Obama/Clinton ticket possible - Just ask Bill Clinton

Hollyweird

ledvedderman wrote:

So you don't think Clinton supporters would back Obama? She's telling her supporters he's a strong enough candidate to be one heart beat away from being President as a VP, but not as a candidate?

To assume that Barack Obama couldn't win California or New York is beyond insane. Lets pretend that California had a primary on it's own date and not with 21 other states. Hillary Clinton had a 20+ point lead in the weeks leading up to Super Tuesday. While Obama was visiting many other states and not putting all his eggs in one basket, he STILL managed to narrow her margin of victory significantly.

And all BILL CLINTON said was that it would be a formidable national ticket. Frankly I took it to mean that they might be willing to accept VP themselves. They never said Obama would be the VP.

ledvedderman

Hollyweird wrote:

Well since I live here and around alot of political people I can tell you what the buzz is. I am not saying he would not win, I am saying he is vulnerable in those states. He already fucked himself in Florida with his comments about Castro and the embargo, so mark that state Red already. California has a strong and popular REPUBLICAN governor. A little guy named Schwarzeneger who is all about McCain. New York has Guliani. Dont believe for a second that people in the Big Apple aren't still about national security. So....if Obama has an opportunity to put Clinton on the ticket and decides to fight, dont count on it. That would put Clinton people who are far more centrist than Obama people, potentially over to McCain. Myself included. If everyone kissed and made up, if Obama leads in the delegate count and popular vote going into the convention AND offers up VP to Hillary in exchange for dropping the convention fight I, as a Clinton supporter, would vote for that ticket. Otherwise, probably not. This almost has to happen at this point assuming no one gets to the magic number and I dont think the Clintons would divide the party at the convention if they knew they could not win. Cant say the same about Obama.

Since national security is a big issue in New York still, what is Hillary's national security experience?

Hollyweird

ledvedderman wrote:

Since national security is a big issue in New York still, what is Hillary's national security experience?

You dont need to regurgitate Obama's campaign talking points. I was talking about McCain. That's they guy you are running against in the general election. I dont need to remind you of his credentials do I? Neither Obama or Clinton have National Security experience. Personally I thought Clinton should run with Jim Webb to shore up that issue. But that doesn't look like it will happen. Dual ticket is going to happen absent a dramatic turn of events between now and June. Both candidates have big problems on that issue. But the way things are going its going to be about the Economy anyways in which case edge to the Democrats. Joint ticket makes sense in that area. You have to agree that a united party will be far better than a divided one come November.

KosmicJelli

Hollyweird wrote:

I think you have your politicians confused. Bill Clinton had the most oral support...

We all know "BillyBoy" had plenty of oral support in the Oval office

prism

KDH12 wrote:

my take, is that Hillary needs Obama more than Obama needs hillary. I do not think that Obama would pick her

I also think Hillary talking about a split ticket is B.S. she is trying to tell Obama supports "vote for me I will keep your guy around" only to pick someone else later on.....

that's exactly the first things that crossed my mind when I heard her talking about a split ticket. perhaps because she is always talking out of both sides of her mouth and she will say anything to win.

Hollyweird

KosmicJelli wrote:

We all know "BillyBoy" had plenty of oral support in the Oval office

That was my point. No one got the joke.

Hollyweird

prism wrote:

that's exactly the first things that crossed my mind when I heard her talking about a split ticket. perhaps because she is always talking out of both sides of her mouth and she will say anything to win.

You people are so fucking jaded. She is acknowledging the political reality of the situation. That's what I am talking about with Obama people. The just dont operate in reality. Obama is NOT going to win on delegates. So a deal has to be done and the Clintons know that. Thats experience.

jeffbr

ledvedderman wrote:

To assume that Barack Obama couldn't win California or New York is beyond insane.

It really isn't insane to think that Obama couldn't carry California. The only major state he's carried is his own.

