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  • mrussel1
    mrussel1 Posts: 30,981
    edited June 2018
    unsung said:
    Spiritual_Chaos said:
    unsung said:
    I care. 

    Democrats have abandoned the middle class, stop importing replacement votes. 




    Do you think it's okey to seperate young chilren from their mothers/fathers, as been done?
    Hmmn, tough question...

    What does DCFS do to children and parents that don't want to pump them full of vaccines?
    Spirtual Chaos is right.  The question is what do YOU think and where is YOUR moral center.
  • unsung
    unsung I stopped by on March 7 2024. First time in many years, had to update payment info. Hope all is well. Politicians suck. Bye. Posts: 9,487
    Again, I assign the blame on the parents.  The US govt is responsible as far as allowing incentives to be handed out to the people illegally coming here.  


  • mrussel1
    mrussel1 Posts: 30,981
    unsung said:
    Again, I assign the blame on the parents.  The US govt is responsible as far as allowing incentives to be handed out to the people illegally coming here.  


    So you have no moral or ethical opinion on the subject?  You can blame the parents all you want, but then children are hurt.  Is that okay with you because it's the parents' fault?
  • LongestRoad
    LongestRoad Posts: 477
    mace1229 said:
    I see a lot disputing the crim rates of illegals. When looking for myself it seemed most resources tried to say the same thing, but did so by completing ignoring the population difference.
    Of what I read those sources don’t factor in the difference of populations. If 5% of the populations commits 10% of the crime, you can’t claim they commit less crime.


     You have to disregard statistics, logic and facts for their view. 
  • Spiritual_Chaos
    Spiritual_Chaos Posts: 31,668
    LongestRoad said:
    mace1229 said:
    I see a lot disputing the crim rates of illegals. When looking for myself it seemed most resources tried to say the same thing, but did so by completing ignoring the population difference.
    Of what I read those sources don’t factor in the difference of populations. If 5% of the populations commits 10% of the crime, you can’t claim they commit less crime.


     You have to disregard statistics, logic and facts for their view. 
    So what do you think of Fox News?
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • LongestRoad
    LongestRoad Posts: 477
    oftenreading said:
    mace1229 said:
    I see a lot disputing the crim rates of illegals. When looking for myself it seemed most resources tried to say the same thing, but did so by completing ignoring the population difference.
    Of what I read those sources don’t factor in the difference of populations. If 5% of the populations commits 10% of the crime, you can’t claim they commit less crime.

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.washingtonpost.com/amphtml/news/wonk/wp/2018/06/19/two-charts-demolish-the-notion-that-immigrants-here-illegally-commit-more-crime/
    Another link claiming illegals commit less crime, but again ignores the population difference in the data. When you consider the population difference it’s a completely different result.

    https://kriskobach.com/breitbart-columns/breitbart-columns-correcting-the-record-on-illegal-aliens-and-crime/
    This article states that illegals make up 14% of federal prisons, but only 3-6% of the population.


    Now I don’t think most immigrants, legal or not, are bad people. I think Trumps quote should be flipped, most are good, and I assume some are bad.
    This is just my input on the debate over level of crime that I saw happening.


    They make up a higher percentage of the federal prison population because immigration offences are federal offences. The majority are simply in there for immigration related reasons.
    Are you factoring in the crimes that some commited that put them in prison awaiting deportation?
  • oftenreading
    oftenreading Victoria, BC Posts: 12,856
    LongestRoad said:
    oftenreading said:
    mace1229 said:
    I see a lot disputing the crim rates of illegals. When looking for myself it seemed most resources tried to say the same thing, but did so by completing ignoring the population difference.
    Of what I read those sources don’t factor in the difference of populations. If 5% of the populations commits 10% of the crime, you can’t claim they commit less crime.

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.washingtonpost.com/amphtml/news/wonk/wp/2018/06/19/two-charts-demolish-the-notion-that-immigrants-here-illegally-commit-more-crime/
    Another link claiming illegals commit less crime, but again ignores the population difference in the data. When you consider the population difference it’s a completely different result.

    https://kriskobach.com/breitbart-columns/breitbart-columns-correcting-the-record-on-illegal-aliens-and-crime/
    This article states that illegals make up 14% of federal prisons, but only 3-6% of the population.


