Why support Nader?

124

Comments

  • THC
    THC Posts: 525
    http://news.yahoo.com/s/bloomberg/20080227/pl_bloomberg/aj20k269dy0;_ylt=AuwzsPh3cqSeUFnLlUntwu4DW7oF
    “Kept in a small bowl, the goldfish will remain small. With more space, the fish can grow double, triple, or quadruple its size.”
    -Big Fish
  • Abookamongstthemany
    Abookamongstthemany Posts: 8,209
    dg1979us wrote:
    Just curious, and correct me if Im wrong. But I believe I read in another thread that you voted for Kerry in 04. Did you seriously think he was the best choice?

    Nope, I knew he wasn't and did it anyway. I've also stated that I regret that lapse in judgement...it was a vote made in fear.
    If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.

    Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
    -Oscar Wilde
  • Abookamongstthemany
    Abookamongstthemany Posts: 8,209
    soulsinging wrote:
    fair enough. i don't think i've been very good at explaining myself in this thread.

    i will not be picking based on fear of mccain. nor would i really encourage people to do so. personally, kucinich, paul, and nader aren't really my cup of tea regardless. when i campaigned for nader, i was smoking a LOT of pot at the time ;) but my point was not that i should have voted for gore solely becos bush turned out to be a nightmare. my point was that there WERE significant differences between gore and bush. and just as you feel i would be doing a disservice to urge people to vote dem out of fear of republicans, i think you are doing a disservice by acting like there is no difference between mccain and obama. there is.

    so i think what i am urging is not "vote dem or else." it's more a matter of truly thinking things through and not being blinded by rhetoric, be it the rhetoric of third party votes are wasted or the rhetoric of all major party candidates are evil corporate whores. at the time, i was saying the same things about bush and gore that you are saying now about mccain and the dems. my point was that i was wrong and i wish i had known then what i know now.

    by all means, vote your heart. but don't vote out of fear that any major party candidate will inevitably be ruled by special interests. al gore would have made a fantastic president. if only he'd had edwards as a running mate to give the ticket enough personality to win, i'd be a whole lot happier today ;)

    IMO, there wasn't enough difference between Gore and Bush pre 9/11 in the 2000 to support Gore's half-assed platform. If you thought there was you should have voted and campaigned for him instead. I don't understand how pot would have caused you not do so but perhaps it works differently for different people. I got high as hell in 04 and still managed to vote for Kerry. Maybe that was because of the pot, hmmm....nah, I'm still going with fear on that one.

    And it's not rhetoric about Obama that turned me against him. It's because I had supported Kucinich and went into great detail when comparing the others guys so that I could be sure I was making the best decision. What I found, I didn't like at all. Obama IS backed by special interests, most alarming to me is the nuclear power industry. That might not mean shit to you, but it does to me. Also, his record lacked much to be desired. So yeah, I'm voting for the best person.
    If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.

    Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
    -Oscar Wilde
  • Abookamongstthemany
    Abookamongstthemany Posts: 8,209
    FinsburyParkCarrots wrote:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JIFEceopAUI


    'Obama makes us cry sometimes.' Great point

    Messaged boiled down to: The two parties in power now are the best we can ever hope for. Don't be so foolish as to stand up against them or think progress is worth it. It's not and neither is a damn thing you believe in. You MUST submit. Even though the Democratic party hasn't done too much for you lately and have mostly sold out to special interests, this should be none of your concern. Big bad republican monster will always be under your bed keeping you and your visions of 'real' change in check. So do what's right kids, the media has already told you how limited your potential is, how optionless your choices are and how powerless you really are....so act like it, shut the fuck up and do as we say.

    Actually, my boiled down summary might have been longer. :D
    If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.

    Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
    -Oscar Wilde
  • FinsburyParkCarrots
    FinsburyParkCarrots Seattle, WA Posts: 12,223
    Abookamongstthemany wrote:
    'Obama makes us cry sometimes.' Great point

    Messaged boiled down to: The two parties in power now are the best we can ever hope for. Don't be so foolish as to stand up against them or think progress is worth it. It's not and neither is a damn thing you believe in. You MUST submit. Even though the Democratic party hasn't done too much for you lately and have mostly sold out to special interests, this should be none of your concern. Big bad republican monster will always be under your bed keeping you and your visions of 'real' change in check. So do what's right kids, the media has already told you how limited your potential is, how optionless your choices are and how powerless you really are....so act like it, shut the fuck up and do as we say.

    Actually, my boiled down summary might have been longer. :D

    Er, I think it was a bit more ironic than that. ;)
  • Abookamongstthemany
    Abookamongstthemany Posts: 8,209
    FinsburyParkCarrots wrote:
    Er, I think it was a bit more ironic than that. ;)


    Perhaps. It's hard to tell these days...honestly
    If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.

    Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
    -Oscar Wilde
  • soulsinging
    soulsinging Posts: 13,202
    Abookamongstthemany wrote:
    IMO, there wasn't enough difference between Gore and Bush pre 9/11 in the 2000 to support Gore's half-assed platform. If you thought there was you should have voted and campaigned for him instead. I don't understand how pot would have caused you not do so but perhaps it works differently for different people. I got high as hell in 04 and still managed to vote for Kerry. Maybe that was because of the pot, hmmm....nah, I'm still going with fear on that one.

