waterboaring

Towsertunes

Abookamongstthemany wrote:

How do you know he's not saying whatever you might want to hear to have the torture stopped?

Apparently waterboarding is such a devastating psychological
trick that it really makes people feel as if they are drowning.
Human instinct kicks in and voila,they spill the beans.
this is why it is the preferred technique.

Abookamongstthemany

Towsertunes wrote:

Apparently waterboarding is such a devastating psychological
trick that it really makes people feel as if they are drowning.
Human instinct kicks in and voila,they spill the beans.
this is why it is the preferred technique.

but how do you know the 'beans' are authentic and not just to get you to stop making them feel as if they are drowning?

Kann

Abookamongstthemany wrote:

but how do you know the 'beans' are authentic and not just to get you to stop making them feel as if they are drowning?

That, and how do you know this guy knows stuff? Maybe he doesn't know anything, and you just made him feel as he was drowning for nothing.

mammasan

hailhailkc wrote:

Let's try to keep your bedroom antics out of the thread...mmmkay?!

I prefer hamsters.

Towsertunes

Kann wrote:

That, and how do you know this guy knows stuff? Maybe he doesn't know anything, and you just made him feel as he was drowning for nothing.

I would think this form of interrogation will not be used on just anyone.
The person subjected to this form of treatment will be someone of importance.
This technique is rarely used.
But keep on making up excuses not to use it if it makes you feel better.
As long as you realize that it could be a landmark in your city or a family members city that is targeted.

sweet adeline

.......

edit: i thought this was a thread about wakeboarding.

PaperPlates

I don't thinkf or one second that when they "torture" a suspect, it is simply for the goal of getting them to admit to being a terrorist. "Cmon, admit you're a terrorist!" SPLASH! "Admit it!" SPLASH!! Not how it works!!!

I know it sounds very "24"ish, (tho the conspiracy xfile freaks shouldnt argue the possibilties) but if they had to waterboard someone they knew or strongly suspected of having INFORMATION they could use to stop, oh idk, a dirty bomb in NYC, or a train bombing in spain, or a bus in London,to get that info, and they prevented a large loss of life, id pretty much be okay with how they got that info.

But then again Im a heartless warmongering republican.

melodious

Puck78 wrote:

http://unsubscribe-me.org/films/blipesque-sof-480.swf

You are tied to a board, your ankles, wrists, chest and head strapped firmly down. Water pours onto your face, flows up your nose, into your mouth, down your throat and fills your lungs and stomach. You gag, choke and struggle for breath.

This is waterboarding.

The CIA uses waterboarding to try to extract information from detainees in the ‘war on terror’. President George Bush calls it a ‘necessary tool’. In reality it is torture.

Act now - visit http://www.unsubscribe-me.org

oh my, my, my, my...it's the thief at your door....

Collin

PaperPlates wrote:

I don't thinkf or one second that when they "torture" a suspect, it is simply for the goal of getting them to admit to being a terrorist. "Cmon, admit you're a terrorist!" SPLASH! "Admit it!" SPLASH!! Not how it works!!!

I know it sounds very "24"ish, (tho the conspiracy xfile freaks shouldnt argue the possibilties) but if they had to waterboard someone they knew or strongly suspected of having INFORMATION they could use to stop, oh idk, a dirty bomb in NYC, or a train bombing in spain, or a bus in London,to get that info, and they prevented a large loss of life, id pretty much be okay with how they got that info.

But then again Im a heartless warmongering republican.

I just hope you're never mistaken for a terrorist.

Anyway, I'm against it. Even if the terrorist is a real meanie!

Kann

Towsertunes wrote:

But keep on making up excuses not to use it if it makes you feel better.

I think we disagree a little too much on life for me to post a consistent counter argument.

edit :

PaperPlates wrote:

I know it sounds very "24"ish, (tho the conspiracy xfile freaks shouldnt argue the possibilties) but if they had to waterboard someone they knew or strongly suspected of having INFORMATION they could use to stop, oh idk, a dirty bomb in NYC, or a train bombing in spain, or a bus in London,to get that info, and they prevented a large loss of life, id pretty much be okay with how they got that info.

But then again Im a heartless warmongering republican.

