September 11th 1973

2

Comments

  • Byrnzie
    Byrnzie Posts: 21,037
    cincybearcat wrote:
    Not pretending anything. But it certainly had nothing to do with foreign policy to the little boy who never got to know his father that was killed as he was trying to save others from the burning buildings. For someone as intelligent as you seem to be, I would have thought the point was fairly easy to grasp.

    I do get your overall point. I just think it probably could have stayed out of 1 thread. Timing is everything and I don't think you need to shit on the memory of the people killed on 9/1/01 in the US to try to further your argument against the evils of the US government and it's people.

    Not to mention, I think there are plenty of people that have used the day to remember the lives lost on that day as well as what happened afterwards. I certainly wish I could take back my support of the war in Iraq and I allowed myself to believe that the president of the US knew more and knew enough. It was believable to me, but I will try to not let believable and a hunch put me in that situation again. 9/11/01 changed many people's lives. I was fortunate to not be directly effected by a loss of a loved one, but many can't say the same thing. It had me thinking about kids in Iraq who feel the same way that kids in New York felt on 9/11/01. It had me understanding what their hatred for the US must be.

    It's too bad that all it had you thinking was how horrible the US and it's people are.

    Show me where I've shat on the memory of those killed in America on 9/11.

    This thread is about another 9/11 that happened in another country. Not everyone on this board is American.
    Do you think that what happened in Chile on September 11th 1973 was irrelevant? It resulted in over 3000 deaths, 17 years of oppression and the torture of approx 35,000 people.
  • Godfather.
    Godfather. Posts: 12,504
    this thread topic is a wate of space Byrnzie,you've managed to shit on the memories and pain of Americans
    and especially those of the people in New York and their familys and friends...great move man. :? you keep keep fishing for the "how bad the US is" card while you live in ...what China or Japan or something like that ?
    really ?... please save the bullshit for someone else.


    Godfather.
  • Byrnzie
    Byrnzie Posts: 21,037
    cincybearcat wrote:
    Byrnzie wrote:
    The Juggler wrote:
    yeah, kinda feels like your marginalizing it dude. kinda feels like your just looking for a reaction, which is pretty fucked up.

    If you check any of the other threads on 9/11 you'll see that I haven't downgraded, marginalized, or denigrated what happened on that day at all.
    The fact that I created this thread dealing with what happened in Chile on that same day is no reason for anyone - including Americans - to have a hissy fit. Period.


    Except here of course.

    http://community.pearljam.com/posting.p ... &p=3904344

    Is that statement true, or isn't it? Or do we need to shelve truth during this particular time on our calendar?
  • Byrnzie
    Byrnzie Posts: 21,037
    Godfather. wrote:
    this thread topic is a wate of space Byrnzie,you've managed to shit on the memories and pain of Americans
    and especially those of the people in New York and their familys and friends...great move man. :? you keep keep fishing for the "how bad the US is" card while you live in ...what China or Japan or something like that ?
    really ?... please save the bullshit for someone else.


    Godfather.

    Do you think the life of an American is worth more than the life of a Chilean?

    If not, then what's your problem?
  • cincybearcat
    cincybearcat Posts: 16,976
    Byrnzie wrote:
    cincybearcat wrote:
    Not pretending anything. But it certainly had nothing to do with foreign policy to the little boy who never got to know his father that was killed as he was trying to save others from the burning buildings. For someone as intelligent as you seem to be, I would have thought the point was fairly easy to grasp.

    I do get your overall point. I just think it probably could have stayed out of 1 thread. Timing is everything and I don't think you need to shit on the memory of the people killed on 9/1/01 in the US to try to further your argument against the evils of the US government and it's people.

    Not to mention, I think there are plenty of people that have used the day to remember the lives lost on that day as well as what happened afterwards. I certainly wish I could take back my support of the war in Iraq and I allowed myself to believe that the president of the US knew more and knew enough. It was believable to me, but I will try to not let believable and a hunch put me in that situation again. 9/11/01 changed many people's lives. I was fortunate to not be directly effected by a loss of a loved one, but many can't say the same thing. It had me thinking about kids in Iraq who feel the same way that kids in New York felt on 9/11/01. It had me understanding what their hatred for the US must be.

    It's too bad that all it had you thinking was how horrible the US and it's people are.

    Show me where I've shat on the memory of those killed in America on 9/11.

