Canadian Politics Redux
Comments
-
your comments are generally not over the top (neither are mine, save for the one above). they are outright false projections as to how you wish to see my views. which is an incorrect assessment, which you continually choose to ignore.Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
Oh, of course.HughFreakingDillon said:
mine was so over the top it was obviously made in jest. you constantly make these claims that you actually seem to believe with regards to our system that you think I wish to give every rapist a hug and get him a job at a daycare. it's stupid, not to mention insulting. not to mention you don't listen. I fully support everything you support, with one major exception: death penalty. I support harsher penalties in most cases. Rehabilitation if it's suitable. but you choose to ignore that so you can make your hyperbolic posts.Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
You should read your post which, in turn, prompted mine.HughFreakingDillon said:
come on. you aren't nearly as ignorant as this statement would suggest. your penchant for the dramatic has soured me on this discussion once again. that was quick this time, possibly a record.Thirty Bills Unpaid said:Okay. You clearly think raping and murdering children is an offence along the lines of dealing drugs or stealing a car- jail time.
Always cool when the dramatics suit your position, eh?
Don't fling mud if you don't want to get dirty.
whatever.
Your over the top comments are cool, while my over the top comments are insulting and a bunch of other things too. You'd have to excuse me for misunderstanding the field I was playing on- I didn't realize it could only be titled one direction.By The Time They Figure Out What Went Wrong, We'll Be Sitting On A Beach, Earning Twenty Percent.0 -
Key term: stance.HughFreakingDillon said:
wow, that's not arrogant (if not completely false) at all.Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
Really?PJ_Soul said:
I meant HFD and I are saying that. "We."Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
We aren't saying that. You are.PJ_Soul said:
Most who get life do not get paroled after 25 years if ever, as is expected to be the case with Bernardo. Everyone involved expects him to die in prison. That's what started the conversation in the first place. Why are you playing dumb right now?Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
Yes. 25 years isn't exactly life. That's why I laughed.PJ_Soul said:
Are you trying to say that's not true? You can't. It's fact.Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
lolHughFreakingDillon said:
sure they do. life in prison, as defined by the criminal code of canada, means not eligible for parole for 25 years.Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
Funny you say this. Murderers never get life in prison either. Come on.HughFreakingDillon said:
people who sell drugs or rob a convenience store have never gotten life in prison. come on.Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
Well let me try and illustrate it for you:PJ_Soul said:Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
Sure. But who cares? I'm saying that just because we have abolished the death penalty... that doesn't mean we got it figured out.PJ_Soul said:
So you think Saudi Arabia, China, North Korea, Iran, America, et al have it figured out? I assume you don't. If you look at the countries that do use the death penalty and at those that don't, it is pretty clear that most of the more socially successful nations in terms of human rights as well as standards of living and crime rates do not use it. That means something whether you want it to or not.Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
Yah. And they got it figured out, eh? Shall I point out all the things that Canada and the rest of the entire western world don't have figured out?PJ_Soul said:
No they couldn't. Canada and literally the rest of the entire Western world besides America doesn't have the death penalty because they understand that good people are better than the murderers.Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
They could, of course, not have to attend because the asshole is rotting in the ground after he received a sentence of death like he deserved. Very fair given his offences... just sayin'.PJ_Soul said:
They could, of course, not attend and request that they not even be notified of such proceedings. Still not fair, but just sayin'.lukin2006 said:I agree he's never getting out, its the families the should not have to go through these proceedings. I would have no problem with life throw away the key...
These people are heavily invested. Their children were taken from them in the most horrific manner imaginable.
We aren't the beacons of social success if that's what you've implied.
Whether you care to admit it or not... the natural consequence for murdering children isn't a comfy prison cell with conjugal visits and such (remember the last case we discussed where psycho got knocked up having some good old sex while serving a sentence for murdering someone?). The natural consequence for such a grievous offence is death and that doesn't make people who acknowledge such barbaric... it makes them pragmatic- a quality lost around here sometimes.
Natural consequence?? That makes no sense. Natural according to what or whom?Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
Sure. But who cares? I'm saying that just because we have abolished the death penalty... that doesn't mean we got it figured out.PJ_Soul said:Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
Yah. And they got it figured out, eh? Shall I point out all the things that Canada and the rest of the entire western world don't have figured out?PJ_Soul said:
No they couldn't. Canada and literally the rest of the entire Western world besides America doesn't have the death penalty because they understand that good people are better than the murderers.Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
They could, of course, not have to attend because the asshole is rotting in the ground after he received a sentence of death like he deserved. Very fair given his offences... just sayin'.PJ_Soul said:
They could, of course, not attend and request that they not even be notified of such proceedings. Still not fair, but just sayin'.lukin2006 said:I agree he's never getting out, its the families the should not have to go through these proceedings. I would have no problem with life throw away the key...
These people are heavily invested. Their children were taken from them in the most horrific manner imaginable.
We aren't the beacons of social success if that's what you've implied.
owledge such barbaric... it makes them pragmatic- a quality lost around here sometimes.
Life if prison is pragmatic The death penalty is indeed barbarism, and all about emotions and revenge. That doesn't seem very pragmatic to me.
If you rape and murder children... you deserve a sentence that differs from someone who robbed a convenience store or sold drugs.
We have placed a ceiling on punishment, but the sky is the limit for crime. How is that 'pragmatic'?
why stop at death then? that's a ceiling too! we should mutilate their dead bodies in public in front of their children and call it a learning tool.
Okay.
