wow....in my rage this morning I sent an e mail to Michael Rapino (CEO of Livenation). He actually responded. I am pretty impressed and yes I stressed it was not the saleman's fault. Not looking for anyone to get in trouble. I'm kind of a big deal.
wow....in my rage this morning I sent an e mail to Michael Rapino (CEO of Livenation). He actually responded. I am pretty impressed and yes I stressed it was not the saleman's fault. Not looking for anyone to get in trouble. I'm kind of a big deal.
yes, you definitely have a cause of action and you can pm if the CEO wasn't able to help you. You purchased the tickets based on 1. What the sales person said or failed to say and 2. Based on the history of where the VIP usually are and have been for similar events. Live nation had a duty to make you aware that the VIP section or seats were no a different location for this and any other event. You relied in good faith on their definition of VIP which based on their history of concerts was the sixth row, not something that simply changes from event to event, further they were season tickets right, and season tickets usually mean the same seat for each event throughout the season.
wow....in my rage this morning I sent an e mail to Michael Rapino (CEO of Livenation). He actually responded. I am pretty impressed and yes I stressed it was not the saleman's fault. Not looking for anyone to get in trouble. I'm kind of a big deal.
yes, you definitely have a cause of action and you can pm if the CEO wasn't able to help you. You purchased the tickets based on 1. What the sales person said or failed to say and 2. Based on the history of where the VIP usually are and have been for similar events. Live nation had a duty to make you aware that the VIP section or seats were no a different location for this and any other event. You relied in good faith on their definition of VIP which based on their history of concerts was the sixth row, not something that simply changes from event to event, further they were season tickets right, and season tickets usually mean the same seat for each event throughout the season.
but wait.....no funds were allocated...just promises in writing
I'm a lawyer but I'll spare you the legalese: what's your loss here? You thought you had something but didn't risk anything to get it, LiveNation screwed up, now you don't have something. End of story. Sounds like you've gotten 2 unexpected apologies (from LiveNation AND from 10c -- not sure why they apologized)...what are you looking for? You didn't rely on the promise from LiveNation, because tickets aren't on sale yet (so you haven't missed on other opportunities) and you didn't give them any money yet.
Sure it sucks, but a lawsuit? Come on man. I understand PJ20 will be historic (for PJ fans) and it was thrilling I'm sure to seemingly score great seats (before the rest of the fan club no less) and make sure the rest of us nervous fans knew about your great deal (viewtopic.php?f=4&t=157134&start=105), but you didn't lose any money, you didn't lose any opportunities to get tickets (there is still the 10c presale, the general TM sale, and other scalpers I'm sure). So your loss here? Well...nothing. It sucks and I'm sure you're disappointed, but disappointment without any money or detriment to you is not enough to sue anybody.
I don't mean any offense by this, but get over it. It sucks, you're disappointed, but it's starting to sound ridiculous and whiney with this lawsuit stuff. Move on. You'll get tickets tomorrow at a fraction of what you would've been paying to LiveNation and by 9/3 and 9/4, I promise you, you will have long forgotten about what might've been, how disappointed you were and any ridiculous waste of time threatened lawsuit.
So to you and everyone else tomorrow, good luck. I'm sure we'll all be very happy.
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2003-06-16 St. Paul
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wow....in my rage this morning I sent an e mail to Michael Rapino (CEO of Livenation). He actually responded. I am pretty impressed and yes I stressed it was not the saleman's fault. Not looking for anyone to get in trouble. I'm kind of a big deal.
yes, you definitely have a cause of action and you can pm if the CEO wasn't able to help you. You purchased the tickets based on 1. What the sales person said or failed to say and 2. Based on the history of where the VIP usually are and have been for similar events. Live nation had a duty to make you aware that the VIP section or seats were no a different location for this and any other event. You relied in good faith on their definition of VIP which based on their history of concerts was the sixth row, not something that simply changes from event to event, further they were season tickets right, and season tickets usually mean the same seat for each event throughout the season.
