Whats the end result of the Obama hatred? Can he win with all thats been said?

DixieN

I recently read that the Neanderthal attacks on Obama may actually end up helping him win. Not only are they cementing the base, but the attacks are actually causing McCain's prominent supporters to begin to shy away from him. McCain has finally spoken up--late, as usual and not until prompted. This is a leader? He waits 'til he's prompted? And his supporters booed him for it. When you court a lynch mob, you soon find out the main thing they're there for is the lynching. Who gets lynched is pretty much immaterial. McCain has let these dogs go, and when he tries to rein them in, he's going to get bitten badly because "traitor" will shift from Obama to McCain in the blink of an eye. It is difficult to grow a conscience and not pay for it with your hide or more. Allowing Palin to foment commentary she has is yet further proof that McCain cannot see the consequences of his actions on his own. This is not a trait desirable in a president. Imho, McCain's many foibles, like picking Palin in the first place, and then allowing and encouraging angry mobs is proof positive that he is not a leader, but a demagogue who would rise to power using any means necessary. Decent Republicans are very likely questioning just what they are helping to elect. Some decent Republicans will jump ship or simply refuse to vote. I can't blame them. When your fellow rally goers resemble nothing so much as a gathering of the Aryan Brotherhood, decent people start to find places with people more like themselves. And let me say this, I think the majority of Republicans are, in fact, decent people with a higher level of intellect and honesty than some of what we have been shown on You Tube lately.

"...Former Republican Gov. William Milliken is expressing doubts about his party's nominee. "He is not the McCain I endorsed,""He keeps saying, 'Who is Barack Obama?' I would ask the question, 'Who is John McCain?' because his campaign has become rather disappointing to me. I'm disappointed in the tenor and the personal attacks on the part of the McCain campaign, when he ought to be talking about the issues."


Lincoln Chafee, a former Republican U.S. senator from Rhode Island, said he's voting for Obama and urging others to do likewise. "That's not my kind of Republicanism," said Chafee, who now calls himself an independent. "I saw what Bush and Cheney did. They came in with a (budget) surplus and a stable world, and look what's happened now. In eight short years they've taken one peaceful and prosperous world, and they've torn it into tatters." As for McCain's choice of Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin for his running mate, "there's no question she's totally unqualified," Chafee said.

DixieN

One last thing, Rednecks for Obama.

http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5h0zX5SwQKnukSn9Ul4Wo5x-mihIg

"Tony Viessman, 74, and Les Spencer, 60, got politically active last year when it occurred to them there must be other lower income, rural, beer-drinking, gun-loving, NASCAR race enthusiasts fed up with business as usual in Washington."

Rednecks4obama.com

Intelligence is a matter of what's above your neck. Rednecks can rock.

LikeAnOpeningBandForTheSun

if anything it helps Obama. People dont want to be associated with that. and these people are a small minority of people anyway, but the Jerry Springer set always gets the most attention.

prytoj

The question is not whether we hate Muslims, but whether or not we are prepared to put one in the oval office. I think the distinction should be made.

Agree ee should always treat a person on his own merit, but since you asked
why the negativity:

Mosques in America are funded directly by institutions in Saudi Arabia that support jihad.

Over half of all "moderate muslims" believe in some form of sharia law.

Muslim activist lawyers are clogging our courts with frivolous discrimination
suits, costing US tons o' cash.

Just some of the things that bug me...

Yeah, maybe our leadership sucks sometimes, but what does that say about that of the Muslim leadership? I don't see ANY of them hammering the point home that extremism is bad. Our people would be rioting if our leadership pulled any of this crap.

So, it makes it hard...just sayin...and I think your heart should be more focused on the homefront.

Pj_Gurl wrote:

And i'd like to take a moment to apologize to any posters here that are Muslims. I wonder what they think when they see time and time again, angry posts accusing Obama of being a muslim.

