Do you want the USA to win the fight in Iraq? Yes or No.
Uncle Teddy
Posts: 28
Should the American, um, "empire" accept defeat and cut and run from Iraq?
Why does the Democrat(ic?) party (and the American LEFT) have a vested interest in America's defeat and humiliation?
Why does the Democrat(ic?) party (and the American LEFT) have a vested interest in America's defeat and humiliation?
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How long ago were you banned from the board? Doesn't seem long enough.
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Like it or not, the bell curve applies to human beings as well. There are those on the right side of the bell curve, whom for sake of argument we will call the most desirable human beings...people who seem to be slightly ahead of the evolutionary curve. At the top of the bell, you have joe and jane average...people who comprise probably 80% of the world's total population. On the left side of the curve, you have God's mulligans...human beings that did not come out quite right. That's where your terrorists come from.
Look at it another way...if part of a plant gets a disease, do you spare that part of the plant knowing that the disease will spread and ruin what is left of an otherwise good plant, or do you cut the diseased part off so that the rest of the plant can survive?
THAT is what we have to do to anyone who practices terrorism. There's no justice that will resolve the matter faster than terminating the root cause. You have to kill them...I don't care if it's 1000, 10,000, or 250,000...a drop in the bucket in the grand scheme of things.
The vast majority of the world's population are not terrorists. If you have a tumor, and the doctors can cut it out so you will live, you get the tumor cut out. You don't attempt to reason with it, bring it to justice, or sanction it. you don't tell your healthy cells that they have to step up and take control of the tumor. You cut that fucker out, and go through chemo to make sure you've got it all.
That is what you need to do to terrorists. If they want to act in inhuman ways, you must dehumanize them in your mind, and extract them from the bell curve.
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It's in everyones best interest, from Canada to France to Iran- that we leave Iraq a stable country.
winning the "war on terror" will not stabilize Iraq. We're being fed a line of crap by the media. This isn't about terrorism anymore. It's about two sects of the largest religion in Iraq getting ready to throw down.
Not unlike the beef between the catholics and the protestants that went down in Ireland for many years...just more horriffic.
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However, you can easily identify the tumor. It's in a certain location where the doctor can pin point the surgery. If you had 1000 small tumors all over your body, the surgery would get a little more complicated.
I agree with what you are saying and if 250k have to die so 400 million can live free- so be it. Just figuring out how to kill the 250k when they are spread out over an entire continent of a couple billion, where a majority are innocent human beings, proves problematic.
Agreed. It gets even more difficult when the people of Iraq are afraid of their own.
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No- but a stable Iraq will help with the "war on terror" by reducing the amount of places these people can seek refuge.
Regardless if these two groups are at civil war with eachother- it's not in our best interest bc third and fourth groups can now plan and use Iraq as a base bc of the chaos.
I like where you're going with this; but you have to think of it this way. How do you take those cancer cells out? Do you research and come up with a way of safely removing it or do you go in with a butter knife and spread the cancer even more, thus increasing it? The latter is what we have done.
OK- at least you are acknowledging the cancer.
What do you think the best cure is now that it has spread?
I like the idea of engaging Iran and Syria. I saw yesterday Bush again blasted them again for something but I dont see any other way out. Empowering these two countries may not be ideal but it's a better solution than just leaving it in chaos. They will have influence regardless (now or after we leave) and it will be better if we work together now.
Someone created terrorists, but it wasn't God. It is this way of thinking that scares the shit out of the rest of the world because you have no fucking clue how the world works and you elect people who think like this also. Nobody ever asks why these people became terrorists. The Islamic people of the middle east have a different way of life than Americans (believe it or not). Trying to impose the western way of life on people who have lived a certain way for thousands of years is bound to cause some friction. Killing the terrorists isn't the chemo that you need, that is just a placebo to help people who think like you. What you (we) need to do is take ownership for what you have done over there since WW2 and try to find a peaceful way to solve the problems. It's easier said than done.
Harper is from the same mold Bush is. Please enlighten your ignorant neighbors, how does the world work Mr. (my shit don't sthink) Thunder Bay???
No- but no one isnt born a murderer or child molester either. Shit happens and you deal with it accordingly.
A majority of Canadians live the exact same way a majority of Americas live.
Yeah, the Middle East was a beacon of freedom, peace, and tranquility before the Americans starting waging their imperialistic wars...