    And it's not rhetoric about Obama that turned me against him. It's because I had supported Kucinich and went into great detail when comparing the others guys so that I could be sure I was making the best decision. What I found, I didn't like at all. Obama IS backed by special interests, most alarming to me is the nuclear power industry. That might not mean shit to you, but it does to me. Also, his record lacked much to be desired. So yeah, I'm voting for the best person.

    i've no doubt you've done your homework. im willing to bet you know more about any given candidate than i do. i havent looked into it yet... election's a few months away still ;) i guess im more directing it at people who get caught up in the trends of the moment, like i was with nader in 2000.
  • Abookamongstthemany
    Abookamongstthemany Posts: 8,209
    soulsinging wrote:
    i've no doubt you've done your homework. im willing to bet you know more about any given candidate than i do. i havent looked into it yet... election's a few months away still ;) i guess im more directing it at people who get caught up in the trends of the moment, like i was with nader in 2000.

    I definitely understand the feeling. It's a big pet peeve of mine...seeing people jump on a bandwagon and act so fanatical about things they really don't know much about.
    If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.

    Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
    -Oscar Wilde
  • soulsinging
    soulsinging Posts: 13,202
    Abookamongstthemany wrote:
    I definitely understand the feeling. It's a big pet peeve of mine...seeing people jump on a bandwagon and act so fanatical about things they really don't know much about.

    that's what i was trying to get at, in my own misguided, inept, and roundabout way. :)
  • Abookamongstthemany
    Abookamongstthemany Posts: 8,209
    soulsinging wrote:
    that's what i was trying to get at, in my own misguided, inept, and roundabout way. :)


    Gotcha :)
    If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.

    Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
    -Oscar Wilde
  • Urban Hiker
    Urban Hiker Posts: 1,312
    I was just talking to my younger sister, who is 30 years old. She has never given enough damn about politics to make it to the polls, yet she does have her opinions on what she does and does not like about certain political issues.

    Anywho - I was pitching Nader to her and she was like, "Ugh, I don't want to get all informed with all of the details!" :confused:

    I told her it is so simple to get a very basic idea if Nader is someone you care to support. Just go to http://www.votenader.org/issues/ and he lays out some easy to read sentences for you. She agreed to do it and you bet I'll be following up to see how she feels about him.

    I love my sister dearly. However, this is frustrating 'cause I have to wonder how many people are like this. How many people are just following the masses 'cause they would rather watch Entertainment Tonight than hear how our any potential next president plans to run our country? :mad:

    It really chaps my hide. :cool:
    Walking can be a real trip
    ***********************
    "We've laid the groundwork. It's like planting the seeds. And next year, it's spring." - Nader
    ***********************
    Prepare for tending to your garden, America.
  • Abookamongstthemany
    Abookamongstthemany Posts: 8,209
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BiYYNfkVGSo&feature=related

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gvFCcMbnyTs&feature=related

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GdBWdMM3ruc&feature=related
    If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.

    Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
    -Oscar Wilde
  • MrBrian
    MrBrian Posts: 2,672
    abook try and find the video of this

    http://www.hno.harvard.edu/gazette/2004/10.07/17-nader.html

    Nader knocked down every harvard student that attacked him, at the end all they could do is start singing.

    I mean the speech was good, the q&a part at the end was the best. please try and find it. its a must watch!
  • my2hands
    my2hands Posts: 17,117
    Kenny Olav wrote:
    even tho that broken record is playing some good tunes.


    i agree with that...
  • macgyver06
    macgyver06 Posts: 2,500
    people who support and vote for nader, vote for him because they support him.


    if only his name were on your seat belts and airbags would he not be slammed.
  • SundaySilence
    SundaySilence Posts: 537
    On an issue by issue basis, americans would support Nader. See the Civics Test in the original post for examples.

    Its not his policies that americans aren't in support of, its the media narrative that pigeonholes him as a lonely loon.

    Lack of corporate financing and major party support may be unsurmountable in winning the presidency. His aim is to pull the major parties in a more populist direction. If Kucinich, Gravel, or even Edwards won the democratic nomination he wouldn't be running. The more support he can get the stronger his pull will be.

    He may seem stubborn and in your face, but that is how he has achieved his great accomplishments.

    If the democrats don't like it they can present a more populist platform to appeal to his supporters.

    Perhaps he would be more effective, and not forced to defend tiresome accusations of being a spoiler, if he were to run for congress instead.
  • SpreadtheJAM
    SpreadtheJAM Posts: 344
    Why support nader? So McCain can win.
    BORGATA>VIC
  • Abookamongstthemany
    Abookamongstthemany Posts: 8,209
    SpreadtheJAM wrote:
    Why support nader? So McCain can win.

    Nader: "If the Democrats can't landslide the Republicans this year, they ought to just wrap up,"
    If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.

    Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
    -Oscar Wilde
  • dontloseyourheat
    dontloseyourheat Posts: 483
    Nader names Matt Gonzalez as running mate.

    http://www.votenader.org/media/2008/02/28/matt-gonzalez-is-naders-vp/

    "Matt Gonzalez is Ralph Nader’s Vice Presidential running mate.

    In 2000, Gonzalez was elected to the 11 member San Francisco Board of Supervisors, which supervises a city with a budget of $6 billion. He became President of the Board three years later.

    Gonzalez worked as a deputy public defender in San Francisco from 1991 2000, developing extensive trial experience. "
    "Don't lose your inner heat...ever" - EV 5/13/06
  • SpreadtheJAM
    SpreadtheJAM Posts: 344
    Abookamongstthemany wrote:
    Nader: "If the Democrats can't landslide the Republicans this year, they ought to just wrap up,"
    Good quote.. don't want to see it happen, but very true.
    BORGATA>VIC

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