I am so sick and tired of people insinuating that that is a bad thing. Makes me sick to my stomach that the Republican Party has succeeded with associating one religion with absolute hatred, that they’ve been able to instil this idea that every single person in the Middle East has a bomb and a gun and a distinct hatred for Americans. Absolutely not true.

fragileblake

http://www.pollster.com/polls/us/08-us-pres-ge-mvo.php

http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/2008/10/todays-polls-1010.html

http://yglesias.thinkprogress.org/archives/2008/10/four_years_ago.php

http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/2008/08/persistent-myth-of-bradley-effect.html

http://dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/10/11/73436/493/0/626466

http://oxdown.firedoglake.com/diary/546#

http://www.rumromanismrebellion.net/2008/10/07/i-guess-obama-is-dragging-all-of-our-candidates-down/

ACCBootlegGoddess

prytoj wrote:

The question is not whether we hate Muslims, but whether or not we are prepared to put one in the oval office. I think the distinction should be made.

Agree ee should always treat a person on his own merit, but since you asked
why the negativity:

Mosques in America are funded directly by institutions in Saudi Arabia that support jihad.

Over half of all "moderate muslims" believe in some form of sharia law.

Muslim activist lawyers are clogging our courts with frivolous discrimination
suits, costing US tons o' cash.

Just some of the things that bug me...

Yeah, maybe our leadership sucks sometimes, but what does that say about that of the Muslim leadership? I don't see ANY of them hammering the point home that extremism is bad. Our people would be rioting if our leadership pulled any of this crap.

So, it makes it hard...just sayin...and I think your heart should be more focused on the homefront.

Firstly I think its been established the Obama IS NOT A MUSLIM! HE IS CHRISTIAN! So since there is no Muslim running for office your post is irrelevant.

How many times does he or his supporters say that before you fucking people hear and GET it!

Secondly...you make some serious allegations...where is your proof?? I don't see you siting any sources that say the mosques get funding from the Saudi's or that they ALL support a Jihad in some form.
Sounds like you are believing some of the bullshit McCain is spewing and to you I say...get a mind of your own and do some research.

How do you know the lawsuits are frivolous?? I think racism against Muslims and indeed other East Indian people is VERY prevalent (all you have to do is look at the so called random airport checks). I mean your post alone has some very racist overtones. (not saying you personally are racist).

As a Catholic myself...need I remind people that Christianity wasn't always so rightious (sp) either. Anyone study the Crusades???

Lets stick to the ISSUES here and leave race and religion out of the election. I know many Americans can't and won't...and thats what makes me sad, scared and angry.

ACCBootlegGoddess

Pj_Gurl wrote:

And i'd like to take a moment to apologize to any posters here that are Muslims. I wonder what they think when they see time and time again, angry posts accusing Obama of being a muslim.

I am so sick and tired of people insinuating that that is a bad thing. Makes me sick to my stomach that the Republican Party has succeeded with associating one religion with absolute hatred, that they’ve been able to instil this idea that every single person in the Middle East has a bomb and a gun and a distinct hatred for Americans. Absolutely not true.

AMEN Sistah!!! Post of the day right here!!!!!
I'm catholic myself...but I honestly feel that there MUST be some real good in the Muslim faith for it to have sooo many followers. I've heard that Islam is actually a very peaceful religion its just that, like any religion, they have their extremists and THOSE are the ones we hear on the news and read in the paper.
It scares me WAY more to see your nuclear codes in the hands of a 72 year old man who has a temper problem, no fucking clue about the economy, has ties to Oil barrons....and an ignorant power hungry soccer mom as his sidekick in case he kicks it while in office.
It astounds me that it doesn't scare more people.

Mrs.Vedder78

prytoj wrote:

The question is not whether we hate Muslims, but whether or not we are prepared to put one in the oval office. I think the distinction should be made.

Agree ee should always treat a person on his own merit, but since you asked
why the negativity:

Mosques in America are funded directly by institutions in Saudi Arabia that support jihad.

Over half of all "moderate muslims" believe in some form of sharia law.

Muslim activist lawyers are clogging our courts with frivolous discrimination
suits, costing US tons o' cash.

Just some of the things that bug me...

Yeah, maybe our leadership sucks sometimes, but what does that say about that of the Muslim leadership? I don't see ANY of them hammering the point home that extremism is bad. Our people would be rioting if our leadership pulled any of this crap.

So, it makes it hard...just sayin...and I think your heart should be more focused on the homefront.

Let me spell it for you so that you understand:

Obama I-S N-O-T a M-U-S-L-I-M !!!!!!!!!!!!

