Global War(m/n)ing

Obi Once

polaris wrote:

severe drought is another impact of climate change affecting agricultural production ... and freshwater!! ... crikey man - we're polluting all the fresh water ...

rivers are running dry because of dams or glaciers that are shrinking, the new amounts of snow are none or massive creating floods, and yes the polution.. E.g. the Rein is hardly a source for fresh water anymore, since many factories polute it.

polaris

Obi Once wrote:

rivers are running dry because of dams or glaciers that are shrinking, the new amounts of snow are none or massive creating floods, and yes the polution.. E.g. the Rein is hardly a source for fresh water anymore, since many factories polute it.

no kidding!! ... its a clusterfuck out there and this guy is trying to sell us on all these "benefits" ...

surferdude

Obi Once wrote:

Add to this that a rise in temperature will do no good for anybody and can only cost human life, why not at least try to do anything about it?

This is a false statement. How we adapt to climate change will determine if their is a cost in human lives or if any good can be found in the changes.

This is a very grim assessment of man's ability to adapt. And pretty nihillistic if global climate change is primarily driven by non-manmade events.

polaris

surferdude wrote:

This is a false statement. How we adapt to climate change will determine if their is a cost in human lives or if any good can be found in the changes.

This is a very grim assessment of man's ability to adapt. And pretty nihillistic if global climate change is primarily driven by non-manmade events.

lives are already lost ... anyways - it is man-made ... even your conservatives have admitted to that ... no new information has come out in the last few years except for evidence ...

Obi Once

surferdude wrote:

This is a false statement. How we adapt to climate change will determine if their is a cost in human lives or if any good can be found in the changes.

This is a very grim assessment of man's ability to adapt. And pretty nihillistic if global climate change is primarily driven by non-manmade events.

Adapt to long periodes of drought, less fresh water, that includes water for crops, huricanes, floads, loss of bio diversity, more skin related disease, increase of insects and bacteria, no indeed I can almost not see the upside of climate change. And even if we succeed in adaption, what about our food and water? And not admiting that these events, this change is due to mankind is shutting your eyes for the truthiness, dude.
There is no agenda of fear mongering, or an nihilistic idea, just a deep concern that this world is our only home and we shouldn't lose it, and even if all these things don't happen, innovation and switching to non poluting, environment friendly energy resources will last us as long as we will need it.

Pearl Jam and toast

searchlightsoul wrote:

Some people I guess aren't suckers for a Greenpeace scare campaign?

That and the agricultural statement you made are INCREDIBLY ignorant things to say.

First of all, "greenpeace scare campaign" is the kind of phrase fox news uses to assure it's loyal conservative viewers that they shouldn't even consider believing in environmentalist causes,.. "ignore it! hippies! they're all hippies! lies lies lies! It's just a scare campaign! Al Gore's fright fest! Don't look at it". Utter bullshit.


But anyway..

The impoverished nations will indeed suffer, but everyone is basically fucked if that happens.

Considering if the glaciers melt... The agricultural goldmines in north america (and elsewhere) will freeze over, putting a dent in the world's food production that it won't be able to cope with. Essentially everyone starves.

surferdude

Obi Once wrote:

There is no agenda of fear mongering, or an nihilistic idea, just a deep concern that this world is our only home and we shouldn't lose it, and even if all these things don't happen, innovation and switching to non poluting, environment friendly energy resources will last us as long as we will need it.

You honestly do not think that their is an agenda in fear mongering!!! Do you think scientists are somehow not blinded by or not tempted to getting bigger funding (and profit) by over stating negative outcomes? Are scientist impervious to human emotions such as greed?

1970RR

surferdude wrote:

You honestly do not think that their is an agenda in fear mongering!!! Do you think scientists are somehow not blinded by or not tempted to getting bigger funding (and profit) by over stating negative outcomes? Are scientist impervious to human emotions such as greed?

Dont forget ideological reasons. Those who desire more government regulation in the economy would certainly have a reason to stress the worst possible scenarios regarding global warming in order to justify drastic action.

Obi Once

surferdude wrote:

You honestly do not think that their is an agenda in fear mongering!!! Do you think scientists are somehow not blinded by or not tempted to getting bigger funding (and profit) by over stating negative outcomes? Are scientist impervious to human emotions such as greed?

Hopefully they have a hunger for facts and proving what we don't know yet. Sure there are those that might over- or understate theories based on fact, but I was only refering to what I wrote and I have a sceptical view on scientists as a whole since they renew and improve theories all the time, but they are the people providing knowledge and these days peer reviews by other environmental scientists ensure that there is an impact of man on the climate change. Ignoring that is not something I can do.

Fear is not what I would describe what I feel, hope for a future in a beautifull and peacefull world would be better, but eh just watch the news and you'll see we have a long way to go. Cynicism is appropriate, but with hope you can come a long way.

1970RR wrote:

Dont forget ideological reasons. Those who desire more government regulation in the economy would certainly have a reason to stress the worst possible scenarios regarding global warming in order to justify drastic action.

And this applies to every person on every angle, again a vast mayority of the scientists agree on this topic and you try to pin that on idealistic views...?

ThumbingMyWay32

Does anyone want to sign this polar bear post card before I drop it in the bathtub?

polaris

these are the impacts of climate change ... they are costing us now ...

http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-cold16jan16,0,487422.story?coll=la-home-headlines

$1.1-billion orange crop is severely damaged
Freeze will mean 'much higher prices' for many vegetables and fruits.
By Sharon Bernstein, David Pierson and Jerry Hirsch, Times Staff Writers
January 16, 2007


As much as 70% of oranges still on California trees may have been destroyed by record cold temperatures across the state, officials and farmers said Monday.

