Exactly! Thank you. I really don't see why people are acting so shocked by this sentiment.
Because some people love to argue even if they are not listening to what you are saying/asking.
Your point has been clear to me since the beginning.
This thread took on a complete life of its own. Suddenly you were *apparently* implying that you couldn't love your family if they were conservatives. I don't know how people read into things.
This is why i don't start threads anymore.
I myself agree with you that i find it odd... i have been to three PJ vote for choice concerts and two vote for change concerts. Clearly there are people on this board that are staunchly opposed to these issues. I guess if the shows were in their neighborhoods they wouldn't go.
If a band i "loved" was doing a show for Operation Rescue I wouldn't go. But I can't imagine me loving the music of a band that did concerts for operation rescue. It just seems to me their lyrics and their general attitude would be so far different than mine that i probably would never be in that situation.
I guess the answer is that if they were as great as Pearl Jam... well maybe I'd still DIG them (BUT I wouldn't attend shows where even a dime of my $ went to a cause i was vehemently opposed to.) So there's the answer...
They can and do still love pearl jam despite the differing political views.... because PEARL JAM IS AWESOME.
Because some people love to argue even if they are not listening to what you are saying/asking.
Your point has been clear to me since the beginning.
This thread took on a complete life of its own. Suddenly you were *apparently* implying that you couldn't love your family if they were conservatives. I don't know how people read into things.
This is why i don't start threads anymore.
I myself agree with you that i find it odd... i have been to three PJ vote for choice concerts and two vote for change concerts. Clearly there are people on this board that are staunchly opposed to these issues. I guess if the shows were in their neighborhoods they wouldn't go.
If a band i "loved" was doing a show for Operation Rescue I wouldn't go. But I can't imagine me loving the music of a band that did concerts for operation rescue. It just seems to me their lyrics and their general attitude would be so far different than mine that i probably would never be in that situation.
I guess the answer is that if they were as great as Pearl Jam... well maybe I'd still DIG them (BUT I wouldn't attend shows where even a dime of my $ went to a cause i was vehemently opposed to.) So there's the answer...
They can and do still love pearl jam despite the differing political views.... because PEARL JAM IS AWESOME.
End of arguments. :rolleyes:
It was pretty easy for me as a Conservative to go to the Vote for Change shows. Really, my experience in Toledo and Grand Rapids was the shows were less political than a lot of other shows I attended. I wasn't really worried about $20 going to MoveOn.org. There's more to life than worrying about where a portion of a concert ticket is going to. If your favorite band is playing a 2.5 hour show...go! It isn't like the money you spend on the band isn't going to causes through the band members' charitable and political contributions. If you were worried about where your money went, you wouldn't be able to buy anything, because the money is going to some corporation you probably despise.
I do find it strange that you would so vehemently despise an organization who wanted babies to live. That isn't the worst position in the world a person could take. Very strange!
Where do we get it if we only listen to groups we agree with? Isn't that the problem with the Bush administration? There is no growth. The reason why folks in this thread were angry about the question is that we constantly hear about how open-minded liberals are, but then we constanly get the question about how conservatives can like Pearl Jam if they don't agree with their values. The ONLY answer besides the music being good is that we are open-minded and respectful of Pearl Jam's views. What is the point of Eddie speaking his mind if the entire crowd is the choir?
Edit: I see below that Operation Rescue may have supported violent means to end abortion. I just assumed that it was a normal anti-abortion organization.
Maybe I'm still an idealist, but I really agree with Ed's speech at DC 1 on the solo tour when he said the scariest people who vote are those people who only ever vote for one party and could never ever consider voting for someone not in their party even if that person was the better candidate. And in the rant he was ripping a Democrat he saw interviewed on tv who said she could never vote for a Republican no matter what the situation and he said people like that are not really helping and only helping to divide the country further. (I'm paraphrasing, but he went on to say we're not two different teams in America, but rather one country who are all part of the same team who need to elect the best person even if you aren't a member of their party.)
I bet Ed is really pissed at himself every time Pearl Jam plays Even Flow and Ed sings at the end "Never vote Republican!".
I do find it strange that you would so vehemently despise an organization who wanted babies to live. That isn't the worst position in the world a person could take. Very strange!
Operation Rescue
The anti-choice movement has historically aligned itself with violent extremists. Eric Rudolph is
on the FBI’s Ten Most Wanted list for murdering a police officer in the bombing of a medical
clinic in Alabama. He has been clearly linked to the anti-government militia movement. Paul
Hill is serving a life sentence for the murder of a doctor in Florida. He is believed to be a
member of the shadowy, violent Phineas Priesthood, a white supremacist group that requires its
members to kill doctors, racial minorities, or gays and lesbians for entry into the “priesthood.”
