From an email I sent to a friend on religion. Any opinions?

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Comments

  • Rhinocerous Surprise
    Rhinocerous Surprise Posts: 4,423
    Vedderlution_Baby! wrote:
    Whoa. that blows my mind.

    It wasn't really as bad as that made it sound - they never told us we were going to hell if we didn't believe or anything, and the religious stuff they made us attend was usually instead of a Religion class, or better yet, a proper class, so we didn't complain. :p
    Smokey Robinson constantly looks like he's trying to act natural after being accused of farting.
  • Kilgore_Trout
    Kilgore_Trout Posts: 7,334
    Rhinocerous Surprise wrote:
    A little suburb in Ireland, just outside Dublin. It was a pretty religious school, even though it wasn't officially a Catholic one. We had a load of religious ceremonies that they made most kids go to - sometimes, Muslims or other religions would get exemptions, but never atheists. They even turned our graduation into a religious thing.

    Luckily, my teachers for religion class were usually pretty cool, and willing to have proper debates with me. They usually told my parents that I knew more about religion than the kids who believed. :p
    thats whats most important to me if youre gonna take a particular stance on the religious issue... atleast be informed about what youre denying... ive become an agnostic recently... leaning somewhat towards atheism... but i also went to sunday school for 10 years and know my shit... ive talked with some atheist before that really dont have a basis for their argument... if nothing else i can appreciate the bible for what it is... a pretty damn good collection of short stories... star wars and pearl jam are more religious experiences to me tho
    "Senza speme vivemo in disio"

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  • Rhinocerous Surprise
    Rhinocerous Surprise Posts: 4,423
    sgossard3 wrote:
    thats whats most important to me if youre gonna take a particular stance on the religious issue... atleast be informed about what youre denying... ive become an agnostic recently... leaning somewhat towards atheism... but i also went to sunday school for 10 years and know my shit... ive talked with some atheist before that really dont have a basis for their argument... if nothing else i can appreciate the bible for what it is... a pretty damn good collection of short stories... star wars and pearl jam are more religious experiences to me tho

    I think it's equally important to be informed about what you're accepting. I find it pretty depressing knowing there are people going to church just cos it's what they do on a Sunday, or saying that god exists just cos they never took the time to consider other possibilities.
    Smokey Robinson constantly looks like he's trying to act natural after being accused of farting.
  • Jeremy1012
    Jeremy1012 Posts: 7,170
    Vedderlution_Baby! wrote:
    Whoa. that blows my mind.
    I was once made to stand out front in our school chapel when I refused to sing. I stood out front and continued to not sing. It wasn't so much the forced singing that bothered me, more the fact that the school seemed horrified by the prospect of anyone NOT being a christian or worse, not believing in any religion. They made sikhs, muslims, hindus, tons of people of different faiths sing songs of christianity and pray to the christian god and wouldn't accept it any other way. I decided I'd had enough :p It was more to do with the chaplain's dislike of me from other resistance I had shown to him that he got pissed off at me, not so much just my not singing. Plenty of people wouldn't sing and never got made an example of. End of story was, my mother (who is training to be a baptist minister which is ironic) came to school and asked him why he was bullying me and told him that I was entitled to my own mind. He shat himself and never so much as looked at me the wrong way again :D To this day I, as an atheist, respect christians like my mother as long as they respect my right not to be one.
    "I remember one night at Muzdalifa with nothing but the sky overhead, I lay awake amid sleeping Muslim brothers and I learned that pilgrims from every land — every colour, and class, and rank; high officials and the beggar alike — all snored in the same language"
  • Vedderlution_Baby
    Vedderlution_Baby Posts: 2,535
    Jeremy1012 wrote:
    I was once made to stand out front in our school chapel when I refused to sing. I stood out front and continued to not sing. It wasn't so much the forced singing that bothered me, more the fact that the school seemed horrified by the prospect of anyone NOT being a christian or worse, not believing in any religion. They made sikhs, muslims, hindus, tons of people of different faiths sing songs of christianity and pray to the christian god and wouldn't accept it any other way. I decided I'd had enough :p It was more to do with the chaplain's dislike of me from other resistance I had shown to him that he got pissed off at me, not so much just my not singing. Plenty of people wouldn't sing and never got made an example of. End of story was, my mother (who is training to be a baptist minister which is ironic) came to school and asked him why he was bullying me and told him that I was entitled to my own mind. He shat himself and never so much as looked at me the wrong way again :D To this day I, as an atheist, respect christians like my mother as long as they respect my right not to be one.



