When is Obama going to implement his alternate energy plan?

RolandTD20Kdrummer

jhinkle1114 wrote:

That's a rigid rule for pessimistic losers.

Everyone should be cautious and skeptical, but cautious optimism is the way to change.

Your rule would let no one get behind new ideas, but rather just sit on the sidelines and watch them fail without helping themselves and then call it a failure and a bunch of lies when all is said in done.

As Obama said in his speech:



We need a leader like Obama to inspire people and get people to make changes in their own lives for the common good.

And that won't happen with a shitty stance of treating everything as a lie until proven otherwise. People need to be optimistic and accept that it will take hard work and sacrifices from them and everyone else to bring about real change in energy use and dependency.

I'm going to vehemently disagree on not holding politicians to a higher level of scrutiny by not immediately taking what they have to say at face value. I think that's how the US got into the mess it's in in the first place.

A president should not be a rock star, but so many Obama followers are so star struck.

Do some people not get how democracy works? It's expected Obama will do all these things...why be so thoroughly enamored by it?

To me it's just common sense that the existing plan is a total failure to humanity, and change is inevitable. The alternative is global destruction and mass murder....no brainer really.

Solat13

I'm looking at Obama's energy plan.

Here's the first point on his web page:

Enact a Windfall Profits Tax to Provide a $1,000 Emergency Energy Rebate to American Families.

Obama will enact a windfall profits tax on excessive oil company profits to give American families an immediate $1,000 emergency energy rebate to help families pay rising bills. This relief would be a down payment on Obama’s long-term plan to provide middle-class families with at least $1,000 per year in permanent tax relief.

Now the rebate of this year of $600 for individuals and $1,200 for couples cost the government about $160 billion.

The Big Five Oil Companies' profits in 2007 were about $124 billion. So where will the shortfall be made up from? And also, ill these companies continue to run with no profits?

And if Obama does get us off fossil fuel how will the $1,000 a year permanent tax relief be paid for because obviously if we get off oil then oil companies won't profit as much.

jhinkle1114

RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:

I'm going to vehemently disagree on not holding politicians to a higher level of scrutiny by not immediately taking what they have to say at face value. I think that's how the US got into the mess it's in in the first place.

Learn to read.

I said cautiously optimistic and that we should be skeptical. That's not taking what they say at face value.

It's just giving them a chance and being willing to get behind them and help them achieve their goals.

Rather than taking what they say as an outright lie unless they prove otherwise. Nothing will every happen with that kind of pessimistic, bullshit outlook on the world.

A president should not be a rock star, but so many Obama followers are so star struck.

People aren't star struck, not most of them anyway. People are just inspired and happy to see a new message in politics. Particularly democrats who had to suffer through the awful Gore and Kerry campaigns and the resulting 8 years of Bush-Cheney.

I'm skeptical Obama will accomplish even the majority of his goals, but at least he's trying and I agree with the majority of his goals. He's not some god who's going to fix things over night, or even in 4-8 years. But he is a big step in the right direction IMO, and I'm happy to support him and to have made the first political campaign donations of my life.

Do some people not get how democracy works? It's expected Obama will do all these things...why be so thoroughly enamored by it?

To me it's just common sense that the existing plan is a total failure to humanity, and change is inevitable. The alternative is global destruction and mass murder....no brainer really.

We've had 8 years of an administration that's done the exact opposite of what needed to be done, what was common sense, on nearly every issue.

So we do know how democracy works. We've seen first hand what damage can be done if the wrong people get in power, and if younger folks (I'm 30) don't put enough interest and effort into the system.

Change may be inevitable, but the Bush administration did a damn fine job of denying that it was and doing everything they could to make things worse.

McCain will continue this course of inaction and misguided policy, so damn right I'm throwing myself behind Obama who will at least take some steps in the right direction. There's a great deal of question about how much he can achieve, but at least he's trying and there's little doubt that he'll make some progress if elected.

That's a much better option than no progress.

jhinkle1114

Solat13 wrote:

And if Obama does get us off fossil fuel how will the $1,000 a year permanent tax relief be paid for because obviously if we get off oil then oil companies won't profit as much.

There's already a post by me with quotes from his speech last night and mention of other parts of his plans to PAY FOR ALL HIS POLICY GOALS.

Solat13

jhinkle1114 wrote:

There's already a post by me with quotes from his speech last night and mention of other parts of his plans to PAY FOR ALL HIS POLICY GOALS.

I'm going right off his web page platform. Shouldn't he update his platform then?

The website specifically says he's enacting a windfall profits tax to pay for this. I mean it is the first one.

jhinkle1114

Solat13 wrote:

I'm going right off his web page platform. Shouldn't he update his platform then?

The website specifically says he's enacting a windfall profits tax to pay for this. I mean it is the first one.

Fair point.

But of course, the bigger point is whether he can pay for everything overall--i.e. that all his tax cut rollbacks for the wealthy, closing loopholes for corporations, trimming fat out of the federal budget etc. etc. pay for all his new plans.

I wouldn't take his issues page on his web as a line for line budget with an exact explanation of completely how he plans to pay for each policy. That would be far to complicated to list out on a campaign website.

In this case, I'd just take the windfall profits tax as the main source of funds for the tax rebate. Not as the sole method it will be paid for. It's just listed for campaign purposes to say "hey I'm going to stick to the oil companies and give back to the people."

Pats54

jhinkle1114 wrote:

From his speech:



From other things he's said in the past, increasing taxes for the highest brackets, windfall profits taxes on oil companies, giving tax breaks to companies who work on alternative fuel to spur development etc. etc.

He has very well thought out plans, and as he said, has it budgeted very well. People, especially conservatives and the wealthy, may not like them, but he's shown how he'll pay for his plans.

So please, go read his stances before you go spouting off a bunch of rhetoric. The only worthwhile opinion is an informed opinion.




The government has to play a role in making this happen. Encouraging R&D in development of alternative power now ratehr than later so prices can begin falling. Offering financial incentive to people for buying plug in hybrids when they are out to offset the price over regular cars. Same with other fueled cars when those come out.

Again, it won't happen over night, this will be a long, slow battle over the coming decades. But it is the most important issue facing America and the world IMO, and we need to start the ball rolling as soon as possible.

Change will be hard and take a long time, but it will take even longer if we put off the start by electing John McCain.

Let me understand this Obama is a man from Chicago, who puts the ultimate DC insider on his Ticket, as Biden has been there since 1972. McCain has been a Maverick most of his long career and he picks the ultimate DC outsider in Palin who herself has fought special interest and been a Maverick herself. Yes you are right Obama really gives us change we can believe in.
His energy policy states no specifics other than throwing 150Bl at the problem. Where is that money going to come from? You democrats get so caught up in the tax the rich talking points that you fail to see that it makes no logical sense. THERE ARE NOT ENOUGH RICH IN THIS COUNTRY TO PAY FOR WHAT OBAMA WANTS TO DO. WHile he is implementing all of his new programs he is also going to give a tax break to 95% of taxpayers. I guess it is ok because he gives a really good speech and makes people feel good about themselves.