Colombia-Ecuador-Venezuela crisis

pouch15

I dont know if this has been posted yet, but what do you guys think of the situation, I think its going to get bad, Hugo Chavez has already sent troops to the border. What Colombia did was awful, but why does Hugo Chavez gets his nose in. I think the situation is going to get ugly and the US will help Colombia.

Commy

Seems like everyone is against Colombia in this, including Brazil, which is big. But Colombia has been given billions in US military equipment, probably has the use of military intelligence as well. This could get ugly if Venezuela, Ecuador and Brazil get invloved with Colombia.

RolandTD20Kdrummer

My guess is if someone does some digging they will find the CIA helped with the execution (or in fact did it themselves) in order to strike up military conflict with Venezuela due to Chavez's patriotism of what is known to the US as "communist anti-Americanism"....or by today's standards *cough* "terrorism"

Oh, and they have oil... Conflict of personal beliefs, and natural resources.... a dead ringer for getting reamed out by the MIC.

pouch15

RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:

My guess is if someone does some digging they will find the CIA helped with the execution (or in fact did it themselves) in order to strike up military conflict with Venezuela due to Chavez's patriotism of what is known to the US as "communist anti-Americanism"....or by today's standards *cough* "terrorism"

Oh, and they have oil... Conflict of personal beliefs, and natural resources.... a dead ringer for getting reamed out by the MIC.

I dont know, seems to risky, but with the petroleum...... who knows, I think it will get messy

RolandTD20Kdrummer

pouch15 wrote:

I dont know, seems to risky, but with the petroleum...... who knows, I think it will get messy

It does open up a host of available "opportunities". I bet there's a money trail that leads to an office that still conducts the same CIA habits of old. Any conflict is good conflict when you're the third party that steps in afterwards.

This type of thing is so politically motivated.

catefrances

pouch15 wrote:

I dont know if this has been posted yet, but what do you guys think of the situation, I think its going to get bad, Hugo Chavez has already sent troops to the border. What Colombia did was awful, but why does Hugo Chavez gets his nose in. I think the situation is going to get ugly and the US will help Colombia.

will help? how about already are?

and this is exactly why chavez sent troops to the border.

TheVoiceInside

where is Jack Ryan when you need him

http://youtube.com/watch?v=gM-GZa578rU

flywallyfly

Now this is getting outrageous. Colombia accuses Venezuela of giving the rebels 300 million dollars. Then Venezuela says they have documents proving Colombia's national police chief is involved in the cocaine trade. THEN the trump card -- Colombia says the rebels are smuggling and selling, you guessed it, URANIUM.
I'm guessing bin Laden will be seen hiding in Equador's jungles soon...lol.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080304/ap_on_re_la_am_ca/venezuela_colombia

Hollyweird

pouch15 wrote:

I dont know if this has been posted yet, but what do you guys think of the situation, I think its going to get bad, Hugo Chavez has already sent troops to the border. What Colombia did was awful, but why does Hugo Chavez gets his nose in. I think the situation is going to get ugly and the US will help Colombia.

It's in the news up here. More importantly what do you guys think of him? Chavez is a loud mouth. He isn't going to do shit.

Hollyweird

pouch15 wrote:

I dont know if this has been posted yet, but what do you guys think of the situation, I think its going to get bad, Hugo Chavez has already sent troops to the border. What Colombia did was awful, but why does Hugo Chavez gets his nose in. I think the situation is going to get ugly and the US will help Colombia.

It's in the news up here. More importantly what do you guys think of him? Chavez is a loud mouth. He isn't going to do shit.

Drowned Out

RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:

My guess is if someone does some digging they will find the CIA helped with the execution (or in fact did it themselves) in order to strike up military conflict with Venezuela due to Chavez's patriotism of what is known to the US as "communist anti-Americanism"....or by today's standards *cough* "terrorism"

From the yahoo article posted above:

"When they mention negotiations for 50 kilos of uranium this means that the FARC are taking big steps in the world of terrorism to become a global aggressor. We're not talking of domestic guerrilla but transnational terrorism," Gen. Oscar Naranjo said at an explosive news conference.

Who's writing this guy's script?

uranium :eek: everybody shit your pants, FARC has uranium!!!
My gawd, what if they sell it to Iran or sumptin?

Hollyweird

flywallyfly wrote:

Now this is getting outrageous. Colombia accuses Venezuela of giving the rebels 300 million dollars. Then Venezuela says they have documents proving Colombia's national police chief is involved in the cocaine trade. THEN the trump card -- Colombia says the rebels are smuggling and selling, you guessed it, URANIUM.
I'm guessing bin Laden will be seen hiding in Equador's jungles soon...lol.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080304/ap_on_re_la_am_ca/venezuela_colombia

I hate to say it but I agree with the conspiracy theorists for once. This is serious George W CIA crap. Does anyone honestly think the Columbian military has the intelligence capability on its own to find this FARC guy, drop a pinpoint bomb on his camp AND manage to pull the laptop out intact? I mean c'mon. This is George W's last stand. As for Chavez I wouldn't worry about him any time soon, The Venezuelan economy is totally dependent on its oil trade with the U.S. Venezuela exports a full 60% of it's oil to the United States and the U.S imports 10% of it's oil from Venezuela.

