Well if god turns out to be real, he/she/it will surely see through those religious people who are ensuring their ticket to heaven, and are just being selfish and self righteous.
Am I alone in this belief. Everyone scrambling to impress God to try and get themselves into heaven. Saying they are doing Gods will but really they are doing it for themselves as they don't want to go to hell or to rot in the ground no longer being. I'm sure many ppl will deny this but I bet a lot less would have "faith" is there was no reward at the end of it. Why does everyone need a reason to be nice to each other and something to believe in beyond this existance. I personally prefer knowing that when I die, I die. Live life while you still have it!
Very interesting to hear this. Personally I agree with you and not to start a religious war but I was brought up to be Catholic and it seemed for me at least I was always doing something against what the church wanted. So one day I stopped and said that as long as Im a good person that's okay with me. Im really blown away that you've brought this up, thank you!
...Im going to go listen to Release now thanks!
Am I alone in this belief. Everyone scrambling to impress God to try and get themselves into heaven. Saying they are doing Gods will but really they are doing it for themselves as they don't want to go to hell or to rot in the ground no longer being. I'm sure many ppl will deny this but I bet a lot less would have "faith" is there was no reward at the end of it. Why does everyone need a reason to be nice to each other and something to believe in beyond this existance. I personally prefer knowing that when I die, I die. Live life while you still have it!
why do those who chose to not have religious beliefs have to constantly shit on and categorize those who do?> Why do you object to a belief system whose basic teachings, teach love and kindness? Your problem should be with people in general, not a belief system.
People in general are selfish. Its our nature. To preserve one's self.
Should I cheat on a test just to get an A+?? Of course not!
Should I help an old lady across the street just to score "points" with God??
Of course not!!
It's NOT the end-all and be-all that matters, here, people!! It's the MATTER that matters!! It's the day in and day out!! Not the end...
It's facing yourself in the mirror each day, and hoping to see a friend!
Jaysus Chrikee. Live while you CAN! Die only when you must...
If I help an old lady across the street just to "score points", does that take away from the fact that she's still safe on the other side? Of all things to complain about, people doing good things based upon a religious belief should be the least of all of our concerns.
why do those who chose to not have religious beliefs have to constantly shit on and categorize those who do?> Why do you object to a belief system whose basic teachings, teach love and kindness? Your problem should be with people in general, not a belief system.
People in general are selfish. Its our nature. To preserve one's self.
The only thing is religion gives some people an excuse to justify this selfishness and discrimination as us being imperfect and thats just the way it is. We should still work on these imperfections. Humans should evolve not remain stuck on the type of thinking that deems us as doomed to fail and in need of supernatural guidence. People should have to rely on themselves to better this world. The current plan, be it God's or whoevers, just isn't working out for our species. So we need to come up with one that will ensure our species flourish and advances on without constant turmoil and destruction.
If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
The only thing is religion gives some people an excuse to justify this selfishness and discrimination as us being imperfect and thats just the way it is. We should still work on these imperfections. Humans should evolve not remain stuck on the type of thinking that deems us as doomed to fail and in need of supernatural guidence. People should have to rely on themselves to better this world. The current plan, be it God's or whoevers, just isn't working out for our species. So we need to come up with one that will ensure our species flourish and advances on without constant turmoil and destruction.
Without the religion as their excuse, they'd find another excuse. Those who actually use religion to excuse deplorable behaviour, do NOT represent the idealogy, nor the religion. Unless of course your religion specifically calls for death to non-believers, and your religious leaders echo those sentiments. In that case, religion of that nature is surely evil.
And to declare that humans need to evolve, coming from a person who supports the "rights" of nations who adamantly refuse to evolve, and are stuck in 1st century thinking, is laughable at best. Western religion evolves, along with man. Something along the lines of rethinking convictions, as times and circumstances warrant.
And you don't speak for our entire species last I checked. I kinda like my life. Why do you hate yours so much? Not an attack, just a question. You dwell on the negatives in people lives (your own?) so much.