Your post is pointless! as no one in this presidential race is a Muslim!

prytoj

Some uninformed McCain voters mistkely believe Obama
is Muslim

But the larger point, in answer to the poster, is the distinction between HATE and PRACTICALITY when it comes to the question, on it's face, of a Muslim in the white house.

And my facts are supported by a book written by Mark Steyn, entitled "America Alone." I recommend.

The original poster stated a strong anti-muslim sentiment attached to Obama by the right, which I don't necessarily buy. Followed by PJgurl's heartfelt apology to all muslims who might be reading our negative associations of them.

Just some perspective...

A whole lot more people are misinformed about the Keating 5 than they are about Obama's faith, if you ask me...

JaneNY

prytoj wrote:

The question is not whether we hate Muslims, but whether or not we are prepared to put one in the oval office. I think the distinction should be made.

Why would this be a question at this time, since no Muslims are running for president in 2008? I personally don't care what someone's religion is - I want someone who has the expertise to run the complicated country that the U.S. is at this time, and I think Obama is that person.

fugawzi

JaneNY wrote:

Why would this be a question at this time, since no Muslims are running for president in 2008? I personally don't care what someone's religion is - I want someone who has the expertise to run the complicated country that the U.S. is at this time, and I think Obama is that person.

Good point, no Muslims running for office from what we can tell. HOWEVER, religion is something to be considered when voting. Look at the last 8 years. Bush's foreign policy has been largely based on his faith. He has said it himself. I'm pretty sure that Bush even said God told him what to do, which wars were right to fight. Obama, nor McCain I don't think would be as extreme with religion as Bush has been. Sarah Palin, that's another story.

Anon

prytoj wrote:

So, it makes it hard...just sayin...and I think your heart should be more focused on the homefront.

What the fuck..

Who said my heart wasn't focused on the homefront?

prytoj

Pj_Gurl wrote:

What the fuck..

Who said my heart wasn't focused on the homefront?

to the person apologizing to the to the muslims for the ugly american...
that would be me.

Anon

prytoj wrote:

to the person apologizing to the to the muslims for the ugly american...
that would be me.

Seriously, you don't know anything about me so you really need to be careful about making comments insinuating that i am not ''focused on the homefront.''
Are you somehow trying to insinuate that i am not loyal enough to America?

You like to make assumptions about people? I can do that too..

I bet your from the South....

DixieN

ACCBootlegGoddess wrote:

Firstly I think its been established the Obama IS NOT A MUSLIM! HE IS CHRISTIAN! So since there is no Muslim running for office your post is irrelevant.

How many times does he or his supporters say that before you fucking people hear and GET it!

Secondly...you make some serious allegations...where is your proof?? I don't see you siting any sources that say the mosques get funding from the Saudi's or that they ALL support a Jihad in some form.
Sounds like you are believing some of the bullshit McCain is spewing and to you I say...get a mind of your own and do some research.

How do you know the lawsuits are frivolous?? I think racism against Muslims and indeed other East Indian people is VERY prevalent (all you have to do is look at the so called random airport checks). I mean your post alone has some very racist overtones. (not saying you personally are racist).

As a Catholic myself...need I remind people that Christianity wasn't always so rightious (sp) either. Anyone study the Crusades???

Lets stick to the ISSUES here and leave race and religion out of the election. I know many Americans can't and won't...and thats what makes me sad, scared and angry.

Truly, I don't understand people who think Obama is a Muslim. I wonder if they really do (which seriously raises issues regarding these people's sanity), or if they're so bent on making political hay they don't care if what they say is true or not...it's just a good rallying call for the bottom of the barrel element of John McCain's base. Either way, it's a sad commentary on our times.

http://fightthesmears.com/articles/3/baracksfaith?source=sem-pm-fts-mm-search-us&gclid=CM695KmkoJYCFQEziQod1zuN7g

I'm not the Pope, but I was raised in a household that had a Catholic in it. By some people's "reasoning," I guess I'm the first female Pope whether I want to own up to it or not.

Commy

radiohead33 wrote:

I make no bones about my dislike of obama and that i will not vote for him.

However the stuff going around now seems so outrageous one has to wonder where it stops, and whats the end result?

It seems from the Youtube interviews of Mccain supporters and just the whole "fox news" mentality is this: Obama is a muslim and a terrorist supporter. That he is a radical.