    This thread is about another 9/11 that happened in another country. Not everyone on this board is American.
    Do you think that what happened in Chile on September 11th 1973 was irrelevant? It resulted in over 3000 deaths, 17 years of oppression and the torture of approx 35,000 people.

    Ok. Perhaps I'm being too critical on this thread as it is suppose to be about a different topic. But please don't pretend that you haven't been dismissing or marginalizing the 9/11 tragedy on these forums, specifically in the other thread.
    hippiemom = goodness
  • cincybearcat
    cincybearcat Posts: 16,976
    Byrnzie wrote:
    cincybearcat wrote:
    Byrnzie wrote:

    If you check any of the other threads on 9/11 you'll see that I haven't downgraded, marginalized, or denigrated what happened on that day at all.
    The fact that I created this thread dealing with what happened in Chile on that same day is no reason for anyone - including Americans - to have a hissy fit. Period.


    Except here of course.

    posting.php?mode=quote&f=13&p=3904344

    Is that statement true, or isn't it? Or do we need to shelve truth during this particular time on our calendar?

    True statement, wrong thread to put it in. The thread was about "Where were you"... obviously getting out the personal connections to the tragedy. By the way, some really powerful posts on that thread too.

    When people are thinking back to that day, where they were, how they felt, how they were effected, perhaps you could take 1 thread off trying to remind everyone how evil the US is?
    hippiemom = goodness
  • Godfather.
    Godfather. Posts: 12,504
    Byrnzie wrote:
    Godfather. wrote:
    this thread topic is a wate of space Byrnzie,you've managed to shit on the memories and pain of Americans
    and especially those of the people in New York and their familys and friends...great move man. :? you keep keep fishing for the "how bad the US is" card while you live in ...what China or Japan or something like that ?
    really ?... please save the bullshit for someone else.


    Godfather.

    Do you think the life of an American is worth more than the life of a Chilean?

    If not, then what's your problem?

    I think you are a smart guy and good at using words to fit your agenda but you shit your hole full on this one buddy.

    Godfather.
  • Byrnzie
    Byrnzie Posts: 21,037
    cincybearcat wrote:
    http://community.pearljam.com/posting.php?mode=quote&f=13&p=3904074

    And here.

    My point here was that if 9/11 taught Americans anything it was that they don't exist in a bubble. You are a part of a wider World and not everyone see's things through the same lenses as you.

    This thread is just another example of that.

    The way I see it, 9/11 should be a day of mourning not just for Americans, but for all the hundreds of thousands (or over one million, if the many surveys are correct) Iraqis, Afghans, and other people who have suffered as a result of that day, for whatever reason.

    It should also be a day to remember what happened in Chile on that day, as it was fucked-up and resulted in 17 years of suffering and persecution. And Americans really shouldn't take offense when someone brings it up.
  • polaris_x
    polaris_x Posts: 13,559
    hey brynzie ... even if 1 lurker out there take this post for what it truly is meant for ... it will be worth it ...
  • Byrnzie
    Byrnzie Posts: 21,037
    cincybearcat wrote:
    True statement, wrong thread to put it in. The thread was about "Where were you"... obviously getting out the personal connections to the tragedy. By the way, some really powerful posts on that thread too.

    When people are thinking back to that day, where they were, how they felt, how they were effected, perhaps you could take 1 thread off trying to remind everyone how evil the US is?

    O.k. Maybe I shouldn't have posted it there.
  • cincybearcat
    cincybearcat Posts: 16,976
    Byrnzie wrote:

    My point here was that if 9/11 taught Americans anything it was that they don't exist in a bubble. You are a part of a wider World and not everyone see's things through the same lenses as you.

    This thread is just another example of that.

    The way I see it, 9/11 should be a day of mourning not just for Americans, but for all the hundreds of thousands (or over one million, if the many surveys are correct) Iraqis, Afghans, and other people who have suffered as a result of that day, for whatever reason.

    It should also be a day to remember what happened in Chile on that day, as it was fucked-up and resulted in 17 years of suffering and persecution. And Americans really shouldn't take offense when someone brings it up.

    True...about the bubble.

    Also true about those killed in the subsequent wars.

    Again, true about "really shouldn't take offense when someone brings it up." Is a good point, and I'm sorry to say that my initial reaction was to be pissed off.

