Okla. tea parties and lawmakers envision militia
Comments
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There's a clear and vast difference between protesting, standing up for the values our nation was founded upon compared to forming an armed militia. What purpose do they really have? We have police and similar - so protection is out. Is it to rebel against our current government - very possible. And whether you are for or against their ideas/beliefs - one man's freedom fighters is another man's terrorist group.Godfather. wrote:what would you all have called the Minuit men or the those that fought and died at the Alamo or the men that fought during the civil war ? or even the student's that died at Kent state protesting for what they thought was right, I am not siding with one or the other on this discussion just saying this country is still a new country compared to other country's and we have fought for everything we have including our freedom and some people are ready to stand and fight to keep what they have, to them their right in what they do.
just a thought.
Godfather.CONservative governMENt
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis0 -
Godfather. wrote:what would you all have called the Minuit men or the those that fought and died at the Alamo or the men that fought during the civil war ? or even the student's that died at Kent state protesting for what they thought was right, I am not siding with one or the other on this discussion just saying this country is still a new country compared to other country's and we have fought for everything we have including our freedom and some people are ready to stand and fight to keep what they have, to them their right in what they do.
just a thought.
Godfather.
It is the same principle by which Ed was able to stand on stage and have the right to speak out against our invasion of Iraq. I happen to agree with him, but it was the same minute men and american revolutionaries that fought to provide us with that very right. AND you are right, we are a VERY young country and culture. The people we are fighting now have been around for millennia, which makes me feel we were kind of silly to go to headlong into war with these zealots, first in Iraq, and now Afghanistan. Someone posted you cannot fight a war with an idea (or tactic). How will we ever get out? Back to the OP- I do not believe that state run militias are an answer to anything and cannot do anything positive anywhere.fuck 'em if they can't take a joke
"what a long, strange trip it's been"0 -
inmytree wrote:I still don't understand these folks...what the hell are they so upset about...? I guess when words (or shout) don't work, frustrated fools will resort to threats of violence...
and to compare them to the founding fathers is simply stupid...
I think these teabaggers are blinded by hate for Obama and they hate America...
damn, I can't wait until these out of work fuckheads find jobs...
and to compare them to the founding fathers is simply stupid...OOOOOOOO REALLY ?
like I said I'm not one one side or the other, but just for shit's and giggles why don't you do a little history
on the founding father's...you know some of the guy's that told the queen and her tax's to piss up a rope,
or how about the SKULL AND BONES or the FREE MASONS or the KKK, I'll bet you find our founding father's knee deep in the secret society kimshi.....the real stuff this country was founded on........well I feel better now that I got that off my chest.....one more thing "I can't wait until these out of work fuckheads find jobs.."
count your blessing's my friend, if you are working be thankful.
Godfather.0 -
Godfather. wrote:inmytree wrote:I still don't understand these folks...what the hell are they so upset about...? I guess when words (or shout) don't work, frustrated fools will resort to threats of violence...
and to compare them to the founding fathers is simply stupid...
I think these teabaggers are blinded by hate for Obama and they hate America...
damn, I can't wait until these out of work fuckheads find jobs...
and to compare them to the founding fathers is simply stupid...OOOOOOOO REALLY ?
like I said I'm not one one side or the other, but just for shit's and giggles why don't you do a little history
on the founding father's...you know some of the guy's that told the queen and her tax's to piss up a rope,
or how about the SKULL AND BONES or the FREE MASONS or the KKK, I'll bet you find our founding father's knee deep in the secret society kimshi.....the real stuff this country was founded on........well I feel better now that I got that off my chest.....one more thing "I can't wait until these out of work fuckheads find jobs.."
count your blessing's my friend, if you are working be thankful.
Godfather.
you ask OOOOOOOOOO REALLY....I say YES, REALLY...now if we had a Queen to tell to piss up a rope, I'd understand...as it stands we don't...and your secret society point makes no sense to me...
and I do count my blessings every day...0 -
Our founding fathers didn't have the right to vote, protest or speak freely as we do. They were merely a colony to be exploited and pay taxes too. We live in a representative democracy with tons of freedoms - albeit it is skewed and screwed up, it is no where near what our founding fathers had dealt with. The gripes these people make are not of ongoing wrong-doing or long term problems, but instead issues that they merely disagree with - where as we have half the voting population who swings the other way. That isn't "wrong-doing" it is disagreement. And if you "rebel" or create armed militias because you disagree, you are a terrorist (a group aimed at change through the use of violence).Godfather. wrote:and to compare them to the founding fathers is simply stupid...OOOOOOOO REALLY ?
like I said I'm not one one side or the other, but just for shit's and giggles why don't you do a little history
on the founding father's...you know some of the guy's that told the queen and her tax's to piss up a rope,
or how about the SKULL AND BONES or the FREE MASONS or the KKK, I'll bet you find our founding father's knee deep in the secret society kimshi.....the real stuff this country was founded on........well I feel better now that I got that off my chest.....one more thing "I can't wait until these out of work fuckheads find jobs.."
count your blessing's my friend, if you are working be thankful.