To these people, thats a fact. No one can prove them wrong because they believe these are facts.

Thats why I dont think Obama will win. There are thousands maybe millions of people who think obama is a muslim and a terrorist supporter. Millions more who are racist and will not vote for him, solely on the fact his skin tone is dark.

I think also, if he does get elected, as I stated in previous threads and posts, sadly alot of people, will want him dead.

If people are shouting "kill" "bomb" and "off with his head", and people are "scared" of a obama presidency, just think the mayhem that will ensue if he gets into the white house.

As I said, I dont support obama, he isnt a candidate I like. That said he isnt a muslim, or terrorist lover.

I'm almost on the other end of the spectrum. Almost. The difference of course is that I don't want John McCain dead.

There will be riots if another republican is elected. They've fucked us over for 8 years now, put into 2 wars (that we know about), and have turned the economy into levels not seen since 1920, circa the great depression. They've shit on labor, destroyed unions, lowered (yes lowered) minimum wage, and have put very little effort into backing the epa, among taking away countless rights, and shredding the constitution.

Having said that I am not partisan, and see very little difference between the dems and republicans.

However, I will give Obama a chance, 4 years in the whitehouse. And he will be elected by the way, your intel seems to be a bit removed from reality. But after those 4 years, if nothing changes, you will see that I am not the only who will have given up on the American electoral system. And we will find a way to make ourselves be heard. try to silence the voiceless, after all this shit. Try.

ccRyderzz

Pj_Gurl wrote:

Isn't it awesome how we are portrayed to the rest of the world. People see all of these events in the 'news'' over and over again and they think that those peoples behaviour and thoughts are the 'norm'. No wonder the rest of the world laughs their asses off at us. Seriously.