The underground Army of God has a long history of terrorizing women’s health clinics and
praises those who murder doctors. It also distributes a manual containing information on how to
use chemical weapons and explosives.
Operation Rescue – Randall Terry
Randall Terry founded Operation Rescue in 1988, and the group began organizing massive
protests in front of women’s clinics shortly thereafter. The group continued these sidewalk
demonstrations throughout the late 1980s and early 1990s. An example of this is the 1991
“Summer of Mercy” blockades in Kansas. During this seven-week protest, police made 2,600
arrests involving 1,500 protestors.
Terry courted and recruited from the radical fringe of the Religious Right and the antigovernment
movement. He served as the Northeast Regional Co-Chairman for the U.S.
Taxpayers Party in 1994 and spoke at its convention. Now known as the Constitution Party, the
group combines fundamentalist Christianity with themes of the anti-government movement.
In the late 1980s and early 1990s, Larry Pratt helped Operation Rescue skirt a court-ordered
freeze of the group’s asset. Pratt’s Committee to Protect the Family Foundation funneled money
for Operation Rescue through its bank accounts and paid the group’s bills. Pratt was one of the
catalysts for the anti-government movement that emerged in the early 1990s. He made headlines
in 1996 when Pat Buchanan was forced to dismiss him from Buchanan’s presidential campaign.
Pratt, who served as the campaign’s co-chairman, became a liability to Buchanan when the press
discovered Pratt’s ties to militia members and white supremacists.
The call to violence has never been far from Operation Rescue. Terry began telling people in
1995 to “take up the sword” and “overthrow the tyrannical regime that oppresses them.” Joe
Foreman, one of the co-founders of Operation Rescue, signed a petition saying, “The use of
lethal force is justified if it is carried out for the purpose of protecting the lives of unborn
children.” Another Operation activist said, “It is your God-given right to destroy any man or
woman calling themselves doctors who willingly slaughter innocent children.” Michael Bray
masterminded a series of bombings in 1984. His targets were abortion providers and choice
groups. Following the assassination of Dr. David Gunn in 1993, Bray approvingly said it was a
“rational way of following the Operation Rescue dictum: ‘If you believe abortion is murder,
then act like it.’”
Terry has also served as leadership for the Coalition on Revival. Started in 1982, the group
pushes Christian Reconstruction. Reconstruction believes civil law should be identical to
Biblical law. The group believes that no government can exist separate from God, and
Christians must hold office to push religious doctrine. Terry has called for a theocratic state
founded on the Ten Commandments and a “culture based on Biblical Law.”
Operation Save America – Flip Benham
In 1994, Flip Benham took over as the leader of Operation Rescue, and the group changed its
name to Operation Save America is 1999. The change in name coincided with a broadening of
the group’s agenda. Instead of focusing solely on abortion, it would now oppose gays and the
absence of God in public schools.
Benham has had many tussles with law enforcement in his Operation activism. He was arrested
for obstructing traffic and throwing advertising materials onto the street while protesting the
Walt Disney Company’s tolerance of gays in Florida in 1997.
In 1998, Benham and Operation Rescue were fined $10 million for stalking and harassing an
obstetrician and his wife in Texas. The doctor and his wife were followed and received death
threats. Operation also protested in front of the doctor’s office and wife’s place of employment.
These practices lasted for almost a year. Benham was ordered to pay $170,000 of the judgment.
Also in 1998, Benham received a six-month prison term for a demonstration in front of a high
school in Lynchburg, Virginia. Benham led a group of 150 students from Liberty University,
founded by the Rev. Jerry Falwell, in the protest. The protestors blocked students from entering
and exiting the high school, as they passed out literature and held up placards with pictures of
alleged aborted fetuses.
In 2000, members of Operation Save America disrupted the service at a predominately gay
church in Texas and were convicted in March 2002. Benham tried to stop the minister from
administering communion during the service. He was not one of the activists that had charges
filed against him.
Benham joined with Religious Right icons Jerry Falwell and Pat Robertson is blaming the
terrorist attack of 9/11 on the moral decay of America. Benham focused specifically on abortion.
Benham said: “Because of this open rebellion and blatant disregard for the law of God and for
life, our nation is suffering under the remedial judgments of God himself. Blood is coursing
down the corridors of our schools, home, workplaces, and streets.”
Missionaries to the Preborn - Matthew Trewhella
Trewhella founded Missionaries to the Preborn, his own version of Operation Rescue, in 1990.
