Would PJ denounce Obama and Socialism?

fear4freedom wrote:

Is it possible? Pearl Jam has completely utilized and benefitted from Capitalism! Would they ever say anything positive or good about Capitalism? Would they denounce Socialism at that time? How can Pearl Jam be for a bigger Federal Govt.? If not, how can they vote for it? This new admin. is killing this country and our kindred spirit! Its ok to vote for it once.....but twice.....?? My message to the band....remember....1/2 of your fan base is against the liberal Democratic party and its big govt. agendas! So with that being said......Eddie....stick to your music and if not.....promote Capitalism!

Obama, Socialist?!

HALF of the fan base?!?

I think Ed already expressed his opinion about this on VH1 Storytellers: "Fuck 'em."
(Anyone have a link to a clip of that handy?)

fear4freedom wrote:

Is it possible? Pearl Jam has completely utilized and benefitted from Capitalism!

I'm a bit confused by this statement.

This is a band that wouldn't capitalize on their huge fame by making videos to push on MTV, they instead toured relentlessly and got themselves out in front of their audience. They didn't have a perfume or a designer clothing line.

Instead of seeing fans ripped off for bad bootlegs, they make them available for cheap... They've been very successful at not sucking as much money form fans as they can... they could have released Vs and Vitalogy separately in collector boxes but decided that it wasn't worth it... combined them so the fans didn't have to shell out more money than they had to.

They rebelled against Ticketmaster. They've done a lot of charity songs and never went for the big pay days they could have gone for. So... how did they utilize capitalism? By making music that their audiences wanted to hear? That's just... being a musician.

I doubt it.

Once upon a time they probably would denounce a CORPORATIST (merger of corporation and state, also known as economic fascism) and WAR-MONGERING president or government-- PJ around the year 2000 and before. Those guys had it right. It's in their lyrics (Grievance, and Whipping much earlier) and their political endorsements (Ralph Nader). At least socialism is well-intentioned and seemingly compassionate, except when it is implemented by government, because wealth has to be transferred by force, and is actually inherently a violent way to solve the problem of poverty and economic inequality. Voluntary socialism would be a much better system. At least they managed to rail against the wars deep into Bush's presidency, and maybe they had to compromise on their anti-corporatist philosophy to support a president that seemed LESS IN FAVOR of the wars, or at the very least, the lesser of two evils, John Kerry. It seemed Eddie strongly supported Obama's campaign, maybe again to vote for the lesser of two evils, aside for his strong enthusiasm for Obama, which he did not really seem to have for Kerry. Since Obama's election, Eddie has been nearly silent about the wars, and really hasn't been publicly critical about Obama. I imagine he will support Obama once again. As is evident on Backspacer, it could just be that the band has tried a positive vibe for a change, having a little hope and faith in who they may have genuinely thought would be a good leader to simply do the right things. We're still only 2.5 years into Barack's presidency, and maybe some good will come out of it. Personally, I don't believe that will be the case, but I also don't think that being completely negative about the whole deal will help much either. In this way and this way only do I think they are really being consistent with their past political beliefs-- but then again, maybe their political beliefs have changed? Maybe with regards to the wars they are starting to see a humanitarian aspect to them ("spreading democracy", "freeing the oppressed") under Obama, where under Bush they only saw the big business of the wars? Personally, I think there is nothing humanitarian about war, and it should only be waged in matters of self-defense ONLY.

Humanity should take a page from Pearl Jam's book-- their operation is a microcosm of how a progressive-minded free-market free-society SHOULD work. They are a group of people who took a tremendous risk by quitting their regular jobs to do something that they LOVE, who have honed their craft and have worked their asses off, have put forth the best quality product that they could produce, have made millions of people happy in doing it, have received no special favors / grants / subsidies from government-- only contributions from loyal fans, have hurt nobody or cheated nobody in the process, have made a comfortable living doing it, and have taken huge portions of their profits and voluntarily donated them to causes that they feel are important.

The reality is that they are living the libertarian ideal in a society that is largely constrained by economic, social, and political forces to the contrary. In some ways, I would think that their politics would follow this, and I believe they used to.

In other ways, it makes you wonder why would they be in favor of anything but the status quo? They've done really well for themselves under whatever you consider this current system to be. However, I do believe them to be very selfless as evidenced by their contributions to various charities.

But after all that hot air, I think Eddie still holds one belief very dear to his heart back from '91, Evenflow, "Never vote Republican." I could see him backing Nader again, but in all likelihood, he will back Obama in 2012. But if Ron Paul were to get the nomination of the Republican Party, and the guys really want the first ever true vote for PEACE in an American president, they should make an exception at least once. If any other Republican candidate gets the nomination they should definitely back a third party guy, but I think they'll likely give Barack a second chance.

"Obama" and "Socialsim" in the same sentence as if they were realted... now that's interesting!

As far as just Obama goes, I would hope they would object to his recent weak stand in environment. Recent events related to that are flat out disturbing.

Great post Vinny! This is how I exactly feel. Calling Obama socialist as an insult is just lazy, among other things. For the most part, that sort of system works very well in smaller countries, such as Sweden, Norway, Finland, etc. I just think its a lot more difficult to apply that to a country of our size, ideals, culture.

The biggest thing about Obama that I oppose, is his expanding our wars. Wasn't that how the Dems got control of Congress back in 2006. Now look at where we are at. How many more innocent civilians need to die?

Prince Of Dorkness wrote:

...They rebelled against Ticketmaster. ...

catefrances wrote:

Prince Of Dorkness wrote:

...They rebelled against Ticketmaster. ...

Didn't say they were successful at that one. But they at least tried.