Nope. A reliance claim requires detriment on Sawyer's part. Since they informed him prior to the onsale, the only detriment is the disappointment that an agreement was not reached. But hey, things change when a suit is filed. You have money to burn and a point to prove, my guess is that the settlement would be favorable. But it will cost you if you want good legal representation. My initial retainer for such a case would be $5,000. My estimate of the cost to finalize such an action against a multinational corporation would be at least $25,000. No shit.
wow....in my rage this morning I sent an e mail to Michael Rapino (CEO of Livenation). He actually responded. I am pretty impressed and yes I stressed it was not the saleman's fault. Not looking for anyone to get in trouble. I'm kind of a big deal.
yes, you definitely have a cause of action and you can pm if the CEO wasn't able to help you. You purchased the tickets based on 1. What the sales person said or failed to say and 2. Based on the history of where the VIP usually are and have been for similar events. Live nation had a duty to make you aware that the VIP section or seats were no a different location for this and any other event. You relied in good faith on their definition of VIP which based on their history of concerts was the sixth row, not something that simply changes from event to event, further they were season tickets right, and season tickets usually mean the same seat for each event throughout the season.
Nope. A reliance claim requires detriment on Sawyer's part. Since they informed him prior to the onsale, the only detriment is the disappointment that an agreement was not reached. But hey, things change when a suit is filed. You have money to burn and a point to prove, my guess is that the settlement would be favorable. But it will cost you if you want good legal representation. My initial retainer for such a case would be $5,000. My estimate of the cost to finalize such an action against a multinational corporation would be at least $25,000. No shit.
wow...i have all the e mails from the salesmen saying my tickets are 'secured'. does that mean anything?
wow...i have all the e mails from the salesmen saying my tickets are 'secured'. does that mean anything?
Yeah that's going to be a problem. It's gonna be a problem for them. This a clear violation of your rights as a consumer. It's an infringement on your constitutional rights. It's outrageous, egregious, preposterous.
1996: Randall's Island 2 1998: East Rutherford | MSG 1 & 2 2000: Cincinnati | Columbus | Jones Beach 1, 2, & 3 | Boston 1 | Camden 1 & 2 2003: Philadelphia | Uniondale | MSG 1 & 2 | Holmdel 2005: Atlantic City 1 2006: Camden 1 | East Rutherford 1 & 2 2008: Camden 1 & 2 | MSG 1 & 2 | Newark (EV) 2009: Philadelphia 1, 2 & 4 2010: Newark | MSG 1 & 2 2011: Toronto 1 2013: Wrigley Field | Brooklyn 2 | Philadelphia 1 & 2 | Baltimore 2015: Central Park 2016: Philadelphia 1 & 2 | MSG 1 & 2 | Fenway Park 2 | MSG (TOTD) 2017: Brooklyn (RnR HOF) 2020: MSG | Asbury Park2021: Asbury Park 2022: MSG | Camden | Nashville 2024: MSG 1 & 2 (#50) | Philadelphia 1 & 2 | Baltimore 2025: Raleigh
wow...i have all the e mails from the salesmen saying my tickets are 'secured'. does that mean anything?
Yeah that's going to be a problem. It's gonna be a problem for them. This a clear violation of your rights as a consumer. It's an infringement on your constitutional rights. It's outrageous, egregious, preposterous.
In all seriousness... you don't have a contract so I'd say you're out of luck.
Let me ask you this... if prior to you signing the contract Pearl Jam announced that Ed had laryngitis and the concert was now off would you you still pay $900 for the Jimmy Buffet tickets if LiveNation was demanding payment since that show was still on? Or would you tell LiveNation to go pound salt because you never signed the contract?
