New Respect For Billie - Green Day
Comments
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facepollution wrote:His music has always appealed to young people, it's just now there is a bit more of a message going with it - if you don't agree with the message, too bad. That doesn't make it bad music.
my assertion is the complete opposite.
"slappy hours," "kerplunk" and "dookie" was pure pop-punk driven by teen angst, heartache and the politics of boredom.
"insomniac," "nimrod" and "warning" were amazingly produced records that showed good songwriting, but slowly slipped away from meaningful (punk) music.
"american idiot" was the biggest load of bullshit (that i am embarrassed to say i bought into for a couple months) fueled by verizon wireless, watered-down liberalism, and eye-liner. a COMPLETE failure for their fans who had been moved by the music and the messages, and a COMPLETE success for people who are easily persuaded by imagery and simple statements.
LIKE I SAID, no matter what Billie Boy does now, i can't have respect for the dude(tte). i will respect him if he comes out and says how much money he got to throw away his credibility.0 -
chrisopalooza wrote:my assertion is the complete opposite.
"slappy hours," "kerplunk" and "dookie" was pure pop-punk driven by teen angst, heartache and the politics of boredom.
"insomniac," "nimrod" and "warning" were amazingly produced records that showed good songwriting, but slowly slipped away from meaningful (punk) music.
"american idiot" was the biggest load of bullshit (that i am embarrassed to say i bought into for a couple months) fueled by verizon wireless, watered-down liberalism, and eye-liner. a COMPLETE failure for their fans who had been moved by the music and the messages, and a COMPLETE success for people who are easily persuaded by imagery and simple statements.
LIKE I SAID, no matter what Billie Boy does now, i can't have respect for the dude(tte). i will respect him if he comes out and says how much money he got to throw away his credibility.
Utter rubbish. First of all get over the whole eyeliner thing, boys wearing makeup is hardly a new thing, and most importantly it has nothing to do with the music. Secondly, all they were ever doing was singing about the things they cared about. If the album had flopped they wouldn't catch half the shit they do becuase of its success. I can only presume you have an issue with the message they are singing about. To throw away your credibility is to do something you don't truly believe in - I'm willing to bet you that he still stands by every word on that album.0 -
I have little respect for those media-hungry whores, and that certainly won't change by watching the singer try to decapitate an audience member because the guy in the crowd was drunk or abusive or whatever....
But at least they are trying to educate their fans, and that is what seperates them from utter shite like Good Charlotte.REMEMBER KIDS....
The Bible is full of lies - Stone is the leader of us all!0 -
facepollution wrote:Utter rubbish. First of all get over the whole eyeliner thing, boys wearing makeup is hardly a new thing, and most importantly it has nothing to do with the music. Secondly, all they were ever doing was singing about the things they cared about. If the album had flopped they wouldn't catch half the shit they do becuase of its success. I can only presume you have an issue with the message they are singing about. To throw away your credibility is to do something you don't truly believe in - I'm willing to bet you that he still stands by every word on that album.
the eyeliner thing is an issue. why did he start dressing up like an emo chick all of a sudden? did it come with the "message" of american idiot or did some publicist tell him that every other pop-punk band is doing it right now? i'll never know the real answer, but with the blatant commercial success of the record, i think i have an idea. i clearly remember during green day's behind the music (filmed in 2000 or 2001) that bllie bob said something along the lines of, "i wanna grow up, i dont wanna be a 30-year old kid and keep playing kiddie music." well, dressing up like a 13-year old my chemical romance fanatic certainly isn't growing up.
if the album flopped, it would have had the same affect on me. the music on the record is a joke. just because you stand up and write some cheesy lines about how much the government sucks doesn't make you political. yes, it is risky and takes courage to be political band, but if you don't know what the hell you are talking about, then you look incredibly stupid...such as green day.
and i am sure billie boy stands by every word he wrote, but they are weak, childish words. it doesn't impress me the least bit.
i am sure vh1 and rolling stone magazine will treat green day as one of the great, political punk bands with a message of our time. but every punk fan knows green day is the polar opposite of what punk rock is about.