Based in Wisconsin, the organization has gained notoriety for its anti-choice methods, which
include picket signs of alleged aborted fetuses. However, there’s a side to Trewhella and
Missionaries to the Preborn that focuses on more than graphic signs and rhetoric. They have
aligned themselves with the militia movement and most violent fringe of anti-choice activists.
In 1993, Trewhella signed a declaration stating that murdering abortion providers was legitimate.
The document said Michael Griffin use of “lethal force” was “justifiable” when he murdered
Florida doctor David Gunn.
Newsweek reported in 1994 that Trewhella was one of a half-dozen anti-choice activists being
investigated as conspirators in the death of Florida doctor John Britton. The article sites an FBI
document it obtained.
In 1994, Trewhella was a featured speaker at the U.S. Taxpayers Party’s Convention. This was
the same convention that Randall Terry of Operation Rescue addressed. He advocated forming
church-based militias, and said, “This Christmas I want you to do the most loving thing, and I
want you to buy each of your children an SKS rifle and 500 rounds of ammunition.” He also
recommended that parents teach their children how to assemble a rifle while blindfolded.
In June 2001, Trewhella and Missionaries demonstrated in six Montana cities as part of its
“Unmasking Planned Parenthood Western States Tour.” The protestors numbered about fifty.
Constitution Party of Montana – Jonathan Martin
In the wake of Missionaries to the Preborn’s Montana tour, Jonathan Martin helped start Pro-Life
Great Falls. The group has consistently held protests at the Planned Parenthood clinic in Great
Falls, complete with the vulgar signs traditionally used by Missionaries. Martin has been listed
as the contact point for Benham’s tour.
Martin is also Chairman of the Constitution Party of Montana. The group combines extreme
Christian fundamentalism with the anti-government “patriot” movement. It endorses
“unorganized militias,” or groups like the Militia of Montana. It also opposes abortion even in
cases of rape in incest. Martin is running for the Montana Legislature from House District 43.
The Constitution Party of Montana is affiliated with the national Constitution Party. The
national party has attracted the likes of Matthew Trewhella and Randall Terry under its former
name, the U.S. Taxpayers Party [see above].
During his campaign for the Montana Legislature in 2000, Martin attacked Montana Right to
Life for endorsing George W. Bush, because Bush had appointed a “pro-abortion, pro-sodomite”
woman to a judgeship in Texas. Montana Right to Life still endorsed him. He also said
gathering signatures to get the Constitution Party of Montana on the ballot was like “ministering
and witnessing” to people.
The Constitution Party of Montana’s first annual convention featured an anti-choice speaker
from Michigan named Cal Zastrow. Zastrow encouraged adults to sponsor youth in the antichoice
movement, because they have less to lose by getting arrested.
I'm sure many so-called Pearl Jam fans would be trying to pull the same ol' shit on Pearl Jam that fans of other artist pull, (make them think you'll quit liking them) but they know Ed and PJ don't give a retarded rats ass what they think. So they zip it and burn up inside.
I do find it strange that you would so vehemently despise an organization who wanted babies to live. That isn't the worst position in the world a person could take. Very strange!
Edit: I see below that Operation Rescue may have supported violent means to end abortion. I just assumed that it was a normal anti-abortion organization.
Operation Rescue has been an radical extremist terrorist organization for TWENTY years!!!
And you just insulted me for being vehemently opposed to their ideologies.
I'm sure many so-called Pearl Jam fans would be trying to pull the same ol' shit on Pearl Jam that fans of other artist pull, (make them think you'll quit liking them) but they know Ed and PJ don't give a retarded rats ass what they think. So they zip it and burn up inside.
So conservatives who like PJ are just "so-called fans"? Thirteen years ago when I was 14 and spent every day at 7:00 pm putting a tape in the stereo to tape a rare song or live song off of Q101's nightly Pearl Jam four song set or taping the MonkeyWrench radio programs, I was just a so-called fan? Or when I picked up the guitar for the first time because of Pearl Jam I was just a so-called fan? When I paid $50 for a bootleg I was just a so-called fan? When my first CD I ever bought was Ten in 1995, and I had every CD single of PJ's before I had five CD's from another band, I was just a so-called PJ fan. 34 shows (in 14 states and two countries with only ONE home state show), 80 posters, and I'm just a so-called fan PJ who is burning up inside? When buying a concert/airline ticket the DAY of a show and leaving at 4:00 PM in Indy to arrive at 7:00 PM in San Diego to see Ed solo and then go right back to the airport after the show to hop back on a plane at 6:00am, I was being just a so-called fan?
