Do you have any idea how large the increase would be? It says that he would offset the tax with a rebate, I assume that if he eliminates the IRS and still has money to issue a rebate, the sales tax increase would have to be substantial.
So people who need to buy food and clothes, and gas/tranportation to and from work, now have to wait to get a REBATE check in the mail in order to afford necessities?
I don't know that much about it except: A) It would hit poor families harder than rich families; and It seems like a pain in the ass, what with having to wait on rebate checks every month and what not.
anyway, not saying I'd be totally against it. But, on the surface, I don't see the draw.
no, thats false, im actually pretty educated on the subject having read the book, and like the current tax code it hits rich people more than the poor, its, to put it in a broad term, a consumption tax, where you would be paying a national sales tax on every NEW item purchased, used items excluded...and whats the complication with rebate checks? seems simple enough to me, you get a monthly check to pay for your essential needs...and the only candidate that matters thats supporting it right now is mike huckabee, and its not a republican idea, its a libertarian idea...
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...i know all the rules but the rules do not know me, guaranteed...
So you support tax breaks for the rich and the corporations.....and NOT For the working class poor or lower middle class?
the national sales tax is not a tax break at all..i think your confusing it with this fair tax thing... they are not the same
its a national sales tax
and the description i used the other day is
if you buy a 2000 dollar laptop you will pay a higher proportioned tax on it rather than the person who buys a 700 dollar laptop... its not just a flat 7 percent or 8 percent...
So people who need to buy food and clothes, and gas/tranportation to and from work, now have to wait to get a REBATE check in the mail in order to afford necessities?
....or you yourself can give the poor some money if you feel bad....
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...i know all the rules but the rules do not know me, guaranteed...
So people who need to buy food and clothes, and gas/tranportation to and from work, now have to wait to get a REBATE check in the mail in order to afford necessities?
Yeah. Like I said, sounds like a huge pain in the ass.
Another question: Would a national sales tax eliminate state/local sales taxes? I don't think it would. So now we're paying sales tax on top of sales tax. A $2 gallon of milk becomes $6. Even if it all evens out by the fact that we no longer pay income taxes, good luck selling that to the public.
everybody wants the most they can possibly get
for the least they could possibly do
So people who need to buy food and clothes, and gas/tranportation to and from work, now have to wait to get a REBATE check in the mail in order to afford necessities?
I was legitimately asking if you knew how large the increase would be, I am not defending it. I'm not supporting Gravel, in fact I didn't start researching his policies until macgyver started all these threads.
the national sales tax is not a tax break at all..i think your confusing it with this fair tax thing... they are not the same
its a national sales tax
and the description i used the other day is
if you buy a 2000 dollar laptop you will pay a higher proportioned tax on it rather than the person who buys a 700 dollar laptop... its not just a flat 7 percent or 8 percent...
the more you spend the more you are taxed.
in 5 years we would see the debt going down
Another honest question: wouldn't this just kill consumption, which is pretty much the engine that drives the economy?
everybody wants the most they can possibly get
for the least they could possibly do
if you buy a 2000 dollar laptop you will pay a higher proportioned tax on it rather than the person who buys a 700 dollar laptop... its not just a flat 7 percent or 8 percent...
wouldnt that further destroy the middle class and drive an even bigger wedge between the rich and poor? Only rich people would be able to afford top of the line shit, and the added taxes would cut out many middle income peeps. no companies would make top of the line stuff anymore, and innovation would cease. thats if they could afford to innovate if they wanted to, considering the gov't just severely reduced their income.
I was legitimately asking if you knew how large the increase would be, I am not defending it. I'm not supporting Gravel, in fact I didn't start researching his policies until macgyver started all these threads.
Ok, fair enough.
Yes, Mike Gravel supports a 20-25% National Sales tax.
So people who need to buy food and clothes, and gas/tranportation to and from work, now have to wait to get a REBATE check in the mail in order to afford necessities?