    Now I don’t think most immigrants, legal or not, are bad people. I think Trumps quote should be flipped, most are good, and I assume some are bad.
    This is just my input on the debate over level of crime that I saw happening.


    They make up a higher percentage of the federal prison population because immigration offences are federal offences. The majority are simply in there for immigration related reasons.
    Are you factoring in the crimes that some commited that put them in prison awaiting deportation?

    Like I said, the majority counted in this data did not commit any other crimes than their immigration status.
    my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
  • brianlux
    brianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 43,801
    LongestRoad said:
    rgambs said:
    LongestRoad said:
    oftenreading said:
    LongestRoad said:
    the response above is twisting my words

    No, it isn't. Your words weren't even used, let alone twisted. H2TM was responding to your comment concerning perceived criminality among immigrants. 
    You are also twisting my words. Are you saying there are only criminal American citizens?? There has never been a criminal from south of the border come into this country? Stop trying to focus on twisting my words to sound like I think the majority of immigrants coming into this country are criminals. But  you can bet your ass I don't want any of the drug dealing rapist gang members coming into this country no matter how small a percentage there is of them. Not one of those scumbags should be able to sneak in. Not only for the people that are already here but also for the immigrants that those low lifes try to prey on. Are the liberals able to comprehend that without twisting my words? I have a hunch not. lol
    Question:
    Do you think our scumbag drug dealing rapist gang murderers are inherently better than the ones from south of the border?
    HaHa No but if you f'n liberals stopped fighting for the rights of convicted scumbag murdering rapist drug dealing gang members then maybe it would be harder for them to get back out on the streets.And sanother thing, stop making their time in prison comfortable. 
    Lovely- so now we're fuckin' liberals?  (Yeah, we all know what "f'n" means).  That's such an endearing term.  I think from now on when people ask me if I'm on the right or the left I'll say, "Just call me a "fuckin' liberal." 

    Who here is "rights of convicted scumbag murdering rapist drug dealing gang members"?  We need to know.  Smoke 'em out!

    "stop making their time in prison comfortable".  Right.  Let me think about this.  I hear people all the time trying to decide if they should take a cruise on there vacation or spend a few years in the state penitentiary.  Yeah, tough choice, for sure.

    And remember what were her for folks.  To protect out scumbag murdering rapist drug dealing gang member.  God bless their pointy little heads.  


    "It's a sad and beautiful world"
    -Roberto Benigni

  • Spiritual_Chaos
    Spiritual_Chaos Posts: 31,668
    I think "liberal" is a funny word. Because in the US it seems to be looked on as being socialist or communist or whatever.

    In Sweden liberals are looked on as middle/right.
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • mace1229
    mace1229 Posts: 10,056
    oftenreading said:
    LongestRoad said:
    oftenreading said:
    mace1229 said:
    I see a lot disputing the crim rates of illegals. When looking for myself it seemed most resources tried to say the same thing, but did so by completing ignoring the population difference.
    Of what I read those sources don’t factor in the difference of populations. If 5% of the populations commits 10% of the crime, you can’t claim they commit less crime.

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.washingtonpost.com/amphtml/news/wonk/wp/2018/06/19/two-charts-demolish-the-notion-that-immigrants-here-illegally-commit-more-crime/
    Another link claiming illegals commit less crime, but again ignores the population difference in the data. When you consider the population difference it’s a completely different result.

    https://kriskobach.com/breitbart-columns/breitbart-columns-correcting-the-record-on-illegal-aliens-and-crime/
    This article states that illegals make up 14% of federal prisons, but only 3-6% of the population.


    Now I don’t think most immigrants, legal or not, are bad people. I think Trumps quote should be flipped, most are good, and I assume some are bad.
    This is just my input on the debate over level of crime that I saw happening.


    They make up a higher percentage of the federal prison population because immigration offences are federal offences. The majority are simply in there for immigration related reasons.
    Are you factoring in the crimes that some commited that put them in prison awaiting deportation?