We like Pearl Jam's music. We respect Pearl Jam's views and their right to express their views. Hearing Pearl Jam express their views doesn't send me in a mental tailspin where I question everything I believe in. I now understand why FoxNews freaks so many liberals out. They can't handle listening to views that they don't agree with.
Operation Rescue
The anti-choice movement has historically aligned itself with violent extremists. Eric Rudolph is on the FBI’s Ten Most Wanted list for murdering a police officer in the bombing of a medical clinic in Alabama. He has been clearly linked to the anti-government militia movement. Paul Hill is serving a life sentence for the murder of a doctor in Florida. He is believed to be a member of the shadowy, violent Phineas Priesthood, a white supremacist group that requires its members to kill doctors, racial minorities, or gays and lesbians for entry into the “priesthood.” The underground Army of God has a long history of terrorizing women’s health clinics and praises those who murder doctors. It also distributes a manual containing information on how to use chemical weapons and explosives.
Operation Rescue – Randall Terry
Randall Terry founded Operation Rescue in 1988......... The call to violence has never been far from Operation Rescue. Terry began telling people in 1995 to “take up the sword” and “overthrow the tyrannical regime that oppresses them.” Joe Foreman, one of the co-founders of Operation Rescue, signed a petition saying, “The use of lethal force is justified if it is carried out for the purpose of protecting the lives of unborn children.” Another Operation activist said, “It is your God-given right to destroy any man or woman calling themselves doctors who willingly slaughter innocent children.” Michael Bray masterminded a series of bombings in 1984. His targets were abortion providers and choice groups. Following the assassination of Dr. David Gunn in 1993, Bray approvingly said it was a “rational way of following the Operation Rescue dictum: ‘If you believe abortion is murder, then act like it.’”........
Operation Save America – Flip Benham.....
In 1998, Benham and Operation Rescue were fined $10 million for stalking and harassing an obstetrician and his wife in Texas. The doctor and his wife were followed and received death threats......
Missionaries to the Preborn - Matthew Trewhella
Trewhella founded Missionaries to the Preborn, his own version of Operation Rescue, in 1990..... In 1993, Trewhella signed a declaration stating that murdering abortion providers was legitimate. The document said Michael Griffin use of “lethal force” was “justifiable” when he murdered Florida doctor David Gunn. Newsweek reported in 1994 that Trewhella was one of a half-dozen anti-choice activists being investigated as conspirators in the death of Florida doctor John Britton.....
How strange indeed that someone wouldn't support this group!!
According to bootlegger10, if this message was presented with a good guitar riff, you'd be close-minded to dislike it. :rolleyes:
So conservatives who like PJ are just "so-called fans"? Thirteen years ago when I was 14 and spent every day at 7:00 pm putting a tape in the stereo to tape a rare song or live song off of Q101's nightly Pearl Jam four song set or taping the MonkeyWrench radio programs, I was just a so-called fan? Or when I picked up the guitar for the first time because of Pearl Jam I was just a so-called fan? When I paid $50 for a bootleg I was just a so-called fan? When my first CD I ever bought was Ten in 1995, and I had every CD single of PJ's before I had five CD's from another band, I was just a so-called PJ fan. 34 shows (in 14 states and two countries with only ONE home state show), 80 posters, and I'm just a so-called fan PJ who is burning up inside? When buying a concert/airline ticket the DAY of a show and leaving at 4:00 PM in Indy to arrive at 7:00 PM in San Diego to see Ed solo and then go right back to the airport after the show to hop back on a plane at 6:00am, I was being just a so-called fan?
We like Pearl Jam's music. We respect Pearl Jam's views and their right to express their views. Hearing Pearl Jam express their views doesn't send me in a mental tailspin where I question everything I believe in. I now understand why FoxNews freaks so many liberals out. They can't handle listening to views that they don't agree with.
So conservatives who like PJ are just "so-called fans"? Thirteen years ago when I was 14 and spent every day at 7:00 pm putting a tape in the stereo to tape a rare song or live song off of Q101's nightly Pearl Jam four song set or taping the MonkeyWrench radio programs, I was just a so-called fan? Or when I picked up the guitar for the first time because of Pearl Jam I was just a so-called fan? When I paid $50 for a bootleg I was just a so-called fan? When my first CD I ever bought was Ten in 1995, and I had every CD single of PJ's before I had five CD's from another band, I was just a so-called PJ fan. 34 shows (in 14 states and two countries with only ONE home state show), 80 posters, and I'm just a so-called fan PJ who is burning up inside? When buying a concert/airline ticket the DAY of a show and leaving at 4:00 PM in Indy to arrive at 7:00 PM in San Diego to see Ed solo and then go right back to the airport after the show to hop back on a plane at 6:00am, I was being just a so-called fan?
