Should Florida and Michigan Re-vote?

Pacomc79

anotherclone wrote:

To me, it seems like a no brainer. Follow the rules you argreed to. If you don't, you will suffer some consequences of your actions. These are things I tell my 7 year old daughter and she understands.

These states should issue some sort of statement that tells their populations that they fucked up and accept the responsiblity for what they did.

If Obama was saying "we don't want to disenfranchise these voters. Lets do a do-over", Clinton would be all over his ass like a fat kid on a twinkie.

To allow a do-over and make the DNC pay for it is insane. It would be setting a dangerous precedent for the future that basically says "don't follow the rules".

THat's the deal. It's Florida and Michigans OWN FREAKING FAULT that they didn't follow the rules. There are consequences... and maybe some government officials should be unseated for causing thier voter disenfranchisment.

This is certainly an issue, but it was so freaking retardedly easily avoidable this should never have happened.


now, option 2. Get rid of the stupid ass conventions in the first place... Open the damn competition up.


The "democrat" process in this republic is a freaking joke and a half.

Ebizzie

If I'm a dem living in MI or FL, I'm livid with my state leaders right now....ESPECIALLY after reading their quotes which not only denied responsibility but tried to blame the DNC for the position they're in.

No, there shouldn't be another vote. If they allow this to happen, the 2012 primary season is going to get UGLY as states vie for earlier primary dates and would have the precedents set by MI and FL to defend their positions.

This is a chance for the dems, and Howard Dean especially, to show they've got some backbone.

gimmesometruth27

Pacomc79 wrote:

THat's the deal. It's Florida and Michigans OWN FREAKING FAULT that they didn't follow the rules. There are consequences... and maybe some government officials should be unseated for causing thier voter disenfranchisment.

This is certainly an issue, but it was so freaking retardedly easily avoidable this should never have happened.

i agree with paco here. those states' officials knew this was going to happen and they went ahead and voted early anyway and disenfranchised their entire populations. these people defied the rules of the DNC and now they are like "our bad, can we vote again for real this time?" i say no way. this is what happens when local committees try to be bigger than the national party. as in most cases insubordination is not always the best idea.

this is not the best example but its the only one i can think of right now. it reminds me of the garden of eden story. god told adam and eve not to eat from that tree or they would be expelled from the garden. what happened? they ate from it and then they were fucked. could anyone imagine them saying "sorry god, we didn't think you were serious. can we go back in the garden if we don't do it again?" and god says "oh alright even though you defied me i will pay you expenses and let you back into paradise."

Ebizzie

gimmesometruth27 wrote:

these people defied the rules of the DNC and now they are like "our bad, can we vote again for real this time?"

Except in the article that's not even what they're saying....they're saying that it's wrong for the DNC to disenfranchise his state's voters. They're deflecting any and all blame...it seems that they TRULY believe that they did nothing to bring this on. Unbelievable.

Thank God the wench is so far behind that FL and MI won't help her.

Hollyweird

macgyver06 wrote:

its doesnt matter florida is going to a republican.

If you nominate Obama. This cat has said time and again he wants to hang out with Castro. Good luck with Fla and the Cuban vote.

Hollyweird

Ebizzie wrote:

If I'm a dem living in MI or FL, I'm livid with my state leaders right now....ESPECIALLY after reading their quotes which not only denied responsibility but tried to blame the DNC for the position they're in.

No, there shouldn't be another vote. If they allow this to happen, the 2012 primary season is going to get UGLY as states vie for earlier primary dates and would have the precedents set by MI and FL to defend their positions.

This is a chance for the dems, and Howard Dean especially, to show they've got some backbone.

Clearly an Obamite opinion. You will get your chance to cast your vote for him. Dems cant be legitimate, rules or no rules, by nominating a candidate in 48 and not 50 states. Rules or not, there is a remedy and you are going to have it. Either way now there will be a problem with the legitimacy of the nomination and it's coming down to Florida...again. I highly doubt your opinion represents the majority in Florida since you are obviously anti-Clinton. So what are you afraid of? 50 states should vote. Period. Deal with it.

blackredyellow

Hollyweird wrote:

Clearly an Obamite opinion. You will get your chance to cast your vote for him. Dems cant be legitimate, rules or no rules, by nominating a candidate in 48 and not 50 states. Rules or not, there is a remedy and you are going to have it. Either way now there will be a problem with the legitimacy of the nomination and it's coming down to Florida...again. I highly doubt your opinion represents the majority in Florida since you are obviously anti-Clinton. So what are you afraid of? 50 states should vote. Period. Deal with it.

Gimme a break with the 48 out of 50 states bullshit... In every other primary season in recent memory, the nominees were both decided well before all 50 states had meaningful votes.

