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yes but if you are honest about it most people are only talking about it because the President in an asshole. In a weird way those for the movement should thank Trump because he put it even more to the forefront than it was before.cottagesteeze said:
I see where you are coming from, but I think you are still attempting to belittle the movement. Those celebrities took a knee and now look how many of us are talking about it. Just by taking a knee they put a large influence on the conversation. I'm not saying that there aren't more powerful ways to participate, but for a celebrity, even a selfie can make huge changes.pjhawks said:
no where did i say these current celebs taking a knee was wrong (still don't think you should do it during the anthem but totally get it this past week in the wake of Trump's comments) . all i said was after someone posted a pic of Bill Russell is i guess we will start seeing all these celebs showing pics of themselves doing it. so far I've already seen Eddie, Roger Walters, Dave Matthews, Stevie Wonder and now Bill Russell. whose next? shall we bet on who is next?PJ_Soul said:
I didn't say you were a Trump supporter. I said it's typical of his ilk. If you're not a Trump supporter, it's probably good for you to know that your immediate reaction aligns with theirs.pjhawks said:
except i'm no where near a Trump supporter. I am disgusted by his behavior as any one is and i can't fathom 60 million people voting for such a piece of garbage. I was just asking a question wondering if we will start seeing every celeb taking pictures of themselves kneeling. Id' rather Bill Russell and all these other celebs actually do something to help instead of taking pictures of themselves. we live the selfie-generation so it shouldn't surprise me. i'd much rather see something like below than pictures. buy hey that's just me.PJ_Soul said:
Totally typical alt-right/Trump supporter tactic to belittle and demean the peaceful protest in the name of real, important issues that align with the US Constitution, especially if the issue is connected to race relations and civil rights of minority groups.pjhawks said:i guess taking a knee is the new ice bucket challenge where we will see every celebrity out taking a knee?
http://www.csnphilly.com/philadelphia-eagles/chris-long-putting-my-money-where-my-mouth-donation-game-checks0 -
I know man. I am specifically talking about the comment you did make - comparing it to the ice bucket challenge and focusing on celebrity. You say it's "an honest question", but I feel like there is a statement in that question... I mean, it occurred to you, right? It's at best a really cynical ponderance.pjhawks said:
no where did i say these current celebs taking a knee was wrong (still don't think you should do it during the anthem but totally get it this past week in the wake of Trump's comments) . all i said was after someone posted a pic of Bill Russell is i guess we will start seeing all these celebs showing pics of themselves doing it. so far I've already seen Eddie, Roger Walters, Dave Matthews, Stevie Wonder and now Bill Russell. whose next? shall we bet on who is next?PJ_Soul said:
I didn't say you were a Trump supporter. I said it's typical of his ilk. If you're not a Trump supporter, it's probably good for you to know that your immediate reaction aligns with theirs.pjhawks said:
except i'm no where near a Trump supporter. I am disgusted by his behavior as any one is and i can't fathom 60 million people voting for such a piece of garbage. I was just asking a question wondering if we will start seeing every celeb taking pictures of themselves kneeling. Id' rather Bill Russell and all these other celebs actually do something to help instead of taking pictures of themselves. we live the selfie-generation so it shouldn't surprise me. i'd much rather see something like below than pictures. buy hey that's just me.PJ_Soul said:
Totally typical alt-right/Trump supporter tactic to belittle and demean the peaceful protest in the name of real, important issues that align with the US Constitution, especially if the issue is connected to race relations and civil rights of minority groups.pjhawks said:i guess taking a knee is the new ice bucket challenge where we will see every celebrity out taking a knee?
http://www.csnphilly.com/philadelphia-eagles/chris-long-putting-my-money-where-my-mouth-donation-game-checks
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata0 -
I see it as an available way to add support to the discussion. I don't care if each person who adds their support wasn't first. Think of it as a way of voting and each vote adds to the total ... for racial justice. We can do it. We're Americans and we can do anything, right?
Falling down,...not staying down0 -
PJ_Soul said:
I personally see absolutely NOTHING wrong with people showing support for a cause that some other people started. That is how it always works. People see what others are doing, think about that issue, and realize that they really support what they're saying so they get on board too. I think that is a positive thing, not something to laugh at. If people didn't do that, protest would never lead to anything. And I think it's dismissive to say that these people "miraculously discovered their social consciences". You have no idea what the beliefs of those people are, or what they've done otherwise to voice those views or take action outside of this particular display of protest. And for those who haven't done anything... it is a good thing if they were inspired to think more about these issues because of what others did. We don't come out of the womb with our views. Every day is a new opportunity to develop our beliefs and join causes that we weren't very aware of before.DarthMaeglin said:Is it wrong to respect the handful of players who were taking a knee prior to this weekend, but laugh at all the bandwagon jumpers who have miraculously discovered their social consciences because they feel it's safe to protest the sitting president (but screw solidarity on the police brutality issue)? Personally I'm glad to see the backlash against players and teams (though in today's biased media world, it's difficult to actually gauge how widespread these protests are).
I tried watching Colbert's opening monologue and the man is simply insufferable in his disdain for Trump, and no longer cares about presenting the truth if he can make Trump into a white hood wearing Nazi. Our media here north of the border isn't much better either.
I get what you're saying, and I trust you realize that what you're saying applies equally to both sides of the aisle, right? I didn't agree with Kaepernick when this first started, but didn't begrudge him (and those that joined him) their rights to free expression or protest. What I'm questioning now is the motivation of all the Johnny-come-latelies. Are they truly protesting police brutality, or are they protesting Trump? All the comments I've seen from various athletes show me that they're protesting Trump. And doing these protests during the Canadian national anthem at CFL games is just downright silly (if the American anthem was played at these games (given how many U.S. players there are), that would be the time)."The world is full of idiots and I am but one of them."
