Edward Snowden & The N.S.A Revelations

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  • Byrnzie
    Byrnzie Posts: 21,037
    mickeyrat wrote:
    despite what the gaurdian says, I appreciate having the info but he's still a criminal.

    But you have no problem with James Clapper committing a felony by lying to the Senate Intelligence Committee, and with the NSA breaching the U.S Constitution.

    I think i see where your priorities are.
  • ajedigecko
    ajedigecko \m/deplorable af \m/ Posts: 2,431
    Based on the blue highlight...it is telling and one can only imagine how far both sides will go to lead us with their lies.
    live and let live...unless it violates the pearligious doctrine.
  • mickeyrat
    mickeyrat Posts: 45,346
    Byrnzie wrote:
    mickeyrat wrote:
    despite what the gaurdian says, I appreciate having the info but he's still a criminal.

    But you have no problem with James Clapper committing a felony by lying to the Senate Intelligence Committee, and with the NSA breaching the U.S Constitution.

    I think i see where your priorities are.
    Care to share where I said that? See, exposing illegal activity by committing illegal activity is still wrong, no matter how important the info was to the american public at large.

    I'd think mr snowden would do well to follow the example of Ms. Manning in taking responsibility for his actions.
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • Byrnzie
    Byrnzie Posts: 21,037
    mickeyrat wrote:
    exposing illegal activity by committing illegal activity is still wrong, no matter how important the info was to the american public at large.

    Maybe according to you it is. Some would say the means justifies the ends, especially when it involves reigning in those who are abusing their power.
  • Thirty Bills Unpaid
    Thirty Bills Unpaid Posts: 16,881
    Byrnzie wrote:
    mickeyrat wrote:
    exposing illegal activity by committing illegal activity is still wrong, no matter how important the info was to the american public at large.

    Maybe according to you it is. Some would say the means justifies the ends, especially when it involves reigning in those who are abusing their power.

    Byrnzie...

    While I do agree with this statement you have made, you have consistently defended the need for due process and legalities. At least in this matter, you have become somewhat conflicted.
    "My brain's a good brain!"
  • Byrnzie
    Byrnzie Posts: 21,037
    Thirty Bills Unpaid wrote:
    Byrnzie wrote:
    mickeyrat wrote:
    exposing illegal activity by committing illegal activity is still wrong, no matter how important the info was to the american public at large.

    Maybe according to you it is. Some would say the means justifies the ends, especially when it involves reigning in those who are abusing their power.

    Byrnzie...

    While I do agree with this statement you have made, you have consistently defended the need for due process and legalities. At least in this matter, you have become somewhat conflicted.

    Are you referring to the illegality by James Clapper of lying to the Senate Intelligence Committee, or to the illegality of Edward Snowden of stealing government documents in order to expose government lies and it's mass surveillance operation, which breaches the U.S Constitution?
  • Byrnzie
    Byrnzie Posts: 21,037
    In Chinese Government parlance, Edward Snowden engaged in 'subversion of State power', and is therefore a criminal who should be prosecuted and imprisoned. Something that many people on this message board clearly agree with, despite being quick to mention China in relation to lack of freedoms, and totalitarianism. Funny that.
  • Thirty Bills Unpaid
    Thirty Bills Unpaid Posts: 16,881
    Byrnzie wrote:

    Are you referring to the illegality by James Clapper of lying to the Senate Intelligence Committee, or to the illegality of Edward Snowden of stealing government documents in order to expose government lies and it's mass surveillance operation, which breaches the U.S Constitution?

    Specifically... neither. I was just curious as to your comment which seemed to be in contrast to what seemed to be your steadfast beliefs. You have consistently asserted to allow for due process is and the comment I made reference to didn't seem to be in line with these 'typical' beliefs. I wasn't arguing against it... it just seemed atypical.

    More significantly for me... you have been relatively quiet lately. I was wondering what was going on.
    "My brain's a good brain!"
  • Byrnzie
    Byrnzie Posts: 21,037
    Thirty Bills Unpaid wrote:
    More significantly for me... you have been relatively quiet lately. I was wondering what was going on.

    I've become addicted to Fifa 14. 8-)
  • unsung
    unsung I stopped by on March 7 2024. First time in many years, had to update payment info. Hope all is well. Politicians suck. Bye. Posts: 9,487
    If he committed an act of treason to expose what the general government is illegally doing to the people then I'm good with his "crime". Were people hurt because of it? Not that I'm aware of.
  • Thirty Bills Unpaid
    Thirty Bills Unpaid Posts: 16,881
    Byrnzie wrote:
    Thirty Bills Unpaid wrote:
    More significantly for me... you have been relatively quiet lately. I was wondering what was going on.

    :lol:

    I've become addicted to Fifa 14. 8-)

    I haven't tapped the seal of Bioshock Infinite yet. Once I do... oy yoy yoy.
    "My brain's a good brain!"
  • mickeyrat
    mickeyrat Posts: 45,346
    Byrnzie wrote:
    mickeyrat wrote:
    exposing illegal activity by committing illegal activity is still wrong, no matter how important the info was to the american public at large.

    Maybe according to you it is. Some would say the means justifies the ends, especially when it involves reigning in those who are abusing their power.
    ends justifying the means? Prime excuse to abuse power AND the rule of law. Cant have it both ways.
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • Byrnzie
    Byrnzie Posts: 21,037
    mickeyrat wrote:
    Byrnzie wrote:
    mickeyrat wrote:
    exposing illegal activity by committing illegal activity is still wrong, no matter how important the info was to the american public at large.