There are lots of pundits who think he'll have trouble. Here's an interesting analysis:
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2008/03/obama_is_weak_in_key_general_e.html

prism

Hollyweird wrote:

You people are so fucking jaded. She is acknowledging the political reality of the situation. That's what I am talking about with Obama people. The just dont operate in reality. Obama is NOT going to win on delegates. So a deal has to be done and the Clintons know that. Thats experience.

but neither is Clinton going to win on delegates, not with Obama ahead by over 100 plegded delegates, the super-delegates are not going to swing things Clinton's way because of what going against the will of the people could mean to their own political careers. so for a convention compromise of a split ticket that would mean Clinton having to take the VP spot...do you honestly think she'd take playing a distant second fiddle to anyone?

MasterFramer

Hollyweird wrote:

No matter who wins the other candidates people would be very very disenfranchised and may not vote at all.

Your agrument is flawed. You havnet been reading the exit polling data as of late. The majority of clinton supporters show strong support for Obama when asked the question would you still vote with Obama as the nominee. When Obama supporters are asked the same question a significant number say they will "stay home" or not support Clinton.

Hollyweird

prism wrote:

but neither is Clinton going to win on delegates, not with Obama ahead by over 100 plegded delegates, the super-delegates are not going to swing things Clinton's way because of what going against the will of the people could mean to their own political careers. so for a convention compromise of a split ticket that would mean Clinton having to take the VP spot...do you honestly think she'd take playing a distant second fiddle to anyone?

In fact why would her husband go out there and put the idea out there if they werent willing to accept that. Say what you want about the Clintons but stupid they are not. They can do the math. If President Clinton says "split ticket" and they probably cant win on delegates either they have to know that they are more likely to be the VP at this time. Of course wild cards could still be re-votes in Michigan and Florida. If Hillary can win Pennsylvania, another big state, and some of the other Applachian states, and get re-votes which result in Primaries in Michigan and Fla she can lead going into the convention. But that is alot of ifs....

MasterFramer

Hollyweird wrote:

And all BILL CLINTON said was that it would be a formidable national ticket. Frankly I took it to mean that they might be willing to accept VP themselves. They never said Obama would be the VP.

This whole thing is flying far above your head if you just think Bill is just "throwing that idea" out there. The Clintons are cold and calculated, Clinton\Obama idea, which Hillary has also brought up is to fuck with Obama supporters and undecided superdelegates.

Hillary is still behind and there is no way for her to catch him. Even if she wins every state, he is still ahead.

He needs to hit her back hard on this issue.

"Why the fuck would you want me on your ticket bitch if you don’t want me answering the goddamn "red phone" at 3am."

"Im not experienced enough remember? What kind of judgment is that Mrs Super Experienced Senator?"

Throw this classic Clinton double speak right back at them...

"...As far as I know he's a Christian" Clinton has gone to Church services and prayed with him!

I am shocked Dems are still fools by these fucks...

Hollyweird

MasterFramer wrote:

Your agrument is flawed. You havnet been reading the exit polling data as of late. The majority of clinton supporters show strong support for Obama when asked the question would you still vote with Obama as the nominee. When Obama supporters are asked the same question a significant number say they will "stay home" or not support Clinton.

Polls? Really? Because they have been so accurate. If Obama is on the ticket and he gets the vote out his people will not stay home no matter what. Clinton people are more likely to swing to McCain then Obama people. Further, Obama has been winning Caucus states. Not primary states. So who cares if the 10000 people who voted for Obama in a Caucus do. If he is on the ticket and the party unites, 6 months from now everyone will be pulling together as opposed to just half of us. It just makes sense. Look, I do not want Obama to be the nominee and I know when push comes to shove if the whole party is united it will be hard for me to pull the lever for McCain which is my inclination. If the party is divided, the Dems will lose. Bill Clinton knows this as does everyone else in the party by now. At least he had the balls to put it out there. Thats what experience is. And Obama would be crazy to say no to the only Democrats in the party who have taken down the Republican Machine in two national elections. They know how to take the hits and keep on going. Obama has a glass jaw.

Hollyweird

MasterFramer wrote:

This whole thing is flying far above your head if you just think Bill is just "throwing that idea" out there. The Clintons are cold and calculated, Clinton\Obama idea, which Hillary has also brought up is to fuck with Obama supporters and undecided superdelegates.