We like Pearl Jam's music. We respect Pearl Jam's views and their right to express their views. Hearing Pearl Jam express their views doesn't send me in a mental tailspin where I question everything I believe in. I now understand why FoxNews freaks so many liberals out. They can't handle listening to views that they don't agree with.
So because I don't want to make The Operation Rescue Band my FAVORITE band... because I don't want to do all the things that you brag about in your first paragraph for a terrorist organization... that means I can't handle listening to views that I don't agree with?
Seriously... you've got to have at least SOME values and standards now, don't you?
I honestly don't get it. Being a liberal, I can't imagine that I could ever be a huge fan of a band that used its music and platform to promote extremly conservative ideas.
I love music for what it says, not just the guitar riff behind it. So if it said a bunch of stuff that I thought was total BS, I wouldn't be able to really love the music, and I wouldn't want to.
Additionally, I don't think being a talented musician makes up for being an offensive asshole. So I wouldn't be able to respect Ed as a person if he were espousing political philosophies or other ideas that I found offensive.
And before someone pulls out the same old tired anti-liberal line frequently used on this board, let me be clear that I love Pearl Jam in large part because of their liberal politics; I do not have liberal politics because I love Pearl Jam.
I think a better question, is how can Pearl Jam like Pearl Jam?
This is a band that has talked a good game about their liberal idealogies, and making huge points about things like Mass Media, Ticketmaster, and even SUV's and shitty beer.
A lot of hypocrisy comes from the '03 tour
Listen to Detroit 1 from '03. Eddie goes on a rant about the following things..
A rant about is the media still "free", followed by a rant about how the media is going to be all one company..
So how did they promote their most recent album?
A VH1 Storytellers. Owned by MTV, a network that exploits the youth of this country and continually promotes unhealthy lifestyles and glorifies people like R. Kelly.
An AOL sessions. As in AOL time WARNER. The same warner that used that "little racist frog."
Miller lite is piss water beer. 2 months later? Drinking a budweiser at Wrigley Field.
Also from the '03 tour- "Dont Drive me, Im an SUV"
2 weeks later? Taking a Giant Gas Guzzling SUV from their hotel to the Ed Sullivan Theater for Letterman. So much for walking or public transportation.
Ticketmaster- all about protecting the fans.
I understand the costs of concerts has gone up across the board. And a lot of PJs prices are well within the average concert costs. My bigger issues stem from the shows at
Casinos- Well known as exploiters of the poor.
Charity Special Shows- Insane prices, sure the cause is good, but aren't they ignoring a large percentage of their fan base just for additional money? Its not like most of these shows are just Evenflow, Alive and Elderly Woman- usually these shows have very special moments.... that most fans cant afford to see.
How about the Ten Club? Recent tours have had inexcusable errors regarding ticketing policy. Announcing shows in small chunks, so you pay top $ for tickets for shows hundreds of miles away, only to have a show announced 2 weeks later- in your hometown.... And you cant resell your tickets.
Limited Edition- really. How nice. Benayora Vinyl- available only to people who happened to be able to be online at a specific moment. Good lookin out PJ.
Pearl Jam is insanely capitalist, regardless of songs like "Green Disease." I still love the music though.
Comments
Yep... Yep.
one reason I love this place is because I see a great deal of diversity and how do we learn when we only sing to the choir???
good day lovely jammers...hi ho hi hi ohhhh off to work...
a derivitive of nature.
nature is god
god is love
love is light
Because some people love to argue even if they are not listening to what you are saying/asking.
Your point has been clear to me since the beginning.
This thread took on a complete life of its own. Suddenly you were *apparently* implying that you couldn't love your family if they were conservatives. I don't know how people read into things.
This is why i don't start threads anymore.
I myself agree with you that i find it odd... i have been to three PJ vote for choice concerts and two vote for change concerts. Clearly there are people on this board that are staunchly opposed to these issues. I guess if the shows were in their neighborhoods they wouldn't go.
If a band i "loved" was doing a show for Operation Rescue I wouldn't go. But I can't imagine me loving the music of a band that did concerts for operation rescue. It just seems to me their lyrics and their general attitude would be so far different than mine that i probably would never be in that situation.