NO.. NOT AT ALL
this is a bonus to the plan...rather than doing tax write offs for education and employment related things..it would be done immediately... for example school supplies... you pay taxes at the time of transaction (school supplies arent going to be taxed at a higher proportion because they are relatively cheap) you will be refunded monthly on these items. keep in mind...this is not where the majority of tax money will be generating from anyway.. it will be Automobiles, Homes, Computers big ticket items.
Yeah. Like I said, sounds like a huge pain in the ass.
Another question: Would a national sales tax eliminate state/local sales taxes? I don't think it would. So now we're paying sales tax on top of sales tax. A $2 gallon of milk becomes $6. Even if it all evens out by the fact that we no longer pay income taxes, good luck selling that to the public.
Thats correct.
And not to mention the fact that it would create a black market of sorts where things would be sold illegally to avoid taxation.
Not to mention it would kill tourism.
Why would someone want to come to America to buy Chinese made goods for 20-25% higher.
the fair tax would be a 23% sales tax on every new item you buy, i know that sounds extremely high, but the actual cost of everything would be the same because there are already embedded taxes in the cost of everything we buy, the fair tax would eliminate the irs, and support business growth, you would get your full pay check each week and spend your money as you see fit, no taxes, no entitlement programs ( social security, medicare ) that you would have to pay into anymore..
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...i know all the rules but the rules do not know me, guaranteed...
this is a bonus to the plan...rather than doing tax write offs for education and employment related things..it would be done immediately... for example school supplies... you pay taxes at the time of transaction (school supplies arent going to be taxed at a higher proportion because they are relatively cheap) you will be refunded monthly on these items. keep in mind...this is not where the majority of tax money will be generating from anyway.. it will be Automobiles, Homes, Computers big ticket items.
Thats not true. It would affect all goods.
Nowhere have I read anything that you are suggesting.
wouldnt that further destroy the middle class and drive an even bigger wedge between the rich and poor? Only rich people would be able to afford top of the line shit, and the added taxes would cut out many middle income peeps.
absolutely not. if someone buys a hummer...they are going to be paying a lot more taxes on it than someone who buys a ford focus... the pool of tax money taken from both these car sales go into the entire tax fund... the guy who buys the hummer has just contributed more to the tax pool and HE SHOULD!
Yeah. Like I said, sounds like a huge pain in the ass.
Another question: Would a national sales tax eliminate state/local sales taxes? I don't think it would. So now we're paying sales tax on top of sales tax. A $2 gallon of milk becomes $6. Even if it all evens out by the fact that we no longer pay income taxes, good luck selling that to the public.
no everything would cost the same..
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...i know all the rules but the rules do not know me, guaranteed...
the fair tax would be a 23% sales tax on every new item you buy, i know that sounds extremely high, but the actual cost of everything would be the same because there are already embedded taxes in the cost of everything we buy, the fair tax would eliminate the irs, and support business growth, you would get your full pay check each week and spend your money as you see fit, no taxes, no entitlement programs ( social security, medicare ) that you would have to pay into anymore..
Again...extremely republican....which is fine if thats your thing. Many people are in favor of that. Im just pointing out Gravels stance on it.
Yeah. Like I said, sounds like a huge pain in the ass.
Another question: Would a national sales tax eliminate state/local sales taxes? I don't think it would. So now we're paying sales tax on top of sales tax. A $2 gallon of milk becomes $6. Even if it all evens out by the fact that we no longer pay income taxes, good luck selling that to the public.
it replaces your income tax...now you would be paying a national sales tax.. it benefits the wise and modest. THE MAJORITY IN THIS COUNTRY
absolutely not. if someone buys a hummer...they are going to be paying a lot more taxes on it than someone who buys a ford focus... the pool of tax money taken from both these car sales go into the entire tax fund... the guy who buys the hummer has just contributed more to the tax pool and HE SHOULD!
Basic food will still cost 23% more.