What if you discovered after the torture session that your man acutally had none of the necessary information? Wouldn't you feel a little bad, even as a heartless warmongering republican?

melodious

it's a horrible thought, i must agree...but i had a conversation with someone who is consumed with protecting others...

this person said it like this: if doing so, prevented harmful damage to a mass of people and within those people was your daughter, your family and your friends, then it's very easy to sleep at night...(not exact quote but gest is the same)

and even though i hate this thought of being cruel and unkind to others, i have to think about our planet, our mother...if inflicting harm on another human prevents mass demolition and war (it's a cost effective means for soulution) , then this one act is like severing cancer cells from a body that is overidden with that horrible virus...

i never in my life thought i would see things so differently than my compassionate side, but we do treat other diseases, aggresively, with no remorse...

melodious

be thankful for our blessings and be thankful that your job is not assigned to such...but each of us have different roles in this universe....

to look at a bee hive is a great way to compare...there is only one queen and then others who serve....it's natures way...

this person who does this job is serving all of us.for our safety is that person's queen...thank you for letting me see another side, thief...peace to you for you give us peace...

sending heartfelt thoughts...

Collin

melodious wrote:

it's a horrible thought, i must agree...but i had a conversation with someone who is consumed with protecting others...

this person said it like this: if doing so, prevented harmful damage to a mass of people and within those people was your daughter, your family and your friends, then it's very easy to sleep at night...(not exact quote but gest is the same)

and even though i hate this thought of being cruel and unkind to others, i have to think about our planet, our mother...if inflicting harm on another human prevents mass demolition and war (it's a cost effective means for soulution) , then this one act is like severing cancer cells from a body that is overidden with that horrible virus...

i never in my life thought i would see things so differently than my compassionate side, but we do treat other diseases, aggresively, with no remorse...

I wonder how many times it happens that they prevent the death of hundreds, or save the world by torturing one guy.

I also wonder how many times torture leads to useless information, or information that doesn't save the lives of others or helps save the world.

Just slip the fuckers some lsd. They'll realize every being is equally important and that we're all connected, they'll realize their actions will lead to the deaths of people, brothers and sisters, mothers and fathers. Then they'll cry and tell you the answer. Simple as that

Collin

melodious wrote:

be thankful for our blessings and be thankful that your job is not assigned to such...but each of us have different roles in this universe

to look at a bee hive is a great way to compare...there is only one queen and then others who serve....it's natures way...

this person who does this job is serving all of us.for our safety is that person's queen...thank you for letting me see another side, thief...peace to you for you give us peace...

sending heartfelt thoughts...

Yeah, screw that. I'm a human being. I have a conscience. Don't become what you're fighting.

melodious

i love you, back, collin...and perhaps you are right... there are other answers, but never the less this stuff does happen and it's not my calling to judge any other human, only myself

i do remember a quote from the peace offerings i am posting....out of thunder arises peace....

yin/yang...

we don't live in gather/hunter times, we live in 2008 and we as humans have to share compassion when we look in others eyes, even when we don't agree...it's the only way to truly find peace....

i don't condone waterboarding, unless of course it has to do with moving water and enjoyment...i am only learning empathize and even appreciate the tale side of a coin...

melodious

Collin wrote:

Yeah, screw that. I'm a human being. I have a conscience. Don't become what you're fighting.

as do i, i am grateful to establish a postive and fluid relationship in this universe...if we are living according to universal laws, then hopefully we will not endeavor to have to experience either side of the water board....

peace begins with_in...and we can all touch eachother if we wish to...

bob says it well: we can make it work...come together....but we still have those few cancer cells in nature.....


i do like the lsd remedy, very much...;)....

Towsertunes

Kann wrote:

I think we disagree a little too much on life for me to post a consistent counter argumen



Which is a fancy way of saying you don't have one.
Like I said before this is only used in extreme circumstances.
chances are if they are waterboarding a suspect it is because they have very good reason to feel there is significant danger posed to innocent lives.

Wouldn't you feel bad if you let this suspect slip through and he sets off a "dirty bomb" killing/injuring many people?

mammasan

Towsertunes wrote:

Kann wrote:

I think we disagree a little too much on life for me to post a consistent counter argumen



Which is a fancy way of saying you don't have one.
Like I said before this is only used in extreme circumstances.
chances are if they are waterboarding a suspect it is because they have very good reason to feel there is significant danger posed to innocent lives.

Wouldn't you feel bad if you let this suspect slip through and he sets off a "dirty bomb" killing/injuring many people?

The minute we become like our enemy is the minute that they can declare victory. We are not savages but a civilized nation and civilized nations do not torture people. So if creating these "24"-like scenerios helps you sleep better at night with the thought that you are all on board with torturing another human being that that is your right. I personally sleep better at night knowing that I completely disapprove of this barbaric behavior.

melodious

yes..very true...but the act itself is legal, so, make it illegal...

and then we don't have to worry about it...

does your vote get ya what ya really want?
repeal, repeal, repeal...

mammasan

melodious wrote:

yes..very true...but the act itself is legal, so, make it illegal...

and then we don't have to worry about it...

does your vote get ya what ya really want?
repeal, repeal, repeal...

Actually under the rules of the Geneva Convention it is illegal but since our government decided that it is above the law they do as they please.