Are you trying to say that some sentences aren't appropriate to the crime? Agreed. But the logical progression from that is not "KILL THEM!!!" It's to examine the sentences where it should have probably been life in prison but wasn't.
A joke, man. Our penal system is a joke. You somewhat defending it is kinda comical too.
And we are not defending the penal system, we are saying that the death penalty is not a reasonable or pragmatic solution to its flaws.
I'm okay with the general idea of executing someone who deserves it given the nature of their offence (serial, mass, or any murder involving a child... in other words... murder for kicks). You're not. End of discussion (at least in this thread).
Oh, that is too bad you can't hold up your end of the argument - I could hold up mine forever.
1. Go to Death Penalty thread.
2. Count submissions made by 30 Bills Unpaid in Death Penalty thread.
3. Review this comment.
All the points you are trying to make have been very eloquently made by others. And they've all been countered with mine and others. I don't need to repeat myself in this thread at this moment- especially when, for this particular moment, there is no need to given the opponents of the DP have not advocated for their position very well at all (the pro stance is hardly threatened from my perspective).
the pro stance isn't threatened? t would seem the anti stance is hardly threatened, since it ISN'T LEGAL. LOL.
As defined like this: the attitude of a person or organization toward something; a standpoint.
Or as used in common language such as in the following sentence: Liking the Oilers, Johnny took the stance that Connor McDavid was the best player in the game; however, Tim disagreed with Johnny's stance- insisting Sydney Crosby was the best."My brain's a good brain!"0 -
yeah, I know what the word means. this is what you said: there is no need to given the opponents of the DP have not advocated for their position very well at allThirty Bills Unpaid said:
Key term: stance.HughFreakingDillon said:
wow, that's not arrogant (if not completely false) at all.Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
Really?PJ_Soul said:
I meant HFD and I are saying that. "We."Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
We aren't saying that. You are.PJ_Soul said:
Most who get life do not get paroled after 25 years if ever, as is expected to be the case with Bernardo. Everyone involved expects him to die in prison. That's what started the conversation in the first place. Why are you playing dumb right now?Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
Yes. 25 years isn't exactly life. That's why I laughed.PJ_Soul said:
Are you trying to say that's not true? You can't. It's fact.Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
lolHughFreakingDillon said:
sure they do. life in prison, as defined by the criminal code of canada, means not eligible for parole for 25 years.Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
Funny you say this. Murderers never get life in prison either. Come on.HughFreakingDillon said:
people who sell drugs or rob a convenience store have never gotten life in prison. come on.Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
Well let me try and illustrate it for you:PJ_Soul said:Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
Sure. But who cares? I'm saying that just because we have abolished the death penalty... that doesn't mean we got it figured out.PJ_Soul said:
So you think Saudi Arabia, China, North Korea, Iran, America, et al have it figured out? I assume you don't. If you look at the countries that do use the death penalty and at those that don't, it is pretty clear that most of the more socially successful nations in terms of human rights as well as standards of living and crime rates do not use it. That means something whether you want it to or not.Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
Yah. And they got it figured out, eh? Shall I point out all the things that Canada and the rest of the entire western world don't have figured out?PJ_Soul said:
No they couldn't. Canada and literally the rest of the entire Western world besides America doesn't have the death penalty because they understand that good people are better than the murderers.Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
They could, of course, not have to attend because the asshole is rotting in the ground after he received a sentence of death like he deserved. Very fair given his offences... just sayin'.PJ_Soul said:
They could, of course, not attend and request that they not even be notified of such proceedings. Still not fair, but just sayin'.lukin2006 said:I agree he's never getting out, its the families the should not have to go through these proceedings. I would have no problem with life throw away the key...
These people are heavily invested. Their children were taken from them in the most horrific manner imaginable.
We aren't the beacons of social success if that's what you've implied.
Whether you care to admit it or not... the natural consequence for murdering children isn't a comfy prison cell with conjugal visits and such (remember the last case we discussed where psycho got knocked up having some good old sex while serving a sentence for murdering someone?). The natural consequence for such a grievous offence is death and that doesn't make people who acknowledge such barbaric... it makes them pragmatic- a quality lost around here sometimes.
Natural consequence?? That makes no sense. Natural according to what or whom?Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
Sure. But who cares? I'm saying that just because we have abolished the death penalty... that doesn't mean we got it figured out.PJ_Soul said:Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
Yah. And they got it figured out, eh? Shall I point out all the things that Canada and the rest of the entire western world don't have figured out?PJ_Soul said:
No they couldn't. Canada and literally the rest of the entire Western world besides America doesn't have the death penalty because they understand that good people are better than the murderers.Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
They could, of course, not have to attend because the asshole is rotting in the ground after he received a sentence of death like he deserved. Very fair given his offences... just sayin'.PJ_Soul said:
They could, of course, not attend and request that they not even be notified of such proceedings. Still not fair, but just sayin'.lukin2006 said:I agree he's never getting out, its the families the should not have to go through these proceedings. I would have no problem with life throw away the key...
These people are heavily invested. Their children were taken from them in the most horrific manner imaginable.
We aren't the beacons of social success if that's what you've implied.
owledge such barbaric... it makes them pragmatic- a quality lost around here sometimes.
Life if prison is pragmatic The death penalty is indeed barbarism, and all about emotions and revenge. That doesn't seem very pragmatic to me.
If you rape and murder children... you deserve a sentence that differs from someone who robbed a convenience store or sold drugs.
