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Conservative thinking
mikepegg44
Posts: 3,353
Reading a lot of posts on this forum has often caused this question to come up in my mind a lot...
do a lot of you think that being a conservative is based on ignorance?
I don't want this to turn into a bunch of name calling and defensiveness, I am legitimately asking, do the democrats, liberals, and left leaning thinkers on this forum think think that conservatives are ignorant?
do a lot of you think that being a conservative is based on ignorance?
I don't want this to turn into a bunch of name calling and defensiveness, I am legitimately asking, do the democrats, liberals, and left leaning thinkers on this forum think think that conservatives are ignorant?
that’s right! Can’t we all just get together and focus on our real enemies: monogamous gays and stem cells… - Ned Flanders
It is terrifying when you are too stupid to know who is dumb
- Joe Rogan
It is terrifying when you are too stupid to know who is dumb
- Joe Rogan
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i would say tho the majority of the conservatives on here are not in general ignorant ... they just have a different value system ... like i've said before - me vs. we ...
ignorant...? perhaps some folks...but that's with any group...
selfish...yes...
If I am reading it right, that is where we disagree I guess. This whole me vs we argument. I don't believe it is selfish to think that I should be able to keep what I earn and that no matter what I make I should be treated the same as everyone else. Glad to hear you don't think it is ignorance, but I take issue with the selfish part. Giving a man a fish and teaching him to fish are two good things. Why is one seen as selfish and the other seen as a great thing to do?
I am glad to hear you don't think it is simply ignorance.
It is terrifying when you are too stupid to know who is dumb
- Joe Rogan
granted you can have a conservative be waaaaaay more generous than a liberal ... these are generalizations of course ... but fundamentally, i think the me vs. we theory is a good foundation of the variances ...
I made a comment in another threat on AMT that was poorly thought out and worded, and Electric_Delta (I think it was him) called me out for it - and rightfully so. It didn't really apply to the topic in question at all, but it's something I've been thinking about a lot this week (what I posted, not being called out for it).
A professor at LSU was giving a lecture on climate change, and attacked both sides of the argument in class to try and provoke discussion. A student filmed the lecture and posted video of it online, but edited out one entire train of argument to make it look like the only thing the professor was doing was ridiculing students who don't think humans are impacting climate change. In a conservative state like Louisiana, the shit hit the fan quickly, and the professor has been raked over the coals by the public (including my conservative father-in-law who tells me whenever the subject comes up that climate change is just a liberal hoax, no real scientist supports it, and any scientist who does support it is just a fraud who has bought into the Al Gore hype). Anyway - a few of the comments that were made about it on Facebook got me thinking about the mindset of some people. Somehow, the discussion thread on Facebook turned from climate change to evolution (also known as Liberal Hoax Number One), and one woman absolutely went off about how universities are just one-sided and they never teach students the whole story, and if universities just stuck to the indisputable "facts" then they would spend more time teaching students that god created the universe and less time teaching students absolute nonsense about how everything evolved over time. Her argument was that if you really think about organisms changing from one form to another over a period of time then it's impossible and illogical, and that the only reasonable explanation is that god did it all himself.
I read that comment and thought, "That woman is completely retarded. She's completely ignoring overwhelming scientific evidence in favor of words that were written in a book 1,500 years ago. The majority of the people on this planet have accepted the theory of evolution, but she is willfully part of the minority that believes with every ounce of their being that it's absolute rubbish and is all part of some conspiracy. I think she's completely ignorant."
And I also believe that she's sitting there thinking about people like me, and thinking, "They're completely retarded. They're completely ignoring the teachings of a book that answered every question about the universe people have been asking for two thousand years in favor of a book written by a guy on a boat 150 years ago. Anyone who believes that whales can turn into cows without the guiding hand of some supernatural force is completely ignorant."
I guess at the end of the day ignorance is all a matter of perspective
the me vs we does apply in most cases. but they want no government intrusion into their lives, unless of course we are talking about medicine, no stem cell research, no abortions, and keep terri shiavo alive at all costs, and health insurance reform, calling it socialist, when clearly it is not. and recently we have the conservatives fighting tooth and nail until the death for tax breaks for millionaires and billionaires while cutting social security, medicare, medicaid, and unemployment benefits, all while finding ways to pay for more war, more intelligence, and more planes and weapons, and being for domestic oil drilling, for a regressive energy policy, and completely denying climate change when nearly every country in the world is taking action based on solid science that the world is warming....there is nothing relating to "conservation" in current conservative thinking anywhere in our government...
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
I figured you'd be bothered by that, but that wasn't my intention...
by selfish, I mean that conservatives only want gov't to do what they want, to when they want...
for example, corporate welfare is good because it helps business...but that damn welfare queen better quit living off my dime...
It comes down to sharing...I'm ok with share via my tax dollars...I may not agree with all the gov't does, but I'm happy to have it...