10-30-1991 Toronto, Toronto 1 & 2 2016, Toronto 20220 -
HughFreakingDillon said:
he said there are many good people who were marching with white supremacists.DarthMaeglin said:cottagesteeze said:
Do you realize Cobert is a comedian and not a reporter? LOLDarthMaeglin said:Is it wrong to respect the handful of players who were taking a knee prior to this weekend, but laugh at all the bandwagon jumpers who have miraculously discovered their social consciences because they feel it's safe to protest the sitting president (but screw solidarity on the police brutality issue)? Personally I'm glad to see the backlash against players and teams (though in today's biased media world, it's difficult to actually gauge how widespread these protests are).
I tried watching Colbert's opening monologue and the man is simply insufferable in his disdain for Trump, and no longer cares about presenting the truth if he can make Trump into a white hood wearing Nazi. Our media here north of the border isn't much better either.
I do realize that and allow him (and other comedians) certain latitude because of that role, but he (and many, if not every late night host) seem to have abandoned even lip service to the truth. I've yet to hear/see a direct link between Trump's comments and race, yet Colbert was basically saying the only reason Trump made those comments was racism. He could have addressed it much differently while still making Trump look bad, but chose to go low, in my opinion, only giving fuel for Trump's supporters (though I doubt many of those are watching Colbert these days, lol).
He also said there were "fine people" on the opposing side, while acknowledging there were bad seeds on both sides, if I remember correctly. But it seems that people only remember the white supremacist side of the comment."The world is full of idiots and I am but one of them."
10-30-1991 Toronto, Toronto 1 & 2 2016, Toronto 20220 -
yes i am a quite cynical person especially when it comes to public gestures. one of the things I respect most about all that the guys in PJ do for others is they rarely do it publicly.PJ_Soul said:
I know man. I am specifically talking about the comment you did make - comparing it to the ice bucket challenge and focusing on celebrity. You say it's "an honest question", but I feel like there is a statement in that question... I mean, it occurred to you, right? It's at best a really cynical ponderance.pjhawks said:
no where did i say these current celebs taking a knee was wrong (still don't think you should do it during the anthem but totally get it this past week in the wake of Trump's comments) . all i said was after someone posted a pic of Bill Russell is i guess we will start seeing all these celebs showing pics of themselves doing it. so far I've already seen Eddie, Roger Walters, Dave Matthews, Stevie Wonder and now Bill Russell. whose next? shall we bet on who is next?PJ_Soul said:
I didn't say you were a Trump supporter. I said it's typical of his ilk. If you're not a Trump supporter, it's probably good for you to know that your immediate reaction aligns with theirs.pjhawks said:
except i'm no where near a Trump supporter. I am disgusted by his behavior as any one is and i can't fathom 60 million people voting for such a piece of garbage. I was just asking a question wondering if we will start seeing every celeb taking pictures of themselves kneeling. Id' rather Bill Russell and all these other celebs actually do something to help instead of taking pictures of themselves. we live the selfie-generation so it shouldn't surprise me. i'd much rather see something like below than pictures. buy hey that's just me.PJ_Soul said:
Totally typical alt-right/Trump supporter tactic to belittle and demean the peaceful protest in the name of real, important issues that align with the US Constitution, especially if the issue is connected to race relations and civil rights of minority groups.pjhawks said:i guess taking a knee is the new ice bucket challenge where we will see every celebrity out taking a knee?
http://www.csnphilly.com/philadelphia-eagles/chris-long-putting-my-money-where-my-mouth-donation-game-checks0 -
of course I remember him saying that. that's what he said. He said "good people on both sides", which means one of those sides was the white supremacist side.DarthMaeglin said:HughFreakingDillon said:
he said there are many good people who were marching with white supremacists.DarthMaeglin said:cottagesteeze said:
Do you realize Cobert is a comedian and not a reporter? LOLDarthMaeglin said:Is it wrong to respect the handful of players who were taking a knee prior to this weekend, but laugh at all the bandwagon jumpers who have miraculously discovered their social consciences because they feel it's safe to protest the sitting president (but screw solidarity on the police brutality issue)? Personally I'm glad to see the backlash against players and teams (though in today's biased media world, it's difficult to actually gauge how widespread these protests are).
I tried watching Colbert's opening monologue and the man is simply insufferable in his disdain for Trump, and no longer cares about presenting the truth if he can make Trump into a white hood wearing Nazi. Our media here north of the border isn't much better either.
I do realize that and allow him (and other comedians) certain latitude because of that role, but he (and many, if not every late night host) seem to have abandoned even lip service to the truth. I've yet to hear/see a direct link between Trump's comments and race, yet Colbert was basically saying the only reason Trump made those comments was racism. He could have addressed it much differently while still making Trump look bad, but chose to go low, in my opinion, only giving fuel for Trump's supporters (though I doubt many of those are watching Colbert these days, lol).
