We do not have a general election in the US. Therefore every vote doesn't count. You may claim a 3rd party voter who votes for Nader is somehow spoiling the election, but this is not true. Would you claim a Republican voting in a projected to win Blue state a wasted vote or "spoiler"? Our election is not a popularity contest - ie, let's try and pick the winner. It is about voting for the person who most closely resembles your believes and views. To some, "electability" comes into play, for others it does not. In my opinion, basing your opinions and vote upon the "electability" of a candidate means nothing more than going along with the popular candidate cause it is what others want or veer towards or even the best (i use that term lightly) candidate parties have to offer. No one has a right to tell others who to vote for, not to mention blame others for their candidate or party not winning. Accountability should be that factor - ie, if a candidate doesn't do enough to win votes and voters, it's their own fault - not the people who didn't vote for them.
Where have you been?
If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
Yeah, I hear ya on the frustration. Far too many have been swept into the lull.
CONservative governMENt
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
I can understand what many of you are arguing in support of Nader. It is a good point that discouraging running based on chances of success is a dangerous game to play.
I'm still not convinced that this top to bottom campaigning is the best way to go though.
I was also unaware that Nader is an independent candidate in this election so thanks for pointing that one out.
I will be proudly casting a vote for Obama this November, as I feel he is our best chance at the moment of getting this country back on track.
I can understand what many of you are arguing in support of Nader. It is a good point that discouraging running based on chances of success is a dangerous game to play.
I'm still not convinced that this top to bottom campaigning is the best way to go though.
I was also unaware that Nader is an independent candidate in this election so thanks for pointing that one out.
I will be proudly casting a vote for Obama this November, as I feel he is our best chance at the moment of getting this country back on track.
It's certainly your right to think so and vote however you please. What most of us Nader supporters aren't seeing though is how Obama's policies will be getting this country back on the right track when so much of them mirrors what's wrong with this country instead.
If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
'I want to hurry home to you
put on a slow, dumb show for you
and crack you up
so you can put a blue ribbon on my brain
god I'm very, very frightening
and I'll overdo it'
'I want to hurry home to you
put on a slow, dumb show for you
and crack you up
so you can put a blue ribbon on my brain
god I'm very, very frightening
and I'll overdo it'
Why do you insist on trying to get a 3rd party started at the highest level of office? Nader has absolutely NO chance of ever being elected president. I don't believe any 3rd party candidate does in this day and age.
So you just say "fuck it then"? They give us two people to vote for, I'm gonna pick one of those???????
www.RLMcDaniel.com
1996: Ft Lauderdale
1998: Birmingham
2000: Charlotte, Tampa
2003: Tampa, Atlanta, Phoenix
2004: Kissimmee
2008: West Palm Beach, Bonnaroo, Columbia
2010: MSG2
2012: Music Midtown
2014: Memphis
2016: Ft. Lauderdale, Miami, Jacksonville, JazzFest 2018: Wrigley 1, Fenway 1 2022: Nashville 2023: Ft. Worth II 2024: Baltimore
Why do you insist on trying to get a 3rd party started at the highest level of office? Nader has absolutely NO chance of ever being elected president. I don't believe any 3rd party candidate does in this day and age.
It makes so much more sense to start at local and state levels and work up from there. For one, it is easier to get a smaller number of people to get behind an alternative candidate than convincing a nation 300 million strong. Last gubenatorial election in IL, the Green party candidate made a double-digit showing against the Repubs and Dems. Nader would be lucky to get 2%.
Why not build up from the bottom until there is enough grassroots support for the party to challenge the 2 party system on the main stage?
Not trying to offend any of you out there, but idealism with no basis in reality wont get us any farther than if you don't vote at all.
I just had the pleasure earlier today to spend a few minutes talking one-on-one with Ralph Nader here in Montgomery, Alabama, on a campaign stop. He's a very engaging individual and has a wonderful, consumer oriented platform (which is very important to me). Even though he doesn't have a viable chance to win the presidency, he can at the very least bring to the forefront important issues that Obama and McCain refuse to mention. If Nader is on the ballot in Alabama (getting close with the petition drive), I'll be voting for him.
United Center (Chicago): 8/24/09
Gibson Amphitheatre (Los Angeles): 10/7/09
I just had the pleasure earlier today to spend a few minutes talking one-on-one with Ralph Nader here in Montgomery, Alabama, on a campaign stop. He's a very engaging individual and has a wonderful, consumer oriented platform (which is very important to me). Even though he doesn't have a viable chance to win the presidency, he can at the very least bring to the forefront important issues that Obama and McCain refuse to mention. If Nader is on the ballot in Alabama (getting close with the petition drive), I'll be voting for him.
