Canadian Politics Redux

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  • sure they do. life in prison, as defined by the criminal code of canada, means not eligible for parole for 25 years.
    lol

    Okay.
    "My brain's a good brain!"
  • PJ_SoulPJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,363
    edited November 2016
    Yeah, and there are plenty of murderers who spend life in prison in Canada, just like Paul Bernardo is expected to.
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 39,027

    Okay. You clearly think raping and murdering children is an offence along the lines of dealing drugs or stealing a car- jail time.

    come on. you aren't nearly as ignorant as this statement would suggest. your penchant for the dramatic has soured me on this discussion once again. that was quick this time, possibly a record.
    "every society honours its live conformists and its dead troublemakers"




  • PJ_SoulPJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,363

    lol

    Okay.
    Are you trying to say that's not true? You can't. It's fact.
    Are you trying to say that some sentences aren't appropriate to the crime? Agreed. But the logical progression from that is not "KILL THEM!!!" It's to examine the sentences where it should have probably been life in prison but wasn't.
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 39,027

    lol

    Okay.
    in the US, you can get out in 35. even if it's GENOCIDE.
    "every society honours its live conformists and its dead troublemakers"




  • come on. you aren't nearly as ignorant as this statement would suggest. your penchant for the dramatic has soured me on this discussion once again. that was quick this time, possibly a record.
    You should read your post which, in turn, prompted mine.

    Always cool when the dramatics suit your position, eh?

    Don't fling mud if you don't want to get dirty.
    "My brain's a good brain!"
  • PJ_Soul said:

    Are you trying to say that's not true? You can't. It's fact.
    Are you trying to say that some sentences aren't appropriate to the crime? Agreed. But the logical progression from that is not "KILL THEM!!!" It's to examine the sentences where it should have probably been life in prison but wasn't.
    Yes. 25 years isn't exactly life. That's why I laughed.

    A joke, man. Our penal system is a joke. You somewhat defending it is kinda comical too.
    "My brain's a good brain!"
  • PJ_SoulPJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,363
    edited November 2016

    Yes. 25 years isn't exactly life. That's why I laughed.

    A joke, man. Our penal system is a joke. You somewhat defending it is kinda comical too.
    Most who get life do not get paroled after 25 years if ever, as is expected to be the case with Bernardo. Everyone involved expects him to die in prison. That's what started the conversation in the first place. Why are you playing dumb right now?
    And we are not defending the penal system, we are saying that the death penalty is not a reasonable or pragmatic solution to its flaws.
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • lukin2006lukin2006 Posts: 9,087
    I have certain rules I live by ... My First Rule ... I don't believe anything the government tells me ... George Carlin

    "Life Is What Happens To You When Your Busy Making Other Plans" John Lennon
  • Thirty Bills UnpaidThirty Bills Unpaid Posts: 16,881
    edited November 2016
    PJ_Soul said:

    Most who get life do not get paroled after 25 years if ever, as is expected to be the case with Bernardo. Everyone involved expects him to die in prison. That's what started the conversation in the first place. Why are you playing dumb right now?
    And we are not defending the penal system, we are saying that the death penalty is not a reasonable or pragmatic solution to its flaws.
    We aren't saying that. You are.

    I'm okay with the general idea of executing someone who deserves it given the nature of their offence (serial, mass, or any murder involving a child... in other words... murder for kicks). You're not. End of discussion (at least in this thread).

    Edit: I just realized by 'we'... you meant you and your friends that are above executing a child murderer.
    Post edited by Thirty Bills Unpaid on
    "My brain's a good brain!"
  • PJ_SoulPJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,363

    We aren't saying that. You are.

    I'm okay with the general idea of executing someone who deserves it given the nature of their offence (serial, mass, or any murder involving a child... in other words... murder for kicks). You're not. End of discussion (at least in this thread).
    I meant HFD and I are saying that. "We."
    Oh, that is too bad you can't hold up your end of the argument - I could hold up mine forever. =)
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • PJ_Soul said:

    I meant HFD and I are saying that. "We."
    Oh, that is too bad you can't hold up your end of the argument - I could hold up mine forever. =)
    Really?

    1. Go to Death Penalty thread.
    2. Count submissions made by 30 Bills Unpaid in Death Penalty thread.
    3. Review this comment.

    All the points you are trying to make have been very eloquently made by others. And they've all been countered with mine and others. I don't need to repeat myself in this thread at this moment- especially when, for this particular moment, there is no need to given the opponents of the DP have not advocated for their position very well at all (the pro stance is hardly threatened from my perspective).
    "My brain's a good brain!"
  • lukin2006 said:
    Key excerpts from the two pieces:

    * 33% of 'lifers' granted full parole by boards in 2013-14.