He also said there were "fine people" on the opposing side, while acknowledging there were bad seeds on both sides, if I remember correctly. But it seems that people only remember the white supremacist side of the comment.
his former chief strategist is a white supremacist.
he is the original birther.
we could go on, but do we need to?Hugh Freaking Dillon is currently out of the office, returning sometime in the fall0 -
I think some are protesting both, and some maybe Trump. Both are completely valid things to protest IMO. I don't think that CFL thing is silly at all - what's silly about showing support and solidarity for a cause or for people with whom they know?? You know a ton of Americans play for the CFL, right? I really don't understand why you are being so negatively judgemental about it all.DarthMaeglin said:PJ_Soul said:
I personally see absolutely NOTHING wrong with people showing support for a cause that some other people started. That is how it always works. People see what others are doing, think about that issue, and realize that they really support what they're saying so they get on board too. I think that is a positive thing, not something to laugh at. If people didn't do that, protest would never lead to anything. And I think it's dismissive to say that these people "miraculously discovered their social consciences". You have no idea what the beliefs of those people are, or what they've done otherwise to voice those views or take action outside of this particular display of protest. And for those who haven't done anything... it is a good thing if they were inspired to think more about these issues because of what others did. We don't come out of the womb with our views. Every day is a new opportunity to develop our beliefs and join causes that we weren't very aware of before.DarthMaeglin said:Is it wrong to respect the handful of players who were taking a knee prior to this weekend, but laugh at all the bandwagon jumpers who have miraculously discovered their social consciences because they feel it's safe to protest the sitting president (but screw solidarity on the police brutality issue)? Personally I'm glad to see the backlash against players and teams (though in today's biased media world, it's difficult to actually gauge how widespread these protests are).
I tried watching Colbert's opening monologue and the man is simply insufferable in his disdain for Trump, and no longer cares about presenting the truth if he can make Trump into a white hood wearing Nazi. Our media here north of the border isn't much better either.
I get what you're saying, and I trust you realize that what you're saying applies equally to both sides of the aisle, right? I didn't agree with Kaepernick when this first started, but didn't begrudge him (and those that joined him) their rights to free expression or protest. What I'm questioning now is the motivation of all the Johnny-come-latelies. Are they truly protesting police brutality, or are they protesting Trump? All the comments I've seen from various athletes show me that they're protesting Trump. And doing these protests during the Canadian national anthem at CFL games is just downright silly (if the American anthem was played at these games (given how many U.S. players there are), that would be the time).
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata0 -
HughFreakingDillon said:
of course I remember him saying that. that's what he said. He said "good people on both sides", which means one of those sides was the white supremacist side.DarthMaeglin said:HughFreakingDillon said:
he said there are many good people who were marching with white supremacists.DarthMaeglin said:cottagesteeze said:
Do you realize Cobert is a comedian and not a reporter? LOLDarthMaeglin said:Is it wrong to respect the handful of players who were taking a knee prior to this weekend, but laugh at all the bandwagon jumpers who have miraculously discovered their social consciences because they feel it's safe to protest the sitting president (but screw solidarity on the police brutality issue)? Personally I'm glad to see the backlash against players and teams (though in today's biased media world, it's difficult to actually gauge how widespread these protests are).
I tried watching Colbert's opening monologue and the man is simply insufferable in his disdain for Trump, and no longer cares about presenting the truth if he can make Trump into a white hood wearing Nazi. Our media here north of the border isn't much better either.
I do realize that and allow him (and other comedians) certain latitude because of that role, but he (and many, if not every late night host) seem to have abandoned even lip service to the truth. I've yet to hear/see a direct link between Trump's comments and race, yet Colbert was basically saying the only reason Trump made those comments was racism. He could have addressed it much differently while still making Trump look bad, but chose to go low, in my opinion, only giving fuel for Trump's supporters (though I doubt many of those are watching Colbert these days, lol).
He also said there were "fine people" on the opposing side, while acknowledging there were bad seeds on both sides, if I remember correctly. But it seems that people only remember the white supremacist side of the comment.
his former chief strategist is a white supremacist.
he is the original birther.
we could go on, but do we need to?
In the interests of keeping things on-topic I'm happy to move on from that specific point, lol."The world is full of idiots and I am but one of them."
10-30-1991 Toronto, Toronto 1 & 2 2016, Toronto 20220 -
it's not silly, especially given the CFL's recent push for diversity, which wasn't started because of trump, but they rolled it out earlier than expected as a show of solidarity.DarthMaeglin said:PJ_Soul said:
I personally see absolutely NOTHING wrong with people showing support for a cause that some other people started. That is how it always works. People see what others are doing, think about that issue, and realize that they really support what they're saying so they get on board too. I think that is a positive thing, not something to laugh at. If people didn't do that, protest would never lead to anything. And I think it's dismissive to say that these people "miraculously discovered their social consciences". You have no idea what the beliefs of those people are, or what they've done otherwise to voice those views or take action outside of this particular display of protest. And for those who haven't done anything... it is a good thing if they were inspired to think more about these issues because of what others did. We don't come out of the womb with our views. Every day is a new opportunity to develop our beliefs and join causes that we weren't very aware of before.DarthMaeglin said:Is it wrong to respect the handful of players who were taking a knee prior to this weekend, but laugh at all the bandwagon jumpers who have miraculously discovered their social consciences because they feel it's safe to protest the sitting president (but screw solidarity on the police brutality issue)? Personally I'm glad to see the backlash against players and teams (though in today's biased media world, it's difficult to actually gauge how widespread these protests are).
I tried watching Colbert's opening monologue and the man is simply insufferable in his disdain for Trump, and no longer cares about presenting the truth if he can make Trump into a white hood wearing Nazi. Our media here north of the border isn't much better either.