Radness!
I wish more people would take the opportunity to go hear Ralph Nader speak in person. I feel they would find he does in fact have charisma. I feel like I learn something every time I listen to his speeches.
Good luck on that petition drive.
Walking can be a real trip
***********************
"We've laid the groundwork. It's like planting the seeds. And next year, it's spring." - Nader
***********************
Prepare for tending to your garden, America.
Radness!
I wish more people would take the opportunity to go hear Ralph Nader speak in person. I feel they would find he does in fact have charisma. I feel like I learn something every time I listen to his speeches.
Good luck on that petition drive.
I don't get that either...how people claim Nader isn't charismatic. They obviously know shit about what they are talking about and are just going by some idiotic media produced common misconception.
If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
I support Nader because I agree with his policy principles more than the other candidates, and at the local level I typically support the green or libertarian parties too. I don't think there are many Nader supporters who don't support a 3rd party at the local level too.
It is this sort of pessismism that will be a self-fulfilling prophecy that will inevitably produce more of the same centrist politics and politicians.
and do any of the green candidates you vote for at the local level ever win?
i agree that we need more than two parties, but honestly, the greens just don't seem to be able to capture america's interest, esp not on a national level. maybe it's time for new blood, under a new banner. and without papa nader's frowning, grumpy specter to taint it (read: fuck it up).
"Ladies and gentlemen, the President of the United States, Barack Obama."
"Obama's main opponent in this election on November 4th (was) not John McCain, it (was) ignorance."~Michael Moore
"i'm feeling kinda righteous right now. with my badass motherfuckin' ukulele!"
~ed, 8/7
I don't get that either...how people claim Nader isn't charismatic. They obviously know shit about what they are talking about and are just going by some idiotic media produced common misconception.
Forget what we see with our own eyes, it must be the media causing this. Maybe if I had some rose colored lenses for my shades.....
Such as I have seen him on numerous shows pitching himself and he is not charismatic to me and MANY others on here. To say we believe this because of media misconception is false.
Such as I have seen him on numerous shows pitching himself and he is not charismatic to me and MANY others on here. To say we believe this because of media misconception is false.
Well give me an example of his uncharismatic ways so I know where you are coming from.
If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
Such as I have seen him on numerous shows pitching himself and he is not charismatic to me and MANY others on here. To say we believe this because of media misconception is false.
Maybe some people don't see him as charismatic, because he stays very much on topic and is down to business.
I love his passion for what he believes in, which translates into charisma for me. He uses what little time he gets in the spotlight to drive the message home. I'm sure if he spent any of his time bantering with show hosts, the same people bored by his on target answers would bash him for not having a serious message.
I am impassioned by his drive. I don't know where he gets his energy and ability to keep fighting the good fight in such hostile territory. I am inspired by him and therefore find him very charismatic.
I think those who don't find him charismatic want to be entertained by their leaders. I don't think they want to have to think and face the serious issues in this world. Anyone who asks them to think and take serious action is just 'like a total buzzkill, man'.
Walking can be a real trip
***********************
"We've laid the groundwork. It's like planting the seeds. And next year, it's spring." - Nader
***********************
Prepare for tending to your garden, America.
Comments
Where have you been?
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
Yeah, I hear ya on the frustration. Far too many have been swept into the lull.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
I'm still not convinced that this top to bottom campaigning is the best way to go though.
I was also unaware that Nader is an independent candidate in this election so thanks for pointing that one out.
I will be proudly casting a vote for Obama this November, as I feel he is our best chance at the moment of getting this country back on track.
It's certainly your right to think so and vote however you please. What most of us Nader supporters aren't seeing though is how Obama's policies will be getting this country back on the right track when so much of them mirrors what's wrong with this country instead.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
put on a slow, dumb show for you
and crack you up
so you can put a blue ribbon on my brain
god I'm very, very frightening
and I'll overdo it'
I like cartoons, too!