They want a smaller gov't, which means lets cut all the social programs and keep military spending....
stuff like that...
x2...
well said..
But also, the first thing that come to my mind was the willingness to asking questions and critical thinking... I'm not talking about liberal or conservative radio/tv pundits, or the people who believe every word that they say... those people on both sides are lost causes.
(One again, generally speaking) But, maybe it's an education level or an age thing, but it seems to be that people on the left are more apt to question authority or ask the "and then what?" types of follow up questions. Like I said, age might have a lot to do with it... I don't know...
was like a picture
of a sunny day
“We can complain because rose bushes have thorns, or rejoice because thorn bushes have roses.”
― Abraham Lincoln
do you think that people who are fiscally conservative think differently about those other things? I certainly do. I was more referring to fiscal policy. Should have been more specific.
That is why I guess I get so frustrated here. When one uses the word conservative, a lot more than simple fiscal policy comes into play. I agree that there is a certain amount of conflict in a socially conservative and fiscally conservative agenda that never truly seems to get rectified.
It is terrifying when you are too stupid to know who is dumb
- Joe Rogan
Unfortunately, most of this problem has to do with talk radio and Fox / MSNBC type networks. It's subtle, but before you know it, you get locked into their "thinking".
I do certainly wish that people who call themselves conservative and make a big public display about how conservative they are(limbaugh especially) would try and straighten out their beliefs before they spout them because people like myself who are caught in the cross fire because I consider myself fiscally conservative get a bad name. You cannot want the federal government out of everything and then say "except for"... it doesnt work that way. Unfortunately I think the only true conservatives are libertarians, and that group of people are just too sane to be taken seriously
I would say as a general rule, I have a much larger problem with and am more annoyed by inconsistent conservatives than anything else...I mean I can understand the opinions of liberals, I just don't agree with some of them, I cannot understand inconsistency. That is how I would describe the GOP, not necessarily selfish, but inconsistent.
It is terrifying when you are too stupid to know who is dumb
- Joe Rogan
See - I think that is horribly misguided to the point of ignorance. It is possible to think conservatively from the standpoint that it is in EVERYONE'S best interest or the good of the whole.
...are those who've helped us.
Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
Go read Mark Levin's Book Liberty and Tryanny ( a conservative manifesto ) then you might actually understand what real fisical conservatives believe. Not the ones who claim to be like Karl rove and the other talking heads.
Don't want to get off topic, but Mark Levin is an idiot - If that's the voice of reason then this country will have no hope!
I like Mike's responds - It makes sense and he has a point. Unfortunately for you Mike you are caught in the cross fire because anyone who considers themselves conservatives are usually linked to idiots like Palin, Beck, Boehner, tea baggers, and all the new leaders of the house! All those pigs have sold out the American people!
>
...a lover and a fighter.
"I'm at least half a bum" Rocky Balboa
http://www.videosift.com/video/Obamas-Message-To-American-Indians
Edmonton, AB. September 5th, 2005
Vancouver, BC. April 3rd, 2008
Calgary,AB. August 8th, 2009
You know, I can't really find much to disagree about with this....I agree that inconsistency is hard to understand...
nice post...
And while I cannot speak for the people on this board, I can speak for many people that I know, especially my friends. What I have found is that those that have clear conservative beliefs are misinformed and ignorant, and they lack an open-mindedness that results in a lack of persepctive. Religion is a big part of their lives, and some of them will say that gay marriage is "wrong" because the Bible says so. And, many of them call Obama a Socialist, but they do not know the definition of the word. TV is important to these individuals. The extent of their reading is the Bible and People/US Weekly.
My friends that read, study, and are informed, lean to the left. They, like I, rarely watch TV - if they even have it. I have hour long (or longer) conversations with these friends, while I have short conversations with the "righties" that are about sports or things that happened in college.
I don't feel like typing anymore; I am getting sad.
Willfully ignorant?
Indoctrinated?
Not intellectually curious?
all of the above.
I agree. I think it is all about perspective and voluntary engagement. if you're not engaged, if you don't read about the issues, then you're not someone I will listen to or have a conversation with. This happens on both sides.
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
Palin Accuses Obamas Of Spending Too Much Time Listening To A Preacher’s “Rants Against America And White People”
In another leak from Sarah Palin’s new book, the former governor takes aim at Barack and Michelle Obama, questioning their love of country and whether they were too influenced by someone she regards as anti-white.
In leaked extracts of her new book, Mrs Palin delves into the minefield of racial politics, arguing that the first African American US president is among those who regarded the conservative tea party movement as racially prejudiced and who thinks that “America is a fundamentally unjust and unequal country”.
As proof, she dredged up a quote from a 2008 campaign speech in which Mrs Obama said “for the first time in my adult life, I am really proud of my country”.
Mrs Palin went on to say: “I guess this shouldn’t surprise us, since both of them spent almost two decades in the pews of the Reverend Jeremiah Wright’s church listening to his rants against America and white people.”