The thing that is more scary is that the Russians are now arming Chavez with state of the art fighters and Chavez is apparently willing to use them. The funny thing is that it wasn't even his country that got bombed. I think we just let Hugo and George W have a a shootout mano y mano and leave the rest of us out of it. The last thing anyone needs is a needless war in South America of all places. Can't we just all hold our fire until Obama gets elected and has his dictators of the world lovefest?

Hollyweird

catefrances wrote:

will help? how about already are?

and this is exactly why chavez sent troops to the border.

Chavez is a loud mouth. He sent his troops to the border because he is a narcissisitc freak who is looking to exploit the demise of Castro. Are you guys willing to sanction any jerk off who mouthes off to the United States? I mean the guy did initially come to power in a military coup.....It's South America. No one is clean down there, least of all Chavez.

catefrances

Hollyweird wrote:

Chavez is a loud mouth. He sent his troops to the border because he is a narcissisitc freak who is looking to exploit the demise of Castro. Are you guys willing to sanction any jerk off who mouthes off to the United States? I mean the guy did initially come to power in a military coup.....It's South America. No one is clean down there, least of all Chavez.

maybe chavez is a loud mouth. he sent his troops to the border cause he knows how shifty the US government can be in exploiting 'border skirmishes' that have absolutely fuck all to do with their own security. the soldiers may be wearing the national uniform of another country but the muscle comes from washington. they have form on this type of thing.

and no i do not sanction just any 'jerk' that mouths off to the US. and i highly doubt the demise of castro has anything to do with chavez's actions.

and how rich of you to point the finger at dirty south america. as an american (if you are) you should be frighteningly aware of your own country's track record. and hello wasn't your country borne of war?

Hollyweird

catefrances wrote:

maybe chavez is a loud mouth. he sent his troops to the border cause he knows how shifty the US government can be in exploiting 'border skirmishes' that have absolutely fuck all to do with their own security. the soldiers may be wearing the national uniform of another country but the muscle comes from washington. they have form on this type of thing.

and no i do not sanction just any 'jerk' that mouths off to the US. and i highly doubt the demise of castro has anything to do with chavez's actions.

and how rich of you to point the finger at dirty south america. as an american (if you are) you should be frighteningly aware of your own country's track record. and hello wasn't your country borne of war?

I am not pointing fingers. Maybe I should be more accurate. South American politics ARE dirty. Very dirty. It's not even debatable. There's hardly a government down there that does not have a history of horrific oppression, dictatorship, murder, nazism, etc, etc, etc. It's all the same shit is my point. Chavez is as dirty as whoever the U.S propped up in Columbia. You just can't annoint one guy right and the other guy wrong because the first guy curses the United States. Don't be so naive. Chavez wears his little red beanie around, carouses with Fidel and Communist rebels. Isn't it fairly obvious he is just trying to manipulate the masses? Don't you think it's funny that this guy runs his mouth at the U.S full time yet sells more than half his countries yearly oil exports to the United States? A real man of the people this guy. Seems to me if this guy thinks were all devils up here in North America he would sell his oil to someone else. Done deal. Put your money where your mouth is. But he doesn't. He the dough as much as the next guy. So it's all bullshit then isn't it. He ain't doing anything. And I doubt he even has spare parts for his tanks....

Hollyweird

catefrances wrote:

maybe chavez is a loud mouth. he sent his troops to the border cause he knows how shifty the US government can be in exploiting 'border skirmishes' that have absolutely fuck all to do with their own security. the soldiers may be wearing the national uniform of another country but the muscle comes from washington. they have form on this type of thing.

and no i do not sanction just any 'jerk' that mouths off to the US. and i highly doubt the demise of castro has anything to do with chavez's actions.

and how rich of you to point the finger at dirty south america. as an american (if you are) you should be frighteningly aware of your own country's track record. and hello wasn't your country borne of war?

I am not pointing fingers. Maybe I should be more accurate. South American politics ARE dirty. Very dirty. It's not even debatable. There's hardly a government down there that does not have a history of horrific oppression, dictatorship, murder, nazism, etc, etc, etc. It's all the same shit is my point. Chavez is as dirty as whoever the U.S propped up in Columbia. You just can't annoint one guy right and the other guy wrong because the first guy curses the United States. Don't be so naive. Chavez wears his little red beanie around, carouses with Fidel and Communist rebels. Isn't it fairly obvious he is just trying to manipulate the masses? Don't you think it's funny that this guy runs his mouth at the U.S full time yet sells more than half his countries yearly oil exports to the United States? A real man of the people this guy. Seems to me if this guy thinks were all devils up here in North America he would sell his oil to someone else. Done deal. Put your money where your mouth is. But he doesn't. He the dough as much as the next guy. So it's all bullshit then isn't it. He ain't doing anything. And I doubt he even has spare parts for his tanks....

catefrances

Hollyweird wrote:

I am not pointing fingers. Maybe I should be more accurate. South American politics ARE dirty. Very dirty. It's not even debatable. There's hardly a government down there that does not have a history of horrific oppression, dictatorship, murder, nazism, etc, etc, etc. It's all the same shit is my point. Chavez is as dirty as whoever the U.S propped up in Columbia. You just can't annoint one guy right and the other guy wrong because the first guy curses the United States. Don't be so naive. Chavez wears his little red beanie around, carouses with Fidel and Communist rebels. Isn't it fairly obvious he is just trying to manipulate the masses? Don't you think it's funny that this guy runs his mouth at the U.S full time yet sells more than half his countries yearly oil exports to the United States? A real man of the people this guy. Seems to me if this guy thinks were all devils up here in North America he would sell his oil to someone else. Done deal. Put your money where your mouth is. But he doesn't. He the dough as much as the next guy. So it's all bullshit then isn't it. He ain't doing anything. And I doubt he even has spare parts for his tanks....

ia m not saying one guy is right and one is not.
ALL politicians manipulate the masses. show me a politician who is NOT a hypocrite? my comments on chavez in this instance are limited to the current situation involving colombia.
and yes you are correct, if chavez actually had the courage of his convictions then maybe he would not trade with the 'evil' US. but then again isnt this the same (counter)argument that is levelled at the US administration when it comes to trading (or not trading as the case may be) with cuba?
btw my beanie is red as well. but dont ever make the mistake of thinking that i am naive. ive been watching this shit for too long now.

Cosmo

"The great rule of conduct for us in regard to foreign nations is, in extending our commercial relations to have with them as little political connection as possible. So far as we have already formed engagements let them be fulfilled with perfect good faith. Here let us stop."

George Washington - Farewell Address, 1796
( ref. http://www.csamerican.com/Doc.asp?doc=washfarewell#pt4 )
...
God. I hope our hands are clean of this mess. My feeling is... they ain't.

Hollyweird

Cosmo wrote:

"The great rule of conduct for us in regard to foreign nations is, in extending our commercial relations to have with them as little political connection as possible. So far as we have already formed engagements let them be fulfilled with perfect good faith. Here let us stop."

George Washington - Farewell Address, 1796
( ref. http://www.csamerican.com/Doc.asp?doc=washfarewell#pt4 )
...
God. I hope our hands are clean of this mess. My feeling is... they ain't.

Too bad we threw that rule out like 100 years ago. We are so totally behind this Columbia deal. We have been propping them up since Bush 1. It will be interesting to see how this pans out. Right now it's just a ridiculous propaganda war between Chavez and the U.S. That laptop shit is just crazy! By all accounts there was nothing but little bits of bodies left after the attack and yet this magic laptop survives with WMD shit on it? Wow! That's all I got to say. The ones that are being forgotten in this whole discussion is...um...Ecuador. Last I heard they were the ones that got bombed and they ain't threatening people with Russian Jets. What up with all that? Crazy. The Columbians may have pulled the trigger but you know this our game plan.

Hollyweird

Cosmo wrote:

"The great rule of conduct for us in regard to foreign nations is, in extending our commercial relations to have with them as little political connection as possible. So far as we have already formed engagements let them be fulfilled with perfect good faith. Here let us stop."

George Washington - Farewell Address, 1796
( ref. http://www.csamerican.com/Doc.asp?doc=washfarewell#pt4 )
...
God. I hope our hands are clean of this mess. My feeling is... they ain't.

Too bad we threw that rule out like 100 years ago. We are so totally behind this Columbia deal. We have been propping them up since Bush 1. It will be interesting to see how this pans out. Right now it's just a ridiculous propaganda war between Chavez and the U.S. That laptop shit is just crazy! By all accounts there was nothing but little bits of bodies left after the attack and yet this magic laptop survives with WMD shit on it? Wow! That's all I got to say. The ones that are being forgotten in this whole discussion is...um...Ecuador. Last I heard they were the ones that got bombed and they ain't threatening people with Russian Jets. What up with all that? Crazy. The Columbians may have pulled the trigger but you know this our game plan.

Cosmo

Hollyweird wrote:

Too bad we threw that rule out like 100 years ago. We are so totally behind this Columbia deal. We have been propping them up since Bush 1. It will be interesting to see how this pans out. Right now it's just a ridiculous propaganda war between Chavez and the U.S. That laptop shit is just crazy! By all accounts there was nothing but little bits of bodies left after the attack and yet this magic laptop survives with WMD shit on it? Wow! That's all I got to say. The ones that are being forgotten in this whole discussion is...um...Ecuador. Last I heard they were the ones that got bombed and they ain't threatening people with Russian Jets. What up with all that? Crazy. The Columbians may have pulled the trigger but you know this our game plan.

...
Another bad decision... we re-wrote the book on pre-emptive attacks. We are now in a tough bargaining position to argue against a Venezuelean pre-emptive attack... when we are guilty of the same thing, right? You're right... we are in probably deeply involved in this mess.
And how is it that nations like Japan are never dragged into messes like this? Is it because they are following the common sense approach of George Washington and steering clear of foriegn political entanglements and just trade with these countries?