You should check out the Mr. Fish thread:
http://forums.pearljam.com/showthread.php?t=284901
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
Good, let's sit back and enjoy today's meltdown then.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
Thanks for the link. Some great work..My favs:
http://harpers.org/media/image/art/cartoons/mrfish/IranianChild_490x492.jpg
http://tryworks.org/blog/wp-content/uploads/2007/02/Obama.jpg
http://www.harpers.org/media/image/art/cartoons/mrfish/ClintonObama_600.jpg
http://harpers.org/media/image/art/cartoons/mrfish/Katrina_576x460.jpg
put on a slow, dumb show for you
and crack you up
so you can put a blue ribbon on my brain
god I'm very, very frightening
and I'll overdo it'
So you just say "fuck it then"? They give us two people to vote for, I'm gonna pick one of those???????
1996: Ft Lauderdale
1998: Birmingham
2000: Charlotte, Tampa
2003: Tampa, Atlanta, Phoenix
2004: Kissimmee
2008: West Palm Beach, Bonnaroo, Columbia
2010: MSG2
2012: Music Midtown
2014: Memphis
2018: Wrigley 1, Fenway 1
2022: Nashville
2023: Ft. Worth II
2024: Baltimore
Upcoming: 2025 Hollywood, FL Night 2
I just had the pleasure earlier today to spend a few minutes talking one-on-one with Ralph Nader here in Montgomery, Alabama, on a campaign stop. He's a very engaging individual and has a wonderful, consumer oriented platform (which is very important to me). Even though he doesn't have a viable chance to win the presidency, he can at the very least bring to the forefront important issues that Obama and McCain refuse to mention. If Nader is on the ballot in Alabama (getting close with the petition drive), I'll be voting for him.
Gibson Amphitheatre (Los Angeles): 10/7/09
Radness!
I wish more people would take the opportunity to go hear Ralph Nader speak in person. I feel they would find he does in fact have charisma. I feel like I learn something every time I listen to his speeches.
Good luck on that petition drive.
***********************
"We've laid the groundwork. It's like planting the seeds. And next year, it's spring." - Nader
***********************
Prepare for tending to your garden, America.
I don't get that either...how people claim Nader isn't charismatic. They obviously know shit about what they are talking about and are just going by some idiotic media produced common misconception.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
and do any of the green candidates you vote for at the local level ever win?
i agree that we need more than two parties, but honestly, the greens just don't seem to be able to capture america's interest, esp not on a national level. maybe it's time for new blood, under a new banner. and without papa nader's frowning, grumpy specter to taint it (read: fuck it up).
"Obama's main opponent in this election on November 4th (was) not John McCain, it (was) ignorance."~Michael Moore
"i'm feeling kinda righteous right now. with my badass motherfuckin' ukulele!"
~ed, 8/7
—Dorothy Parker
http://img210.imageshack.us/img210/6902/conspiracytheoriesxt6qt8.jpg
Forget what we see with our own eyes, it must be the media causing this. Maybe if I had some rose colored lenses for my shades.....
Such as?
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
And you're basing this on what exactly?
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
That's practically a pre-requisite for President.
Such as I have seen him on numerous shows pitching himself and he is not charismatic to me and MANY others on here. To say we believe this because of media misconception is false.
yes, he can. Nader taking away votes might not even be a factor this time around.
this answer of course is underestimating the overwhelming stupidity of about half of the united states.
Well give me an example of his uncharismatic ways so I know where you are coming from.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
Who decides who's stupid?
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
Maybe some people don't see him as charismatic, because he stays very much on topic and is down to business.
I love his passion for what he believes in, which translates into charisma for me. He uses what little time he gets in the spotlight to drive the message home. I'm sure if he spent any of his time bantering with show hosts, the same people bored by his on target answers would bash him for not having a serious message.
I am impassioned by his drive. I don't know where he gets his energy and ability to keep fighting the good fight in such hostile territory. I am inspired by him and therefore find him very charismatic.
I think those who don't find him charismatic want to be entertained by their leaders. I don't think they want to have to think and face the serious issues in this world. Anyone who asks them to think and take serious action is just 'like a total buzzkill, man'.
***********************
"We've laid the groundwork. It's like planting the seeds. And next year, it's spring." - Nader
***********************
Prepare for tending to your garden, America.
OK, just let me figure out how to hook up the video download from my brain.
Seriously, can I find Nader not charismatic without having to gather "proof" of this? It is my opinion of the man.
I was just wondering if you had an example of something that helped you to form this opinion. lol
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
well, the definition of stupid varies from person to person of course....
but In my own personal view, If you get kicked in the nuts twice and you ask for another, that's stupid.
Just for the record, I don't consider Nader voters stupid..
just slightly delusional and self rightous.