    Like I said, the majority counted in this data did not commit any other crimes than their immigration status.
    From what I can tell illegals being sent to federal prison in large numbers is new with this zero tolerance policy. They just weren’t sent to federal prison before. So those numbers aren’t just ones in prison for crossing the boarder.
    Is that not correct? I couldn’t find anything said said otherwise.
  • oftenreading
    oftenreading Victoria, BC Posts: 12,856
    mace1229 said:
    oftenreading said:
    LongestRoad said:
    oftenreading said:
    mace1229 said:
    I see a lot disputing the crim rates of illegals. When looking for myself it seemed most resources tried to say the same thing, but did so by completing ignoring the population difference.
    Of what I read those sources don’t factor in the difference of populations. If 5% of the populations commits 10% of the crime, you can’t claim they commit less crime.

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.washingtonpost.com/amphtml/news/wonk/wp/2018/06/19/two-charts-demolish-the-notion-that-immigrants-here-illegally-commit-more-crime/
    Another link claiming illegals commit less crime, but again ignores the population difference in the data. When you consider the population difference it’s a completely different result.

    https://kriskobach.com/breitbart-columns/breitbart-columns-correcting-the-record-on-illegal-aliens-and-crime/
    This article states that illegals make up 14% of federal prisons, but only 3-6% of the population.


    Now I don’t think most immigrants, legal or not, are bad people. I think Trumps quote should be flipped, most are good, and I assume some are bad.
    This is just my input on the debate over level of crime that I saw happening.


    They make up a higher percentage of the federal prison population because immigration offences are federal offences. The majority are simply in there for immigration related reasons.
    Are you factoring in the crimes that some commited that put them in prison awaiting deportation?

    Like I said, the majority counted in this data did not commit any other crimes than their immigration status.
    From what I can tell illegals being sent to federal prison in large numbers is new with this zero tolerance policy. They just weren’t sent to federal prison before. So those numbers aren’t just ones in prison for crossing the boarder.
    Is that not correct? I couldn’t find anything said said otherwise.

    That's not correct. Wherever undocumented immigrants were taken into custody it's considered a federal incarceration.
    my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
  • LongestRoad
    LongestRoad Posts: 477
    Spiritual_Chaos said:
    LongestRoad said:
    mace1229 said:
    I see a lot disputing the crim rates of illegals. When looking for myself it seemed most resources tried to say the same thing, but did so by completing ignoring the population difference.
    Of what I read those sources don’t factor in the difference of populations. If 5% of the populations commits 10% of the crime, you can’t claim they commit less crime.


     You have to disregard statistics, logic and facts for their view. 
    So what do you think of Fox News?
    I already talked about this the other day. They should be called Fox Opinion and CNN Opinion. Although from watching many different news stations, I would say Fox has an edge over CNN only for some actual real news thrown in. CNN only discusses their complete dislike for the President pretty much 24 hours a day. You barely see any other news on that station anymore. 
  • brianlux
    brianlux Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 43,801
    Fox has real news?  :lol:

    But what do I know.  I'm a fuckin' liberal!  :smiley: 
    "It's a sad and beautiful world"
    -Roberto Benigni

  • oftenreading
    oftenreading Victoria, BC Posts: 12,856
    Sorry - to clarify my comment above, because I wrote it too quickly - whenever undocumented immigrants are taken into custody due to their immigration status, it’s considered a federal incarceration, which means that even if it’s only briefly, it’s counted  Also, by no means was it always brief, even before this current issue. 
    my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
  • oftenreading
    oftenreading Victoria, BC Posts: 12,856
    LongestRoad said:
    Spiritual_Chaos said:
    LongestRoad said:
    mace1229 said:
    I see a lot disputing the crim rates of illegals. When looking for myself it seemed most resources tried to say the same thing, but did so by completing ignoring the population difference.
    Of what I read those sources don’t factor in the difference of populations. If 5% of the populations commits 10% of the crime, you can’t claim they commit less crime.


     You have to disregard statistics, logic and facts for their view. 
    So what do you think of Fox News?
    I already talked about this the other day. They should be called Fox Opinion and CNN Opinion. Although from watching many different news stations, I would say Fox has an edge over CNN only for some actual real news thrown in. CNN only discusses their complete dislike for the President pretty much 24 hours a day. You barely see any other news on that station anymore. 
    Well, that flies in the face of the researched and documented differences in presentation of true statements between Fox and CNN. Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but Fox does not come out ahead. 
    my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
  • LongestRoad
    LongestRoad Posts: 477
    oftenreading said:
    LongestRoad said:
    Spiritual_Chaos said:
    LongestRoad said:
    mace1229 said:
    I see a lot disputing the crim rates of illegals. When looking for myself it seemed most resources tried to say the same thing, but did so by completing ignoring the population difference.
    Of what I read those sources don’t factor in the difference of populations. If 5% of the populations commits 10% of the crime, you can’t claim they commit less crime.