Without the religion as their excuse, they'd find another excuse. Those who actually use religion to excuse deplorable behaviour, do NOT represent the idealogy, nor the religion. Unless of course your religion specifically calls for death to non-believers, and your religious leaders echo those sentiments. In that case, religion of that nature is surely evil.
And to declare that humans need to evolve, coming from a person who supports the "rights" of nations who adamantly refuse to evolve, and are stuck in 1st century thinking, is laughable at best. Western religion evolves, along with man. Something along the lines of rethinking convictions, as times and circumstances warrant.
And you don't speak for our entire species last I checked. I kinda like my life. Why do you hate yours so much? Not an attack, just a question. You dwell on the negatives in people lives (your own?) so much.
The US may not say it outloud but they call for the death of non believers and deliver on that promise. Organized religion is bs and it shows.
I think all humans are born with rights no matter how they choose to live. I may not agree with their culture but it doesn't mean they should degraded as evil and stripped of their most basic human rights. Do you honestly think progress can be made with violence and self righteousness? No, it can be made with communication, diplomacy, and acceptance...you can't force ideology on people....you have to prove it to be worthwhile.
Where did I say I hate my life???? I just don't go along with things my heart and brain tell me are wrong. I refuse to go along with things that are void of reason, logic and simple human compassion for one another. I'm not miserable but I'm not about to excuse things that are wrong no matter how good my life is going. There is a whole world of life and people outside of my own. I have purpose in my life apart from self survival....that's just too primitive and small minded. It's time to evolve and learn how to spread our advancements without killing or enslaving....that's nothing but counterproductive and goes against everything that has ever actually worked.
If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
The US may not say it outloud but they call for the death of non believers and deliver on that promise. Organized religion is bs and it shows.
I think all humans are born with rights no matter how they choose to live. I may not agree with their culture but it doesn't mean they should degraded as evil and stripped of their most basic human rights. Do you honestly think progress can be made with violence and self righteousness? No, it can be made with communication, diplomacy, and acceptance...you can't force ideology on people....you have to prove it to be worthwhile.
Where did I say I hate my life???? I just don't go along with things my heart and brain tell me are wrong. I refuse to go along with things that are void of reason, logic and simple human compassion for one another. I'm not miserable but I'm not about to excuse things that are wrong no matter how good my life is going. There is a whole world of life and people outside of my own. I have purpose in my life apart from self survival....that's just too primitive and small minded. It's time to evolve and learn how to spread our advancements without killing or enslaving....that's nothing but counterproductive and goes against everything that has ever actually worked.
Good luck with all that. Seriously. And Im glad you dont hate life. I didnt say you said you did. Just seems to me sometimes that you love wallowing in the mire.
Good luck with all that. Seriously. And Im glad you dont hate life. I didnt say you said you did. Just seems to me sometimes that you love wallowing in the mire.
I guess you can over look the mire instead of offering out your hand to help others out of it. The mire does exist, is all I'm saying. Shrug and walk away if you choose. I'm going to put myself out there and try to help even if it isn't the easiest path to choose.
If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
why do those who chose to not have religious beliefs have to constantly shit on and categorize those who do?> Why do you object to a belief system whose basic teachings, teach love and kindness? Your problem should be with people in general, not a belief system.
Well its basically because this belief system ppl choose to have teaches them that my beliefs are wrong and these "believers" go out of their way to try and change my beliefs, so I am just exercising my right to try and do the same for them.
Your point about the basic teachings of religion is a valid one and one I have heard many times before but come on, we all know it is also used for the opposite, and ppl use their beliefs as justification to do wrong e.g. most wars are started out of a difference in religious beliefs.
Sure the ppl are the selfish ones but religion breeds the ignorance that stops them from seeing they are being selfish and therefore they believe not only are they not wrong but they are actually helping themselves and others.