    So anyhow, thanks for the info about Chile, although I would prefer to see more info from a different writer.
    hippiemom = goodness
  • chadwick
    chadwick up my ass Posts: 21,157
    365 days a year, 12 months out of the year mankind is far from kind to man or other life forms, nor is mankind kind to our wonderous planet. we're in a world of shit, folks.

    365 days a year we should live in a peaceful kind of grace with compassion and understanding. governments are straight up cruel clear across the board. i can't think of one single country that is safe and or living in peace and harmony.

    Netherlands? that place comes to mind as peaceful. yet the Dutch have some fucked up history with enslaving Eskimos. can you believe it? what was really a great item was to have a Eskimo finger inside one's favorite books used as a book marker.

    we are barbaric creatures, ingenious at torture, maiming, and killing others in the name of anything out of control. we want blood, yet fly to the moon, sail oceans, plant gardens, and starve entire countries. we pollute this earth in the name of ignorance and greed.

    there is not one shred of decency to be found in conflict. the rich get richer, poor get poorer.
    i remember when taking music appreaciation in college. i forget the family's name, they are Italian, they funded wars. they were wealthy (still are im sure swimming in old money) and they fueled money to both sides of the war. they were paid back with interest from every direction they tossed blood money.

    end of rant. fuck.
    for poetry through the ceiling. ISBN: 1 4241 8840 7

    "Hear me, my chiefs!
    I am tired; my heart is
    sick and sad. From where
    the sun stands I will fight
    no more forever."
    Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
  • Byrnzie
    Byrnzie Posts: 21,037
    chadwick wrote:
    365 days a year, 12 months out of the year mankind is far from kind to man or other life forms, nor is mankind kind to our wonderous planet. we're in a world of shit, folks.

    365 days a year we should live in a peaceful kind of grace with compassion and understanding. governments are straight up cruel clear across the board. i can't think of one single country that is safe and or living in peace and harmony.

    Netherlands? that place comes to mind as peaceful. yet the Dutch have some fucked up history with enslaving Eskimos. can you believe it? what was really a great item was to have a Eskimo finger inside one's favorite books used as a book marker.

    we are barbaric creatures, ingenious at torture, maiming, and killing others in the name of anything out of control. we want blood, yet fly to the moon, sail oceans, plant gardens, and starve entire countries. we pollute this earth in the name of ignorance and greed.

    there is not one shred of decency to be found in conflict. the rich get richer, poor get poorer.
    i remember when taking music appreaciation in college. i forget the family's name, they are Italian, they funded wars. they were wealthy (still are im sure swimming in old money) and they fueled money to both sides of the war. they were paid back with interest from every direction they tossed blood money.

    end of rant. fuck.

    :clap:
  • Byrnzie
    Byrnzie Posts: 21,037
    cincybearcat wrote:
    So anyhow, thanks for the info about Chile, although I would prefer to see more info from a different writer.

    Here's a couple:

    http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Terro ... SHand.html

    http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Choms ... _Chom.html
  • cincybearcat
    cincybearcat Posts: 16,976
    Byrnzie wrote:
    cincybearcat wrote:
    So anyhow, thanks for the info about Chile, although I would prefer to see more info from a different writer.

    Here's a couple:

    http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Terro ... SHand.html

    http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Choms ... _Chom.html

    Thank You, I will take a look.
    hippiemom = goodness
  • chadwick
    chadwick up my ass Posts: 21,157
    Byrnzie, i just want the world to slow down a bit and cry for awhile. i am fucking worn out. i can't imagine how one feels living within a war zone. some of these countries been killing one another for thousands of years.

    i just want love, man.

    one of my favorite poets is Chilean. Mr. Pablo Neruta (that being his pen name)
    Mr. Neftalí Ricardo Reyes Basoalto. oddly enough he died on September 23rd 1973.
    he was all into Politics and shit. i believe he was a communist senator. i need to study up on this man a bit. i am quite busy writing my own poetry ;) and trying hard to live in health and peace.