1996: Randall's Island 2 1998: East Rutherford | MSG 1 & 2 2000: Cincinnati | Columbus | Jones Beach 1, 2, & 3 | Boston 1 | Camden 1 & 2 2003: Philadelphia | Uniondale | MSG 1 & 2 | Holmdel 2005: Atlantic City 1 2006: Camden 1 | East Rutherford 1 & 2 2008: Camden 1 & 2 | MSG 1 & 2 | Newark (EV) 2009: Philadelphia 1, 2 & 4 2010: Newark | MSG 1 & 2 2011: Toronto 1 2013: Wrigley Field | Brooklyn 2 | Philadelphia 1 & 2 | Baltimore 2015: Central Park 2016: Philadelphia 1 & 2 | MSG 1 & 2 | Fenway Park 2 | MSG (TOTD) 2017: Brooklyn (RnR HOF) 2020: MSG | Asbury Park2021: Asbury Park 2022: MSG | Camden | Nashville 2024: MSG 1 & 2 (#50) | Philadelphia 1 & 2 | Baltimore 2025: Raleigh
wow...i have all the e mails from the salesmen saying my tickets are 'secured'. does that mean anything?
Cant say without having all the facts. My guess is that there is a "subject to change clause" in the contract and that after you sign and funds are exchanged they still have authority to move your seats. LN knows what they are doing as far as ticket commitments go. Ask yourself this: Could they sue you now for nonpayment? My guess is no. That speaks volumes as to the validity of any such contract.
I will add that this my educated guess based on a thread in a message forum and not based upon knowledge of the specific details. Take the papers and your recollection of the phone conversations to a local attorney. You might get lucky and find someone willing to take this on just to make a name for him/her self. Ticket cases generate publicity that could outweigh the legal fees. Hope this helps.
wow...i have all the e mails from the salesmen saying my tickets are 'secured'. does that mean anything?
Cant say without having all the facts. My guess is that there is a "subject to change clause" in the contract and that after you sign and funds are exchanged they still have authority to move your seats. LN knows what they are doing as far as ticket commitments go. Ask yourself this: Could they sue you now for nonpayment? My guess is no. That speaks volumes as to the validity of any such contract.
I will add that this my educated guess based on a thread in a message forum and not based upon knowledge of the specific details. Take the papers and your recollection of the phone conversations to a local attorney. You might get lucky and find someone willing to take this on just to make a name for him/her self. Ticket cases generate publicity that could outweigh the legal fees. Hope this helps.
did you see my direct e mail translations above from the sales rep?
last thing...lawyers please weigh in on this. Especially question 2. my questions to him copied directly from my e mail as of FRIDAY:
2. Will Pearl Jam's Fan Club impact these seats being taken or are they already 'off the market'?
.....thanks in advance
his response........
Yes, for 3 shows if you choose Alpine only and it is per seat.
I only have 4 seats left.
I do not have any knowledge of what holds or seats the Fan Club is using. I know my season seat holds and that is the extent of it.
Therein lies the problem. This person was not aware of the 10c agreement with LN. Mistake of fact or misunderstanding is actually another way to void a contract. Not playing devils advocate, calling it as I would if I was a judge and following the strict letter of the law.
All of that being said,and from a strictly business perspective, I do think LN should provide you with some compensation for the screw up.
Ask yourself this: Could they sue you now for nonpayment? My guess is no. That speaks volumes as to the validity of any such contract.
Exactly. If Sawyer found out today that his wife was due to have a baby that weekend he'd be perfectly justified in backing out on buying the tickets and he'd be all over the fact that he never signed a contract if they came after him for the money.
1996: Randall's Island 2 1998: East Rutherford | MSG 1 & 2 2000: Cincinnati | Columbus | Jones Beach 1, 2, & 3 | Boston 1 | Camden 1 & 2 2003: Philadelphia | Uniondale | MSG 1 & 2 | Holmdel 2005: Atlantic City 1 2006: Camden 1 | East Rutherford 1 & 2 2008: Camden 1 & 2 | MSG 1 & 2 | Newark (EV) 2009: Philadelphia 1, 2 & 4 2010: Newark | MSG 1 & 2 2011: Toronto 1 2013: Wrigley Field | Brooklyn 2 | Philadelphia 1 & 2 | Baltimore 2015: Central Park 2016: Philadelphia 1 & 2 | MSG 1 & 2 | Fenway Park 2 | MSG (TOTD) 2017: Brooklyn (RnR HOF) 2020: MSG | Asbury Park2021: Asbury Park 2022: MSG | Camden | Nashville 2024: MSG 1 & 2 (#50) | Philadelphia 1 & 2 | Baltimore 2025: Raleigh
last thing...lawyers please weigh in on this. Especially question 2. my questions to him copied directly from my e mail as of FRIDAY:
2. Will Pearl Jam's Fan Club impact these seats being taken or are they already 'off the market'?
.....thanks in advance
his response........
Yes, for 3 shows if you choose Alpine only and it is per seat.
I only have 4 seats left.
I do not have any knowledge of what holds or seats the Fan Club is using. I know my season seat holds and that is the extent of it.
Therein lies the problem. This person was not aware of the 10c agreement with LN. Mistake of fact or misunderstanding is actually another way to void a contract. Not playing devils advocate, calling it as I would if I was a judge and following the strict letter of the law.
All of that being said,and from a strictly business perspective, I do think LN should provide you with some compensation for the screw up.
but isn't that the exact thing they need to have knowledge of?
but isn't that the exact thing they need to have knowledge of?
Yes. But it is the promoter and the sales/venue manager's job to insure that its sales people know exactly what is for sale to VIPs. Given the fact that no other act has such specific seating requirements, it is not surprising (to me) that a salesman went with a standard VIP seating chart. Completely unprofessional? Yup.
but isn't that the exact thing they need to have knowledge of?
Yes. But it is the promoter and the sales/venue manager's job to insure that its sales people know exactly what is for sale to VIPs. Given the fact that no other act has such specific seating requirements, it is not surprising (to me) that a salesman went with a standard VIP seating chart. Completely unprofessional? Yup.
still the same company and I think some reimbursement then no?
still the same company and I think some reimbursement then no?
I cant speak to the managerial/sales layers that exist. That is almost a trade secret. There are a lot of people that want to know the details of LN's business model.
But reimbursement for what? A sales promise made over the phone/email that did even result in a written agreement or funds beings exchanged? Think about how many times that happens every day.
still the same company and I think some reimbursement then no?
I cant speak to the managerial/sales layers that exist. That is almost a trade secret. There are a lot of people that want to know the details of LN's business model.
But reimbursement for what? A sales promise made over the phone/email that did even result in a written agreement or funds beings exchanged? Think about how many times that happens every day.
i think this is much different than that...especially with all the e mails. There is clear confusion
i think this is much different than that...especially with all the e mails. There is clear confusion
Nah, the only difference is that it involves something you care deeply about and something that is highly coveted. If it was a deal to fix your sidewalk would you be as passionate about enforcing the verbal/electronic deal? Id guess no. Like I said, its bad business, but LN doesn't really have to worry about that when they have a monopoly.
i know this isn't Law & Order but that is damaging evidence to Livenation imo
It sounds like he really screwed up. I don't think there's a reason to sue as long as you get your money back. But had you not found out about this mistake before 10 clubs sale tomorrow and missed your chance at good seats than more likely an issue. Was he purposefully be deceitful to make the sale is uncertain and probably hard to prove. I thought you meant to sue to get your money back was what I was thinking in my post. This is a special event and he may not have been aware of the special circumstances, which yes he should have been is probably how you feel. But I don't see too much harm as long as you get your money back. But still push Livenation to do something for some sort of compensation for the time you put in and such, as they a heartless bastards anyway and have the ability to make amends, like tickets to an upcoming concert of another artist as they own them all. Again, good luck tomorrow buddy as I'm pulling for you and everyone on this board, forget about this shit and have positive thoughts about tomorrow and the concerts.