We have placed a ceiling on punishment, but the sky is the limit for crime. How is that 'pragmatic'?
why stop at death then? that's a ceiling too! we should mutilate their dead bodies in public in front of their children and call it a learning tool.
Okay.
Are you trying to say that some sentences aren't appropriate to the crime? Agreed. But the logical progression from that is not "KILL THEM!!!" It's to examine the sentences where it should have probably been life in prison but wasn't.
A joke, man. Our penal system is a joke. You somewhat defending it is kinda comical too.
And we are not defending the penal system, we are saying that the death penalty is not a reasonable or pragmatic solution to its flaws.
I'm okay with the general idea of executing someone who deserves it given the nature of their offence (serial, mass, or any murder involving a child... in other words... murder for kicks). You're not. End of discussion (at least in this thread).
Oh, that is too bad you can't hold up your end of the argument - I could hold up mine forever.
1. Go to Death Penalty thread.
2. Count submissions made by 30 Bills Unpaid in Death Penalty thread.
3. Review this comment.
All the points you are trying to make have been very eloquently made by others. And they've all been countered with mine and others. I don't need to repeat myself in this thread at this moment- especially when, for this particular moment, there is no need to given the opponents of the DP have not advocated for their position very well at all (the pro stance is hardly threatened from my perspective).
the pro stance isn't threatened? t would seem the anti stance is hardly threatened, since it ISN'T LEGAL. LOL.
As defined like this: the attitude of a person or organization toward something; a standpoint.
Or as used in common language such as in the following sentence: Liking the Oilers, Johnny took the stance that Connor McDavid was the best player in the game; however, Tim disagreed with Johnny's stance- insisting Sydney Crosby was the best.
that's just plain ignorant.By The Time They Figure Out What Went Wrong, We'll Be Sitting On A Beach, Earning Twenty Percent.0 -
No.PJ_Soul said:
Liberal fluffs??? That's what you call people who are simply against the DP? What do I call you then? Blood-thirsty?Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
Key excerpts from the two pieces:lukin2006 said:By the numbers: ‘Lifers’ in Canada’s prisons
http://globalnews.ca/news/1864132/by-the-numbers-lifers-in-canadas-prisons/
Why life in prison rarely works out that way in Canada
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/opinion/why-life-in-prison-rarely-works-out-that-way-in-canada/article24301991/
* 33% of 'lifers' granted full parole by boards in 2013-14.
Hardly life.
* Life without parole protects the public by permanently separating heinous killers from law-abiding Canadians. According to the Parole Board of Canada, long-term follow-up of 1886 convicted murderers who were granted parole during a 14-year period (1994 to 2008) found that 13 per cent breached their parole conditions, 6 per cent committed non-violent offences and 3 per cent committed violent offences.
Not fantastic for the hard liners' perspective, but not too shabby for the liberal fluffs (I mean... it wasn't too many innocents harmed as we tried so hard to let killers try again, eh?).
* Take last week’s police announcement of a Canada-wide arrest warrant for Francis Patrick Clancy, who was picked up by Victoria police on Monday. He was granted parole while serving a life sentence for murdering an innocent young man by smashing his face repeatedly with an axe. Shockingly, he was assessed as a “moderate high risk for general and violent offending” just prior to being day-paroled. Police had warned the public that Clancy was violent and not to approach him.
Just give him space and tread carefully around him... alright? And for gawd's sakes... don't let him have an axe.
I have always sided 100% with you about how sentences can be too light or otherwise fucked up in Canada. It's ridiculous. My only argument is that the DP isn't the solution to this.
Liberal fluffs as in those people that think our penal system rocks and that we need to be releasing hardened murderers into the mainstream."My brain's a good brain!"0 -
ZERO. that's how many people think our penal system rocks. but you continue to call anyone who isn't pro-DP "liberal thug huggers" and the like. the proof is in the DP thread you mentioned earlier.Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
No.PJ_Soul said:
Liberal fluffs??? That's what you call people who are simply against the DP? What do I call you then? Blood-thirsty?Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
Key excerpts from the two pieces:lukin2006 said:By the numbers: ‘Lifers’ in Canada’s prisons
http://globalnews.ca/news/1864132/by-the-numbers-lifers-in-canadas-prisons/
Why life in prison rarely works out that way in Canada
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/opinion/why-life-in-prison-rarely-works-out-that-way-in-canada/article24301991/
* 33% of 'lifers' granted full parole by boards in 2013-14.
Hardly life.
* Life without parole protects the public by permanently separating heinous killers from law-abiding Canadians. According to the Parole Board of Canada, long-term follow-up of 1886 convicted murderers who were granted parole during a 14-year period (1994 to 2008) found that 13 per cent breached their parole conditions, 6 per cent committed non-violent offences and 3 per cent committed violent offences.
Not fantastic for the hard liners' perspective, but not too shabby for the liberal fluffs (I mean... it wasn't too many innocents harmed as we tried so hard to let killers try again, eh?).
* Take last week’s police announcement of a Canada-wide arrest warrant for Francis Patrick Clancy, who was picked up by Victoria police on Monday. He was granted parole while serving a life sentence for murdering an innocent young man by smashing his face repeatedly with an axe. Shockingly, he was assessed as a “moderate high risk for general and violent offending” just prior to being day-paroled. Police had warned the public that Clancy was violent and not to approach him.
Just give him space and tread carefully around him... alright? And for gawd's sakes... don't let him have an axe.
I have always sided 100% with you about how sentences can be too light or otherwise fucked up in Canada. It's ridiculous. My only argument is that the DP isn't the solution to this.