    Your mom sounds awesome. Being a smartass myself, I may have started singing Running with the devil, and made everything a lot worse.
  • Rhinocerous Surprise
    Rhinocerous Surprise Posts: 4,423
    Jeremy1012 wrote:
    I was once made to stand out front in our school chapel when I refused to sing. I stood out front and continued to not sing. It wasn't so much the forced singing that bothered me, more the fact that the school seemed horrified by the prospect of anyone NOT being a christian or worse, not believing in any religion. They made sikhs, muslims, hindus, tons of people of different faiths sing songs of christianity and pray to the christian god and wouldn't accept it any other way. I decided I'd had enough :p It was more to do with the chaplain's dislike of me from other resistance I had shown to him that he got pissed off at me, not so much just my not singing. Plenty of people wouldn't sing and never got made an example of. End of story was, my mother (who is training to be a baptist minister which is ironic) came to school and asked him why he was bullying me and told him that I was entitled to my own mind. He shat himself and never so much as looked at me the wrong way again :D To this day I, as an atheist, respect christians like my mother as long as they respect my right not to be one.


    Hehe... Nice. ;) For our religious graduation ceremony, the band was made up of me, and three of my atheist friends. They wanted us to play that crappy religious "Oh Happy Day" song. We refused, because we didn't want our graduation to be religious, and if it was gonna be, we weren't gonna actively participate. So we made the entire choir sing the theme from Happy Days instead. :D
    Smokey Robinson constantly looks like he's trying to act natural after being accused of farting.
  • Collin
    Collin Posts: 4,931
    sgossard3 wrote:
    thats whats most important to me if youre gonna take a particular stance on the religious issue... atleast be informed about what youre denying... ive become an agnostic recently... leaning somewhat towards atheism... but i also went to sunday school for 10 years and know my shit... ive talked with some atheist before that really dont have a basis for their argument... if nothing else i can appreciate the bible for what it is... a pretty damn good collection of short stories... star wars and pearl jam are more religious experiences to me tho

    I'm not denying anything, because that would mean there is something to deny to begin with. I believe there is not.

    Furthermore, what do you mean "basis for their argument?" Why would someone even have to know about the bible to be an atheist in the first place?
    THANK YOU, LOSTDAWG!


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  • Brain of J.Lo
    Brain of J.Lo Posts: 3,259
    Collin wrote:
    Why would someone even have to know about the bible to be an atheist in the first place?

    lol :) Sooooo true. I don't need to read all of Aesop's Fables to know that they are not true stories. ;)

    edit: sorry to jump onto the end/or into the middle of a discussion. I just had to say that. lol :)
  • Rhinocerous Surprise
    Rhinocerous Surprise Posts: 4,423
    Collin wrote:
    I'm not denying anything, because that would mean there is something to deny to begin with. I believe there is not.

    Furthermore, what do you mean "basis for their argument?" Why would someone even have to know about the bible to be an atheist in the first place?

    I think it helps to have a good knowledge of all religions - not specifically to agree or disagree with any writings, but to understand where the believers are coming from. You don't have to know the Bible to be an atheist, but to understand a Christian's point of view, it does help to have at least passing familiarity.
    Smokey Robinson constantly looks like he's trying to act natural after being accused of farting.
  • josevolution
    josevolution Posts: 31,784
    man i don't know what or who i believe ,somedays i read the news and say there is no god and then i look at my children and say thank you god for giving me healthy kids i just don't know ....i ?? can this be it i mean we live and then die and that's it ?? ...
    jesus greets me looks just like me ....
  • Rhinocerous Surprise
    Rhinocerous Surprise Posts: 4,423
    josevolution wrote:
    man i don't know what or who i believe ,somedays i read the news and say there is no god and then i look at my children and say thank you god for giving me healthy kids i just don't know ....i ?? can this be it i mean we live and then die and that's it ?? ...