I guess the answer is that if they were as great as Pearl Jam... well maybe I'd still DIG them (BUT I wouldn't attend shows where even a dime of my $ went to a cause i was vehemently opposed to.) So there's the answer...
They can and do still love pearl jam despite the differing political views.... because PEARL JAM IS AWESOME.
End of arguments. :rolleyes:
It was pretty easy for me as a Conservative to go to the Vote for Change shows. Really, my experience in Toledo and Grand Rapids was the shows were less political than a lot of other shows I attended. I wasn't really worried about $20 going to MoveOn.org. There's more to life than worrying about where a portion of a concert ticket is going to. If your favorite band is playing a 2.5 hour show...go! It isn't like the money you spend on the band isn't going to causes through the band members' charitable and political contributions. If you were worried about where your money went, you wouldn't be able to buy anything, because the money is going to some corporation you probably despise.
I do find it strange that you would so vehemently despise an organization who wanted babies to live. That isn't the worst position in the world a person could take. Very strange!
Where do we get it if we only listen to groups we agree with? Isn't that the problem with the Bush administration? There is no growth. The reason why folks in this thread were angry about the question is that we constantly hear about how open-minded liberals are, but then we constanly get the question about how conservatives can like Pearl Jam if they don't agree with their values. The ONLY answer besides the music being good is that we are open-minded and respectful of Pearl Jam's views. What is the point of Eddie speaking his mind if the entire crowd is the choir?
Edit: I see below that Operation Rescue may have supported violent means to end abortion. I just assumed that it was a normal anti-abortion organization.
I bet Ed is really pissed at himself every time Pearl Jam plays Even Flow and Ed sings at the end "Never vote Republican!".
The anti-choice movement has historically aligned itself with violent extremists. Eric Rudolph is
on the FBI’s Ten Most Wanted list for murdering a police officer in the bombing of a medical
clinic in Alabama. He has been clearly linked to the anti-government militia movement. Paul
Hill is serving a life sentence for the murder of a doctor in Florida. He is believed to be a
member of the shadowy, violent Phineas Priesthood, a white supremacist group that requires its
members to kill doctors, racial minorities, or gays and lesbians for entry into the “priesthood.”
The underground Army of God has a long history of terrorizing women’s health clinics and
praises those who murder doctors. It also distributes a manual containing information on how to
use chemical weapons and explosives.
Operation Rescue – Randall Terry
Randall Terry founded Operation Rescue in 1988, and the group began organizing massive
protests in front of women’s clinics shortly thereafter. The group continued these sidewalk
demonstrations throughout the late 1980s and early 1990s. An example of this is the 1991
“Summer of Mercy” blockades in Kansas. During this seven-week protest, police made 2,600
arrests involving 1,500 protestors.
Terry courted and recruited from the radical fringe of the Religious Right and the antigovernment
movement. He served as the Northeast Regional Co-Chairman for the U.S.
Taxpayers Party in 1994 and spoke at its convention. Now known as the Constitution Party, the
group combines fundamentalist Christianity with themes of the anti-government movement.
In the late 1980s and early 1990s, Larry Pratt helped Operation Rescue skirt a court-ordered
freeze of the group’s asset. Pratt’s Committee to Protect the Family Foundation funneled money
for Operation Rescue through its bank accounts and paid the group’s bills. Pratt was one of the
catalysts for the anti-government movement that emerged in the early 1990s. He made headlines
in 1996 when Pat Buchanan was forced to dismiss him from Buchanan’s presidential campaign.
Pratt, who served as the campaign’s co-chairman, became a liability to Buchanan when the press
discovered Pratt’s ties to militia members and white supremacists.
The call to violence has never been far from Operation Rescue. Terry began telling people in
1995 to “take up the sword” and “overthrow the tyrannical regime that oppresses them.” Joe
Foreman, one of the co-founders of Operation Rescue, signed a petition saying, “The use of
lethal force is justified if it is carried out for the purpose of protecting the lives of unborn
children.” Another Operation activist said, “It is your God-given right to destroy any man or
woman calling themselves doctors who willingly slaughter innocent children.” Michael Bray
masterminded a series of bombings in 1984. His targets were abortion providers and choice
groups. Following the assassination of Dr. David Gunn in 1993, Bray approvingly said it was a
“rational way of following the Operation Rescue dictum: ‘If you believe abortion is murder,
then act like it.’”
Terry has also served as leadership for the Coalition on Revival. Started in 1982, the group
pushes Christian Reconstruction. Reconstruction believes civil law should be identical to
Biblical law. The group believes that no government can exist separate from God, and
Christians must hold office to push religious doctrine. Terry has called for a theocratic state
founded on the Ten Commandments and a “culture based on Biblical Law.”