Liberal fluffs as in those people that think our penal system rocks and that we need to be releasing hardened murderers into the mainstream.By The Time They Figure Out What Went Wrong, We'll Be Sitting On A Beach, Earning Twenty Percent.0 -
You're calling me ignorant because I expressed the argument that was presented to me didn't inspire me to rush to the DP's defence?HughFreakingDillon said:
yeah, I know what the word means. this is what you said: there is no need to given the opponents of the DP have not advocated for their position very well at allThirty Bills Unpaid said:
Key term: stance.HughFreakingDillon said:
wow, that's not arrogant (if not completely false) at all.Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
Really?PJ_Soul said:
I meant HFD and I are saying that. "We."Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
We aren't saying that. You are.PJ_Soul said:
Most who get life do not get paroled after 25 years if ever, as is expected to be the case with Bernardo. Everyone involved expects him to die in prison. That's what started the conversation in the first place. Why are you playing dumb right now?Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
Yes. 25 years isn't exactly life. That's why I laughed.PJ_Soul said:
Are you trying to say that's not true? You can't. It's fact.Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
lolHughFreakingDillon said:
sure they do. life in prison, as defined by the criminal code of canada, means not eligible for parole for 25 years.Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
Funny you say this. Murderers never get life in prison either. Come on.HughFreakingDillon said:
people who sell drugs or rob a convenience store have never gotten life in prison. come on.Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
Well let me try and illustrate it for you:PJ_Soul said:Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
Sure. But who cares? I'm saying that just because we have abolished the death penalty... that doesn't mean we got it figured out.PJ_Soul said:
So you think Saudi Arabia, China, North Korea, Iran, America, et al have it figured out? I assume you don't. If you look at the countries that do use the death penalty and at those that don't, it is pretty clear that most of the more socially successful nations in terms of human rights as well as standards of living and crime rates do not use it. That means something whether you want it to or not.Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
Yah. And they got it figured out, eh? Shall I point out all the things that Canada and the rest of the entire western world don't have figured out?PJ_Soul said:
No they couldn't. Canada and literally the rest of the entire Western world besides America doesn't have the death penalty because they understand that good people are better than the murderers.Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
They could, of course, not have to attend because the asshole is rotting in the ground after he received a sentence of death like he deserved. Very fair given his offences... just sayin'.PJ_Soul said:
They could, of course, not attend and request that they not even be notified of such proceedings. Still not fair, but just sayin'.lukin2006 said:I agree he's never getting out, its the families the should not have to go through these proceedings. I would have no problem with life throw away the key...
These people are heavily invested. Their children were taken from them in the most horrific manner imaginable.
We aren't the beacons of social success if that's what you've implied.
Whether you care to admit it or not... the natural consequence for murdering children isn't a comfy prison cell with conjugal visits and such (remember the last case we discussed where psycho got knocked up having some good old sex while serving a sentence for murdering someone?). The natural consequence for such a grievous offence is death and that doesn't make people who acknowledge such barbaric... it makes them pragmatic- a quality lost around here sometimes.
Natural consequence?? That makes no sense. Natural according to what or whom?Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
Sure. But who cares? I'm saying that just because we have abolished the death penalty... that doesn't mean we got it figured out.PJ_Soul said:Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
Yah. And they got it figured out, eh? Shall I point out all the things that Canada and the rest of the entire western world don't have figured out?PJ_Soul said:
No they couldn't. Canada and literally the rest of the entire Western world besides America doesn't have the death penalty because they understand that good people are better than the murderers.Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
They could, of course, not have to attend because the asshole is rotting in the ground after he received a sentence of death like he deserved. Very fair given his offences... just sayin'.PJ_Soul said:
They could, of course, not attend and request that they not even be notified of such proceedings. Still not fair, but just sayin'.lukin2006 said:I agree he's never getting out, its the families the should not have to go through these proceedings. I would have no problem with life throw away the key...
These people are heavily invested. Their children were taken from them in the most horrific manner imaginable.
We aren't the beacons of social success if that's what you've implied.
owledge such barbaric... it makes them pragmatic- a quality lost around here sometimes.
Life if prison is pragmatic The death penalty is indeed barbarism, and all about emotions and revenge. That doesn't seem very pragmatic to me.
If you rape and murder children... you deserve a sentence that differs from someone who robbed a convenience store or sold drugs.
We have placed a ceiling on punishment, but the sky is the limit for crime. How is that 'pragmatic'?
why stop at death then? that's a ceiling too! we should mutilate their dead bodies in public in front of their children and call it a learning tool.
Okay.
Are you trying to say that some sentences aren't appropriate to the crime? Agreed. But the logical progression from that is not "KILL THEM!!!" It's to examine the sentences where it should have probably been life in prison but wasn't.
A joke, man. Our penal system is a joke. You somewhat defending it is kinda comical too.
And we are not defending the penal system, we are saying that the death penalty is not a reasonable or pragmatic solution to its flaws.
I'm okay with the general idea of executing someone who deserves it given the nature of their offence (serial, mass, or any murder involving a child... in other words... murder for kicks). You're not. End of discussion (at least in this thread).
Oh, that is too bad you can't hold up your end of the argument - I could hold up mine forever.
1. Go to Death Penalty thread.
2. Count submissions made by 30 Bills Unpaid in Death Penalty thread.
3. Review this comment.
All the points you are trying to make have been very eloquently made by others. And they've all been countered with mine and others. I don't need to repeat myself in this thread at this moment- especially when, for this particular moment, there is no need to given the opponents of the DP have not advocated for their position very well at all (the pro stance is hardly threatened from my perspective).
the pro stance isn't threatened? t would seem the anti stance is hardly threatened, since it ISN'T LEGAL. LOL.