I really don't think I would have a problem with organised religion if it didn't have such an effect on me. Tell you what, when ppl stop shitting on my beliefs and catagorising me as a "non-believer" I will extend the same courtesy to them.
amongstthewav.es
2006 - Leeds Festival
2007 - London
2009 - Manchester / London
2010 - Berlin
2012 - Manchester I / Manchester II / EV Manchester
I really don't think I would have a problem with organised religion if it didn't have such an effect on me. Tell you what, when ppl stop shitting on my beliefs and catagorising me as a "non-believer" I will extend the same courtesy to them.
see here's the thing anti-santa, it shouldn't matter to you what other people think. if they want to be prejudicial in their views then that is their loss. and it is an attitiude that puts them at odds with their chosen God. it's of no consequence to you and how you chose to live. i am speaking as an atheist who is always amused by the look of disbelief on people's face when i inform them that i am a non-believer. i care not that they think i'm damned to hell, nor if they feel some pity towards me. for me, all that matters is that i am right within my own self. and i am, so everything that's floating around doesn't touch me. it is not a part of who i am or the life i am leading. have the courage of your convictions and let the rest just wash over you.
hear my name
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
Am I alone in this belief. Everyone scrambling to impress God to try and get themselves into heaven. Saying they are doing Gods will but really they are doing it for themselves as they don't want to go to hell or to rot in the ground no longer being. I'm sure many ppl will deny this but I bet a lot less would have "faith" is there was no reward at the end of it. Why does everyone need a reason to be nice to each other and something to believe in beyond this existance. I personally prefer knowing that when I die, I die. Live life while you still have it!
I don't believe myself, but I think this is a pretty hasty conclusion. I see other benefits as well.
And I think most just believe because they have it past down from their parents and it fits within their lives. I find it weird when someone believes so strongly that they are out of this world. No connection with the here and now, and I can’t help but smile when I meet such a person. Still I think that follow the path that they were showed because it works for them. I don’t think an abstract notion of a live here after and the greed for that has that much to do with it. Maybe I’m, wrong.
« One man's glory is another man's hell.
You’re on the outside, never bound by such a spell.
Together in the darkness, alone in the light.
I took it upon me to be yours, Timmy,
I’ll lead your angels and demons at play tonight......»
this thread doesnt even make sense. everyone is selfish. it's human nature. doesn't matter if you're religious or not. even this thread is selfish in its "patting myself on the back for my beliefs" knocking of religious people. it's seeking validation which is selfish gratification.
The following from Romans chapter 12. Selfish? Hardly. Sounds more like an encouragement of complete selflessness to me.
"9Love must be sincere. Hate what is evil; cling to what is good. 10Be devoted to one another in brotherly love. Honor one another above yourselves. 11Never be lacking in zeal, but keep your spiritual fervor, serving the Lord. 12Be joyful in hope, patient in affliction, faithful in prayer. 13Share with God's people who are in need. Practice hospitality.
14Bless those who persecute you; bless and do not curse. 15Rejoice with those who rejoice; mourn with those who mourn. 16Live in harmony with one another. Do not be proud, but be willing to associate with people of low position.[c] Do not be conceited.
17Do not repay anyone evil for evil. Be careful to do what is right in the eyes of everybody. 18If it is possible, as far as it depends on you, live at peace with everyone. 19Do not take revenge, my friends, but leave room for God's wrath, for it is written: "It is mine to avenge; I will repay,"[d]says the Lord. 20On the contrary:
"If your enemy is hungry, feed him;
if he is thirsty, give him something to drink.
In doing this, you will heap burning coals on his head."[e] 21Do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good."
A commom argument against faith i read on this board is the "I want to live my life to the fullest, the way I choose, according to MY plan... etc." argument. "I, I, I. Me, me, me". Yet it is the faithful who are singled out as selfish. Patently ridiculous.
"When all your friends and sedatives mean well but make it worse... better find yourself a place to level out."
The following from Romans chapter 12. Selfish? Hardly. Sounds more like an encouragement of complete selflessness to me.
"9Love must be sincere. Hate what is evil; cling to what is good. 10Be devoted to one another in brotherly love. Honor one another above yourselves. 11Never be lacking in zeal, but keep your spiritual fervor, serving the Lord. 12Be joyful in hope, patient in affliction, faithful in prayer. 13Share with God's people who are in need. Practice hospitality.