thus, i am sorry, i STILL will never have respect for billie joey armystrongy.0 -
chrisopalooza wrote:the eyeliner thing is an issue. why did he start dressing up like an emo chick all of a sudden? did it come with the "message" of american idiot or did some publicist tell him that every other pop-punk band is doing it right now? i'll never know the real answer, but with the blatant commercial success of the record, i think i have an idea. i clearly remember during green day's behind the music (filmed in 2000 or 2001) that bllie bob said something along the lines of, "i wanna grow up, i dont wanna be a 30-year old kid and keep playing kiddie music." well, dressing up like a 13-year old my chemical romance fanatic certainly isn't growing up.
if the album flopped, it would have had the same affect on me. the music on the record is a joke. just because you stand up and write some cheesy lines about how much the government sucks doesn't make you political. yes, it is risky and takes courage to be political band, but if you don't know what the hell you are talking about, then you look incredibly stupid...such as green day.
and i am sure billie boy stands by every word he wrote, but they are weak, childish words. it doesn't impress me the least bit.
i am sure vh1 and rolling stone magazine will treat green day as one of the great, political punk bands with a message of our time. but every punk fan knows green day is the polar opposite of what punk rock is about.
thus, i am sorry, i STILL will never have respect for billie joey armystrongy.
Can I just clarify, do you disagree with the band's stance on the war?0 -
facepollution wrote:Can I just clarify, do you disagree with the band's stance on the war?
first of all, i am anti-war. bush is a horrible leader. i lean left.
green day is dumbing-down the message. sure, they are probably anti-war, but they don't know why, they are just riding on the popuar anti-bush aura in the country.
they are not political by any means. i would put $100 on that billie bob doesn't know 5 senators. $200 says he doesn't know who the current secretary of defense is.
it's easy as hell to stand up on Mtv and say you are against George Bush to a bunch of 12-year old cunts. there's no real message behind green day's music. none.0 -
chrisopalooza wrote:first of all, i am anti-war. bush is a horrible leader. i lean left.
green day is dumbing-down the message. sure, they are probably anti-war, but they don't know why, they are just riding on the popuar anti-bush aura in the country.
they are not political by any means. i would put $100 on that billie bob doesn't know 5 senators. $200 says he doesn't know who the current secretary of defense is.
it's easy as hell to stand up on Mtv and say you are against George Bush to a bunch of 12-year old cunts. there's no real message behind green day's music. none.
Your probably right. there are quite a few bands that jumped the anti Bush wagon
7/02/06 Denver
12/02/06 Honolulu0 -
run_into_the_rain wrote:Your probably right. there are quite a few bands that jumped the anti Bush wagon
my response might have been a little bit of an overkill and snobby, but yeah man, i think a lot of uneducated bands "became" political for publicity, not because they were concerned with the state of the union.0 -
chrisopalooza wrote:first of all, i am anti-war. bush is a horrible leader. i lean left.
green day is dumbing-down the message. sure, they are probably anti-war, but they don't know why, they are just riding on the popuar anti-bush aura in the country.
they are not political by any means. i would put $100 on that billie bob doesn't know 5 senators. $200 says he doesn't know who the current secretary of defense is.
it's easy as hell to stand up on Mtv and say you are against George Bush to a bunch of 12-year old cunts. there's no real message behind green day's music. none.
Seriously stop and listen to yourself, "12-year old cunts" - cause God forbid you were once a twelve year old, how fucking narrow-minded. Is it incoceivable that 12 year old kids are only part of their audience? What makes me laugh more than anything, is that people judged bands like Pearl Jam and their fans just as harshly when they seemingly got big over night. Do you seriously think all the people who bought Ten and Vs were all fans of deep, thought-provoking music?! NO, there were millions of people who bought those records because Pearl Jam happened to be the 'in' thing at the time. Pearl Jam were referred to as the commerical face of grunge, but without knowing a band personally, you have no real way of knowing what their true intentions are. Your views are just as biased by the media outlets that propagate them, as those people who base their political opinions solely on a particular band they listen to.