As defined like this: the attitude of a person or organization toward something; a standpoint.
Or as used in common language such as in the following sentence: Liking the Oilers, Johnny took the stance that Connor McDavid was the best player in the game; however, Tim disagreed with Johnny's stance- insisting Sydney Crosby was the best.
that's just plain ignorant."My brain's a good brain!"0 -
no, ignorant is saying something that is inherently false based on nothing but an opinion.By The Time They Figure Out What Went Wrong, We'll Be Sitting On A Beach, Earning Twenty Percent.0
-
Why do you think I was referring to anyone specifically here?HughFreakingDillon said:
ZERO. that's how many people think our penal system rocks. but you continue to call anyone who isn't pro-DP "liberal thug huggers" and the like. the proof is in the DP thread you mentioned earlier.Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
No.PJ_Soul said:
Liberal fluffs??? That's what you call people who are simply against the DP? What do I call you then? Blood-thirsty?Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
Key excerpts from the two pieces:lukin2006 said:By the numbers: ‘Lifers’ in Canada’s prisons
http://globalnews.ca/news/1864132/by-the-numbers-lifers-in-canadas-prisons/
Why life in prison rarely works out that way in Canada
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/opinion/why-life-in-prison-rarely-works-out-that-way-in-canada/article24301991/
* 33% of 'lifers' granted full parole by boards in 2013-14.
Hardly life.
* Life without parole protects the public by permanently separating heinous killers from law-abiding Canadians. According to the Parole Board of Canada, long-term follow-up of 1886 convicted murderers who were granted parole during a 14-year period (1994 to 2008) found that 13 per cent breached their parole conditions, 6 per cent committed non-violent offences and 3 per cent committed violent offences.
Not fantastic for the hard liners' perspective, but not too shabby for the liberal fluffs (I mean... it wasn't too many innocents harmed as we tried so hard to let killers try again, eh?).
* Take last week’s police announcement of a Canada-wide arrest warrant for Francis Patrick Clancy, who was picked up by Victoria police on Monday. He was granted parole while serving a life sentence for murdering an innocent young man by smashing his face repeatedly with an axe. Shockingly, he was assessed as a “moderate high risk for general and violent offending” just prior to being day-paroled. Police had warned the public that Clancy was violent and not to approach him.
Just give him space and tread carefully around him... alright? And for gawd's sakes... don't let him have an axe.
I have always sided 100% with you about how sentences can be too light or otherwise fucked up in Canada. It's ridiculous. My only argument is that the DP isn't the solution to this.
Liberal fluffs as in those people that think our penal system rocks and that we need to be releasing hardened murderers into the mainstream.
Clearly... there are people who fit my description. Are you denying this?
"My brain's a good brain!"0 -
I'm sorry, did I miss a conversation that just happened here about that? I thought we were talking about the DP.....Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
No.PJ_Soul said:
Liberal fluffs??? That's what you call people who are simply against the DP? What do I call you then? Blood-thirsty?Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
Key excerpts from the two pieces:lukin2006 said:By the numbers: ‘Lifers’ in Canada’s prisons
http://globalnews.ca/news/1864132/by-the-numbers-lifers-in-canadas-prisons/
Why life in prison rarely works out that way in Canada
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/opinion/why-life-in-prison-rarely-works-out-that-way-in-canada/article24301991/
* 33% of 'lifers' granted full parole by boards in 2013-14.
Hardly life.
* Life without parole protects the public by permanently separating heinous killers from law-abiding Canadians. According to the Parole Board of Canada, long-term follow-up of 1886 convicted murderers who were granted parole during a 14-year period (1994 to 2008) found that 13 per cent breached their parole conditions, 6 per cent committed non-violent offences and 3 per cent committed violent offences.
Not fantastic for the hard liners' perspective, but not too shabby for the liberal fluffs (I mean... it wasn't too many innocents harmed as we tried so hard to let killers try again, eh?).
* Take last week’s police announcement of a Canada-wide arrest warrant for Francis Patrick Clancy, who was picked up by Victoria police on Monday. He was granted parole while serving a life sentence for murdering an innocent young man by smashing his face repeatedly with an axe. Shockingly, he was assessed as a “moderate high risk for general and violent offending” just prior to being day-paroled. Police had warned the public that Clancy was violent and not to approach him.
Just give him space and tread carefully around him... alright? And for gawd's sakes... don't let him have an axe.
I have always sided 100% with you about how sentences can be too light or otherwise fucked up in Canada. It's ridiculous. My only argument is that the DP isn't the solution to this.
Liberal fluffs as in those people that think our penal system rocks and that we need to be releasing hardened murderers into the mainstream.
I personally don't know a single person who thinks the Canadian penal system "rocks". Literally no one. I know someone... is it digin? Or someone else? Thinks that the problems are a very small minority of cases, and besides that, everybody here and every person I have ever spoken about it with, and everybody on social media, is well aware that sometimes sentences handed down by judges are a joke. So who are all these "liberal fluffs" who support light sentences? Can you direct me to a place where this is evident? Because they don't exist in my world (which is jam packed with liberal thinkers), and I'm curious about who the fuck these fluffs are.Post edited by PJ_Soul onWith all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata0 -
That's one definition I guess. Not typically the most used definition (lacking knowledge).HughFreakingDillon said:no, ignorant is saying something that is inherently false based on nothing but an opinion.