I just finished law school (in Canada), and although I havn't read through all of the 18 pages here (and this is not legal advice), it seems like most comments are correct in that you haven't really suffered any pecuniary loss. However, if you really wanted to push it (which isn't advible considering the costs of litigation and the power LN would have in their legal team) you could feasibly argue that you're entitled to specific performance of the contract in that what you bargained for was "so unique" that it cannot easily be replaced on the market. This happens in Canada now usually only in regards to real property (houses/land) that is unique (like a castle on a lake or something). Chances are, even if you were successful, LN would only be entitled to replace your tickets with say some that were purchased off StubHub or similar.
Anyways, I feel for you, that really sucks.
1992-07-21 Vancouver
1993-9-4 Vancouver
1996-9-16 Seattle
1998-7-19 Vancouver, 7-21 Seattle, Memorial Stadium
2000-11-6 Seattle
2001-10-22 Seattle
2002 -12-09 Seattle
2009-8-17 Manchester, 9-25 Vancouver
2011-6-16 Seattle (EV), 9-3/4 PJ20, 9-25 Vancouver
2012-6-27 Amsterdam (#2!)
2013-11-29 Portland, 12-4 Vancouver, 12-6 Seattle
2014-AUS - 1-26 Sydney, 1-31 Adelaide, 2-11/12 EV Sydney State Theatre, 2-13 EV Opera House
2014 - USA - Memphis, Detroit, MOLINE, St. Paul, MILWAUKEE, Denver, 25/26 Bridge School
2016 - Lexington, Philly x 2, MSG x 2, Quebec City, Ottawa, Toronto x 2, Pemberton, Fenway x 2, Wrigley x 2 2018 - Seattle x 2, Missoula, Fenway x 2
Maybe pearl jam can get involved they had that ticket master thing going a while back. This was the most cost saving thread I have seen to date on this board. I was going to try this live nation thing. Now I will just sit on my unlimited pile of cash. Laughing good luck
Comments
yes, you definitely have a cause of action and you can pm if the CEO wasn't able to help you. You purchased the tickets based on 1. What the sales person said or failed to say and 2. Based on the history of where the VIP usually are and have been for similar events. Live nation had a duty to make you aware that the VIP section or seats were no a different location for this and any other event. You relied in good faith on their definition of VIP which based on their history of concerts was the sixth row, not something that simply changes from event to event, further they were season tickets right, and season tickets usually mean the same seat for each event throughout the season.
but wait.....no funds were allocated...just promises in writing
Sure it sucks, but a lawsuit? Come on man. I understand PJ20 will be historic (for PJ fans) and it was thrilling I'm sure to seemingly score great seats (before the rest of the fan club no less) and make sure the rest of us nervous fans knew about your great deal (viewtopic.php?f=4&t=157134&start=105), but you didn't lose any money, you didn't lose any opportunities to get tickets (there is still the 10c presale, the general TM sale, and other scalpers I'm sure). So your loss here? Well...nothing. It sucks and I'm sure you're disappointed, but disappointment without any money or detriment to you is not enough to sue anybody.
I don't mean any offense by this, but get over it. It sucks, you're disappointed, but it's starting to sound ridiculous and whiney with this lawsuit stuff. Move on. You'll get tickets tomorrow at a fraction of what you would've been paying to LiveNation and by 9/3 and 9/4, I promise you, you will have long forgotten about what might've been, how disappointed you were and any ridiculous waste of time threatened lawsuit.
So to you and everyone else tomorrow, good luck. I'm sure we'll all be very happy.
2003-06-16 St. Paul
2006-06-26 St. Paul
2007-08-05 Chicago
2009-08-23 Chicago
2009-08-28 San Francisco
2010-05-01 NOLA (Jazz Fest)
2011-07-02 EV Minneapolis
2011-09-03 PJ20
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2011-09-17 Winnipeg
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2012-06-27 Amsterdam
2013-07-19 Wrigley
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2025-05-03 NOLA (Jazz Fest)
wow...i have all the e mails from the salesmen saying my tickets are 'secured'. does that mean anything?