Operation Save America – Flip Benham
In 1994, Flip Benham took over as the leader of Operation Rescue, and the group changed its
name to Operation Save America is 1999. The change in name coincided with a broadening of
the group’s agenda. Instead of focusing solely on abortion, it would now oppose gays and the
absence of God in public schools.
Benham has had many tussles with law enforcement in his Operation activism. He was arrested
for obstructing traffic and throwing advertising materials onto the street while protesting the
Walt Disney Company’s tolerance of gays in Florida in 1997.
In 1998, Benham and Operation Rescue were fined $10 million for stalking and harassing an
obstetrician and his wife in Texas. The doctor and his wife were followed and received death
threats. Operation also protested in front of the doctor’s office and wife’s place of employment.
These practices lasted for almost a year. Benham was ordered to pay $170,000 of the judgment.
Also in 1998, Benham received a six-month prison term for a demonstration in front of a high
school in Lynchburg, Virginia. Benham led a group of 150 students from Liberty University,
founded by the Rev. Jerry Falwell, in the protest. The protestors blocked students from entering
and exiting the high school, as they passed out literature and held up placards with pictures of
alleged aborted fetuses.
In 2000, members of Operation Save America disrupted the service at a predominately gay
church in Texas and were convicted in March 2002. Benham tried to stop the minister from
administering communion during the service. He was not one of the activists that had charges
filed against him.
Benham joined with Religious Right icons Jerry Falwell and Pat Robertson is blaming the
terrorist attack of 9/11 on the moral decay of America. Benham focused specifically on abortion.
Benham said: “Because of this open rebellion and blatant disregard for the law of God and for
life, our nation is suffering under the remedial judgments of God himself. Blood is coursing
down the corridors of our schools, home, workplaces, and streets.”
Missionaries to the Preborn - Matthew Trewhella
Trewhella founded Missionaries to the Preborn, his own version of Operation Rescue, in 1990.
Based in Wisconsin, the organization has gained notoriety for its anti-choice methods, which
include picket signs of alleged aborted fetuses. However, there’s a side to Trewhella and
Missionaries to the Preborn that focuses on more than graphic signs and rhetoric. They have
aligned themselves with the militia movement and most violent fringe of anti-choice activists.
In 1993, Trewhella signed a declaration stating that murdering abortion providers was legitimate.
The document said Michael Griffin use of “lethal force” was “justifiable” when he murdered
Florida doctor David Gunn.
Newsweek reported in 1994 that Trewhella was one of a half-dozen anti-choice activists being
investigated as conspirators in the death of Florida doctor John Britton. The article sites an FBI
document it obtained.
In 1994, Trewhella was a featured speaker at the U.S. Taxpayers Party’s Convention. This was
the same convention that Randall Terry of Operation Rescue addressed. He advocated forming
church-based militias, and said, “This Christmas I want you to do the most loving thing, and I
want you to buy each of your children an SKS rifle and 500 rounds of ammunition.” He also
recommended that parents teach their children how to assemble a rifle while blindfolded.
In June 2001, Trewhella and Missionaries demonstrated in six Montana cities as part of its
“Unmasking Planned Parenthood Western States Tour.” The protestors numbered about fifty.
Constitution Party of Montana – Jonathan Martin
In the wake of Missionaries to the Preborn’s Montana tour, Jonathan Martin helped start Pro-Life
Great Falls. The group has consistently held protests at the Planned Parenthood clinic in Great
Falls, complete with the vulgar signs traditionally used by Missionaries. Martin has been listed
as the contact point for Benham’s tour.
Martin is also Chairman of the Constitution Party of Montana. The group combines extreme
Christian fundamentalism with the anti-government “patriot” movement. It endorses
“unorganized militias,” or groups like the Militia of Montana. It also opposes abortion even in
cases of rape in incest. Martin is running for the Montana Legislature from House District 43.
The Constitution Party of Montana is affiliated with the national Constitution Party. The
national party has attracted the likes of Matthew Trewhella and Randall Terry under its former
name, the U.S. Taxpayers Party [see above].
During his campaign for the Montana Legislature in 2000, Martin attacked Montana Right to
Life for endorsing George W. Bush, because Bush had appointed a “pro-abortion, pro-sodomite”
woman to a judgeship in Texas. Montana Right to Life still endorsed him. He also said
gathering signatures to get the Constitution Party of Montana on the ballot was like “ministering
and witnessing” to people.