It will take days to make a full assessment of the losses to the $1.1-billion orange crop. But the state's top agriculture official said Monday that damage to fruit and vegetable crops overall will be greater and more widespread than in the devastating freeze of 1998, which destroyed $700 million worth of produce across California.

[see link for rest of article]

Obi Once

Polaris - Hopefuly these kind of things, combined with other things like Katrina etc will open the eyes of those who still think doing something will only cost money, instead of that it will prevent damage of all sorts and will actually save money.

Just FYI here it has been concluded it was the warmest 1st 2 weeks of januari ever and there now is a storm and authories have urged everyone to stay indoors, the trains have mostly stopped and interstates are closed.

chopitdown

remember when changes in weather were called seasons and cycles. I agree we need to take care of the environment and be responsible with the resources; something we can all improve upon. But it seems that global warming is responsible for everything...if it's too hot, it's b/c of global warming...if it's too cold, yep global warming can cause that too...if there's a lot of rain or hurricaine activity then global warming is the reason; if it's dry or unusually innactive hurricaine season it's clearly b/c of global warming.

polaris

chopitdown wrote:

remember when changes in weather were called seasons and cycles. I agree we need to take care of the environment and be responsible with the resources; something we can all improve upon. But it seems that global warming is responsible for everything...if it's too hot, it's b/c of global warming...if it's too cold, yep global warming can cause that too...if there's a lot of rain or hurricaine activity then global warming is the reason; if it's dry or unusually innactive hurricaine season it's clearly b/c of global warming.

that is why many use the term climate change ... climate change will reflect the more immediate impacts while global warming refers to the long term phonemena ...

temperature is the single biggest variable related to weather patterns - by artificially warming the planet - we are affecting weather patterns ... to compensate - the planet must adjust thus giving us these extreme conditions ...

there is a significant connection ...

polaris

Obi Once wrote:

Polaris - Hopefuly these kind of things, combined with other things like Katrina etc will open the eyes of those who still think doing something will only cost money, instead of that it will prevent damage of all sorts and will actually save money.

Just FYI here it has been concluded it was the warmest 1st 2 weeks of januari ever and there now is a storm and authories have urged everyone to stay indoors, the trains have mostly stopped and interstates are closed.

i've been on this board for i dunno how many years and its the one thing that i've said is most critical issue facing humanity ... i have noticed more and more people who have taken notice ... the recent proposal by the EU at least shows some movement ...

Obi Once

This kinda topic always gets me going. Th EU plan sounds good, also my new goverment has a goal to become the leading country in Europe in regards to clean energy and reducing CO2 exhausts, hopefully it becomes reality and not jus an underfunded plan that sounds nice during the formation persiod. And yes it seems a conscience is growing, I've been here too for years, I actually outdate this board version..

Pearl Jam and toast

polaris wrote:

that is why many use the term climate change ... climate change will reflect the more immediate impacts while global warming refers to the long term phonemena ...

temperature is the single biggest variable related to weather patterns - by artificially warming the planet - we are affecting weather patterns ... to compensate - the planet must adjust thus giving us these extreme conditions ...

there is a significant connection ...

I know that those things will happen but I'm really not sure it's responsible for the weird weather this year. It might be that because of the reason surge in awareness people are more willing to jump to conclusions when some strange weather patterns arise.

But maybe... If the same kind of weather patterns are persistant than we can draw more accurate conclusions on it's connection to climate change.

Really strange though.. It's been the warmest winter I can remember (keep in mind i've only been around for 17 years) in North Carolina and all of the sudden this monstrous cold front comes in and we've got snow on the ground. It was in the 60's last week! And now it's struggling to make 30.

Very strange.. I'm just reluctant to call 'global warming' on it.

stuckinline

Pearl Jam and toast wrote:

Very strange.. I'm just reluctant to call 'global warming' on it.

so, lets just say this is caused by humans DESTROYING the planet.
where there are humans.....there is pollution

Obi Once

Pearl Jam and toast wrote:

I know that those things will happen but I'm really not sure it's responsible for the weird weather this year. It might be that because of the reason surge in awareness people are more willing to jump to conclusions when some strange weather patterns arise.

But maybe... If the same kind of weather patterns are persistant than we can draw more accurate conclusions on it's connection to climate change.

Really strange though.. It's been the warmest winter I can remember (keep in mind i've only been around for 17 years) in North Carolina and all of the sudden this monstrous cold front comes in and we've got snow on the ground. It was in the 60's last week! And now it's struggling to make 30.

Very strange.. I'm just reluctant to call 'global warming' on it.

It's in the words: Climate Change, not just warmer or colder, but more extremes. True it seems that there is more awareness, but that's not really weird if you take into consideration that worldwide things are changing. Imho it's just getting more obvious there IS climate change.

And let's hope that these patterns you speak of will not be persistent.

polaris

Pearl Jam and toast wrote:

I know that those things will happen but I'm really not sure it's responsible for the weird weather this year. It might be that because of the reason surge in awareness people are more willing to jump to conclusions when some strange weather patterns arise.

But maybe... If the same kind of weather patterns are persistant than we can draw more accurate conclusions on it's connection to climate change.

Really strange though.. It's been the warmest winter I can remember (keep in mind i've only been around for 17 years) in North Carolina and all of the sudden this monstrous cold front comes in and we've got snow on the ground. It was in the 60's last week! And now it's struggling to make 30.

Very strange.. I'm just reluctant to call 'global warming' on it.

temperature is the single biggest variable in determining weather patterns ... altering temperatures will affect weather patterns ...