Lost in Palin’s take is that Michelle Obama explained that what made her proud was the involvement of young people in the electoral process.
For the first time in my lifetime, I am seeing people rolling up their sleeves in way that I haven’t seen and really trying to figure this out, and that’s the source of pride I was talking about.
Palin also puts down talent shows, oblivious to the fact that her daughter is on one.
"The Left has moved to the Center, and the Right has moved to the insane asylum".....hehehehe
Liberal Tricks...
Here are some common liberal tricks that many people fall for:
1.When a liberal theory of pseudo-science is disproved or discredited, then simply change the name (or definition) of the theory to render it impossible to test, as in "global warming" -> "climate change."[1]
2.Claim a candidate is a racist if his campaign received a small donation (amid thousands of other donations) from someone who might be called a racist.
3.Distracting and disrupting reasoned discussion, as in stating irrelevant claims, inconsequential tales of personal experience, or false outrage.
4.Making pseudo-religious arguments even though the person making the arguments does not adhere to the Bible, such as "judge ye not!"
5.Making arguments that have superficial appeal to the dimwitted, but are actually nonsensical and probably not believed by the liberal himself.[2]
6.Try to draw a conservative in to saying or doing something which can then be dishonestly twisted to cast him in a bad light.
7.So as not to show his true beliefs of supporting evil infanticide and taxpayer-funded abortion, Barack Obama insists he is pro-choice, but not pro-abortion. [3]
8.Inserting a liberal assumption into a question, as illustrated by the classic "When did you stop beating your wife?!"
9.Pretending that liberals do not have a political point of view, but are just being reasonable.[4]
10.Exaggerating praise for fellow liberals.[5]
11.Pretending that atheism equals intelligence.
12.In court decisions, holding in favor of the conservative side by using liberal reasons that will be cited for liberal outcomes in future cases[6]
13.Liberals befriending you so that you become liberal. (Conversely, why don't they become conservative?)
14.Citing "live and let live!" except when it comes to praying aloud in school, keeping the money you earn, building on your own property, and every other liberal issue.
15.Citing "it doesn't hurt to try!" (In reference to drugs, alcohol, and other immoral behaviors such as premarital sex, worshiping other gods/many gods/no gods, homosexuality, or abortion).
16.Claiming that because everyone else supposedly believes in something, therefore it must be right.
17.Claiming that your parents aren't cool; that Hollywood values are cool; that professor values are brilliant; and that you must blindly follow your government.
18.There is a shortage of everything we want.
19.Prayer is for dummies, or is antiquated.
20.Kids are getting smarter than old folks.
21.Smearing your adversary with a highly offensive accusation or insinuation.
22.Calling someone a racist if he criticizes a someone who happens to have a different skin color.
23.Demonizing conservatives and pretending they don't care about regular people.
24.If you don't like it (something offensive on television), don't watch it (but they don't seem to go for if you don't like whales being killed, don't watch them being killed).
25.Believing the poor are blameless because they have nothing and the rich are to blame because they have everything.
26.Accusing conservatives of libel, but forgetting that truth is the perfect defense against libel.
27.In discounting other point of views, liberals use comparisons of other known "wrong actions" to justify their supposed correct stance. [7]
28.Inserting false information, usually lewd into a respected work or group of works.
29.Defending the assuration that democrats.com is not affiliated with the Democratic party. (We are told as an independent website, Democrats do not control the views of democrats.com.)
30.Claiming expertise beyond one's area of expertise, as in a "Dr." or professor implying that he is an expert in an area beyond his specialty[8]
31.Pretending an honorary degree does not give someone the right to be called "Doctor".
32.Pretending affirmative action is the best way to fill positions, including President of the U.S.
33.Fearing the wrath of voters this election cycle, Democrats have decided not to block offshore drilling bans renewed each October. After the election, Americans get sucker-punched because restoring the ban on new offshore oil drilling leases “will be a top priority for discussion next year.” [9]
34.Saying "If you believe that abortion is murder, don't have one!" as if abortion isn't undisputably the murder of a human being.
35.Supporting classlessness while pretending to care about the preservation of world culture.
36.Finding a diverse individual to be appealing or “cool” until they learn that the individual does not conform to their liberal agenda.
37.Claiming open-mindedness as a disguise for immorality. Such is a typical liberal claim regarding drug/alcohol abuse, promiscuity, etc.
38.Defending the lives of heinous criminals (by opposing capital punishment) while encouraging murder of unborn children (by supporting infanticide, known today as abortion).
39.Justifying sinful lying by saying "what they don't know can't hurt them."
What do you think?
Peace
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
Isn't this in the Bible? Leviticus 4:8
- leviticus 4:8
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
righties love to call it pseudo science when they don't understand. So pretty much all science.
Ignorance, selfishness, and a complete lack of imagination.