14Bless those who persecute you; bless and do not curse. 15Rejoice with those who rejoice; mourn with those who mourn. 16Live in harmony with one another. Do not be proud, but be willing to associate with people of low position.[c] Do not be conceited.
17Do not repay anyone evil for evil. Be careful to do what is right in the eyes of everybody. 18If it is possible, as far as it depends on you, live at peace with everyone. 19Do not take revenge, my friends, but leave room for God's wrath, for it is written: "It is mine to avenge; I will repay,"[d]says the Lord. 20On the contrary:
"If your enemy is hungry, feed him;
if he is thirsty, give him something to drink.
In doing this, you will heap burning coals on his head."[e] 21Do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good."
A commom argument against faith i read on this board is the "I want to live my life to the fullest, the way I choose, according to MY plan... etc." argument. "I, I, I. Me, me, me". Yet it is the faithful who are singled out as selfish. Patently ridiculous.
Are you freaking serious!? Doesn't say much!? Read it again, and, try compreheding it this time.
I am freaking serious. Yes, it is, like you say, encouragement of complete selflessness. But, however, there are a lot of things in the Bible. If I were to make a thread and say religion is violent and pick out the most violent parts of the Bible, you'd rightly disagree.
I have no doubt that Christians that get 'it', try as hard as they can to be a good person and not because that means they'll get into heaven, but out of love.
edit: my reaction wasn't quite right, I should have explained myself.
If I were to make a thread and say religion is violent and pick out the most violent parts of the Bible, you'd rightly disagree.
.
On the contrary, if you were to make such a thread, and provide, in context, scripture than encouraged people to go out kill, maim, destroy and commit all sorts of other unspeakable, random acts of violence, i'd be left with not much choice but to agree with you. So, consider an invitation to do just that.
The passage I provided was very clear. There was really no figurative language left up to interpretation and was not taken out of context. I expect you to follow the same rules.
"When all your friends and sedatives mean well but make it worse... better find yourself a place to level out."
On the contrary, if you were to make such a thread, and provide, in context, scripture than encouraged people to go out kill, maim, destroy and commit all sorts of other unspeakable, random acts of violence, i'd be left with not much choice but to agree with you. So, consider an invitation to do just that.
The passage I provided was very clear. There was really no figurative language left up to interpretation and was not taken out of context. I expect you to follow the same rules.
What is "taken out of context" exactly? I bet there are some Christians out there who'd disagree with you on what you consider "out of context."
"9Love must be sincere. Hate what is evil; cling to what is good.
hate? is that a concept we want to instill in our children. or ourselves for that matter. who decides what is evil? and do we conveniently ignore that the 'evil' actions of another may have been brought about by the actions of ourselves in the first place. or do we say that they should have ignored what was visited upon them.
hear my name
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
Am I alone in this belief. Everyone scrambling to impress God to try and get themselves into heaven. Saying they are doing Gods will but really they are doing it for themselves as they don't want to go to hell or to rot in the ground no longer being. I'm sure many ppl will deny this but I bet a lot less would have "faith" is there was no reward at the end of it. Why does everyone need a reason to be nice to each other and something to believe in beyond this existance. I personally prefer knowing that when I die, I die. Live life while you still have it!
No - you just have a very simplistic, kindergarten-esque view of it.
The only people we should try to get even with...
...are those who've helped us.
Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
hate? is that a concept we want to instill in our children. or ourselves for that matter. who decides what is evil? and do we conveniently ignore that the 'evil' actions of another may have been brought about by the actions of ourselves in the first place. or do we say that they should have ignored what was visited upon them.
I believe they teach you to "turn the other cheek" in that instance.
this thread doesnt even make sense. everyone is selfish. it's human nature. doesn't matter if you're religious or not. even this thread is selfish in its "patting myself on the back for my beliefs" knocking of religious people. it's seeking validation which is selfish gratification.