The Constitution Party of Montana’s first annual convention featured an anti-choice speaker
from Michigan named Cal Zastrow. Zastrow encouraged adults to sponsor youth in the antichoice
movement, because they have less to lose by getting arrested.
Operation Rescue has been an radical extremist terrorist organization for TWENTY years!!!
And you just insulted me for being vehemently opposed to their ideologies.
GET INFORMED PEOPLE!!!
So conservatives who like PJ are just "so-called fans"? Thirteen years ago when I was 14 and spent every day at 7:00 pm putting a tape in the stereo to tape a rare song or live song off of Q101's nightly Pearl Jam four song set or taping the MonkeyWrench radio programs, I was just a so-called fan? Or when I picked up the guitar for the first time because of Pearl Jam I was just a so-called fan? When I paid $50 for a bootleg I was just a so-called fan? When my first CD I ever bought was Ten in 1995, and I had every CD single of PJ's before I had five CD's from another band, I was just a so-called PJ fan. 34 shows (in 14 states and two countries with only ONE home state show), 80 posters, and I'm just a so-called fan PJ who is burning up inside? When buying a concert/airline ticket the DAY of a show and leaving at 4:00 PM in Indy to arrive at 7:00 PM in San Diego to see Ed solo and then go right back to the airport after the show to hop back on a plane at 6:00am, I was being just a so-called fan?
We like Pearl Jam's music. We respect Pearl Jam's views and their right to express their views. Hearing Pearl Jam express their views doesn't send me in a mental tailspin where I question everything I believe in. I now understand why FoxNews freaks so many liberals out. They can't handle listening to views that they don't agree with.
So you would attend a Pearl Jam show at just a normal anti-abortion organization benefit? Because that was my point.
How strange indeed that someone wouldn't support this group!!
According to bootlegger10, if this message was presented with a good guitar riff, you'd be close-minded to dislike it. :rolleyes:
i knew putting so-called in that post would work.
Pearl Jam wouldn't play at an anti-abortion organization benefit... and this was basically the point of the OP!!!
:rolleyes:
So because I don't want to make The Operation Rescue Band my FAVORITE band... because I don't want to do all the things that you brag about in your first paragraph for a terrorist organization... that means I can't handle listening to views that I don't agree with?
Seriously... you've got to have at least SOME values and standards now, don't you?
truth be told...........................they can't
the question is "How can conservatives not be pearl jam fans?" their awesomeness is bigger than politics.
Interesting... because your point to me earlier was that anyone who dislikes any band because the band's views differ from their own is close-minded.
But now you seem to be backtracking and conceding that there is a point at which it's reasonable to dislike a band for their differing ideology.
I think a better question, is how can Pearl Jam like Pearl Jam?
This is a band that has talked a good game about their liberal idealogies, and making huge points about things like Mass Media, Ticketmaster, and even SUV's and shitty beer.
A lot of hypocrisy comes from the '03 tour
Listen to Detroit 1 from '03. Eddie goes on a rant about the following things..
A rant about is the media still "free", followed by a rant about how the media is going to be all one company..
So how did they promote their most recent album?
A VH1 Storytellers. Owned by MTV, a network that exploits the youth of this country and continually promotes unhealthy lifestyles and glorifies people like R. Kelly.
An AOL sessions. As in AOL time WARNER. The same warner that used that "little racist frog."
Miller lite is piss water beer. 2 months later? Drinking a budweiser at Wrigley Field.
Also from the '03 tour- "Dont Drive me, Im an SUV"
2 weeks later? Taking a Giant Gas Guzzling SUV from their hotel to the Ed Sullivan Theater for Letterman. So much for walking or public transportation.
Ticketmaster- all about protecting the fans.
I understand the costs of concerts has gone up across the board. And a lot of PJs prices are well within the average concert costs. My bigger issues stem from the shows at
Casinos- Well known as exploiters of the poor.
Charity Special Shows- Insane prices, sure the cause is good, but aren't they ignoring a large percentage of their fan base just for additional money? Its not like most of these shows are just Evenflow, Alive and Elderly Woman- usually these shows have very special moments.... that most fans cant afford to see.
How about the Ten Club? Recent tours have had inexcusable errors regarding ticketing policy. Announcing shows in small chunks, so you pay top $ for tickets for shows hundreds of miles away, only to have a show announced 2 weeks later- in your hometown.... And you cant resell your tickets.
Limited Edition- really. How nice. Benayora Vinyl- available only to people who happened to be able to be online at a specific moment. Good lookin out PJ.
Pearl Jam is insanely capitalist, regardless of songs like "Green Disease." I still love the music though.