Godfather.CONservative governMENt
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis0 -
considering that the KKK never came into existance until after the civil war i doubt the founding fathers were around to participate in that secret "society"... the KKK was founded by a bunch of...gasp...angry, southern, racist, redneck, civil war veterans that were angry about the confederacy losing the war and the slaves being free...anyone see any parallels with the KKK and the teabagger movment?
it is my contention that the combination of political defeat and the recent empowerment of african americans through the election of barack obama is fueling this movement..."You can tell the greatness of a man by what makes him angry." - Lincoln
"Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."0 -
Kent State protesters weren't an armed militia, that's the difference. They burned down the ROTC and may have rioted, but it wasn't an organized terror movement.Godfather. wrote:what would you all have called the Minuit men or the those that fought and died at the Alamo or the men that fought during the civil war ? or even the student's that died at Kent state protesting for what they thought was right, I am not siding with one or the other on this discussion just saying this country is still a new country compared to other country's and we have fought for everything we have including our freedom and some people are ready to stand and fight to keep what they have, to them their right in what they do.
just a thought.
Godfather.
Interesting about the civil war, there was an article on CNN the other day about this very subject...
http://ac360.blogs.cnn.com/2010/04/12/w ... errorists/
Definitely food for thought.Believe me, when I was growin up, I thought the worst thing you could turn out to be was normal, So I say freaks in the most complementary way. Here's a song by a fellow freak - E.V0 -
Albeit I don't like nor agree with most of the tea-bagger movement, I think generalizing it to mere racism is not correct. In my opinion, part of it is partisan politics as a backlash, part of it is resistance to change, and part of it is the naivety that some of the problems have just either come to light now or even very misguided gripes aimed at the wrong or not fully guilty parties (should be all, not just one). I'm sure for some it maybe racism, but I don't think that encompasses everyone by any means.gimmesometruth27 wrote:considering that the KKK never came into existance until after the civil war i doubt the founding fathers were around to participate in that secret "society"... the KKK was founded by a bunch of...gasp...angry, southern, racist, redneck, civil war veterans that were angry about the confederacy losing the war and the slaves being free...anyone see any parallels with the KKK and the teabagger movment?
it is my contention that the combination of political defeat and the recent empowerment of african americans through the election of barack obama is fueling this movement...CONservative governMENt
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis0 -
point being that our founding father's would be called criminal's today just as the these militia guy's are,
but as far as these guy's go what about federal law don't it over ride state law ?
Godfather.0 -
The founding fathers had no rights to act upon and rebelled to form their own nation in some sort of method of justice and freedom from tyranny.
The tea-party and these militias merely disagree with government policy, have all the freedoms in the world and are not the victim of tyranny by any means.
There is no commonality between the two in any reason or fact.
As for state and federal laws, we live in a federalist state. Unless we want to back to civil war, the colony setup or breaking the union apart - federalism is necessary - and yes, even if you disagree with some of the laws and policies.Godfather. wrote:point being that our founding father's would be called criminal's today just as the these militia guy's are,
but as far as these guy's go what about federal law don't it over ride state law ?
Godfather.CONservative governMENt
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis0 -
Point being made regarding my previous post...you know, this is supposed to be spirited debate, not "fuck em" to the people we disagree with; but that is your right to say that, just not educated as you accuse the tea "baggers" of being.
A couple of points: Did you even read the post or did you just see that I disagreed with your analysis so you decided to take an elitist attitude.
You say a couple of interesting things in one post in particutlar: you say I don't know what they are so pissed about, then you say, "I think", as an opinion! So you are in essance acting out what you accuse!
So when you're checking out CNN, when you're on your knees, sitting in your bucket to catch what leaks out of your spongy comprehension, do you think that these are just rowled up people just because Obama is in the White House; Do you ever listen, think, or anything but nod and say, "uh huh", and "fuck those tea baggin' backwoods, inbread, lowest common denominators of flacid wastes of space bags of bones"?