Your post was selfish to. Your just fishing for a compliment for how intelligent you post.;)
I'll give it to you you are right.:D
« One man's glory is another man's hell.
You’re on the outside, never bound by such a spell.
Together in the darkness, alone in the light.
I took it upon me to be yours, Timmy,
I’ll lead your angels and demons at play tonight......»
Very interesting thread and a rather bold statement. However your arguement is deeply flawed. Selfishness is one of mankinds strengths/weaknesses depending on the context and your point of view. Selfishness, however has nothing to do with religion. I myself am not fond of organized religion, however i would never dare to be as selfish as to proclaim that my views are right for everyone. Religion can give faith and hope and change prople's lives, who are you (or anyone) to accuse religious people as selfish. People are flawed. People are (or can be) selfish. Soulsinging was right. It has nowt to do with religion.
Bashing other peoples beliefs is selfish, whatever side they're on
are we not serving the self whilst we navigate through our days? we are all selfish; now it's up to us to use this power as to reach self regard. religion, smidgeon...each of us are unique;
all insanity:
a derivitive of nature.
nature is god
god is love
love is light
Am I alone in this belief. Everyone scrambling to impress God to try and get themselves into heaven. Saying they are doing Gods will but really they are doing it for themselves as they don't want to go to hell or to rot in the ground no longer being. I'm sure many ppl will deny this but I bet a lot less would have "faith" is there was no reward at the end of it. Why does everyone need a reason to be nice to each other and something to believe in beyond this existance. I personally prefer knowing that when I die, I die. Live life while you still have it!
I would say that the selfishness of religion is amplified in a societal scale, you know, holy wars, etc...
On an individual scale, we all are selfish. We have egos. people Don't need religion to step on other people.
Anyway, one can sift through the Bible (or any other religious writings) to find selfless ideas. There may be selfish ideas but they were written by HUMANS, though they proclaim themselves as prophets or seers, or mouthpieces of God. And because they're human, they also have selfish motives. (jeez, my mind is running in different directions, sorry)
And about the Bible, it's made of a bunch of books written by different people from differen classes and different time periods, so they sometimes tend to conflicting. Let's all put these books into their context. For instrance, "turing one's cheek" is not martyrdom (in the ancient Middle Eastern sense), it's sor tof a silent resistance, it's a "fuck you" to your master (it's the slave who turns his cheek).
Comments
ah yes. a sacrificial lamb upon the altar to His majesty.
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
naděje umírá poslední
Very interesting to hear this. Personally I agree with you and not to start a religious war but I was brought up to be Catholic and it seemed for me at least I was always doing something against what the church wanted. So one day I stopped and said that as long as Im a good person that's okay with me. Im really blown away that you've brought this up, thank you!
...Im going to go listen to Release now thanks!
Go Cubs!
why do those who chose to not have religious beliefs have to constantly shit on and categorize those who do?> Why do you object to a belief system whose basic teachings, teach love and kindness? Your problem should be with people in general, not a belief system.
People in general are selfish. Its our nature. To preserve one's self.
www.myspace.com/jensvad
If I help an old lady across the street just to "score points", does that take away from the fact that she's still safe on the other side? Of all things to complain about, people doing good things based upon a religious belief should be the least of all of our concerns.
www.myspace.com/jensvad
The only thing is religion gives some people an excuse to justify this selfishness and discrimination as us being imperfect and thats just the way it is. We should still work on these imperfections. Humans should evolve not remain stuck on the type of thinking that deems us as doomed to fail and in need of supernatural guidence. People should have to rely on themselves to better this world. The current plan, be it God's or whoevers, just isn't working out for our species. So we need to come up with one that will ensure our species flourish and advances on without constant turmoil and destruction.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
Without the religion as their excuse, they'd find another excuse. Those who actually use religion to excuse deplorable behaviour, do NOT represent the idealogy, nor the religion. Unless of course your religion specifically calls for death to non-believers, and your religious leaders echo those sentiments. In that case, religion of that nature is surely evil.