Aside from "Git er Done!" of course.
This is an occupation and an attempt to minimize violence. Unfortunately, the many factions over there do not want to minimize violence or attempt diplomacy.
...are those who've helped us.
Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
You tell me what your goal is. If I knew what the goal was, I could answer that.
I am sure there is a goal that is positive. However, the stated goals are impossible to achieve.
As I see it, we are killing people in pursuit of a dream we know is not reachable.
Your rebuttals couldn't have made less sense.
Harper would be considered a socialist in the states. The left-wingers here in Canada (almost communists in the US) like to draw parallels between Harper and Bush, but there really is none other than Harper wants the US to buy our shit so he bends over a bit for Bush on providing support for Afghanistan.
No one isn't born a child molestor or murderer? I don't even know how to respond to that as it makes no sense.
Canadians and Americans do live similarily. However, Canadians and Americans do not think similarily. There is a big difference.
Your statement about the middle east is 100% correct. It always has been chaos there. So you think that by waging a war for oil, less chaos will be the result? Canadians and Americans do not think similarily.
Don't take this as an "I hate the states" thing either. I love visiting the US. I always have fun and I usually meet great people. Your foreign policy stinks and it always has.
It was in response to your
You are not born a murderer, molester, or terrorist. Shit happens and you turn into one for some reason(poverty, terrible leaders, bad luck, bored?). Nevermind why- you are a danger to society and need to go.
I have been to Canada a couple times since the war started and yes- almost everyone I spoke with was against the war. However, it's a little different when your leaders lie to you (who only 65M out of 400M voted for) after your country just had these guys fly planes into your buildings. Either way it was bad policy I agree- I just took offense to your head shaking, finger pointing, "you Americans have no idea how the world works" comment.
Completely agree. There is no war to win or lose.
The factions do want to minimize violence. They want the occupying forces out!
You really think that? They seem to be targeting and killing many, many, many more Iraqis than U.S. troops.
...are those who've helped us.
Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
Yes I do.. You have been here long enough to know I think that.
How can you conclude that human beings want violence. They are human beings. They are targeting what they perceive as an enemy. They all have very valid reasons to fight. Our presence is war. the country is at war. Iraqis have grouped with people they trust. Some feel their best choice is to side with the US and they are targeted.
If Iraqis side with the US, they take the responsibility for all the deaths the United States is responsible for.
They are people more than capable of taking care of themselves. We turned their country to war - and if we leave the war will linger until issues are resolved. the fact that we continue simply extends the war with no issues being resolved. That is because it is Iraq - not Utah.
sure they want us out. but violence would get much worse if we left today. you seem to think they will put down their arms and start cheering. sunnis and shiites hugging in the streets or some shit
please don't group me in with all Americans.....there are many of us that detest our foreign policy even more than "Canadians". Actually more since these dipshits represent us. Also please note....more and more Americans are able to see through this shit as evidenced through last election. And this latest crap about blaming Maliki..is just insane. WTF
And I love going to Canada....great people...and best place to see a PJ show..for sure..and hang out with like minded people. Course Canadians always look at me funny...till I tell them I didn't vote for Bush boy..then its on.
Peace
No, I think they will rebuild Iraq. War will continue - but Iraqi progress will be made. The war will end. With us there there is death with no progress.
A civil war will be a war that moves forward. Right now they are spinning backwards.
Top military commanders have said that a full blown civil war usually takes 10% of a population.
Appx 2.6 million deaths by leaving and letting them duke it out...
this makes no sense. they will rebuild Iraq? war will continue.....iraqi progress. war will end. huh?
a civil war will be a war that moves forward. huh?
right now sunnis kill shittes. shiites kill sunnis. seems they are spinning round and round not backwards. how do they spin forward? one one group starts killing more then the other?
the nature of the bell curve, however, is it is always that way and no matter how fast you cut them out, others will step in to fill out the curve. you're mixing your analogies.
did you ever hear about any problems over there until world war 2? nope. cos they didnt give a fuck about us and we didnt give a fuck about them. until we started meddling in their affairs to 1) set up israel, 2) secure oil supplies, and 3) combat that evil red menace. we CREATED terrorists in order to make them fight russia for us. now they've turned on us. the question is, given how our tactics in combatting communism backfired on us... even if we "win" the war on terror, how many people will we piss off en route that will come back to bite us in 40 years?
better them than us.