     You have to disregard statistics, logic and facts for their view. 
    So what do you think of Fox News?
    I already talked about this the other day. They should be called Fox Opinion and CNN Opinion. Although from watching many different news stations, I would say Fox has an edge over CNN only for some actual real news thrown in. CNN only discusses their complete dislike for the President pretty much 24 hours a day. You barely see any other news on that station anymore. 
    Well, that flies in the face of the researched and documented differences in presentation of true statements between Fox and CNN. Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but Fox does not come out ahead. 
    It's all a matter of opinion. Neither should be called news station. The majority is opinions on their political stance on those two in particular. it doesn't stop just at those two though. You have to weed out a lot to get to some topics other than political views. 
  • Spiritual_Chaos
    Spiritual_Chaos Posts: 31,668
    LongestRoad said:
    oftenreading said:
    LongestRoad said:
    Spiritual_Chaos said:
    LongestRoad said:
    mace1229 said:
    I see a lot disputing the crim rates of illegals. When looking for myself it seemed most resources tried to say the same thing, but did so by completing ignoring the population difference.
    Of what I read those sources don’t factor in the difference of populations. If 5% of the populations commits 10% of the crime, you can’t claim they commit less crime.


     You have to disregard statistics, logic and facts for their view. 
    So what do you think of Fox News?
    I already talked about this the other day. They should be called Fox Opinion and CNN Opinion. Although from watching many different news stations, I would say Fox has an edge over CNN only for some actual real news thrown in. CNN only discusses their complete dislike for the President pretty much 24 hours a day. You barely see any other news on that station anymore. 
    Well, that flies in the face of the researched and documented differences in presentation of true statements between Fox and CNN. Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but Fox does not come out ahead. 
    It's all a matter of opinion. Neither should be called news station. The majority is opinions on their political stance on those two in particular. it doesn't stop just at those two though. You have to weed out a lot to get to some topics other than political views. 
    Haha. Kellyanne, is that you pumpkin?
    "Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
  • unsung
    unsung I stopped by on March 7 2024. First time in many years, had to update payment info. Hope all is well. Politicians suck. Bye. Posts: 9,487
    mrussel1 said:
    unsung said:
    Again, I assign the blame on the parents.  The US govt is responsible as far as allowing incentives to be handed out to the people illegally coming here.  


    So you have no moral or ethical opinion on the subject?  You can blame the parents all you want, but then children are hurt.  Is that okay with you because it's the parents' fault?
    Don't blame me, blame the parents.  I did not bring them to a place where there are consequences.

    My sympathy with the children is that they are being used as political pawns.  
  • oftenreading
    oftenreading Victoria, BC Posts: 12,856
    unsung said:
    mrussel1 said:
    unsung said:
    Again, I assign the blame on the parents.  The US govt is responsible as far as allowing incentives to be handed out to the people illegally coming here.  


    So you have no moral or ethical opinion on the subject?  You can blame the parents all you want, but then children are hurt.  Is that okay with you because it's the parents' fault?
    Don't blame me, blame the parents.  I did not bring them to a place where there are consequences.

    My sympathy with the children is that they are being used as political pawns.  
    Do you factor in that most of these individuals and families are fleeing violence severe enough that facing these potential consequences seems like the better option?
    my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
  • mrussel1
    mrussel1 Posts: 30,981
    unsung said:
    mrussel1 said:
    unsung said:
    Again, I assign the blame on the parents.  The US govt is responsible as far as allowing incentives to be handed out to the people illegally coming here.  


    So you have no moral or ethical opinion on the subject?  You can blame the parents all you want, but then children are hurt.  Is that okay with you because it's the parents' fault?
    Don't blame me, blame the parents.  I did not bring them to a place where there are consequences.

    My sympathy with the children is that they are being used as political pawns.  
    In other words, you don't a damn what happens to them, is that right?  Because it's their parents' fault?  Or do you care about their well being?  Either you do or don't.  It's a pretty simple question.  

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