No Freedom of Religion in France?

fuck

puremagic wrote:

How is a person wearing a burka different from a nun or priest, including buddhist priest wearing robes and collars?

How is a person wearing a burka different from a person who wears a cross or women who have to put a red dot on their forehead.

Isn't religion part of a person's culture? Without more details of what the french didn't like about her values its hard to understand why she was denied citizenship.

The other reason was failure to assimilate. Why is there a chinatown in most major cities, including Paris, doesn't that fall under failure to assimilate?

Thank you.

LikeAnOpeningBandForTheSun

i read an article on some of Japan's blatantly racist regulations, but rather than calling them 'racist', they used the term 'race-based'. So maybe thats the same with France. they aren't 'racist', they are 'race-based'.

nobody

_outlaw wrote:

learn about the other things? it's pretty simple... and like I said before, why should it matter if she's not a politician or an activist...?

well, as I said acceptence and knowledge about the liberal-democratic order has become a pre-requisite in attaining the citizenship of many european countries...germany for example even has (a rather ridiculous) test where wannabe-citizens are asked questions about their attitudes to homosexuality, fundamental democratic rights, or the seperation of state and church...France isn't an exception...
the reason for this is on the one hand the paranoia of the population but on the other also (predominantly islamistic) religious spokespeople and preachers that abuse the freedom in those countries to preach an anti-democratic way of thinking and life, condeming western principles and trying to persuade "their people" not to integrate in the respective country...

m.

nobody

_outlaw wrote:

I'm talking about their government, and it's so painfully obvious that I'm talking about their government and not their people... so there's no stereotypes or anything here going on...

as a matter of fact is was some kind of supreme court in France that didn't grant the citizenship, not the government...and no, I don't believe that's one and the same...

m.

fuck

nobody wrote:

as a matter of fact is was some kind of supreme court in France that didn't grant the citizenship, not the government...and no, I don't believe that's one and the same...

m.

as a matter of fact, this "kind of supreme court" is the Council of State which is headed by the Vice President and is presided by the Prime Minister of France.

Not the same thing as the Supreme Court in the US.

callen

puremagic wrote:

How is a person wearing a burka different from a nun or priest, including buddhist priest wearing robes and collars?

How is a person wearing a burka different from a person who wears a cross or women who have to put a red dot on their forehead.

Isn't religion part of a person's culture? Without more details of what the french didn't like about her values its hard to understand why she was denied citizenship.

The other reason was failure to assimilate. Why is there a chinatown in most major cities, including Paris, doesn't that fall under failure to assimilate?

cause them Muslims are evildoers.


nice post

nobody

MrSmith wrote:

i read an article on some of Japan's blatantly racist regulations, but rather than calling them 'racist', they used the term 'race-based'. So maybe thats the same with France. they aren't 'racist', they are 'race-based'.

like in the UK, every person who is born on French soil automatically attains French citizenship. Doesn't sound so "race-based" to me...

m.

nobody

_outlaw wrote:

as a matter of fact, this "kind of supreme court" is the Council of State which is headed by the Vice President and is presided by the Prime Minister of France.

Not the same thing as the Supreme Court in the US.

it's the vice president of the Council of state, though...not the country's vice president...the prime minister is formally responsible for it...
the fact remains: it is not run by the government!

m.

LikeAnOpeningBandForTheSun

The French like keeping things French.

nobody

MrSmith wrote:

The French like keeping things French.

have you seen their national football team?;)
http://www.ebrs.essen.de/faecher/franzoesisch/frankreich%5B1%5D.jpg

EDIT: I know it's not an accurate indicator...yet it's funny...two people on that picture are actually "French"...the goaly and the 2nd from the upper left...

m.

fanch75

NMyTree wrote:

Why do you people always require a preface with a disclaimer, before every fuckin' sentence?

Because white people love to get offended on behalf of other races. Once they find that much-desired "offensive" statement, they can spring into action telling everyone how not every single Muslim is a terrorist (although that's obvious). Then, they can relax in the knowing that they have made a difference through awareness.

nobody

fanch75 wrote:

Because white people love to get offended on behalf of other races. Once they find that much-desired "offensive" statement, they can spring into action telling everyone how not every single Muslim is a terrorist (although that's obvious). Then, they can relax in the knowing that they have made a difference through awareness.

if you had read my posts you would have realized that I was trying to raise awareness in behalf of the French state rather than the "Muslims"...I tend to go with things that have been previously neglected...
and who tells you I'm white?...does my demeanor suggest it to your expertise?:)

m.

nobody

fanch75 wrote:

they can spring into action telling everyone how not every single Muslim is a terrorist (although that's obvious).

and for some people this fact doesn't seem to be so obvious...otherwise obama wouldn't have to repeatedly state that he is no muslim(=terrorist in many people's mind)...

m.

LikeAnOpeningBandForTheSun

nobody wrote:

have you seen their national football team?;)
http://www.ebrs.essen.de/faecher/franzoesisch/frankreich%5B1%5D.jpg

EDIT: I know it's not an accurate indicator...yet it's funny...two people on that picture are actually "French"...the goaly and the 2nd from the upper left...

m.

isnt one of the two the headbutt guy?

nobody

MrSmith wrote:

isnt one of the two the headbutt guy?

he's the one on the very left, he(or his parents) are from Algeria...his name suggests a non-french background: Zinedine Zidane...

m.

Kann

MakingWaves wrote:

I found this story disturbing and wondered if there is more behind this or if this woman was denied citizenship based solely on her religion.
http://jurist.law.pitt.edu/paperchase/2008/07/france-denies-citizenship-to-muslim.php

It is pretty disturbing yes. Usually in France, if you want the nationality, the council in charge does a background check on several things, including terrorist support (groups, money etc.) but not the way of life.
The current government is currently doing a lot of political borderline shit on cases such as these to appeal to the extreme right fringe of the populations. The current government sucks.

MrSmith wrote:

The French like keeping things French.

Well obviously, what else?

_outlaw wrote:

as a matter of fact, this "kind of supreme court" is the Council of State which is headed by the Vice President and is presided by the Prime Minister of France. Not the same thing as the Supreme Court in the US.

Haha. No.
1 - there is no vice president in france
2 - the council of state is not linked to the government as it can be seized by the opposition to check the constitutionality of a law (so obviously, it can't be presided by leader of the government)

_outlaw wrote:

France has always been a pretty racist country.

Either you're talking about the people, which would be pretty ignorant (self explanatory). Or you're talking about the government, which would pretty ignorant considering the proportion of migrants accepted in the country since the end of the war. You choose which fits you best.

FiveB247x

This story is not shocking. We live in a very different world then what most of us have been led to believe the world should be. The very foundation of our country is that church and state should be separate, yet you can't even imagine such a thing now - both are so entangled.