america should not have problems of poverty and homelessness in the 21st century...
Why not? Should we have had those problems in the 20th Century? How about the 19th? The 18th? What's so special about the 21st Century that the problems of poverty and homelessness shouldn't exist?
Any undesirable scenario that implies desirable alternatives.
Are all 'problems' on equal ground?
Of course not. Some problems are more severe than others. Furthermore, all problems are relative to the standards of each who chooses to evaluate them.
Some 'problems' are a bigger deal to me than others.
Me too.
If the 'problem' you are referring to is children in a wealthy country like America living in extreme poverty, then I have to agree with Cosmo.
Do you also agree to speak for "America" in assessing the world's problems?
Of course not. Some problems are more severe than others. Furthermore, all problems are relative to the standards of each who chooses to evaluate them.
Interesting.....I thought you were a more 'absolute' kind of guy. So, from your 'relative' perspective, is poverty in this country something you deem worthy of solving?
Why not? Should we have had those problems in the 20th Century? How about the 19th? The 18th? What's so special about the 21st Century that the problems of poverty and homelessness shouldn't exist?
How about advancement of a civilized society? I'm still not understanding what you are trying to argue. Would you agree that less hardships exist overall in the 21st century than the 18th or 19th?
The greatest obstacle to discovery is not ignorance,
but the illusion of knowledge.
~Daniel Boorstin
Only a life lived for others is worth living.
~Albert Einstein
Why not? Should we have had those problems in the 20th Century? How about the 19th? The 18th? What's so special about the 21st Century that the problems of poverty and homelessness shouldn't exist?
The total requested military budget for 2007 was $699 billion.
U.S. Military Budget[3] - DoD Base Spending: The U.S. Department of Defense (DoD) has the single largest budget of any government agency in the discretionary budget. This department is responsible for four (4) separate branches of the United States Military - the Army, Air Force, Navy and Marine Corps. This includes the cost of base administration, pay for military members, and the costs of repairing and procuring equipment. Last year (FY 2006), Defense Department base budget expenditures were $411 billion, nearly half of net discretionary spending. This year (FY 2007), it has increased to $430 billion, still about half. Next year (FY 2008), it is projected to grow to $481 billion, or 52%. This budget is the basic level needed to keep the DoD in readiness.
U.S. Military Budget - War on Terror Base Spending : The War on Terror (WoT) incurs additional costs by other departments. When added to the DoD base spending, the amount comes to: $474 billion in FY 2006, which is 56% of net discretionary spending, $505 billion in FY 2007, and $554 billion in FY 2008, nearly 60% of discretionary spending.
FY 2006 Supplemental Funding : The Defense Department base budget also does not include “one time only” costs attributable to the War on Terror, which are submitted as Supplemental Funding. In FY 2006, an additional $153 billion in Supplemental Funding was added to the base budget - the War on Terror received $120 billion, while $33 billion went primarily for Hurricane Katrina. As a result, 60% of last year's discretionary spending went to DoD/WoT.
FY 2007 Supplemental Funding : For FY 2007, $70 billion has already been approved, while the President’s FY 2008 Budget requests an additional $102 billion. If approved by Congress, total FY 2007 spending for DoD/WoT would be $673 billion, or 64% of the net discretionary budget. FY 2008 Budget Proposal : For FY 2008, the President has requested the following: The Defense Department Base Budget - $481 billion. WoT(non-DoD) Base Budget - $73 billion. Supplemental Funding for WoT - $145 billion. Total requested Dod/WoT spending is $699 billion, or 65% of total net Discretionary spending.
and dont forget the $243.7 billion for interest on debt... thats right the USA spent $240 billion on INTEREST on our foreign debt
so that is $942 BILLION spent on bombs and interest from debt to pay for the bombs
and that is more than DOUBLE then the follwing combined:
$89.9 billion (+1.3%) - Education and training
$76.9 billion (+8.1%) - Transportation
$72.6 billion (+5.8%) - Veterans' benefits
$43.5 billion (+9.2%) - Administration of justice
$33.1 billion (+5.7%) - Natural resources and environment
$32.5 billion (+15.4%) - Foreign affairs
$27.0 billion (+3.7%) - Agriculture
$26.8 billion (+28.7%) - Community and regional development
$25.0 billion (+4.0%) - Science and technology
$23.5 billion (+0.0%) - Energy
= $450.3 billion...
we are a war machine that is completely neglecting our people, enviroment, and infrastructure... to militarize the globe and dominate it for corporate interests. call me crazy but that is exactly what is going on... while everyone gets out their red white and blue pom poms...
i think we can afford to eliminate poverty and homelessness in our society... if people woke up and stopped letting the military industrial complex steal it from us to feed their quest of global military domination
stay scared of the arab boogey man folks... while they rob us, and our future generations blind
What's weak about it? The logic supporting that money is little different than the logic you'll turn around and use to ask for your money.
because there is no reasonable response
There is no reasonable defense for military spending at those levels, no. But there is no reasonable defense for destroying property and liberty in the hopes of saving them, either.
i think we can afford to eliminate poverty and homelessness in our society... if people woke up and stopped letting the military industrial complex steal it from us to feed their quest of global military domination
ffg doesn't agree with the war expenditures, but he also does not agree with the virtue of the common good either. Correct me if I'm wrong, ffg............Is this your point, perhaps?