I get what you're saying, and I trust you realize that what you're saying applies equally to both sides of the aisle, right? I didn't agree with Kaepernick when this first started, but didn't begrudge him (and those that joined him) their rights to free expression or protest. What I'm questioning now is the motivation of all the Johnny-come-latelies. Are they truly protesting police brutality, or are they protesting Trump? All the comments I've seen from various athletes show me that they're protesting Trump. And doing these protests during the Canadian national anthem at CFL games is just downright silly (if the American anthem was played at these games (given how many U.S. players there are), that would be the time).
they are protesting the same thing Kaepernick did. there are just more that joined since the POTUS has gone on record that what they are doing is wrong and that the "sons of bitches" should be fired.Hugh Freaking Dillon is currently out of the office, returning sometime in the fall0 -
Yeah, the problem was that not a single White Nationalist is a fine person. Not even close. On the contrary. Every single person protesting on that side of the fence that day were rotten human beings. That's the whole problem. The POTUS said that some of the white nationalists are "fine people".DarthMaeglin said:HughFreakingDillon said:
he said there are many good people who were marching with white supremacists.DarthMaeglin said:cottagesteeze said:
Do you realize Cobert is a comedian and not a reporter? LOLDarthMaeglin said:Is it wrong to respect the handful of players who were taking a knee prior to this weekend, but laugh at all the bandwagon jumpers who have miraculously discovered their social consciences because they feel it's safe to protest the sitting president (but screw solidarity on the police brutality issue)? Personally I'm glad to see the backlash against players and teams (though in today's biased media world, it's difficult to actually gauge how widespread these protests are).
I tried watching Colbert's opening monologue and the man is simply insufferable in his disdain for Trump, and no longer cares about presenting the truth if he can make Trump into a white hood wearing Nazi. Our media here north of the border isn't much better either.
I do realize that and allow him (and other comedians) certain latitude because of that role, but he (and many, if not every late night host) seem to have abandoned even lip service to the truth. I've yet to hear/see a direct link between Trump's comments and race, yet Colbert was basically saying the only reason Trump made those comments was racism. He could have addressed it much differently while still making Trump look bad, but chose to go low, in my opinion, only giving fuel for Trump's supporters (though I doubt many of those are watching Colbert these days, lol).
He also said there were "fine people" on the opposing side, while acknowledging there were bad seeds on both sides, if I remember correctly. But it seems that people only remember the white supremacist side of the comment.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata0 -
PJ_Soul said:
I think some are protesting both, and some maybe Trump. Both are completely valid things to protest IMO. I don't think that CFL thing is silly at all - what's silly about showing support and solidarity for a cause or for people with whom they know?? You know a ton of Americans play for the CFL, right? I really don't understand why you are being so negatively judgemental about it all.DarthMaeglin said:PJ_Soul said:
I personally see absolutely NOTHING wrong with people showing support for a cause that some other people started. That is how it always works. People see what others are doing, think about that issue, and realize that they really support what they're saying so they get on board too. I think that is a positive thing, not something to laugh at. If people didn't do that, protest would never lead to anything. And I think it's dismissive to say that these people "miraculously discovered their social consciences". You have no idea what the beliefs of those people are, or what they've done otherwise to voice those views or take action outside of this particular display of protest. And for those who haven't done anything... it is a good thing if they were inspired to think more about these issues because of what others did. We don't come out of the womb with our views. Every day is a new opportunity to develop our beliefs and join causes that we weren't very aware of before.DarthMaeglin said:Is it wrong to respect the handful of players who were taking a knee prior to this weekend, but laugh at all the bandwagon jumpers who have miraculously discovered their social consciences because they feel it's safe to protest the sitting president (but screw solidarity on the police brutality issue)? Personally I'm glad to see the backlash against players and teams (though in today's biased media world, it's difficult to actually gauge how widespread these protests are).
I tried watching Colbert's opening monologue and the man is simply insufferable in his disdain for Trump, and no longer cares about presenting the truth if he can make Trump into a white hood wearing Nazi. Our media here north of the border isn't much better either.
I get what you're saying, and I trust you realize that what you're saying applies equally to both sides of the aisle, right? I didn't agree with Kaepernick when this first started, but didn't begrudge him (and those that joined him) their rights to free expression or protest. What I'm questioning now is the motivation of all the Johnny-come-latelies. Are they truly protesting police brutality, or are they protesting Trump? All the comments I've seen from various athletes show me that they're protesting Trump. And doing these protests during the Canadian national anthem at CFL games is just downright silly (if the American anthem was played at these games (given how many U.S. players there are), that would be the time).
For me the silliness is "protesting" during the anthem of a country that certainly isn't facing this issue (police brutality, if we assume the purest of motives, though you're likely correct, there are some protesting both) to the same degree as south of the border (despite what BLM-Toronto say). If they wanted to show solidarity with U.S. players, why couldn't they arrange to be at the NFL games to join in the protest? I'm just spitballing I admit, and as I type I realize I'd have more respect if the CFL players chose to do the "selfie-knee", instead of protesting during "my" anthem. That said, we do allow for such things under our own Charter Of Rights And Freedoms, so it's really only my personal sensibilities that are bothered (though I suspect I'm far from alone on this point).
I guess you say "negatively judgmental," I admit I'm being cynical more than anything. Potatoes, patatas, lol."The world is full of idiots and I am but one of them."