I think some people have short memories too, back in 2004, emo (cause that term is any more descriptive than 'grunge' was) was not where it is today. My chemical romance, Fall out boy and Panic at the disco were all far from big, so exactly what band wagon were Green Day jumping on? By most people's standards, Green Day were considered a completely spent force. I totally understand why people hate the fact that AI has sold so well, this sort of thing isn't supposed to happen.
The album itself has some amazing songs, only maybe a couple being solely based on the war (American Idiot, Holiday). Jesus of Suburbia, Are we the Waiting, Boulevard of broken dreams etc are based more on the everyday struggles that the 'average Joe' experiences. Themes of loneliness, disaffection, lack of identity, bereavement, and lost hope are just as high up the agenda. The fact this is coming from a guy as rich as Billie Joe Armstrong proves that he hasn't betrayed his roots entirely - it's not like AI was a sure-fire hit.
What you seemingly can't separate is Green Day the all-conquering commercial success, whose album and image were high-jacked by the various corporate institutions that knew they could make money out of their success; and the Green Day that humbley set about writing an album about the things that they cared about deep down. It's easy to see Green Day as being these smug liberal, know-nothing chancers, BUT without the album's success, they would never have drawn such vehement criticism. Ultimately you are judging Green Day the 'commercial package' and not them as a band.0 -
Take a look facepollutionrun_into_the_rain wrote:Yeah, your right. Green day is Pop Punk. they are nothing like The Casualties or rancid. Thanks for correcting me. I do agre with you that the other bands you listed suck. However I do like green day and like you said I am young so who knows, I might grow out of it
This is from a young girl, who admittingly states that listening to Green Day is foolish, but she might grow out of it.
If you want to listen to punk and need a left wing message attached, there's an endless amount of bands who are amazingly talented that would most definately suffice.
Oh and the fact that these songs he wrote are about everyday struggles versus those of a millionares, is because he's trying to get paid. And you got suckered into the swindle.www.myspace.com/olafvonmastadon0 -
sapperskunk wrote:Take a look facepollution
This is from a young girl, who admittingly states that listening to Green Day is foolish, but she might grow out of it.
If you want to listen to punk and need a left wing message attached, there's an endless amount of bands who are amazingly talented that would most definately suffice.
Oh and the fact that these songs he wrote are about everyday struggles versus those of a millionares, is because he's trying to get paid. And you got suckered into the swindle.
Says the person who quite shockingly missed most of my points. Nice one. If all he was doing was trying to get paid, there are far safer ways to do that than risking your entire career on an album named American Idiot.0 -
Wanna hear what "rubbish" is?
Defining one's own intellect by what rock and roll band's CD they put into a CD player. That's what rubbish is.Do you remember Rock & Roll Radio?0 -
fanch75 wrote:Wanna hear what "rubbish" is?
Defining one's own intellect by what rock and roll band's CD they put into a CD player. That's what rubbish is.
oh lets get a list going here, I'll add 'stating the fucking obvious'.0 -
facepollution wrote:Seriously stop and listen to yourself, "12-year old cunts" - cause God forbid you were once a twelve year old, how fucking narrow-minded. Is it incoceivable that 12 year old kids are only part of their audience? What makes me laugh more than anything, is that people judged bands like Pearl Jam and their fans just as harshly when they seemingly got big over night. Do you seriously think all the people who bought Ten and Vs were all fans of deep, thought-provoking music?! NO, there were millions of people who bought those records because Pearl Jam happened to be the 'in' thing at the time. Pearl Jam were referred to as the commerical face of grunge, but without knowing a band personally, you have no real way of knowing what their true intentions are. Your views are just as biased by the media outlets that propagate them, as those people who base their political opinions solely on a particular band they listen to.
I think some people have short memories too, back in 2004, emo (cause that term is any more descriptive than 'grunge' was) was not where it is today. My chemical romance, Fall out boy and Panic at the disco were all far from big, so exactly what band wagon were Green Day jumping on? By most people's standards, Green Day were considered a completely spent force. I totally understand why people hate the fact that AI has sold so well, this sort of thing isn't supposed to happen.