The greatest obstacle to discovery is not ignorance,
but the illusion of knowledge.
~Daniel Boorstin
Only a life lived for others is worth living.
~Albert Einstein
Can I use this the next time we get into a taxation debate?
Absolutely. And you'll contradict yourself in the process.
So you are 'in a position' to state your 'shoulds' or shouldnts', but Comso and I are not?
No, I'm not. I would never say that America should or shouldn't have poverty. I would say that America will or won't have poverty depending on the economic path it chooses as a nation and, more aptly, the individual paths chosen by its citizens.
ffg doesn't agree with the war expenditures, but he also does not agree with the virtue of the common good either.
War expenditures are based on the so-called "virtue of the common good". War expenditures are just another version of the assumed shoulds and shouldnts by a few on the many.
Correct me if I'm wrong, ffg............Is this your point, perhaps?
But there is no reasonable defense for destroying property and liberty in the hopes of saving them, either.
Strawman......What you advocate is indifference which masquerades as freedom. One can not be indifferent to the common good and at the same time expect to grow a cohesive country.
The greatest obstacle to discovery is not ignorance,
but the illusion of knowledge.
~Daniel Boorstin
Only a life lived for others is worth living.
~Albert Einstein
No, I'm not. I would never say that America should or shouldn't have poverty. I would say that America will or won't have poverty depending on the economic path it chooses as a nation and, more aptly, the individual paths chosen by its citizens.
Sigh, and it took how many posts to get you to finally make your point? :rolleyes:
I think you are splitting hairs, but do not disagree with this.
The greatest obstacle to discovery is not ignorance,
but the illusion of knowledge.
~Daniel Boorstin
Only a life lived for others is worth living.
~Albert Einstein
Oh! I thought that post was gonna end with "india"...But I tell yea what, if they did listen to me, America would be in a much better situation, not just me of course, half of the M.Train knows more than the US government
btw, a japanese midget sub was shot by the US, that was before the pearl harbour attacks and is considered the first shots that started or was the start of the pacific war. The sub was scouting and the US sunk it. So it would be silly to think that they (america) had no idea that an attack was coming. they did nothing to secure pearl harbour. why? that question is up for debate.
Weak on the first shot thing...why was the midget sub in U.S. waters...looking for some whales to kill??? Yes in that instant communication age of the early 1940s, it's amazing that they did quickly tie the pieces together. :rolleyes:
BTW, the Pacific war began along time before U.S. involvement...ask the Chinese and the Koreans about that.
All the world will be your enemy, Prince with a thousand enemies, and whenever they catch you, they will kill you. But first they must catch you, digger, listener, runner, prince with the swift warning. Be cunning and full of tricks and your people shall never be destroyed.
Weak on the first shot thing...why was the midget sub in U.S. waters...looking for some whales to kill??? Yes in that instant communication age of the early 1940s, it's amazing that they did quickly tie the pieces together. :rolleyes:
BTW, the Pacific war began along time before U.S. involvement...ask the Chinese and the Koreans about that.
whats weak about it? that it didnt happen? no really why was it in that area? dont dismiss everytg so quickly just becoz it was the 40's. something are just obvious.
Comments
Why not? Should we have had those problems in the 20th Century? How about the 19th? The 18th? What's so special about the 21st Century that the problems of poverty and homelessness shouldn't exist?
Any undesirable scenario that implies desirable alternatives.
Of course not. Some problems are more severe than others. Furthermore, all problems are relative to the standards of each who chooses to evaluate them.
Me too.
Do you also agree to speak for "America" in assessing the world's problems?
Sounds good to me.......
Interesting.....I thought you were a more 'absolute' kind of guy. So, from your 'relative' perspective, is poverty in this country something you deem worthy of solving?
Huh? This is an odd question. Again, your point?
but the illusion of knowledge.
~Daniel Boorstin
Only a life lived for others is worth living.
~Albert Einstein
How about advancement of a civilized society? I'm still not understanding what you are trying to argue. Would you agree that less hardships exist overall in the 21st century than the 18th or 19th?
but the illusion of knowledge.
~Daniel Boorstin
Only a life lived for others is worth living.
~Albert Einstein
I am. All problems are absolutely in the eye of the beholder, baraka.
Most certainly.
My point is regarding whether or not you or Cosmo really is in a position to declare shoulds and shouldnts for America.
How about it?
I would definitely agree!
The total requested military budget for 2007 was $699 billion.
U.S. Military Budget[3] - DoD Base Spending: The U.S. Department of Defense (DoD) has the single largest budget of any government agency in the discretionary budget. This department is responsible for four (4) separate branches of the United States Military - the Army, Air Force, Navy and Marine Corps. This includes the cost of base administration, pay for military members, and the costs of repairing and procuring equipment. Last year (FY 2006), Defense Department base budget expenditures were $411 billion, nearly half of net discretionary spending. This year (FY 2007), it has increased to $430 billion, still about half. Next year (FY 2008), it is projected to grow to $481 billion, or 52%. This budget is the basic level needed to keep the DoD in readiness.