10-30-1991 Toronto, Toronto 1 & 2 2016, Toronto 20220 -
HughFreakingDillon said:
it's not silly, especially given the CFL's recent push for diversity, which wasn't started because of trump, but they rolled it out earlier than expected as a show of solidarity.DarthMaeglin said:PJ_Soul said:
I personally see absolutely NOTHING wrong with people showing support for a cause that some other people started. That is how it always works. People see what others are doing, think about that issue, and realize that they really support what they're saying so they get on board too. I think that is a positive thing, not something to laugh at. If people didn't do that, protest would never lead to anything. And I think it's dismissive to say that these people "miraculously discovered their social consciences". You have no idea what the beliefs of those people are, or what they've done otherwise to voice those views or take action outside of this particular display of protest. And for those who haven't done anything... it is a good thing if they were inspired to think more about these issues because of what others did. We don't come out of the womb with our views. Every day is a new opportunity to develop our beliefs and join causes that we weren't very aware of before.DarthMaeglin said:Is it wrong to respect the handful of players who were taking a knee prior to this weekend, but laugh at all the bandwagon jumpers who have miraculously discovered their social consciences because they feel it's safe to protest the sitting president (but screw solidarity on the police brutality issue)? Personally I'm glad to see the backlash against players and teams (though in today's biased media world, it's difficult to actually gauge how widespread these protests are).
I tried watching Colbert's opening monologue and the man is simply insufferable in his disdain for Trump, and no longer cares about presenting the truth if he can make Trump into a white hood wearing Nazi. Our media here north of the border isn't much better either.
I get what you're saying, and I trust you realize that what you're saying applies equally to both sides of the aisle, right? I didn't agree with Kaepernick when this first started, but didn't begrudge him (and those that joined him) their rights to free expression or protest. What I'm questioning now is the motivation of all the Johnny-come-latelies. Are they truly protesting police brutality, or are they protesting Trump? All the comments I've seen from various athletes show me that they're protesting Trump. And doing these protests during the Canadian national anthem at CFL games is just downright silly (if the American anthem was played at these games (given how many U.S. players there are), that would be the time).
they are protesting the same thing Kaepernick did. there are just more that joined since the POTUS has gone on record that what they are doing is wrong and that the "sons of bitches" should be fired.
I wasn't aware of any CFL players taking a knee or linking arms prior to this weekend, but admit it may have been happening (haven't really followed the CFL in years now). Again, it's the cynic in me, but it's misdirected at best. Why aren't these players protesting outside U.S. consulates and embassies on a regular basis? Might that not be more appropriate over making a spectacle that will garner news coverage, but ultimately is seemingly proving as divisive as Trump's comments?"The world is full of idiots and I am but one of them."
10-30-1991 Toronto, Toronto 1 & 2 2016, Toronto 20220 -
Am I crazy to think that this comment was taken out of context?DarthMaeglin said:HughFreakingDillon said:
he said there are many good people who were marching with white supremacists.DarthMaeglin said:cottagesteeze said:
Do you realize Cobert is a comedian and not a reporter? LOLDarthMaeglin said:Is it wrong to respect the handful of players who were taking a knee prior to this weekend, but laugh at all the bandwagon jumpers who have miraculously discovered their social consciences because they feel it's safe to protest the sitting president (but screw solidarity on the police brutality issue)? Personally I'm glad to see the backlash against players and teams (though in today's biased media world, it's difficult to actually gauge how widespread these protests are).
I tried watching Colbert's opening monologue and the man is simply insufferable in his disdain for Trump, and no longer cares about presenting the truth if he can make Trump into a white hood wearing Nazi. Our media here north of the border isn't much better either.
I do realize that and allow him (and other comedians) certain latitude because of that role, but he (and many, if not every late night host) seem to have abandoned even lip service to the truth. I've yet to hear/see a direct link between Trump's comments and race, yet Colbert was basically saying the only reason Trump made those comments was racism. He could have addressed it much differently while still making Trump look bad, but chose to go low, in my opinion, only giving fuel for Trump's supporters (though I doubt many of those are watching Colbert these days, lol).
He also said there were "fine people" on the opposing side, while acknowledging there were bad seeds on both sides, if I remember correctly. But it seems that people only remember the white supremacist side of the comment.
Do people really think that Trump meant the White Supremacists were "fine people"? I just find that too idiotic to believe. I thought there was a preservation group that goes around protecting art and sculptures that was there and he meant them.
If they were ALL supremacists then the point is moot though.0 -
It's a symbolic display of solidarity for their friends and past/future teammates in the most public venue they are ever in. I seriously don't understand how anyone could think that's silly. And FWIW, police brutality and police profiling is TOTALLY an issue in Canada too, not that that is what this CFL protest was actually about. And FYI, I have yet to hear from a single Canadian who was offended that that team did that during the Canadian anthem (including yourself I think). As a Canadian as well, it didn't even cross my mind to care about that aspect of it. TBH, I hadn't even thought about it at all until you mentioned it, lol.DarthMaeglin said:PJ_Soul said:
I think some are protesting both, and some maybe Trump. Both are completely valid things to protest IMO. I don't think that CFL thing is silly at all - what's silly about showing support and solidarity for a cause or for people with whom they know?? You know a ton of Americans play for the CFL, right? I really don't understand why you are being so negatively judgemental about it all.DarthMaeglin said:PJ_Soul said:
I personally see absolutely NOTHING wrong with people showing support for a cause that some other people started. That is how it always works. People see what others are doing, think about that issue, and realize that they really support what they're saying so they get on board too. I think that is a positive thing, not something to laugh at. If people didn't do that, protest would never lead to anything. And I think it's dismissive to say that these people "miraculously discovered their social consciences". You have no idea what the beliefs of those people are, or what they've done otherwise to voice those views or take action outside of this particular display of protest. And for those who haven't done anything... it is a good thing if they were inspired to think more about these issues because of what others did. We don't come out of the womb with our views. Every day is a new opportunity to develop our beliefs and join causes that we weren't very aware of before.DarthMaeglin said:Is it wrong to respect the handful of players who were taking a knee prior to this weekend, but laugh at all the bandwagon jumpers who have miraculously discovered their social consciences because they feel it's safe to protest the sitting president (but screw solidarity on the police brutality issue)? Personally I'm glad to see the backlash against players and teams (though in today's biased media world, it's difficult to actually gauge how widespread these protests are).