But the poor, who dont pay income tax, won t get increased paychecks
i think this is hard for people to grasp because some have never been without an income tax. There will be more money in the tax pool with this plan and you will be getting EVERYTHING YOU EARN... its up to you how you spend it... you can buy a mansion and 4 hummers if you want...but you will be paying more immediate taxes than someone who doesnt need these things
i think this is hard for people to grasp because some have never been without an income tax. There will be more money in the tax pool with this plan and you will be getting EVERYTHING YOU EARN... its up to you how you spend it... you can buy a mansion and 4 hummers if you want...but you will be paying more immediate taxes than someone who doesnt need these things
I think this is difficult for you to grasp because you may not be poor. Poor people already live without income tax.....middle-lower class families hardly pay ANY taxes.
if you want more on your paycheck....fix your w-4 form. You can adjust so they dont take anything out now.
see this is the misconception...EVERYTHING IN THIS COUNTRY is extremely overpriced... this sales tax will create a more efficient market in the long run... costs will go down, insurance companies wont have as much influence on the price of drugs and basic health costs.. the value of the dollar would SKYROCKET... you the consumer will be determining how you use your paycheck...if you choose to lay around and eat canned food and do nothing...you arent going to be contributing alot to the country.... thats how you should look at it
I think this is difficult for you to grasp because you may not be poor. Poor people already live without income tax.....middle-lower class families hardly pay ANY taxes.
if you want more on your paycheck....fix your w-4 form. You can adjust so they dont take anything out now.
I cna adjust it so when i get my paycheck if i made 1000 dollars it would say a 1000 dollars?
Regardless of how you feel about the National sales tax, whether its good or bad....it is a VERY, very Conservative/republican idea.
Perhaps thats why the dems dont want him running? I dont know...He's got some great ideas....this is not one of them.
i gotta disagree.. i think its very fair and simple.
the more you consume, the more you put in to the tax pool...after all i think it is safe to say...the ones consuming the greates are the ones using the place up
On line 5 of your w-4, people typically enter a zero or a one. All you hav eto do is raise your allowances...2, 3, whatever....
You will have less taxes taken out of your paycheck....come to think of it, you can do this with your states income tax form too.
You will not get a huge tax return in April....because they wouldnt own you much, if anything. (and you may owe, if you take out too much)
But at least its in your pocket....earning YOU interest instead of the govt.
Say you pay 5,000 a year from your paycheks....some of that is the govt's and some is yours and gets refunded to you in April when you file your taxes.
Well, they hold on to that and earn interest on the money until they give it back to you....but you dont get the interest....you just get the amount you over paid.....
Comments
So people who need to buy food and clothes, and gas/tranportation to and from work, now have to wait to get a REBATE check in the mail in order to afford necessities?
Nuclear fission
...i know all the rules but the rules do not know me, guaranteed...
the national sales tax is not a tax break at all..i think your confusing it with this fair tax thing... they are not the same
its a national sales tax
and the description i used the other day is
if you buy a 2000 dollar laptop you will pay a higher proportioned tax on it rather than the person who buys a 700 dollar laptop... its not just a flat 7 percent or 8 percent...
the more you spend the more you are taxed.
in 5 years we would see the debt going down
...i know all the rules but the rules do not know me, guaranteed...
Yeah. Like I said, sounds like a huge pain in the ass.
Another question: Would a national sales tax eliminate state/local sales taxes? I don't think it would. So now we're paying sales tax on top of sales tax. A $2 gallon of milk becomes $6. Even if it all evens out by the fact that we no longer pay income taxes, good luck selling that to the public.
for the least they could possibly do
granted this is from the people over at wikipedia....but it give you a bit of info.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FairTax
Nuclear fission
I was legitimately asking if you knew how large the increase would be, I am not defending it. I'm not supporting Gravel, in fact I didn't start researching his policies until macgyver started all these threads.
Another honest question: wouldn't this just kill consumption, which is pretty much the engine that drives the economy?
for the least they could possibly do
wouldnt that further destroy the middle class and drive an even bigger wedge between the rich and poor? Only rich people would be able to afford top of the line shit, and the added taxes would cut out many middle income peeps. no companies would make top of the line stuff anymore, and innovation would cease. thats if they could afford to innovate if they wanted to, considering the gov't just severely reduced their income.
Ok, fair enough.
Yes, Mike Gravel supports a 20-25% National Sales tax.
