do it, I think the state should be able to temporarily remove the children from the home and have them vaccinated against the parents' wills. These fools have proven themselves a real and growing threat to the public, and extraordinary measures now need to be taken.

    People tend to have much more fear about doing something that will lead to harm, compared to not doing something that will lead to harm by inaction. It is really the same in the end, but the responsibility of taking action weighs more heavily on humans than not taking action and just letting things unfold "naturally" or "with god's will" or however you view it. Just one of those quirks of human psychology. 
    You seem to be a lot more forgiving of these people than I am, lol.

    Understanding doesn't necessarily equate to forgiveness, though it often does.

    I think you're the first person who has ever accused me of being soft on anti-vaxxers, though :lol:
    my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
  • PJ_SoulPJ_Soul Vancouver, BCPosts: 46,351
    PJ_Soul said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    tbergs said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    I just want to know how in the hell these idiots can live with the fact that they'd apparently rather put their kids lives at risk than have a kid on the spectrum (in their minds - of course we know vaccinations don't cause autism). Talk about a fucking slap in the face to anyone on the spectrum. What kind of shitty parent prefers a dead kid and/or kill other people's kids over having an autistic kid?????
    I guess if that's the only reason they don't vaccinate then they must really believe it is the cause and better to endure other possible diseases than a self-inflicted man made one, but I don't think that's a main reason for most. I don't know enough about what influences those who don't get some or all vaccinations and neither do you. It's easy to pigeon hole it to one item because it gets the most attention though. 
    Yeah, I'm just talking about the ones who don't vaccinate because they think it causes autism... I do think you might be underestimating how many anti-vaxxers don't do it mainly because of this reason though.

    Anyway, to be blunt, I think anti-vaxxers are fucking idiots, and selfish jerks too. I think vaccinations should be legally required no matter what, since this is a huge public safety issue, and public safety is always put before individual rights normally. If parents refuse to do it, I think the state should be able to temporarily remove the children from the home and have them vaccinated against the parents' wills. These fools have proven themselves a real and growing threat to the public, and extraordinary measures now need to be taken.

    People tend to have much more fear about doing something that will lead to harm, compared to not doing something that will lead to harm by inaction. It is really the same in the end, but the responsibility of taking action weighs more heavily on humans than not taking action and just letting things unfold "naturally" or "with god's will" or however you view it. Just one of those quirks of human psychology. 
    You seem to be a lot more forgiving of these people than I am, lol.

    Understanding doesn't necessarily equate to forgiveness, though it often does.

    I think you're the first person who has ever accused me of being soft on anti-vaxxers, though :lol:
    :lol:
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • JS81606JS81606 Posts: 72
    JS81606 said:I will not reveal where I work, nor anything regarding me personally until my research is published and out there as fair fodder for all to do what they please. I also am an advocate for dialogue, but please give reasons as to your point as I find emotional rant, which I am guilty myself, to be drivel. This is how I see the world.
    Apparently the National Enquirer was not accepting research proposals.
    Apparently this is not the National Enquirer, whatever that may be....(EBioMedicine. 2017 Mar; 17: 192–198.)
    Our research. And apparently when we replicated the gut dysbiosis form MMR jab, yes, what Mr Wakefiled found was true. He was recanted for simply on getting legitimate consent, Nuremberg Trials make this so. Never heard gut dysbiosis in Austic kiddos?   It may be tough sledding for you, but most scientist will understand it fully.  Yes...there is more to come and I can care less about opinions based on a belief of vaccines, just like religions of the world...you and yours claim all this science, (yet to see one article put here for my reading, not one...I digress,  but guarantee very few if any have read what is in jabs, what it does to the brain/ nerve system of the body, and immune system....fake immunity does not equate to immunity.  As far as measles out break, this is not serious, if one reviews VEARS, it will see more kiddos died from this shot than actual disease...No I am not anti-vaxxer, I am pro safe vaccines....hand me an insert, and I will gladly explain each and every ingredient so one can understand just what each piece does and is responsible for.  Also, we evolved with these diseases, I just see people taking their own and kiddos out of gene pool.  I often wonder why I say anything on forums when most have no idea what science is or what is happening inside of a human body!

    Title: 

    The Introduction of Diphtheria-Tetanus-Pertussis and Oral Polio Vaccine Among Young Infants in an Urban African Community: A Natural Experiment

    EBioMedicine. 2017 Mar; 17: 192–198. 
    Published online 2017 Feb 1. doi: 10.1016/j.ebiom.2017.01.041
  • mookieblalockmookieblalock Posts: 2,278
    JS81606 said:
    JS81606 said:I will not reveal where I work, nor anything regarding me personally until my research is published and out there as fair fodder for all to do what they please. I also am an advocate for dialogue, but please give reasons as to your point as I find emotional rant, which I am guilty myself, to be drivel. This is how I see the world.
    Apparently the National Enquirer was not accepting research proposals.
    Apparently this is not the National Enquirer, whatever that may be....(EBioMedicine. 2017 Mar; 17: 192–198.)
    Our research. And apparently when we replicated the gut dysbiosis form MMR jab, yes, what Mr Wakefiled found was true. He was recanted for simply on getting legitimate consent, Nuremberg Trials make this so. Never heard gut dysbiosis in Austic kiddos?   It may be tough sledding for you, but most scientist will understand it fully.  Yes...there is more to come and I can care less about opinions based on a belief of vaccines, just like religions of the world...you and yours claim all this science, (yet to see one article put here for my reading, not one...I digress,  but guarantee very few if any have read what is in jabs, what it does to the brain/ nerve system of the body, and immune system....fake immunity does not equate to immunity.  As far as measles out break, this is not serious, if one reviews VEARS, it will see more kiddos died from this shot than actual disease...No I am not anti-vaxxer, I am pro safe vaccines....hand me an insert, and I will gladly explain each and every ingredient so one can understand just what each piece does and is responsible for.  Also, we evolved with these diseases, I just see people taking their own and kiddos out of gene pool.  I often wonder why I say anything on forums when most have no idea what science is or what is happening inside of a human body!

    Title: 

    The Introduction of Diphtheria-Tetanus-Pertussis and Oral Polio Vaccine Among Young Infants in an Urban African Community: A Natural Experiment

    EBioMedicine. 2017 Mar; 17: 192–198. 
    Published online 2017 Feb 1. doi: 10.1016/j.ebiom.2017.01.041
    So this article was published online in February 2017, but in April 2017 you stated it was waiting to be published. Interesting...
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