    Hardly life.

    * Life without parole protects the public by permanently separating heinous killers from law-abiding Canadians. According to the Parole Board of Canada, long-term follow-up of 1886 convicted murderers who were granted parole during a 14-year period (1994 to 2008) found that 13 per cent breached their parole conditions, 6 per cent committed non-violent offences and 3 per cent committed violent offences.

    Not fantastic for the hard liners' perspective, but not too shabby for the liberal fluffs (I mean... it wasn't too many innocents harmed as we tried so hard to let killers try again, eh?).

    * Take last week’s police announcement of a Canada-wide arrest warrant for Francis Patrick Clancy, who was picked up by Victoria police on Monday. He was granted parole while serving a life sentence for murdering an innocent young man by smashing his face repeatedly with an axe. Shockingly, he was assessed as a “moderate high risk for general and violent offending” just prior to being day-paroled. Police had warned the public that Clancy was violent and not to approach him.

    Just give him space and tread carefully around him... alright? And for gawd's sakes... don't let him have an axe.
    "My brain's a good brain!"
  • dignindignin Posts: 9,478
    image
  • JWPearlJWPearl Posts: 19,893
    thank you
  • PJ_SoulPJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,363

    Really?

    1. Go to Death Penalty thread.
    2. Count submissions made by 30 Bills Unpaid in Death Penalty thread.
    3. Review this comment.

    All the points you are trying to make have been very eloquently made by others. And they've all been countered with mine and others. I don't need to repeat myself in this thread at this moment- especially when, for this particular moment, there is no need to given the opponents of the DP have not advocated for their position very well at all (the pro stance is hardly threatened from my perspective).
    You need to consider the meaning behind emojis a little more deeply Thirty. ;)
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 39,027
    edited November 2016

    You should read your post which, in turn, prompted mine.

    Always cool when the dramatics suit your position, eh?

    Don't fling mud if you don't want to get dirty.
    mine was so over the top it was obviously made in jest. you constantly make these claims that you actually seem to believe with regards to our system that you think I wish to give every rapist a hug and get him a job at a daycare. it's stupid, not to mention insulting. not to mention you don't listen. I fully support everything you support, with one major exception: death penalty. I support harsher penalties in most cases. Rehabilitation if it's suitable. but you choose to ignore that so you can make your hyperbolic posts.

    whatever.
    Post edited by HughFreakingDillon on
    "every society honours its live conformists and its dead troublemakers"




  • PJ_SoulPJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,363

    Key excerpts from the two pieces:

    * 33% of 'lifers' granted full parole by boards in 2013-14.

    Hardly life.

    * Life without parole protects the public by permanently separating heinous killers from law-abiding Canadians. According to the Parole Board of Canada, long-term follow-up of 1886 convicted murderers who were granted parole during a 14-year period (1994 to 2008) found that 13 per cent breached their parole conditions, 6 per cent committed non-violent offences and 3 per cent committed violent offences.

    Not fantastic for the hard liners' perspective, but not too shabby for the liberal fluffs (I mean... it wasn't too many innocents harmed as we tried so hard to let killers try again, eh?).

    * Take last week’s police announcement of a Canada-wide arrest warrant for Francis Patrick Clancy, who was picked up by Victoria police on Monday. He was granted parole while serving a life sentence for murdering an innocent young man by smashing his face repeatedly with an axe. Shockingly, he was assessed as a “moderate high risk for general and violent offending” just prior to being day-paroled. Police had warned the public that Clancy was violent and not to approach him.

    Just give him space and tread carefully around him... alright? And for gawd's sakes... don't let him have an axe.
    Liberal fluffs??? That's what you call people who are simply against the DP? What do I call you then? Blood-thirsty?
    I have always sided 100% with you about how sentences can be too light or otherwise fucked up in Canada. It's ridiculous. My only argument is that the DP isn't the solution to this.
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 39,027

    Really?

    1. Go to Death Penalty thread.
    2. Count submissions made by 30 Bills Unpaid in Death Penalty thread.
    3. Review this comment.

    All the points you are trying to make have been very eloquently made by others. And they've all been countered with mine and others. I don't need to repeat myself in this thread at this moment- especially when, for this particular moment, there is no need to given the opponents of the DP have not advocated for their position very well at all (the pro stance is hardly threatened from my perspective).
    wow, that's not arrogant (if not completely false) at all.

    the pro stance isn't threatened? t would seem the anti stance is hardly threatened, since it ISN'T LEGAL. LOL.
    "every society honours its live conformists and its dead troublemakers"




  • mine was so over the top it was obviously made in jest. you constantly make these claims that you actually seem to believe with regards to our system that you think I wish to give every rapist a hug and get him a job at a daycare. it's stupid, not to mention insulting. not to mention you don't listen. I fully support everything you support, with one major exception: death penalty. I support harsher penalties in most cases. Rehabilitation if it's suitable. but you choose to ignore that so you can make your hyperbolic posts.

    whatever.
    Oh, of course.