Nuclear fission
NO.. NOT AT ALL
this is a bonus to the plan...rather than doing tax write offs for education and employment related things..it would be done immediately... for example school supplies... you pay taxes at the time of transaction (school supplies arent going to be taxed at a higher proportion because they are relatively cheap) you will be refunded monthly on these items. keep in mind...this is not where the majority of tax money will be generating from anyway.. it will be Automobiles, Homes, Computers big ticket items.
Thats correct.
And not to mention the fact that it would create a black market of sorts where things would be sold illegally to avoid taxation.
Not to mention it would kill tourism.
Why would someone want to come to America to buy Chinese made goods for 20-25% higher.
Nuclear fission
...i know all the rules but the rules do not know me, guaranteed...
Thats not true. It would affect all goods.
Nowhere have I read anything that you are suggesting.
Nuclear fission
absolutely not. if someone buys a hummer...they are going to be paying a lot more taxes on it than someone who buys a ford focus... the pool of tax money taken from both these car sales go into the entire tax fund... the guy who buys the hummer has just contributed more to the tax pool and HE SHOULD!
...i know all the rules but the rules do not know me, guaranteed...
Again...extremely republican....which is fine if thats your thing. Many people are in favor of that. Im just pointing out Gravels stance on it.
Nuclear fission
it replaces your income tax...now you would be paying a national sales tax.. it benefits the wise and modest. THE MAJORITY IN THIS COUNTRY
Basic food will still cost 23% more.
But the poor, who dont pay income tax, won t get increased paychecks
Nuclear fission
I don't see how that is possible.
for the least they could possibly do
who doesnt have money taken out of their paycheck?
I think this is difficult for you to grasp because you may not be poor. Poor people already live without income tax.....middle-lower class families hardly pay ANY taxes.
if you want more on your paycheck....fix your w-4 form. You can adjust so they dont take anything out now.
Nuclear fission
The poor. the lower middle class.
As a matter of fact....I am upper middle class....and EVEN I dont have money taken out of my check.....people just need to do their taxes right.
I dont need the government to tell me how to do them.
Nuclear fission
see this is the misconception...EVERYTHING IN THIS COUNTRY is extremely overpriced... this sales tax will create a more efficient market in the long run... costs will go down, insurance companies wont have as much influence on the price of drugs and basic health costs.. the value of the dollar would SKYROCKET... you the consumer will be determining how you use your paycheck...if you choose to lay around and eat canned food and do nothing...you arent going to be contributing alot to the country.... thats how you should look at it
what are you talking about? do you get a paycheck everyweek or do you own a business
I cna adjust it so when i get my paycheck if i made 1000 dollars it would say a 1000 dollars?
A little biased on both sides....but offers some different ideas....
http://www.gravel2008.us/?q=fair_tax
http://www.fairtaxfraud.com/
Regardless of how you feel about the National sales tax, whether its good or bad....it is a VERY, very Conservative/republican idea.
Perhaps thats why the dems dont want him running? I dont know...He's got some great ideas....this is not one of them.
Nuclear fission
i gotta disagree.. i think its very fair and simple.
the more you consume, the more you put in to the tax pool...after all i think it is safe to say...the ones consuming the greates are the ones using the place up
yes. Well, you would still deduct State income tax, and Soc Sec, etc.
http://www.irs.gov
http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/fw4.pdf?portlet=3
On line 5 of your w-4, people typically enter a zero or a one. All you hav eto do is raise your allowances...2, 3, whatever....
You will have less taxes taken out of your paycheck....come to think of it, you can do this with your states income tax form too.
You will not get a huge tax return in April....because they wouldnt own you much, if anything. (and you may owe, if you take out too much)
But at least its in your pocket....earning YOU interest instead of the govt.
Say you pay 5,000 a year from your paycheks....some of that is the govt's and some is yours and gets refunded to you in April when you file your taxes.
Well, they hold on to that and earn interest on the money until they give it back to you....but you dont get the interest....you just get the amount you over paid.....
So, fix your w-4, get more on your paycheck....
Nuclear fission