And to declare that humans need to evolve, coming from a person who supports the "rights" of nations who adamantly refuse to evolve, and are stuck in 1st century thinking, is laughable at best. Western religion evolves, along with man. Something along the lines of rethinking convictions, as times and circumstances warrant.
And you don't speak for our entire species last I checked. I kinda like my life. Why do you hate yours so much? Not an attack, just a question. You dwell on the negatives in people lives (your own?) so much.
www.myspace.com/jensvad
The US may not say it outloud but they call for the death of non believers and deliver on that promise. Organized religion is bs and it shows.
I think all humans are born with rights no matter how they choose to live. I may not agree with their culture but it doesn't mean they should degraded as evil and stripped of their most basic human rights. Do you honestly think progress can be made with violence and self righteousness? No, it can be made with communication, diplomacy, and acceptance...you can't force ideology on people....you have to prove it to be worthwhile.
Where did I say I hate my life???? I just don't go along with things my heart and brain tell me are wrong. I refuse to go along with things that are void of reason, logic and simple human compassion for one another. I'm not miserable but I'm not about to excuse things that are wrong no matter how good my life is going. There is a whole world of life and people outside of my own. I have purpose in my life apart from self survival....that's just too primitive and small minded. It's time to evolve and learn how to spread our advancements without killing or enslaving....that's nothing but counterproductive and goes against everything that has ever actually worked.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
Good luck with all that. Seriously. And Im glad you dont hate life. I didnt say you said you did. Just seems to me sometimes that you love wallowing in the mire.
www.myspace.com/jensvad
I guess you can over look the mire instead of offering out your hand to help others out of it. The mire does exist, is all I'm saying. Shrug and walk away if you choose. I'm going to put myself out there and try to help even if it isn't the easiest path to choose.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
Well its basically because this belief system ppl choose to have teaches them that my beliefs are wrong and these "believers" go out of their way to try and change my beliefs, so I am just exercising my right to try and do the same for them.
Your point about the basic teachings of religion is a valid one and one I have heard many times before but come on, we all know it is also used for the opposite, and ppl use their beliefs as justification to do wrong e.g. most wars are started out of a difference in religious beliefs.
Sure the ppl are the selfish ones but religion breeds the ignorance that stops them from seeing they are being selfish and therefore they believe not only are they not wrong but they are actually helping themselves and others.
I really don't think I would have a problem with organised religion if it didn't have such an effect on me. Tell you what, when ppl stop shitting on my beliefs and catagorising me as a "non-believer" I will extend the same courtesy to them.
2006 - Leeds Festival
2007 - London
2009 - Manchester / London
2010 - Berlin
2012 - Manchester I / Manchester II / EV Manchester
see here's the thing anti-santa, it shouldn't matter to you what other people think. if they want to be prejudicial in their views then that is their loss. and it is an attitiude that puts them at odds with their chosen God. it's of no consequence to you and how you chose to live. i am speaking as an atheist who is always amused by the look of disbelief on people's face when i inform them that i am a non-believer. i care not that they think i'm damned to hell, nor if they feel some pity towards me. for me, all that matters is that i am right within my own self. and i am, so everything that's floating around doesn't touch me. it is not a part of who i am or the life i am leading. have the courage of your convictions and let the rest just wash over you.
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
I don't believe myself, but I think this is a pretty hasty conclusion. I see other benefits as well.
And I think most just believe because they have it past down from their parents and it fits within their lives. I find it weird when someone believes so strongly that they are out of this world. No connection with the here and now, and I can’t help but smile when I meet such a person. Still I think that follow the path that they were showed because it works for them. I don’t think an abstract notion of a live here after and the greed for that has that much to do with it. Maybe I’m, wrong.
You’re on the outside, never bound by such a spell.
Together in the darkness, alone in the light.
I took it upon me to be yours, Timmy,
I’ll lead your angels and demons at play tonight......»