And man, if I didn't get another reversed racism comment...think of that one on your own? I wonder why there still racist, someone disagrees with someone on content alone, and just because Obama's black, you disagree with him, you're a racist? What ever happend to thinking??? And I love the generalizing!!! How awesome is that? 1 is all the same? There's no individual thought process with similar values, coming together to be heard as one voice...And a story, a story written by someone with ideals and preformed values writes an article (not saying right or wrong, just that this person has a mind, and he implements thought into words on paper) about a malitia, to be decided in a room by politicians, and look how it's spelled out, every tea party goer is a packin' pissed off ball of rage just ready to blast anyone in the face who stands in there way! Oh, and I really like the comment about our forefathers, the one where you could swear that that person was there. I know this is unpopular thinking in circles around hear, but I'm glad that some people had the courage to not parlay to the thinking of the populous. Makes me damn proud to be honest.0 -
RB112589 wrote:Point being made regarding my previous post...you know, this is supposed to be spirited debate, not "fuck em" to the people we disagree with; but that is your right to say that, just not educated as you accuse the tea "baggers" of being.
A couple of points: Did you even read the post or did you just see that I disagreed with your analysis so you decided to take an elitist attitude.
You say a couple of interesting things in one post in particutlar: you say I don't know what they are so pissed about, then you say, "I think", as an opinion! So you are in essance acting out what you accuse!
So when you're checking out CNN, when you're on your knees, sitting in your bucket to catch what leaks out of your spongy comprehension, do you think that these are just rowled up people just because Obama is in the White House; Do you ever listen, think, or anything but nod and say, "uh huh", and "fuck those tea baggin' backwoods, inbread, lowest common denominators of flacid wastes of space bags of bones"?
And man, if I didn't get another reversed racism comment...think of that one on your own? I wonder why there still racist, someone disagrees with someone on content alone, and just because Obama's black, you disagree with him, you're a racist? What ever happend to thinking??? And I love the generalizing!!! How awesome is that? 1 is all the same? There's no individual thought process with similar values, coming together to be heard as one voice...And a story, a story written by someone with ideals and preformed values writes an article (not saying right or wrong, just that this person has a mind, and he implements thought into words on paper) about a malitia, to be decided in a room by politicians, and look how it's spelled out, every tea party goer is a packin' pissed off ball of rage just ready to blast anyone in the face who stands in there way! Oh, and I really like the comment about our forefathers, the one where you could swear that that person was there. I know this is unpopular thinking in circles around hear, but I'm glad that some people had the courage to not parlay to the thinking of the populous. Makes me damn proud to be honest.
:thumbup: I like your post, I think that people get a little too comfortable with their American way of life
and thinking and either don't know or forget what it took to make America a free country, my thought on that
is that we could loose that freedom if it is not protected always.
Godfather.0 -
FiveB247x wrote:The founding fathers had no rights to act upon and rebelled to form their own nation in some sort of method of justice and freedom from tyranny.
The tea-party and these militias merely disagree with government policy, have all the freedoms in the world and are not the victim of tyranny by any means.
There is no commonality between the two in any reason or fact.
As for state and federal laws, we live in a federalist state. Unless we want to back to civil war, the colony setup or breaking the union apart - federalism is necessary - and yes, even if you disagree with some of the laws and policies.Godfather. wrote:point being that our founding father's would be called criminal's today just as the these militia guy's are,
but as far as these guy's go what about federal law don't it over ride state law ?
Godfather.
disagreement is what started the civil war these two have everything in common, the dates have changed
but the Idea's are the same.
Godfather.0 -
RB112589 wrote:Point being made regarding my previous post...you know, this is supposed to be spirited debate, not "fuck em" to the people we disagree with; but that is your right to say that, just not educated as you accuse the tea "baggers" of being.
A couple of points: Did you even read the post or did you just see that I disagreed with your analysis so you decided to take an elitist attitude.
You say a couple of interesting things in one post in particutlar: you say I don't know what they are so pissed about, then you say, "I think", as an opinion! So you are in essance acting out what you accuse!
So when you're checking out CNN, when you're on your knees, sitting in your bucket to catch what leaks out of your spongy comprehension, do you think that these are just rowled up people just because Obama is in the White House; Do you ever listen, think, or anything but nod and say, "uh huh", and "fuck those tea baggin' backwoods, inbread, lowest common denominators of flacid wastes of space bags of bones"?