Hillary is still behind and there is no way for her to catch him. Even if she wins every state, he is still ahead.

He needs to hit her back hard on this issue.

"Why the fuck would you want me on your ticket bitch if you don’t want me answering the goddamn "red phone" at 3am."

"Im not experienced enough remember? What kind of judgment is that Mrs Super Experienced Senator?"

Throw this classic Clinton double speak right back at them...

"...As far as I know he's a Christian" Clinton has gone to Church services and prayed with him!

I am shocked Dems are still fools by these fucks...

Cant argue politics with a hater anymore. Just watch and learn.

MasterFramer

Hollyweird wrote:

Polls? Really? Because they have been so accurate. If Obama is on the ticket and he gets the vote out his people will not stay home no matter what. Clinton people are more likely to swing to McCain then Obama people. Further, Obama has been winning Caucus states. Not primary states. So who cares if the 10000 people who voted for Obama in a Caucus do. If he is on the ticket and the party unites, 6 months from now everyone will be pulling together as opposed to just half of us. It just makes sense. Look, I do not want Obama to be the nominee and I know when push comes to shove if the whole party is united it will be hard for me to pull the lever for McCain which is my inclination. If the party is divided, the Dems will lose. Bill Clinton knows this as does everyone else in the party by now. At least he had the balls to put it out there. Thats what experience is. And Obama would be crazy to say no to the only Democrats in the party who have taken down the Republican Machine in two national elections. They know how to take the hits and keep on going. Obama has a glass jaw.

Again your lack of knowledge on this whole process is really showing in your posts. The Polling has been very acurate, NH being the ONLY difference there. Ohio polls AND Texas polls all had Hillary inching ahead before they voted. You really should find out what is going on before talking about a subject.

http://www.pollster. com is a great place to start

Just a question for you, why would you want a president that has cancer on his face? You see that budlge latley? It has gotten bigger.

Hollyweird

MasterFramer wrote:

Again your lack of knowledge on this whole process is really showing in your posts. The Polling has been very acurate, NH being the ONLY difference there. Ohio polls AND Texas polls all had Hillary inching ahead before they voted. You really should find out what is going on before talking about a subject.

http://www.pollster. com is a great place to start

Just a question for you, why would you want a president that has cancer on his face? You see that budlge latley? It has gotten bigger.

Youre making me sleepy

Hollyweird

Since I guess its all about the Polls, today Clinton leads in all polls in Pennsylvania by ten points. The other big remaining primary is North Carolina where Obama is up by single digits. So Clinton wins Pennsylvanis, Obama wins Carolina and who cares what happens in the other small primaries. There is no scenario where either candidate can win on delegates. So, there has to be a deal. Or...re-votes in Florida in Michigan which makes more and more sense. A real vote in two real primaries in states you really need to win to beat McCain makes sense. Let the voters in those states get to know the candidates. Obama could use the opportunity to explain his dumbass statements about Cuba. Then you have no argument that everyone didnt get to vote. All the delegates will be counted and you might get a winner without a convention fight. Makes sense. Whats to fear?

Hollyweird

MasterFramer wrote:

Again your lack of knowledge on this whole process is really showing in your posts. The Polling has been very acurate, NH being the ONLY difference there. Ohio polls AND Texas polls all had Hillary inching ahead before they voted. You really should find out what is going on before talking about a subject.

http://www.pollster. com is a great place to start

Just a question for you, why would you want a president that has cancer on his face? You see that budlge latley? It has gotten bigger.

I think I saw some blow under Snowbama's nose.

ledvedderman

Hollyweird wrote:

I think I saw some blow under Snowbama's nose.

Well, there goes any credibility you might have brought to this forum. Hillary...Iranian...women...swimming.

There's some words to float round in your mind if you want to get down and dirty politically.

anotherclone

Did anyone watch Meet The Press this morning? Tim Russert did a nice job with the Governor of PA on this subject.

He said something like..."how can Hillary say Obama isn't experienced enough to be President, and then claim to want him as her VP. The VP is only one heartbeat away from being President. How does that make sense?"

It was brilliant.