"My brain's a good brain!"0 -
Actually... the latest string of comments have been spawned by the introduction of Bernardo and his parole hearing.PJ_Soul said:
I'm sorry, did I miss a conversation that just happened here about that? I thought we were talking about the DP.....Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
No.PJ_Soul said:
Liberal fluffs??? That's what you call people who are simply against the DP? What do I call you then? Blood-thirsty?Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
Key excerpts from the two pieces:lukin2006 said:By the numbers: ‘Lifers’ in Canada’s prisons
http://globalnews.ca/news/1864132/by-the-numbers-lifers-in-canadas-prisons/
Why life in prison rarely works out that way in Canada
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/opinion/why-life-in-prison-rarely-works-out-that-way-in-canada/article24301991/
* 33% of 'lifers' granted full parole by boards in 2013-14.
Hardly life.
* Life without parole protects the public by permanently separating heinous killers from law-abiding Canadians. According to the Parole Board of Canada, long-term follow-up of 1886 convicted murderers who were granted parole during a 14-year period (1994 to 2008) found that 13 per cent breached their parole conditions, 6 per cent committed non-violent offences and 3 per cent committed violent offences.
Not fantastic for the hard liners' perspective, but not too shabby for the liberal fluffs (I mean... it wasn't too many innocents harmed as we tried so hard to let killers try again, eh?).
* Take last week’s police announcement of a Canada-wide arrest warrant for Francis Patrick Clancy, who was picked up by Victoria police on Monday. He was granted parole while serving a life sentence for murdering an innocent young man by smashing his face repeatedly with an axe. Shockingly, he was assessed as a “moderate high risk for general and violent offending” just prior to being day-paroled. Police had warned the public that Clancy was violent and not to approach him.
Just give him space and tread carefully around him... alright? And for gawd's sakes... don't let him have an axe.
I have always sided 100% with you about how sentences can be too light or otherwise fucked up in Canada. It's ridiculous. My only argument is that the DP isn't the solution to this.
Liberal fluffs as in those people that think our penal system rocks and that we need to be releasing hardened murderers into the mainstream.
I personally don't know a single person who thinks the Canadian penal system "rocks". Literally no one. I know someone... is it digin? Or something else? Thinks that the problems are a very small minority of cases, and besides that, everybody here and every person I have ever spoken about it with, and everybody on social media, is well aware that sometimes sentences handed down by judges are a joke. So who are all these "liberal fluffs" who support light sentences? Can you direct me to a place where this is evident? Because they don't exist in my world (which is jam packed with liberal thinkers), and I'm curious about who the fuck these fluffs are.
You don't know who I speak of? They're out there. They've written our country's penal code."My brain's a good brain!"0 -
Yeah, I know, I was the one who reminded you that the conversation started with Bernardo, but I mean that the conversation lead to us discussing the DP, since the premise with Bernardo is that he will never ever get out of prison, so you took it to the only possible next level - the DP.Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
Actually... the latest string of comments have been spawned by the introduction of Bernardo and his parole hearing.PJ_Soul said:
I'm sorry, did I miss a conversation that just happened here about that? I thought we were talking about the DP.....Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
No.PJ_Soul said:
Liberal fluffs??? That's what you call people who are simply against the DP? What do I call you then? Blood-thirsty?Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
Key excerpts from the two pieces:lukin2006 said:By the numbers: ‘Lifers’ in Canada’s prisons
http://globalnews.ca/news/1864132/by-the-numbers-lifers-in-canadas-prisons/
Why life in prison rarely works out that way in Canada
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/opinion/why-life-in-prison-rarely-works-out-that-way-in-canada/article24301991/
* 33% of 'lifers' granted full parole by boards in 2013-14.
Hardly life.
* Life without parole protects the public by permanently separating heinous killers from law-abiding Canadians. According to the Parole Board of Canada, long-term follow-up of 1886 convicted murderers who were granted parole during a 14-year period (1994 to 2008) found that 13 per cent breached their parole conditions, 6 per cent committed non-violent offences and 3 per cent committed violent offences.
Not fantastic for the hard liners' perspective, but not too shabby for the liberal fluffs (I mean... it wasn't too many innocents harmed as we tried so hard to let killers try again, eh?).
* Take last week’s police announcement of a Canada-wide arrest warrant for Francis Patrick Clancy, who was picked up by Victoria police on Monday. He was granted parole while serving a life sentence for murdering an innocent young man by smashing his face repeatedly with an axe. Shockingly, he was assessed as a “moderate high risk for general and violent offending” just prior to being day-paroled. Police had warned the public that Clancy was violent and not to approach him.
Just give him space and tread carefully around him... alright? And for gawd's sakes... don't let him have an axe.
I have always sided 100% with you about how sentences can be too light or otherwise fucked up in Canada. It's ridiculous. My only argument is that the DP isn't the solution to this.
Liberal fluffs as in those people that think our penal system rocks and that we need to be releasing hardened murderers into the mainstream.
I personally don't know a single person who thinks the Canadian penal system "rocks". Literally no one. I know someone... is it digin? Or something else? Thinks that the problems are a very small minority of cases, and besides that, everybody here and every person I have ever spoken about it with, and everybody on social media, is well aware that sometimes sentences handed down by judges are a joke. So who are all these "liberal fluffs" who support light sentences? Can you direct me to a place where this is evident? Because they don't exist in my world (which is jam packed with liberal thinkers), and I'm curious about who the fuck these fluffs are.