And man, if I didn't get another reversed racism comment...think of that one on your own? I wonder why there still racist, someone disagrees with someone on content alone, and just because Obama's black, you disagree with him, you're a racist? What ever happend to thinking??? And I love the generalizing!!! How awesome is that? 1 is all the same? There's no individual thought process with similar values, coming together to be heard as one voice...And a story, a story written by someone with ideals and preformed values writes an article (not saying right or wrong, just that this person has a mind, and he implements thought into words on paper) about a malitia, to be decided in a room by politicians, and look how it's spelled out, every tea party goer is a packin' pissed off ball of rage just ready to blast anyone in the face who stands in there way! Oh, and I really like the comment about our forefathers, the one where you could swear that that person was there. I know this is unpopular thinking in circles around hear, but I'm glad that some people had the courage to not parlay to the thinking of the populous. Makes me damn proud to be honest.
the best line of this incoherent ramble...
every tea party goer is a packin' pissed off ball of rage just ready to blast anyone in the face who stands in there way!
0 -
Godfather. wrote:FiveB247x wrote:The founding fathers had no rights to act upon and rebelled to form their own nation in some sort of method of justice and freedom from tyranny.
The tea-party and these militias merely disagree with government policy, have all the freedoms in the world and are not the victim of tyranny by any means.
There is no commonality between the two in any reason or fact.
As for state and federal laws, we live in a federalist state. Unless we want to back to civil war, the colony setup or breaking the union apart - federalism is necessary - and yes, even if you disagree with some of the laws and policies.Godfather. wrote:point being that our founding father's would be called criminal's today just as the these militia guy's are,
but as far as these guy's go what about federal law don't it over ride state law ?
Godfather.
disagreement is what started the civil war these two have everything in common, the dates have changed
but the Idea's are the same.
Godfather.
Next you'll be bring up the Crusades and the War of 1812 as examples of how super duper the teabaggers are...
here and now, my friend...here and now...0 -
Godfather. wrote:disagreement is what started the civil war these two have everything in common, the dates have changed
but the Idea's are the same.
Godfather.
But what's that idea really? If you feel wronged, grab a gun and take whatever you feel you aren't getting?
That's seems to me to be the "idea" here.
My stance would be that the moment you reach for the gun, you've basically lost, protecting freedom-wise. There may be rare exceptions under extreme totalitarian rule where that is not the case, but it applies to all modern, open countries. (and yes, the US is definitely without a doubt in that category) Few or none real changes have ever happened through violence. Real changes happen over time and through ideas and behaviours. Violence (or threat of it) just shakes things up a bit right now.
Peace
Dan"YOU [humans] NEED TO BELIEVE IN THINGS THAT AREN'T TRUE. HOW ELSE CAN THEY BECOME?" - Death
"Every judgment teeters on the brink of error. To claim absolute knowledge is to become monstrous. Knowledge is an unending adventure at the edge of uncertainty." - Frank Herbert, Dune, 19650 -
those who fail to remember our history are destine to relive it.....heard that somewhere
guy's don't get too riled up I'm not even sure what a teabagger is,you guy's can handle thing's the way you wish,this country has fought war's so you can have that freedom...or dose that matter anymore since we are in the here and now ?
Godfather.0 -
Should we applaud and laud Al Queda for arming themselves and fighting for their brand of freedom, virtuosity and fighting back as well? Seems to fit perfectly within the parameters of fighting for what a group feels is right and standing up for their sense of injustice? Do they as well resemble our fore fathers - is there not a gaping hole in the middle of your argument? Something perhaps to do with methods, availability and pragmatism to change things around you? But let's not add any history or facts to the issue, let's talk how we can pat a group on the back for arming themselves when they have every available means necessary to create change for a variety of methods.
Anyone care to discuss this question? No one has touched it...There's a clear and vast difference between protesting, standing up for the values our nation was founded upon compared to forming an armed militia. What purpose do they really have? We have police and similar - so protection is out. Is it to rebel against our current government - very possible. And whether you are for or against their ideas/beliefs - one man's freedom fighters is another man's terrorist group.Godfather. wrote:those who fail to remember our history are destine to relive it.....heard that somewhere
guy's don't get too riled up I'm not even sure what a teabagger is,you guy's can handle thing's the way you wish,this country has fought war's so you can have that freedom...or dose that matter anymore since we are in the here and now ?
Godfather.CONservative governMENt
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis0 -
Al Queda ? try telling them about your Rights as a American btw we are talking about America right ?
police officer's are payed to up hold state and federal law's and if one of those laws interferes with your freedom then that just too bad....right ?
like I said do as you wish it's your life and if you like being led around by the nose then good,so be it.
Godfather.0 -
Godfather. wrote:Al Queda ? try telling them about your Rights as a American btw we are talking about America right ?
police officer's are payed to up hold state and federal law's and if one of those laws interferes with your freedom then that just too bad....right ?
like I said do as you wish it's your life and if you like being led around by the nose then good,so be it.
Godfather.
yeah, too bad...that's how things work...christ, is it that hard...?
suddenly everyone is an anarchist...I love it...0
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