"9Love must be sincere. Hate what is evil; cling to what is good. 10Be devoted to one another in brotherly love. Honor one another above yourselves. 11Never be lacking in zeal, but keep your spiritual fervor, serving the Lord. 12Be joyful in hope, patient in affliction, faithful in prayer. 13Share with God's people who are in need. Practice hospitality.
14Bless those who persecute you; bless and do not curse. 15Rejoice with those who rejoice; mourn with those who mourn. 16Live in harmony with one another. Do not be proud, but be willing to associate with people of low position.[c] Do not be conceited.
17Do not repay anyone evil for evil. Be careful to do what is right in the eyes of everybody. 18If it is possible, as far as it depends on you, live at peace with everyone. 19Do not take revenge, my friends, but leave room for God's wrath, for it is written: "It is mine to avenge; I will repay,"[d]says the Lord. 20On the contrary:
"If your enemy is hungry, feed him;
if he is thirsty, give him something to drink.
In doing this, you will heap burning coals on his head."[e] 21Do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good."
A commom argument against faith i read on this board is the "I want to live my life to the fullest, the way I choose, according to MY plan... etc." argument. "I, I, I. Me, me, me". Yet it is the faithful who are singled out as selfish. Patently ridiculous.
This really doesn't say much...
naděje umírá poslední
Are you freaking serious!? Doesn't say much!? Read it again, and, try compreheding it this time.
I am freaking serious. Yes, it is, like you say, encouragement of complete selflessness. But, however, there are a lot of things in the Bible. If I were to make a thread and say religion is violent and pick out the most violent parts of the Bible, you'd rightly disagree.
I have no doubt that Christians that get 'it', try as hard as they can to be a good person and not because that means they'll get into heaven, but out of love.
edit: my reaction wasn't quite right, I should have explained myself.
naděje umírá poslední
On the contrary, if you were to make such a thread, and provide, in context, scripture than encouraged people to go out kill, maim, destroy and commit all sorts of other unspeakable, random acts of violence, i'd be left with not much choice but to agree with you. So, consider an invitation to do just that.
The passage I provided was very clear. There was really no figurative language left up to interpretation and was not taken out of context. I expect you to follow the same rules.
What is "taken out of context" exactly? I bet there are some Christians out there who'd disagree with you on what you consider "out of context."
naděje umírá poslední
to that point, how do we know that the writers of the bible haven't taken gods words out of context and attached their own beliefs to it?
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
hate? is that a concept we want to instill in our children. or ourselves for that matter. who decides what is evil? and do we conveniently ignore that the 'evil' actions of another may have been brought about by the actions of ourselves in the first place. or do we say that they should have ignored what was visited upon them.
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
No - you just have a very simplistic, kindergarten-esque view of it.
...are those who've helped us.
Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
I believe they teach you to "turn the other cheek" in that instance.
www.myspace.com/jensvad
Your post was selfish to. Your just fishing for a compliment for how intelligent you post.;)
I'll give it to you you are right.:D
You’re on the outside, never bound by such a spell.
Together in the darkness, alone in the light.
I took it upon me to be yours, Timmy,
I’ll lead your angels and demons at play tonight......»
Wouldn't that be selfish too?
Bashing other peoples beliefs is selfish, whatever side they're on
www.myspace.com/jackietreehornmusic - The Band
a derivitive of nature.
nature is god
god is love
love is light
I would say that the selfishness of religion is amplified in a societal scale, you know, holy wars, etc...
On an individual scale, we all are selfish. We have egos. people Don't need religion to step on other people.
Anyway, one can sift through the Bible (or any other religious writings) to find selfless ideas. There may be selfish ideas but they were written by HUMANS, though they proclaim themselves as prophets or seers, or mouthpieces of God. And because they're human, they also have selfish motives. (jeez, my mind is running in different directions, sorry)
And about the Bible, it's made of a bunch of books written by different people from differen classes and different time periods, so they sometimes tend to conflicting. Let's all put these books into their context. For instrance, "turing one's cheek" is not martyrdom (in the ancient Middle Eastern sense), it's sor tof a silent resistance, it's a "fuck you" to your master (it's the slave who turns his cheek).