The album itself has some amazing songs, only maybe a couple being solely based on the war (American Idiot, Holiday). Jesus of Suburbia, Are we the Waiting, Boulevard of broken dreams etc are based more on the everyday struggles that the 'average Joe' experiences. Themes of loneliness, disaffection, lack of identity, bereavement, and lost hope are just as high up the agenda. The fact this is coming from a guy as rich as Billie Joe Armstrong proves that he hasn't betrayed his roots entirely - it's not like AI was a sure-fire hit.
What you seemingly can't separate is Green Day the all-conquering commercial success, whose album and image were high-jacked by the various corporate institutions that knew they could make money out of their success; and the Green Day that humbley set about writing an album about the things that they cared about deep down. It's easy to see Green Day as being these smug liberal, know-nothing chancers, BUT without the album's success, they would never have drawn such vehement criticism. Ultimately you are judging Green Day the 'commercial package' and not them as a band.
holy jesus of suburbia.
i don't know why pearl jam was brought into this argument. my argument wasn't i don't have respect for billie bob cause american idiot was a commercial success. my beef was that i don't respect a guy throwing his credibility out the window to sell records.
because i dont really wanna breakdown every little sentence, let's just make sure that you know i am not attacking you or your musical preferences. i am not even attacking green day fans. i am just dissing the band and the path they've chosen to take at this stage in their career. it's chickenshit. with that being said, i think we can both agree we've reached the phase of "difference of opinion."0 -
chrisopalooza wrote:holy jesus of suburbia.
i don't know why pearl jam was brought into this argument. my argument wasn't i don't have respect for billie bob cause american idiot was a commercial success. my beef was that i don't respect a guy throwing his credibility out the window to sell records.
because i dont really wanna breakdown every little sentence, let's just make sure that you know i am not attacking you or your musical preferences. i am not even attacking green day fans. i am just dissing the band and the path they've chosen to take at this stage in their career. it's chickenshit. with that being said, i think we can both agree we've reached the phase of "difference of opinion."
Hell yeah, all I'm pointing out is that your idea of 'credibility' is not set in stone somewhere. The reason I bought PJ into it was because people were quick to jump on the bandwagon bashing them back in the day too.
Anyway I'm done.
oh, and calling 12 year olds cunts is not big or clever!!!0 -
facepollution wrote:oh, and calling 12 year olds cunts is not big or clever!!!
it was a rant, but you'd have to be really brainwashed to think that MTV's core audience is comprised of anyone over the age of 18.0 -
i dont want to do this, but my little cousin is here and insists that i say:
BILLIE ROCKS!!!Van '98, Sea I+II '00, Sea '01, Sea II '02, Van '03, Gorge, Van, Cal, Edm '05, Bos I+II, Phi I+II, DC, SF II+III, Port, Gorge I+II '06, DC, NY I+II '08, Sea I+II, Van, Ridge , LA III+IV' 09, Indy '10, Cal, Van '11, Lond, Van, Sea '13, Memphis '14, RRHOF '17, Sea I+II '18, Van I+II, Vegas I+II, Sea I+II '240 -
I'm "SURE" green day sucks, and i am also "SURE" you cant spell "SURE"run_into_the_rain wrote:I think it's stupid that you guys are bashing green day. they are a super succesful band and I know they arn't just apealing to little disrecpectful punk kids. I'm shure there are alot of people who think pj is bullshit. in fact I'm sure of it. I hear about it all the time. You guys might think Billy Joe is a punk and your right, he is a PUNK ROCKER. Your entitled to your oppinion and your speech but I think you should get the facts straight firstthey call them fingers, but i never see them fing. oh, there they go0 -
chrisopalooza wrote:it was a rant, but you'd have to be really brainwashed to think that MTV's core audience is comprised of anyone over the age of 18.
Still doesn't make them cunts!0 -
facepollution wrote:Still doesn't make them cunts!
fine, it makes them douche bags.0
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