I tried watching Colbert's opening monologue and the man is simply insufferable in his disdain for Trump, and no longer cares about presenting the truth if he can make Trump into a white hood wearing Nazi. Our media here north of the border isn't much better either.
I get what you're saying, and I trust you realize that what you're saying applies equally to both sides of the aisle, right? I didn't agree with Kaepernick when this first started, but didn't begrudge him (and those that joined him) their rights to free expression or protest. What I'm questioning now is the motivation of all the Johnny-come-latelies. Are they truly protesting police brutality, or are they protesting Trump? All the comments I've seen from various athletes show me that they're protesting Trump. And doing these protests during the Canadian national anthem at CFL games is just downright silly (if the American anthem was played at these games (given how many U.S. players there are), that would be the time).
For me the silliness is "protesting" during the anthem of a country that certainly isn't facing this issue (police brutality, if we assume the purest of motives, though you're likely correct, there are some protesting both) to the same degree as south of the border (despite what BLM-Toronto say). If they wanted to show solidarity with U.S. players, why couldn't they arrange to be at the NFL games to join in the protest? I'm just spitballing I admit, and as I type I realize I'd have more respect if the CFL players chose to do the "selfie-knee", instead of protesting during "my" anthem. That said, we do allow for such things under our own Charter Of Rights And Freedoms, so it's really only my personal sensibilities that are bothered (though I suspect I'm far from alone on this point).
I guess you say "negatively judgmental," I admit I'm being cynical more than anything. Potatoes, patatas, lol.
And yes, you're being very cynical, to the point where it looks like you're seeking out reasons to not be okay with the whole thing. I just can't figure out why you'd want to stretch for the viewpoint, when the other option is so much more..... righteous and useful.
Post edited by PJ_Soul onWith all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata0 -
that answer is simple: awareness. they are doing this on national tv, instead of posting a video of themselves on instagram. the reach for the message is infinitely wider.DarthMaeglin said:HughFreakingDillon said:
it's not silly, especially given the CFL's recent push for diversity, which wasn't started because of trump, but they rolled it out earlier than expected as a show of solidarity.DarthMaeglin said:PJ_Soul said:
I personally see absolutely NOTHING wrong with people showing support for a cause that some other people started. That is how it always works. People see what others are doing, think about that issue, and realize that they really support what they're saying so they get on board too. I think that is a positive thing, not something to laugh at. If people didn't do that, protest would never lead to anything. And I think it's dismissive to say that these people "miraculously discovered their social consciences". You have no idea what the beliefs of those people are, or what they've done otherwise to voice those views or take action outside of this particular display of protest. And for those who haven't done anything... it is a good thing if they were inspired to think more about these issues because of what others did. We don't come out of the womb with our views. Every day is a new opportunity to develop our beliefs and join causes that we weren't very aware of before.DarthMaeglin said:Is it wrong to respect the handful of players who were taking a knee prior to this weekend, but laugh at all the bandwagon jumpers who have miraculously discovered their social consciences because they feel it's safe to protest the sitting president (but screw solidarity on the police brutality issue)? Personally I'm glad to see the backlash against players and teams (though in today's biased media world, it's difficult to actually gauge how widespread these protests are).
I tried watching Colbert's opening monologue and the man is simply insufferable in his disdain for Trump, and no longer cares about presenting the truth if he can make Trump into a white hood wearing Nazi. Our media here north of the border isn't much better either.
I get what you're saying, and I trust you realize that what you're saying applies equally to both sides of the aisle, right? I didn't agree with Kaepernick when this first started, but didn't begrudge him (and those that joined him) their rights to free expression or protest. What I'm questioning now is the motivation of all the Johnny-come-latelies. Are they truly protesting police brutality, or are they protesting Trump? All the comments I've seen from various athletes show me that they're protesting Trump. And doing these protests during the Canadian national anthem at CFL games is just downright silly (if the American anthem was played at these games (given how many U.S. players there are), that would be the time).
they are protesting the same thing Kaepernick did. there are just more that joined since the POTUS has gone on record that what they are doing is wrong and that the "sons of bitches" should be fired.