You don't know who I speak of? They're out there. They've written our country's penal code.
Alright, so the answer is that you in fact do not know a single person who thinks light sentences for serious violent crimes rock. Got it.With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata0 -
Must be some kind of single day post record in the Canadian thread ...hahahaha
Thirty, if you think your going to see tougher sentences with Trudeau at the helm...I have certain rules I live by ... My First Rule ... I don't believe anything the government tells me ... George Carlin
"Life Is What Happens To You When Your Busy Making Other Plans" John Lennon0 -
I actually don't feel that "upper management" is responsible for most of the too-light sentences. Not directly, anyway. The judges are responsible for it. Where politicians come is with funding for the court and prison systems (and don't forget this is also on a provincial level - believe it or not, it's not all Trudeau's fault, lol. who somehow just hasn't managed to rearrange the entire criminal justice and penal system during his first year in office.lukin2006 said:Must be some kind of single day post record in the Canadian thread ...hahahaha
Thirty, if you think your going to see tougher sentences with Trudeau at the helm...
Hey, Harper couldn't do it in 10, right? 
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata0 -
Typical... she forgets that she pushed the envelope a bit when she suggested: They could, of course, not attend and request that they not even be notified of such proceedings. Still not fair, but just sayin'. In other words... get over it... which prompted a comment from me suggesting a different alternative to 'getting over it'.PJ_Soul said:
Yeah, I know, I was the one who reminded you that the conversation started with Bernardo, but I mean that the conversation lead to us discussing the DP, since the premise with Bernardo is that he will never ever get out of prison, so you took it to the only possible next level - the DP.Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
Actually... the latest string of comments have been spawned by the introduction of Bernardo and his parole hearing.PJ_Soul said:
I'm sorry, did I miss a conversation that just happened here about that? I thought we were talking about the DP.....Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
No.PJ_Soul said:
Liberal fluffs??? That's what you call people who are simply against the DP? What do I call you then? Blood-thirsty?Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
Key excerpts from the two pieces:lukin2006 said:By the numbers: ‘Lifers’ in Canada’s prisons
http://globalnews.ca/news/1864132/by-the-numbers-lifers-in-canadas-prisons/
Why life in prison rarely works out that way in Canada
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/opinion/why-life-in-prison-rarely-works-out-that-way-in-canada/article24301991/
* 33% of 'lifers' granted full parole by boards in 2013-14.
Hardly life.
* Life without parole protects the public by permanently separating heinous killers from law-abiding Canadians. According to the Parole Board of Canada, long-term follow-up of 1886 convicted murderers who were granted parole during a 14-year period (1994 to 2008) found that 13 per cent breached their parole conditions, 6 per cent committed non-violent offences and 3 per cent committed violent offences.
Not fantastic for the hard liners' perspective, but not too shabby for the liberal fluffs (I mean... it wasn't too many innocents harmed as we tried so hard to let killers try again, eh?).
* Take last week’s police announcement of a Canada-wide arrest warrant for Francis Patrick Clancy, who was picked up by Victoria police on Monday. He was granted parole while serving a life sentence for murdering an innocent young man by smashing his face repeatedly with an axe. Shockingly, he was assessed as a “moderate high risk for general and violent offending” just prior to being day-paroled. Police had warned the public that Clancy was violent and not to approach him.
Just give him space and tread carefully around him... alright? And for gawd's sakes... don't let him have an axe.
I have always sided 100% with you about how sentences can be too light or otherwise fucked up in Canada. It's ridiculous. My only argument is that the DP isn't the solution to this.
Liberal fluffs as in those people that think our penal system rocks and that we need to be releasing hardened murderers into the mainstream.
I personally don't know a single person who thinks the Canadian penal system "rocks". Literally no one. I know someone... is it digin? Or something else? Thinks that the problems are a very small minority of cases, and besides that, everybody here and every person I have ever spoken about it with, and everybody on social media, is well aware that sometimes sentences handed down by judges are a joke. So who are all these "liberal fluffs" who support light sentences? Can you direct me to a place where this is evident? Because they don't exist in my world (which is jam packed with liberal thinkers), and I'm curious about who the fuck these fluffs are.
You don't know who I speak of? They're out there. They've written our country's penal code.
Alright, so the answer is that you in fact do not know a single person who thinks light sentences for serious violent crimes rock. Got it.
To your snide comment... outside of the people who have written our country's penal code (which I already answered and you obviously missed), the people who consistently vouch for its awesomeness, and many who sit on our parole boards? I'll take the fifth.
Have a nice day. Oh. And watch out for the axe murderer who's been paroled. He's apparently a risk."My brain's a good brain!"0 -
Whoooaaaa. You interpreted that at "get over it?" Well that is quite the leap, and not in ANY way what I meant or said, and have never said anything that would even come close to suggesting that I would ever think such a thing. Maybe you should stop making such wild assumptions about folks, and you won't be under the illusion that a bunch of people love light sentences for violent offenders.Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
Typical... she forgets that she pushed the envelope a bit when she suggested: They could, of course, not attend and request that they not even be notified of such proceedings. Still not fair, but just sayin'. In other words... get over it... which prompted a comment from me suggesting a different alternative to 'getting over it'.PJ_Soul said:
Yeah, I know, I was the one who reminded you that the conversation started with Bernardo, but I mean that the conversation lead to us discussing the DP, since the premise with Bernardo is that he will never ever get out of prison, so you took it to the only possible next level - the DP.Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
Actually... the latest string of comments have been spawned by the introduction of Bernardo and his parole hearing.PJ_Soul said:
I'm sorry, did I miss a conversation that just happened here about that? I thought we were talking about the DP.....Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
No.PJ_Soul said:
Liberal fluffs??? That's what you call people who are simply against the DP? What do I call you then? Blood-thirsty?Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
Key excerpts from the two pieces:lukin2006 said:By the numbers: ‘Lifers’ in Canada’s prisons
http://globalnews.ca/news/1864132/by-the-numbers-lifers-in-canadas-prisons/
Why life in prison rarely works out that way in Canada
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/opinion/why-life-in-prison-rarely-works-out-that-way-in-canada/article24301991/
* 33% of 'lifers' granted full parole by boards in 2013-14.
