Tipping in the service industry

decides2dream wrote:

and to anyone as getting 'pissed off' over this thread....why? it's one thread, it's opinions, mostly from strangers. who truly gives a flying fuck what another stranger's opinion is? unless of course it impacts you, such as their choice for president. seriously tho.....i think this thread has remained civil and truly discusses the topic, and well. and sure, while many of us still tip and generously, many of us still can be of the opinion that paying a regular wage and doing away with tipping would be much more desirable, and honestly, more fair to all. as mentioned, there are many lines of work similar in skills and requirements, lack of benefits and low-pay, without the benefit of tips. it truly doesn't make sense. pay all a real wage and be done with it. obviously....it's just a disucssion, although truly...it makes sense.

The thing is, I cannot imagine my employer paying me $50 an hour to wait tables. What would he be charging guests per meal to pay his servers $50/hour? No one would go out to eat.

_Crazy_Mary_ wrote:

The thing is, I cannot imagine my employer paying me $50 an hour to wait tables. What would he be charging guests per meal to pay his servers $50/hour? No one would go out to eat.

no, you obviously wouldn't earn $50 an hour, and tht's the point. do you truly think the services of a waiter/watiress 'deserve' $50 an hour? yes, you are providing a service and working hard...but so are many, many others with the same requirements. you would earn a 'decent wage' not a ridiculous one. so you are saying you take home $2000 a week? really? so you make over 100K a year? nice! between that $9 an hour and tips, cali is a good place for waitstaff! interesting. i know a lot of waiters make good $$$, but factoring in no sick leave, no health benefits, no paid vacation, no retirement benefits...also very few work a full 40 hour week nor get awesome tips all the hours they make, i find it hard to believe. just like retail workers and many others. i'm sorry, but a job with zero educational requirements nor special skills does not 'need' to make exactly what a job that DOEs require additional education, specialized skills and/or undesirable or dangerous work.



btw - if you are saying you average 50 an hour in tips, WHERE does this $$$ come from? your patrons! so obviously they are willing to 'pay for it!' also why i say waitstaff DON't fight for a 'decent wage'...they don't want one! i would say most prefer getting their tips b/c they know it is more than what a 'decent wage' would equate to. great for waitstaff, not great for anyone else. i just wonder, who decidd waitstaff shouldn't get at least minimum wage, they deserve tips instead, and other lines of work don't? it's arbitrary at best. and sure, will likely remain so...but this IS, afterall, merely a discussion of tipping customs, the whys and hows of it.



so no.....how about restaurant owners simply charge on average 20% more on all menu items and give that 20% directly to their employees...and then, whatever that would average at an hourly wage, done! 20% up in costs minus having to take it out of pocket, people would of course continue to go iut and eat....i know i would. just like i would still get haircuts, the occasional massage, manicure, taxiride, etc......just happy knowing i don't HAVe to tip, and they are making a decent wage.

Heineken Helen wrote:

I'm definitely never tipping in CA if you earn $50 an hour :eek: you act like a charity and you need my tips to feed your kids :eek: on $50 an hour :eek: c'mon!

she's saying she makes $50 an hour WITH her tips. she already posted she makes $9 an hour as a flat rate, before tips. more than the minimum wage if i am correct. i know at least in NY, the minimum wage is $7 something.


btw - over in ireland and elsewhere, what Is the 'average decent wage' of a waiter/waitress? does anyone know? i am merely curious. i know tipping still occurs, but not as the rule...moreas for excellent/above par service, as tipping in general i think was initially meant to be before it became an expectation here.

pearljamjen wrote:

When I was a waitress in Ireland I earned 7 euros an hour. This was back in 2004 though. I didn't expect to get any tips but I always got a tip! Was a very nice surprise. Maybe they liked my smile Or maybe because I aimed to provide excellent customer service because that was my job rather than because I expected a tip.

Edit: this was in Limerick; perhaps wages would be higher in Dublin.

in today's economy, that's about what.....$13 an hour?
yes, i think that is a more than fair wage. and it is still more than what the average retail worker makes, and i am sure other service industry type jobs. now if someone wants to argue you can't support a family on it, i'll agree. i will also say, i personally do not believe being part of waitstaff is a profession meant to support an entire family. hell, most jobs don't nowadays, but really......many, many jobs do not earn enough to support a family. you need two incomes, or two jobs...or sure....move into another profession. thus why retail, waitstaff and the like are filled with many, many college-age workers, some seniors, etc. sure, there are some life-time professional waitstaff, but i think the bulk made up of a more transient workforce. not every job is meant to be a lifetime job. beyond that, it's a choice. and i am sure to get flak for my opinion, but hey...it's simply my opinion.

Chime wrote:

Our (UK) minimum wage which would include waiters/waitresses is:

£5.73 per hour for workers aged 22 years and older
£4.77 per hour for workers aged 18-21 inclusive
£3.53 per hour for all workers under the age of 18, who are no longer of compulsory school age

thanks for the info...interesting!
so basically with the exchange rate, just about $11.50-$12 an hour. i think i overcalculated for the euro conversion earlier...so really, very similar for the UK and ireland, anyway. definitely more than our minimum wage, but on par with retail pay and other service-type jobs. sounds about right.


bottomline, minimum wage should be just that; the minimum wage to pay. there should be NO exclusions whatsoever.

_Crazy_Mary_ wrote:

Dinner shifts I average $40-$60 an hour including my wages. Lunch shifts I average $25-$35 with wages.
I don't work a 40 hour work week, that would be horrible.
However, whether I deserve $50/hour or not doesn't matter. The bottom line is I would not wait tables if I made less than that, what would be the point? The reason I am a waitress is because the hours and $$ work for my family.

ok i'll say it.. for doing a really simple job you earn way too much money. i also dont believe you earn all that money. if you did then you'd earn more than the restaurant owner... $50 an hour and you have the audacity to bemoan a 15% tip.

because i now know that a waitress earns $50 an hour then i'm definitely not tipping... as Bon Jovi once said "you give waitresses a bad name, a bad name" .. although he might have said love and not waitresses.

Also, food costs are 50%, so on a day when the restaurant takes in $5k, the owners are making $2500, right? So that's quite a lot more than I make.

_Crazy_Mary_ wrote:

Also, food costs are 50%, so on a day when the restaurant takes in $5k, the owners are making $2500, right? So that's quite a lot more than I make.

and of that $2500 how much is taxable, how much wages comes out of it, rent, overheads, supplies, etc.

dunkman wrote:

ok i'll say it.. for doing a really simple job you earn way too much money. i also dont believe you earn all that money. if you did then you'd earn more than the restaurant owner... $50 an hour and you have the audacity to bemoan a 15% tip.

because i now know that a waitress earns $50 an hour then i'm definitely not tipping... as Bon Jovi once said "you give waitresses a bad name, a bad name" .. although he might have said love and not waitresses.

Making $50/hr is quite feasible at a decent restaurant. If wages are $9/hr, and people tip an average of 17%, Mary would have to serve 5 tables per hour, with each bill averaging $48.

dunkman wrote:

thanks... you've just added weight to my whole anti-tipping campaign... in fact, when i'm there next year, i'll take my 17% of any meal i might have tipped and give it to someone more needful... like a cleaner or a garbage man or something

or a Binman?

very true. The numbers I'm giving you are pre-tax.