U.S. Military Budget - War on Terror Base Spending : The War on Terror (WoT) incurs additional costs by other departments. When added to the DoD base spending, the amount comes to: $474 billion in FY 2006, which is 56% of net discretionary spending, $505 billion in FY 2007, and $554 billion in FY 2008, nearly 60% of discretionary spending.
FY 2006 Supplemental Funding : The Defense Department base budget also does not include “one time only” costs attributable to the War on Terror, which are submitted as Supplemental Funding. In FY 2006, an additional $153 billion in Supplemental Funding was added to the base budget - the War on Terror received $120 billion, while $33 billion went primarily for Hurricane Katrina. As a result, 60% of last year's discretionary spending went to DoD/WoT.
FY 2007 Supplemental Funding : For FY 2007, $70 billion has already been approved, while the President’s FY 2008 Budget requests an additional $102 billion. If approved by Congress, total FY 2007 spending for DoD/WoT would be $673 billion, or 64% of the net discretionary budget. FY 2008 Budget Proposal : For FY 2008, the President has requested the following: The Defense Department Base Budget - $481 billion. WoT(non-DoD) Base Budget - $73 billion. Supplemental Funding for WoT - $145 billion. Total requested Dod/WoT spending is $699 billion, or 65% of total net Discretionary spending.
and dont forget the $243.7 billion for interest on debt... thats right the USA spent $240 billion on INTEREST on our foreign debt
so that is $942 BILLION spent on bombs and interest from debt to pay for the bombs
and that is more than DOUBLE then the follwing combined:
$89.9 billion (+1.3%) - Education and training
$76.9 billion (+8.1%) - Transportation
$72.6 billion (+5.8%) - Veterans' benefits
$43.5 billion (+9.2%) - Administration of justice
$33.1 billion (+5.7%) - Natural resources and environment
$32.5 billion (+15.4%) - Foreign affairs
$27.0 billion (+3.7%) - Agriculture
$26.8 billion (+28.7%) - Community and regional development
$25.0 billion (+4.0%) - Science and technology
$23.5 billion (+0.0%) - Energy
= $450.3 billion...
we are a war machine that is completely neglecting our people, enviroment, and infrastructure... to militarize the globe and dominate it for corporate interests. call me crazy but that is exactly what is going on... while everyone gets out their red white and blue pom poms...
i think we can afford to eliminate poverty and homelessness in our society... if people woke up and stopped letting the military industrial complex steal it from us to feed their quest of global military domination
stay scared of the arab boogey man folks... while they rob us, and our future generations blind
fucking suckers
Hehe...yes it was. And nearly all its workers are poor. Isn't that what you want to do? Give money to poor people?
Can I use this the next time we get into a taxation debate?
So you are 'in a position' to state your 'shoulds' or shouldnts', but Comso and I are not?
but the illusion of knowledge.
~Daniel Boorstin
Only a life lived for others is worth living.
~Albert Einstein
weak response...
because there is no reasonable response
What do you mean, 'How about it'? You agreed with me below that we are more advanced today than in the 19th & 18th century.
So I'll ask one more time, what is your point?
but the illusion of knowledge.
~Daniel Boorstin
Only a life lived for others is worth living.
~Albert Einstein
What's weak about it? The logic supporting that money is little different than the logic you'll turn around and use to ask for your money.
There is no reasonable defense for military spending at those levels, no. But there is no reasonable defense for destroying property and liberty in the hopes of saving them, either.
ffg doesn't agree with the war expenditures, but he also does not agree with the virtue of the common good either. Correct me if I'm wrong, ffg............Is this your point, perhaps?
but the illusion of knowledge.
~Daniel Boorstin
Only a life lived for others is worth living.
~Albert Einstein
Absolutely. And you'll contradict yourself in the process.
No, I'm not. I would never say that America should or shouldn't have poverty. I would say that America will or won't have poverty depending on the economic path it chooses as a nation and, more aptly, the individual paths chosen by its citizens.
War expenditures are based on the so-called "virtue of the common good". War expenditures are just another version of the assumed shoulds and shouldnts by a few on the many.
Yes.
Strawman......What you advocate is indifference which masquerades as freedom.
but the illusion of knowledge.
~Daniel Boorstin
Only a life lived for others is worth living.
~Albert Einstein
I certainly support the freedom to be indifferent.
One cannot be free when another assumes her values for her, baraka. Who said anything about "growing a cohesive country"?
Sigh, and it took how many posts to get you to finally make your point? :rolleyes:
I think you are splitting hairs, but do not disagree with this.
but the illusion of knowledge.
~Daniel Boorstin
Only a life lived for others is worth living.
~Albert Einstein
BTW, the Pacific war began along time before U.S. involvement...ask the Chinese and the Koreans about that.
whats weak about it? that it didnt happen? no really why was it in that area? dont dismiss everytg so quickly just becoz it was the 40's. something are just obvious.
anyway return to old thread I guess.