Hardly life.
* Life without parole protects the public by permanently separating heinous killers from law-abiding Canadians. According to the Parole Board of Canada, long-term follow-up of 1886 convicted murderers who were granted parole during a 14-year period (1994 to 2008) found that 13 per cent breached their parole conditions, 6 per cent committed non-violent offences and 3 per cent committed violent offences.
Not fantastic for the hard liners' perspective, but not too shabby for the liberal fluffs (I mean... it wasn't too many innocents harmed as we tried so hard to let killers try again, eh?).
* Take last week’s police announcement of a Canada-wide arrest warrant for Francis Patrick Clancy, who was picked up by Victoria police on Monday. He was granted parole while serving a life sentence for murdering an innocent young man by smashing his face repeatedly with an axe. Shockingly, he was assessed as a “moderate high risk for general and violent offending” just prior to being day-paroled. Police had warned the public that Clancy was violent and not to approach him.
Just give him space and tread carefully around him... alright? And for gawd's sakes... don't let him have an axe.
I have always sided 100% with you about how sentences can be too light or otherwise fucked up in Canada. It's ridiculous. My only argument is that the DP isn't the solution to this.
Liberal fluffs as in those people that think our penal system rocks and that we need to be releasing hardened murderers into the mainstream.
I personally don't know a single person who thinks the Canadian penal system "rocks". Literally no one. I know someone... is it digin? Or something else? Thinks that the problems are a very small minority of cases, and besides that, everybody here and every person I have ever spoken about it with, and everybody on social media, is well aware that sometimes sentences handed down by judges are a joke. So who are all these "liberal fluffs" who support light sentences? Can you direct me to a place where this is evident? Because they don't exist in my world (which is jam packed with liberal thinkers), and I'm curious about who the fuck these fluffs are.
You don't know who I speak of? They're out there. They've written our country's penal code.
Alright, so the answer is that you in fact do not know a single person who thinks light sentences for serious violent crimes rock. Got it.
To your snide comment... outside of the people who have written our country's penal code (which I already answered and you obviously missed), the people who consistently vouch for its awesomeness, and many who sit on our parole boards? I'll take the fifth.
Have a nice day. Oh. And watch out for the axe murderer who's been paroled. He's apparently a risk.With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata0 -
Well what did you mean by offering it? You qualified it weakly after by saying it wasn't really fair and 'just saying', but how should someone interpret it other than the way I did given how you presented it?"My brain's a good brain!"0
-
I actually specifically added the "still not fair, just sayin'" line to note that I don't think they should just get over it, because I was worried someone might misinterpret the comment as an opinion. I guess I should have made it a stronger statement for someone like you (surprisingly, really by now I would think you'd know my stance about this better than you apparently do), but thought people would take it for what it was worth, i.e. that I think it's not fair that those are their only choices, but that's unfortunately the case.Thirty Bills Unpaid said:Well what did you mean by offering it? You qualified it weakly after by saying it wasn't really fair and 'just saying', but how should someone interpret it other than the way I did given how you presented it?
Post edited by PJ_Soul onWith all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata0 -
I'm just hyper sensitive on this issue, Soul.
I realize I come across as obnoxious and overbearing at times with this subject, but it's one of those things that brings out the worst... and best of me.
I sincerely mean have a nice day. And I sarcastically warn you to watch yourself when you're around one of those lifer parolees- especially the axe murdering guy (they say he's a risk to the public while granting him parole anyway)!"My brain's a good brain!"0 -
Thirty Bills Unpaid said:
I'm just hyper sensitive on this issue, Soul.
I realize I come across as obnoxious and overbearing at times with this subject, but it's one of those things that brings out the worst... and best of me.
I sincerely mean have a nice day. And I sarcastically warn you to watch yourself when you're around one of those lifer parolees- especially the axe murdering guy (they say he's a risk to the public while granting him parole anyway)!
(few things piss me off more than when I see those all-to-frequent news items about the violent guy who has been deemed a high risk to reoffend being released into the community... seems like it happens on a weekly basis just in Vancouver, and that's only what hits the news/social media)With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata0
This discussion has been closed.
Categories
- All Categories
- 148.9K Pearl Jam's Music and Activism
- 110.1K The Porch
- 274 Vitalogy
- 35K Given To Fly (live)
- 3.5K Words and Music...Communication
- 39.2K Flea Market
- 39.2K Lost Dogs
- 58.7K Not Pearl Jam's Music
- 10.6K Musicians and Gearheads
- 29.1K Other Music
- 17.8K Poetry, Prose, Music & Art
- 1.1K The Art Wall
- 56.8K Non-Pearl Jam Discussion
- 22.2K A Moving Train
- 31.7K All Encompassing Trip
- 2.9K Technical Stuff and Help