I wasn't aware of any CFL players taking a knee or linking arms prior to this weekend, but admit it may have been happening (haven't really followed the CFL in years now). Again, it's the cynic in me, but it's misdirected at best. Why aren't these players protesting outside U.S. consulates and embassies on a regular basis? Might that not be more appropriate over making a spectacle that will garner news coverage, but ultimately is seemingly proving as divisive as Trump's comments?Hugh Freaking Dillon is currently out of the office, returning sometime in the fall0 -
Lol, I just thought it was interesting. I never really knew why it was sung during sporting events.Go Beavers said:
So the Millennials talked and laughed during the song in 1954? Entitled brats.PJPOWER said:Why the National Anthem is played at sporting events:
http://www.history.com/news/why-the-star-spangled-banner-is-played-at-sporting-events?cmpid=FACEBOOK_FBPAGE__20170925&linkId=427309820 -
PJ_Soul said:
It's a symbolic display of solidarity for their friends and past/future teammates in the most public venue they are ever in. I seriously don't understand how anyone could think that's silly.DarthMaeglin said:PJ_Soul said:
I think some are protesting both, and some maybe Trump. Both are completely valid things to protest IMO. I don't think that CFL thing is silly at all - what's silly about showing support and solidarity for a cause or for people with whom they know?? You know a ton of Americans play for the CFL, right? I really don't understand why you are being so negatively judgemental about it all.DarthMaeglin said:PJ_Soul said:
I personally see absolutely NOTHING wrong with people showing support for a cause that some other people started. That is how it always works. People see what others are doing, think about that issue, and realize that they really support what they're saying so they get on board too. I think that is a positive thing, not something to laugh at. If people didn't do that, protest would never lead to anything. And I think it's dismissive to say that these people "miraculously discovered their social consciences". You have no idea what the beliefs of those people are, or what they've done otherwise to voice those views or take action outside of this particular display of protest. And for those who haven't done anything... it is a good thing if they were inspired to think more about these issues because of what others did. We don't come out of the womb with our views. Every day is a new opportunity to develop our beliefs and join causes that we weren't very aware of before.DarthMaeglin said:Is it wrong to respect the handful of players who were taking a knee prior to this weekend, but laugh at all the bandwagon jumpers who have miraculously discovered their social consciences because they feel it's safe to protest the sitting president (but screw solidarity on the police brutality issue)? Personally I'm glad to see the backlash against players and teams (though in today's biased media world, it's difficult to actually gauge how widespread these protests are).
I tried watching Colbert's opening monologue and the man is simply insufferable in his disdain for Trump, and no longer cares about presenting the truth if he can make Trump into a white hood wearing Nazi. Our media here north of the border isn't much better either.
I get what you're saying, and I trust you realize that what you're saying applies equally to both sides of the aisle, right? I didn't agree with Kaepernick when this first started, but didn't begrudge him (and those that joined him) their rights to free expression or protest. What I'm questioning now is the motivation of all the Johnny-come-latelies. Are they truly protesting police brutality, or are they protesting Trump? All the comments I've seen from various athletes show me that they're protesting Trump. And doing these protests during the Canadian national anthem at CFL games is just downright silly (if the American anthem was played at these games (given how many U.S. players there are), that would be the time).
For me the silliness is "protesting" during the anthem of a country that certainly isn't facing this issue (police brutality, if we assume the purest of motives, though you're likely correct, there are some protesting both) to the same degree as south of the border (despite what BLM-Toronto say). If they wanted to show solidarity with U.S. players, why couldn't they arrange to be at the NFL games to join in the protest? I'm just spitballing I admit, and as I type I realize I'd have more respect if the CFL players chose to do the "selfie-knee", instead of protesting during "my" anthem. That said, we do allow for such things under our own Charter Of Rights And Freedoms, so it's really only my personal sensibilities that are bothered (though I suspect I'm far from alone on this point).
I guess you say "negatively judgmental," I admit I'm being cynical more than anything. Potatoes, patatas, lol.
That may be fine and dandy, but where does it end? There's basketball players who intend some sort of protest (big coverage of the Raptors players' reactions here yesterday). Why don't European football (soccer) players all take a knee too? Will cricket players take a knee too? How will NHLers choose to join in the protest? That's where it's really becoming silly for me, I'm sorry if that offends or bothers others, but I think there's a saying about opinions, lol.
"The world is full of idiots and I am but one of them."
10-30-1991 Toronto, Toronto 1 & 2 2016, Toronto 20220 -
but why does it HAVE to end? the more traction it gains, the more support it gains, and some shit might actually change. I'd probably start crying if I saw international athletes join the protest. and it would drive Trump out of his fucking mind.DarthMaeglin said:PJ_Soul said:
It's a symbolic display of solidarity for their friends and past/future teammates in the most public venue they are ever in. I seriously don't understand how anyone could think that's silly.DarthMaeglin said:PJ_Soul said:
I think some are protesting both, and some maybe Trump. Both are completely valid things to protest IMO. I don't think that CFL thing is silly at all - what's silly about showing support and solidarity for a cause or for people with whom they know?? You know a ton of Americans play for the CFL, right? I really don't understand why you are being so negatively judgemental about it all.DarthMaeglin said:PJ_Soul said:
I personally see absolutely NOTHING wrong with people showing support for a cause that some other people started. That is how it always works. People see what others are doing, think about that issue, and realize that they really support what they're saying so they get on board too. I think that is a positive thing, not something to laugh at. If people didn't do that, protest would never lead to anything. And I think it's dismissive to say that these people "miraculously discovered their social consciences". You have no idea what the beliefs of those people are, or what they've done otherwise to voice those views or take action outside of this particular display of protest. And for those who haven't done anything... it is a good thing if they were inspired to think more about these issues because of what others did. We don't come out of the womb with our views. Every day is a new opportunity to develop our beliefs and join causes that we weren't very aware of before.DarthMaeglin said:Is it wrong to respect the handful of players who were taking a knee prior to this weekend, but laugh at all the bandwagon jumpers who have miraculously discovered their social consciences because they feel it's safe to protest the sitting president (but screw solidarity on the police brutality issue)? Personally I'm glad to see the backlash against players and teams (though in today's biased media world, it's difficult to actually gauge how widespread these protests are).
I tried watching Colbert's opening monologue and the man is simply insufferable in his disdain for Trump, and no longer cares about presenting the truth if he can make Trump into a white hood wearing Nazi. Our media here north of the border isn't much better either.