    Maybe according to you it is. Some would say the means justifies the ends, especially when it involves reigning in those who are abusing their power.
    ends justifying the means? Prime excuse to abuse power AND the rule of law. Cant have it both ways.

    Would you rather we had been kept in the dark? Would you prefer that your government operate in total secrecy and in breach of the u.s Constitution, and they be free to do whatever the fuck they like? They've been trying to get away with it for years. Did you ever watch this documentary? - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=28K2CO-khdY
    But all your criticisms and outrage are directed at the whistle blower, and not those who are cheating the American public and abusing their positions.
  • mickeyrat
    mickeyrat Posts: 45,346
    Byrnzie wrote:
    mickeyrat wrote:
    ends justifying the means? Prime excuse to abuse power AND the rule of law. Cant have it both ways.

    Would you rather we had been kept in the dark? Would you prefer that your government operate in total secrecy and in breach of the u.s Constitution, and they be free to do whatever the fuck they like? They've been trying to get away with it for years. Did you ever watch this documentary? - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=28K2CO-khdY
    But all your criticisms and outrage are directed at the whistle blower, and not those who are cheating the American public and abusing their positions.
    You are free to call him what you wish. I think I've been fairly clear and consistant here, HE IS NOT ABOVE THE LAW himself!

    HE would do well to "take one for the team" as it were and accept the legal responsibility for his crimes. AGAIN, I do appreciate the exposure about this program. But not at the expense of the rule of law he was claiming to defend.

    I have a hellava lot more respect for Chelsea Manning after her statement at sentencing. Might have some if Snowden showed the same level of accountability. At present he is no better than those he exposed.
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • Byrnzie
    Byrnzie Posts: 21,037
    mickeyrat wrote:
    Might have some if Snowden showed the same level of accountability. At present he is no better than those he exposed.

    Those he exposed lied under oath, and are breaking the Constitution by spying on every American with zero accountability, and zero Congressional oversight.
    Edward Snowden sacrificed a well-paid job and a life of comfort and security in order to expose the crimes and deceit of his superiors.
    And yet you place them on the same footing?
  • Jason P
    Jason P Posts: 19,420
    Byrnzie wrote:
    Edward Snowden sacrificed a well-paid job and a life of comfort and security in order to expose the crimes and deceit of his superiors.
    Who is not to say he still doesn't have a well-paid job and a life of comfort and security, comrade?
    Be Excellent To Each Other
    Party On, Dudes!
  • Byrnzie
    Byrnzie Posts: 21,037
    Jason P wrote:
    Byrnzie wrote:
    Edward Snowden sacrificed a well-paid job and a life of comfort and security in order to expose the crimes and deceit of his superiors.
    Who is not to say he still doesn't have a well-paid job and a life of comfort and security, comrade?

    I see you're still indulging your fantasies.

    Whatever gets you through the day.
  • Jason P
    Jason P Posts: 19,420
    Byrnzie wrote:
    Jason P wrote:
    Byrnzie wrote:
    Edward Snowden sacrificed a well-paid job and a life of comfort and security in order to expose the crimes and deceit of his superiors.
    Who is not to say he still doesn't have a well-paid job and a life of comfort and security, comrade?

    I see you're still indulging your fantasies.

    Whatever gets you through the day.
    :lol:

    Security, check. Vlady Putin has got that covered in spades ... just ask greenpeace

    Comfort, check. Judging by his shopping cart at Trader Ivan's, he is well funded and not living off ramen noodles

    Well-paid job ... unknown if he has one or needs one. much like if the hot red head spy made good on her marriage proposal

    My fantasy is easier to judge then your fantasy. Speaking of fantasy, how much info has been leaked since he left camp PRC for camp putin ... :think:

    the dumbest smart person ever or spy. which is it, brynzie???
    Be Excellent To Each Other
    Party On, Dudes!
  • mickeyrat
    mickeyrat Posts: 45,346
    Byrnzie wrote:
    mickeyrat wrote:
    Might have some if Snowden showed the same level of accountability. At present he is no better than those he exposed.

    Those he exposed lied under oath, and are breaking the Constitution by spying on every American with zero accountability, and zero Congressional oversight.
    Edward Snowden sacrificed a well-paid job and a life of comfort and security in order to expose the crimes and deceit of his superiors.
    And yet you place them on the same footing?
    Sacrificed? Didnt he go after that job to begin with to see if what he suspected was true? With the intent to expose if it was true? What sacrifice?

    This well paid job, knowing what he did, he was still able to sleep at night knowing he was a part of it? Thats no sacrifice. He outed himself in a COMMUNIST country, went for the sympathy vote right quick. Hes a fucking pussy punk, not willing to stand up for what hes done.

    Manning is a patriot. Misguided perhaps and gave way too much irrelevant material to assange but still . She stood up for her beliefs.

    Snowden ran like a punk.
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • mickeyrat
    mickeyrat Posts: 45,346
    For the record, I would dearly love for those who lie, misrepresent fact, whatever, be held fully accountable for their actions to the fullest extent the law allows.

    Now, do I believe that will actually come to pass? Sadly no. No it will not.
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14

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