    There doesn't have to be a god for there to be something beyond this life.:)
    Smokey Robinson constantly looks like he's trying to act natural after being accused of farting.
  • josevolution
    josevolution Posts: 31,784
    Rhinocerous Surprise wrote:
    There doesn't have to be a god for there to be something beyond this life.:)

    i tend to lean towards that thinking ...
    jesus greets me looks just like me ....
  • Collin
    Collin Posts: 4,931
    Rhinocerous Surprise wrote:
    I think it helps to have a good knowledge of all religions - not specifically to agree or disagree with any writings, but to understand where the believers are coming from. You don't have to know the Bible to be an atheist, but to understand a Christian's point of view, it does help to have at least passing familiarity.

    I just don't agree that atheism is an "argument" that is derived from one's knowledge of the bible and/or the flaws one might find in it.
    THANK YOU, LOSTDAWG!


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  • eyedclaar
    eyedclaar Posts: 6,980
    josevolution wrote:
    man i don't know what or who i believe ,somedays i read the news and say there is no god and then i look at my children and say thank you god for giving me healthy kids i just don't know ....i ?? can this be it i mean we live and then die and that's it ?? ...

    well, energy is recycled. Your rotting corpse will feed bugs and fertilize grass or something... Life goes on, whether you are consciously aware of it or not.
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  • Rhinocerous Surprise
    Rhinocerous Surprise Posts: 4,423
    Collin wrote:
    I just don't agree that atheism is an "argument" that is derived from one's knowledge of the bible and/or the flaws one might find in it.

    Either do I - I believe you're born atheist, and learn religion. No argument from me there. I just think that a little understanding of where every group is coming from would help everyone, whether atheist or theist.
    Smokey Robinson constantly looks like he's trying to act natural after being accused of farting.
  • redmosquito10
    redmosquito10 Posts: 568
    Rhinocerous Surprise wrote:
    Either do I - I believe you're born atheist, and learn religion. No argument from me there. I just think that a little understanding of where every group is coming from would help everyone, whether atheist or theist.

    Where did religion originally come from then if everyone is born an atheist?

    (Note I'm not a religious person, but given the fact that pretty much as long as humans have existed they've looked to a higher power, I find that argument a tough one to grasp)
    "Ah, life is a gate, a way, a path to Paradise anyway, why not live for fun and joy and love or some sort of girl by a fireside, why not go to your desire and LAUGH..."
  • Collin
    Collin Posts: 4,931
    Rhinocerous Surprise wrote:
    Either do I - I believe you're born atheist, and learn religion. No argument from me there. I just think that a little understanding of where every group is coming from would help everyone, whether atheist or theist.

    I agree. I'm only saying that having knowledge of, or understanding the bible is not a prerequisite for atheism.
    THANK YOU, LOSTDAWG!


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  • Jeremy1012
    Jeremy1012 Posts: 7,170
    redmosquito10 wrote:
    Where did religion originally come from then if everyone is born an atheist?
    Came from a desire from some people to explain the things we cannot understand.
    "I remember one night at Muzdalifa with nothing but the sky overhead, I lay awake amid sleeping Muslim brothers and I learned that pilgrims from every land — every colour, and class, and rank; high officials and the beggar alike — all snored in the same language"
  • Rhinocerous Surprise
    Rhinocerous Surprise Posts: 4,423
    redmosquito10 wrote:
    Where did religion originally come from then if everyone is born an atheist?

    (Note I'm not a religious person, but given the fact that pretty much as long as humans have existed they've looked to a higher power, I find that argument a tough one to grasp)

    I think humans might be inherently spiritual - but you can be spiritual and atheist. I think organised religion, in its modern form, was created by the haves to keep control over the have-nots, and our concept of "god" was invented, as Jeremy said, to explain what people couldn't explain through science. Yet. Do you think children would believe in god today if their parents/school/what-have-you didn't drill it into them?
    Smokey Robinson constantly looks like he's trying to act natural after being accused of farting.
  • Collin
    Collin Posts: 4,931
    redmosquito10 wrote:
    Where did religion originally come from then if everyone is born an atheist?

    (Note I'm not a religious person, but given the fact that pretty much as long as humans have existed they've looked to a higher power, I find that argument a tough one to grasp)

    Ignorance? Uncertainty? Fear? Desire?

    People heard thunder, but they could not explain, so people invented Thor.
    THANK YOU, LOSTDAWG!


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