    Mr. Neruda could if he was still alive teach us a few things. he and his wife lived in exile for quite a long time.

    thread integrity? Mr. Neruda is Chilean and passed away almost on 9/11 1973

    Byrnzie, you seem to enjoy history and politics... study up on this guy. yes/no?
    if you like good romantic, earthy and even political poetry, then you'll enjoy his work.
    i know he wrote a poem about Joseph Stalin as well as Fidel Castro and Fulgencio Batista

    i am positive Chile observes some sort of Neruda day

    that's all i got... :mrgreen:
    for poetry through the ceiling. ISBN: 1 4241 8840 7

    "Hear me, my chiefs!
    I am tired; my heart is
    sick and sad. From where
    the sun stands I will fight
    no more forever."
    Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
  • Smellyman
    Smellyman Asia Posts: 4,528
    Glad this thread has taken a turn in the last few posts.

    I was getting worried for humanity.
  • Byrnzie
    Byrnzie Posts: 21,037
    edited September 2011
    chadwick wrote:
    Byrnzie, i just want the world to slow down a bit and cry for awhile. i am fucking worn out. i can't imagine how one feels living within a war zone. some of these countries been killing one another for thousands of years.

    i just want love, man.

    one of my favorite poets is Chilean. Mr. Pablo Neruta (that being his pen name)
    Mr. Neftalí Ricardo Reyes Basoalto. oddly enough he died on September 23rd 1973.
    he was all into Politics and shit. i believe he was a communist senator. i need to study up on this man a bit. i am quite busy writing my own poetry ;) and trying hard to live in health and peace.

    Mr. Neruda could if he was still alive teach us a few things. he and his wife lived in exile for quite a long time.

    thread integrity? Mr. Neruda is Chilean and passed away almost on 9/11 1973

    Byrnzie, you seem to enjoy history and politics... study up on this guy. yes/no?
    if you like good romantic, earthy and even political poetry, then you'll enjoy his work.
    i know he wrote a poem about Joseph Stalin as well as Fidel Castro and Fulgencio Batista

    i am positive Chile observes some sort of Neruda day

    that's all i got... :mrgreen:

    I had a book of Neruda's poems a long time ago when I was in college. It's been a while, so I'll definitely check his stuff out again.

    Thanks.

    By the way, have you seen a movie called 'Il Postino'? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Il_Postino It's about a postman in Italy who falls in love with a local girl in his village and befriends the exiled poet, Pablo Neruda, asking him for advice on how to write poems to this girl so that he can seduce her. It's a great movie. You'll like it.
    Post edited by Byrnzie on
  • chadwick
    chadwick up my ass Posts: 21,157
    Byrnzie wrote:
    chadwick wrote:
    Byrnzie, i just want the world to slow down a bit and cry for awhile. i am fucking worn out. i can't imagine how one feels living within a war zone. some of these countries been killing one another for thousands of years.

    i just want love, man.

    one of my favorite poets is Chilean. Mr. Pablo Neruta (that being his pen name)
    Mr. Neftalí Ricardo Reyes Basoalto. oddly enough he died on September 23rd 1973.
    he was all into Politics and shit. i believe he was a communist senator. i need to study up on this man a bit. i am quite busy writing my own poetry ;) and trying hard to live in health and peace.

    Mr. Neruda could if he was still alive teach us a few things. he and his wife lived in exile for quite a long time.

    thread integrity? Mr. Neruda is Chilean and passed away almost on 9/11 1973

    Byrnzie, you seem to enjoy history and politics... study up on this guy. yes/no?
    if you like good romantic, earthy and even political poetry, then you'll enjoy his work.
    i know he wrote a poem about Joseph Stalin as well as Fidel Castro and Fulgencio Batista

    i am positive Chile observes some sort of Neruda day

    that's all i got... :mrgreen:

    I had a book of Neruda's poems a long time ago when I was in college. It's been a while, so I'll definitely check his stuff out again.

    Thanks.

    By the way, have you seen a movie called 'Il Postino'? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Il_Postino It's about a postman in Italy who falls in love with a local girl in his village and befriends the exiled poet, Pablo Neruda, asking him for advice on how to write poems to this girl so that he can seduce her. Pablo Neruda actually appears in the film. It's a great movie. You'll like it.
    :mrgreen:

    exactly. i.
    never mind.

    i will watch this. and thank you.
    for poetry through the ceiling. ISBN: 1 4241 8840 7

    "Hear me, my chiefs!
    I am tired; my heart is
    sick and sad. From where
    the sun stands I will fight
    no more forever."
    Chief Joseph - Nez Perce
  • Byrnzie
    Byrnzie Posts: 21,037
    chadwick wrote:
    exactly. i.
    never mind.

    You may get some good tips - if you haven't already succeeded ;)

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