I get what you're saying, and I trust you realize that what you're saying applies equally to both sides of the aisle, right? I didn't agree with Kaepernick when this first started, but didn't begrudge him (and those that joined him) their rights to free expression or protest. What I'm questioning now is the motivation of all the Johnny-come-latelies. Are they truly protesting police brutality, or are they protesting Trump? All the comments I've seen from various athletes show me that they're protesting Trump. And doing these protests during the Canadian national anthem at CFL games is just downright silly (if the American anthem was played at these games (given how many U.S. players there are), that would be the time).
For me the silliness is "protesting" during the anthem of a country that certainly isn't facing this issue (police brutality, if we assume the purest of motives, though you're likely correct, there are some protesting both) to the same degree as south of the border (despite what BLM-Toronto say). If they wanted to show solidarity with U.S. players, why couldn't they arrange to be at the NFL games to join in the protest? I'm just spitballing I admit, and as I type I realize I'd have more respect if the CFL players chose to do the "selfie-knee", instead of protesting during "my" anthem. That said, we do allow for such things under our own Charter Of Rights And Freedoms, so it's really only my personal sensibilities that are bothered (though I suspect I'm far from alone on this point).
I guess you say "negatively judgmental," I admit I'm being cynical more than anything. Potatoes, patatas, lol.
That may be fine and dandy, but where does it end? There's basketball players who intend some sort of protest (big coverage of the Raptors players' reactions here yesterday). Why don't European football (soccer) players all take a knee too? Will cricket players take a knee too? How will NHLers choose to join in the protest? That's where it's really becoming silly for me, I'm sorry if that offends or bothers others, but I think there's a saying about opinions, lol.Hugh Freaking Dillon is currently out of the office, returning sometime in the fall0 -
Yes indeed, why not? I am still not clear on why you would mind if all of them did it. I don't feel like you have come close to actually explaining why you think it's silly. I mean, you keep saying that, but I still don't really get why. Are you perhaps not aware of the impact such acts have on the wider population?DarthMaeglin said:PJ_Soul said:
It's a symbolic display of solidarity for their friends and past/future teammates in the most public venue they are ever in. I seriously don't understand how anyone could think that's silly.DarthMaeglin said:PJ_Soul said:
I think some are protesting both, and some maybe Trump. Both are completely valid things to protest IMO. I don't think that CFL thing is silly at all - what's silly about showing support and solidarity for a cause or for people with whom they know?? You know a ton of Americans play for the CFL, right? I really don't understand why you are being so negatively judgemental about it all.DarthMaeglin said:PJ_Soul said:
I personally see absolutely NOTHING wrong with people showing support for a cause that some other people started. That is how it always works. People see what others are doing, think about that issue, and realize that they really support what they're saying so they get on board too. I think that is a positive thing, not something to laugh at. If people didn't do that, protest would never lead to anything. And I think it's dismissive to say that these people "miraculously discovered their social consciences". You have no idea what the beliefs of those people are, or what they've done otherwise to voice those views or take action outside of this particular display of protest. And for those who haven't done anything... it is a good thing if they were inspired to think more about these issues because of what others did. We don't come out of the womb with our views. Every day is a new opportunity to develop our beliefs and join causes that we weren't very aware of before.DarthMaeglin said:Is it wrong to respect the handful of players who were taking a knee prior to this weekend, but laugh at all the bandwagon jumpers who have miraculously discovered their social consciences because they feel it's safe to protest the sitting president (but screw solidarity on the police brutality issue)? Personally I'm glad to see the backlash against players and teams (though in today's biased media world, it's difficult to actually gauge how widespread these protests are).
I tried watching Colbert's opening monologue and the man is simply insufferable in his disdain for Trump, and no longer cares about presenting the truth if he can make Trump into a white hood wearing Nazi. Our media here north of the border isn't much better either.
I get what you're saying, and I trust you realize that what you're saying applies equally to both sides of the aisle, right? I didn't agree with Kaepernick when this first started, but didn't begrudge him (and those that joined him) their rights to free expression or protest. What I'm questioning now is the motivation of all the Johnny-come-latelies. Are they truly protesting police brutality, or are they protesting Trump? All the comments I've seen from various athletes show me that they're protesting Trump. And doing these protests during the Canadian national anthem at CFL games is just downright silly (if the American anthem was played at these games (given how many U.S. players there are), that would be the time).
For me the silliness is "protesting" during the anthem of a country that certainly isn't facing this issue (police brutality, if we assume the purest of motives, though you're likely correct, there are some protesting both) to the same degree as south of the border (despite what BLM-Toronto say). If they wanted to show solidarity with U.S. players, why couldn't they arrange to be at the NFL games to join in the protest? I'm just spitballing I admit, and as I type I realize I'd have more respect if the CFL players chose to do the "selfie-knee", instead of protesting during "my" anthem. That said, we do allow for such things under our own Charter Of Rights And Freedoms, so it's really only my personal sensibilities that are bothered (though I suspect I'm far from alone on this point).
I guess you say "negatively judgmental," I admit I'm being cynical more than anything. Potatoes, patatas, lol.
That may be fine and dandy, but where does it end? There's basketball players who intend some sort of protest (big coverage of the Raptors players' reactions here yesterday). Why don't European football (soccer) players all take a knee too? Will cricket players take a knee too? How will NHLers choose to join in the protest? That's where it's really becoming silly for me, I'm sorry if that offends or bothers others, but I think there's a saying about opinions, lol.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata0
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