Florida's and Michigan's whole motivation for moving their primaries were to become more relevant... so they break the rules and you want to reward them by doing just that. What happens in 2012 when every state wants to move up in the calender? Does the DNC just let them?

DriftingByTheStorm

Thecure wrote:

why should the people who voted be screwed because their states fucked up.

Their states didn't F* up, their PARTY f*d up.

If they are pissed off, maybe they should get tough with their state PARTY officials.

If they don't like it and they feel disenfranchised by their party, maybe they should stop supporting their party and vote for candidate that will actualy try to make a difference anyhow.

If they really do like their party's candidates, well then it's just tough S for them.

That's what you get when you support a stupid 2 party system.

Sorry.
Deal with it.

chopitdown

sure they can re-vote, just don't count it. They tried to change the rules from what the party wanted. They made their bed, now lay in it.

Skitch Patterson

Well the arguement is that the Michigan legislatures that pushed for this are getting EXACTLY what they wanted. They are showing how awful this primary system is, where again "insignificant" states have such a ridiculously large impact on every where else... Too often viable candidates are gone because of weak showings in Iowa and New Hampshire, while weaker candidates can move on wasting more and more money because they had a good showing in some fucking corn state that they pandered to.

Either way, The Voters and tax payers of michigan did nothing to "break the rules"- the politicians here did, and why shouldnt their votes be heard?



btw everyone, blame this all on Hilary, if she hadnt start to bitch and moan about how Florida and MI should be heard (because she won) it probably would have been a non issue.

MasterFramer

As long as they do Caucuses...

chopitdown

Skitch Patterson wrote:

Either way, The Voters and tax payers of michigan did nothing to "break the rules"- the politicians here did, and why shouldnt their votes be heard?

well if the voters are that upset about the politicians breaking the rules, perhaps they should remember that on election day and remind the politicians by voting them out.

Skitch Patterson

chopitdown wrote:

well if the voters are that upset about the politicians breaking the rules, perhaps they should remember that on election day and remind the politicians by voting them out.

And maybe they will. however, honestly, the choice to take away the voice of michigan voters was made by the DNC, NOT the michigan politicians. THey voted to move up the primary... the DNC decided not to recognize them.

chopitdown

Skitch Patterson wrote:

And maybe they will. however, honestly, the choice to take away the voice of michigan voters was made by the DNC, NOT the michigan politicians. THey voted to move up the primary... the DNC decided not to recognize them.

that's a good point. Did the MI politicians know there could be consequences of the move? If they did and thought the DNC was bluffing....to me that's the same as taking away the choice.

gobrowns19

Hell yeah I'd like to vote and have it be counted. How would anyone living in any other state except MI or FL feel if you got to vote but it didn't mean shit. Worse yet you get to see how important you really are to candidates when they don't visit because it means shit to them and they don't profit. Too bad a few candidates aren't even in it this time if a re-vote was decided. I'm tempted to write him back in.

mca47

They knew the rules before-hand.

Sorry, they broke the rules they don't get recognized.

Im still here

Hollyweird wrote:

Do we really have a national consensus it only 48 states are selecting a Democratic nominee? Re-vote would solve it. States Governors think so..

http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/03/06/florida.michigan/index.html

revote, should've included a poll

blackredyellow

Skitch Patterson wrote:

Either way, The Voters and tax payers of michigan did nothing to "break the rules"- the politicians here did, and why shouldnt their votes be heard?

Not living in either Florida or Michigan, I'm curious, is there actual outrage by the voters about being disenfranchised, and if so, who is the anger target towards?

Listening to state politicians talk, they come off to me as opportunist trying to make it look like they really care about their constituents. There was a point in an interview on CNN last night with Florida Gov. Crist, where I thought that the next thing out of his mouth could be something like, "Won't somebody please think of the children?".

Skitch Patterson

blackredyellow wrote:

Not living in either Florida or Michigan, I'm curious, is there actual outrage by the voters about being disenfranchised, and if so, who is the anger target towards?

Listening to state politicians talk, they come off to me as opportunist trying to make it look like they really care about their constituents. There was a point in an interview on CNN last night with Florida Gov. Crist, where I thought that the next thing out of his mouth could be something like, "Won't somebody please think of the children?".

The economy is so bad here no one really thinks the money should be spent on it, to be honest with you.. in general at least.

HOWEVER. I will point out... No one mentioned doing this until Hilary decided to hint around to count Michigan and Florida, because in Michigan at least, she couldnt be bothered to take her name off the ballot, even though Obama and Edwards did..... And I think Obama will do very well in Michigan, so the more hilary bitches, the more people do want a revote.

We all agree the Primary system is fucked up... so lets hope MI and FL get a revote, which will basically ensure the whole system gets an overhaul in 4 years.

Im still here

re vote