    Your over the top comments are cool, while my over the top comments are insulting and a bunch of other things too. You'd have to excuse me for misunderstanding the field I was playing on- I didn't realize it could only be titled one direction.
    "My brain's a good brain!"
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 39,027

    Oh, of course.

    Your over the top comments are cool, while my over the top comments are insulting and a bunch of other things too. You'd have to excuse me for misunderstanding the field I was playing on- I didn't realize it could only be titled one direction.
    your comments are generally not over the top (neither are mine, save for the one above). they are outright false projections as to how you wish to see my views. which is an incorrect assessment, which you continually choose to ignore.
    "every society honours its live conformists and its dead troublemakers"




  • wow, that's not arrogant (if not completely false) at all.

    the pro stance isn't threatened? t would seem the anti stance is hardly threatened, since it ISN'T LEGAL. LOL.
    Key term: stance.

    As defined like this: the attitude of a person or organization toward something; a standpoint.

    Or as used in common language such as in the following sentence: Liking the Oilers, Johnny took the stance that Connor McDavid was the best player in the game; however, Tim disagreed with Johnny's stance- insisting Sydney Crosby was the best.
    "My brain's a good brain!"
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 39,027

    Key term: stance.

    As defined like this: the attitude of a person or organization toward something; a standpoint.

    Or as used in common language such as in the following sentence: Liking the Oilers, Johnny took the stance that Connor McDavid was the best player in the game; however, Tim disagreed with Johnny's stance- insisting Sydney Crosby was the best.
    yeah, I know what the word means. this is what you said: there is no need to given the opponents of the DP have not advocated for their position very well at all

    that's just plain ignorant.
    "every society honours its live conformists and its dead troublemakers"




  • PJ_Soul said:

    Liberal fluffs??? That's what you call people who are simply against the DP? What do I call you then? Blood-thirsty?
    I have always sided 100% with you about how sentences can be too light or otherwise fucked up in Canada. It's ridiculous. My only argument is that the DP isn't the solution to this.
    No.

    Liberal fluffs as in those people that think our penal system rocks and that we need to be releasing hardened murderers into the mainstream.
    "My brain's a good brain!"
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 39,027

    No.

    Liberal fluffs as in those people that think our penal system rocks and that we need to be releasing hardened murderers into the mainstream.
    ZERO. that's how many people think our penal system rocks. but you continue to call anyone who isn't pro-DP "liberal thug huggers" and the like. the proof is in the DP thread you mentioned earlier.
    "every society honours its live conformists and its dead troublemakers"




  • yeah, I know what the word means. this is what you said: there is no need to given the opponents of the DP have not advocated for their position very well at all

    that's just plain ignorant.
    You're calling me ignorant because I expressed the argument that was presented to me didn't inspire me to rush to the DP's defence?
    "My brain's a good brain!"
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 39,027
    no, ignorant is saying something that is inherently false based on nothing but an opinion.
    "every society honours its live conformists and its dead troublemakers"




  • ZERO. that's how many people think our penal system rocks. but you continue to call anyone who isn't pro-DP "liberal thug huggers" and the like. the proof is in the DP thread you mentioned earlier.
    Why do you think I was referring to anyone specifically here?

    Clearly... there are people who fit my description. Are you denying this?
    "My brain's a good brain!"
  • PJ_SoulPJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,363
    edited November 2016

    No.

    Liberal fluffs as in those people that think our penal system rocks and that we need to be releasing hardened murderers into the mainstream.
    I'm sorry, did I miss a conversation that just happened here about that? I thought we were talking about the DP.....
    I personally don't know a single person who thinks the Canadian penal system "rocks". Literally no one. I know someone... is it digin? Or someone else? Thinks that the problems are a very small minority of cases, and besides that, everybody here and every person I have ever spoken about it with, and everybody on social media, is well aware that sometimes sentences handed down by judges are a joke. So who are all these "liberal fluffs" who support light sentences? Can you direct me to a place where this is evident? Because they don't exist in my world (which is jam packed with liberal thinkers), and I'm curious about who the fuck these fluffs are.
    Post edited by PJ_Soul on
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • no, ignorant is saying something that is inherently false based on nothing but an opinion.

    That's one definition I guess. Not typically the most used definition (lacking knowledge).
    "My brain's a good brain!"
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