Yeah that's going to be a problem. It's gonna be a problem for them. This a clear violation of your rights as a consumer. It's an infringement on your constitutional rights. It's outrageous, egregious, preposterous.
Jackie!!!!!!
Let me ask you this... if prior to you signing the contract Pearl Jam announced that Ed had laryngitis and the concert was now off would you you still pay $900 for the Jimmy Buffet tickets if LiveNation was demanding payment since that show was still on? Or would you tell LiveNation to go pound salt because you never signed the contract?
Hi
Thanks for the link...a couple questions:
1.If I were to purchase the Ultra Elite Package that would be $900 per seat for three shows. Is that correct?
2. Will Pearl Jam's Fan Club impact these seats being taken or are they already 'off the market'?
.....thanks in advance
his response........
Yes, for 3 shows if you choose Alpine only and it is per seat.
I only have 4 seats left.
I do not have any knowledge of what holds or seats the Fan Club is using. I know my season seat holds and that is the extent of it.
whoops............
Do you think this guy is still going to get his commission?
Send my credentials to the house of detention
i know this isn't Law & Order but that is damaging evidence to Livenation imo
I will add that this my educated guess based on a thread in a message forum and not based upon knowledge of the specific details. Take the papers and your recollection of the phone conversations to a local attorney. You might get lucky and find someone willing to take this on just to make a name for him/her self. Ticket cases generate publicity that could outweigh the legal fees. Hope this helps.
did you see my direct e mail translations above from the sales rep?
All of that being said,and from a strictly business perspective, I do think LN should provide you with some compensation for the screw up.
Exactly. If Sawyer found out today that his wife was due to have a baby that weekend he'd be perfectly justified in backing out on buying the tickets and he'd be all over the fact that he never signed a contract if they came after him for the money.
but isn't that the exact thing they need to have knowledge of?
ten club should be praising you ....for catching their confusion with live nation
still the same company and I think some reimbursement then no?
But reimbursement for what? A sales promise made over the phone/email that did even result in a written agreement or funds beings exchanged? Think about how many times that happens every day.
i think this is much different than that...especially with all the e mails. There is clear confusion
sweet 2nd post
It sounds like he really screwed up. I don't think there's a reason to sue as long as you get your money back. But had you not found out about this mistake before 10 clubs sale tomorrow and missed your chance at good seats than more likely an issue. Was he purposefully be deceitful to make the sale is uncertain and probably hard to prove. I thought you meant to sue to get your money back was what I was thinking in my post. This is a special event and he may not have been aware of the special circumstances, which yes he should have been is probably how you feel. But I don't see too much harm as long as you get your money back. But still push Livenation to do something for some sort of compensation for the time you put in and such, as they a heartless bastards anyway and have the ability to make amends, like tickets to an upcoming concert of another artist as they own them all. Again, good luck tomorrow buddy as I'm pulling for you and everyone on this board, forget about this shit and have positive thoughts about tomorrow and the concerts.
Anyways, I feel for you, that really sucks.
1993-9-4 Vancouver
1996-9-16 Seattle
1998-7-19 Vancouver, 7-21 Seattle, Memorial Stadium
2000-11-6 Seattle
2001-10-22 Seattle
2002 -12-09 Seattle
2009-8-17 Manchester, 9-25 Vancouver
2011-6-16 Seattle (EV), 9-3/4 PJ20, 9-25 Vancouver
2012-6-27 Amsterdam (#2!)
2013-11-29 Portland, 12-4 Vancouver, 12-6 Seattle
2014-AUS - 1-26 Sydney, 1-31 Adelaide, 2-11/12 EV Sydney State Theatre, 2-13 EV Opera House
2014 - USA - Memphis, Detroit, MOLINE, St. Paul, MILWAUKEE, Denver, 25/26 Bridge School
2016 - Lexington, Philly x 2, MSG x 2, Quebec City, Ottawa, Toronto x 2, Pemberton, Fenway x 2, Wrigley x 2
2018 - Seattle x 2, Missoula, Fenway x 2