and Simon Carmiggelt journalist (The Slogan)
1914 Alfred Drake [Capurro], Brooklyn NY, singer/actor (Kiss Me Kate)
and Sarah Churchill London, actress (All Over Town, Royal Wedding)
1915 Margarita J Aliger Russian poet (Zoja) [NS]
and Roman Padlewski composer
1916 Walt W Rostow economist (Politics & Stages of Growth)
1917 Helmut Dantine Vienna Austria, actor (Shadow of the Cloak)
and June Allyson Bronx, actress (Till the Clouds Roll By, Vegas)
1919 Erik Elms"ter Sweden, 1st to compete in summer & winter Oly (1948)
and Gabriel Dell Barbados, actor (Steve Allen Show)
1920 Georg Leber German politician (SPD)
1921 John A G Gere English art historian (Pre-Raphaelite painter)
1922 Martha Stewart Bardwell Ky, singer/actress (Daisy Kenyon, Doll Face)
and Reina Princeen Geerligs [Leentjes Vandendriesch], antifascist
1926 Diana Lynn LA CA, actress (Annapolis Story, Easy Come Easy Go)
and Ivan Jirko composer
and Marcello Abbado composer
1927 Al Martino Phila, singer (Here in My Heart)/actor (Godfather)
and Ronald Laing British psychiatrist (anti-psychiatrist)
1931 Desmond Tutu Anglican Archbishop of S Afr (Nobel Peace Prize 1982)
1932 Joannes M G~sen Bishop of Roermond
1933 Paul B Price Cataret NJ, actor (Busting Loose)
1934 Imamu Amiri Baraka [Everett Leroi Jones], US, poet/writer
and Ulrike Meinhof lead German Red Army
and Willie Naulls NBA star (NY Knicks)
and [Everett] LeRoi Jones [Amiri Baraka], US writer (Black Music)
1935 Thomas M Keneally Australia, novelist (Blood Red Sister Rose)
1936 G M Kolesnikov cosmonaut
1938 Robert Drivas Chi, actor (Cool Hand Luke, Illustrated Man) [or 11/21]
1939 Colin Cooper rocker
1940 Bruce F Vento (Rep-D-Minnesota, 1977- )
and Dino Valenti rocker
and Richard H Stallings (Rep-D-ID, 1985- )
1941 Martin Murray, London England, rocker (Honeycombs)
and Tony Sylvester rocker (Main Ingredient)
1943 Oliver L North US colonel (Irangate)
1945 Kevin Godley Manchester England, rock vocalist (10cc)
1949 Dave Hope rock bassist (Kansas)
and Kieran Kane Queens NY, singer (O'Kanes-Daddies Need to Grow Up Too)
1950 Maartje van Weegen [Walet], Dutch TV hostess
1951 Carmen R "Tata" Vega US soul singer (Color Purple soundtrack)
and John Cougar Mellencamp Seymour Indiana, rocker (Jack & Diane)
1952 Ludmila Tourischeva USSR, gymnist (Olympic-gold-1972)
1953 Christopher Norris NYC, actress (Summer of '42, Eat My Dust)
and Tico Torres rock drummer (Bon Jovi-Always)
1954 Victor Manuel Mar wrestler (AAA/NJPW, Black Cat)
1955 Yo-Yo Ma Paris France, world famous Chinese cellist
1956 James Van Patten Bkln NY, actor (Bo-Chisholms)
and Julio Pezua jockey
1957 Jayne Torvill England, ice skater (Torvill & Dean, Oly-gold-84)
1958 Kim Morris San Diego Ca, playmate (Mar, 1986)
1961 Judy Landers Phila, actress (Vega$, BJ & the Bear, Madame's Place)
1964 Ann Curless singer (Expos,-What You Don't Know)
and Sam Brown English singer/songwriter (Stop!)
1965 Juul Ellerman soccer player (PSV, FC Twente)
1968 Randy Bartz Roseville Minn, short track skater (Olympics-1994)
and Toni Braxton singer (You Mean the World to Me)
1974 Alexander Polinsky SF Calif, actor (Adam-Charles in Charge) Deaths
Which Occured October 7:
290 Sergius roman soldier/martyred saint, decapitated
336 Marcus bishop of Rome (336), dies
929 Charles III the Plain, King of France (893-929), dies
1488 Andrea del Verrochio sculptor/painter/goldsmith, dies at about 52
1571 Ali Pasha Turkish fleet commander, dies in battle
1612 Menso Alting reformed vicar/theologist, dies at 70
1639 John I Pontanus physicist/historian (Amsterdam), dies at 68
1660 Paul Scarron French, stagewriter (Le Roman Comique), dies at 50
1681 Nicolaas Heinsius philological/diplomat, dies at 61
1766 Andre Cheron composer, dies at 71
1777 Simon Fraser English general, dies in battle
1780 Patrick Ferguson English major in SC, dies in battle
1800 Gabriel slave revolt leader (Virginia), hanged
1811 August R van Hekeren of Suideras orangist, dies at 68
1849 Edgar Allen Poe poet (Raven), dies in Balt at 40
1864 Alexander Gardiner US Union brig-general, dies in battle
John Gregg US judge/Confederate brig-general, dies in battle at 36
1887 George James Webb composer, dies at 84
1890 John Hill Hewitt composer, dies at 89
1902 Mascha [Willemina JH] Van de Weene dancer/ballerina, dies
1915 Samuel Prowse Warren composer, dies at 74
1918 C Hubert H Parry Engl musicologist/composer (Jerusalem), dies at 70
Sir Charles Hubert Hastings Parry composer, dies at 70
1924 Clemens Baeumker German historian (Christian Philosophy), dies
1925 Hubert Platt Main composer, dies at 86
1939 Harvey (William) Cushing US neurologist, dies at 70
1951 Anton F Philips CEO (Philips), dies at 77
1959 Mario Lanza opera singer, dies at 38 of a heart attack
PM Kassem of Iraq assassinated
1962 Mauritius Dekker [Boris Robazki], writer (Boots in Jail), dies at 66
1963 Grace Darmond silent screen actress (Below the Surface), dies at 69
Gustaf Gr?ndgens actor/director/theatre director (M), dies at 63
1964 Eugen Varga Hungarian/Russian economist/politician, dies at 84
1966 Johnny Kidd rocker (Johnny Kidd & Pirates), dies at 26 in a car crash
Smiley Lewis [Overton Amos Lemons], rocker, dies at 46
1967 Norman Angell (Lane) English journalist/pacifist (Nobel 1933), dies
1969 Wim of Nuland [Willem C M"hlmann], priest/writer (Doorstep), dies
1976 Nikolai Lopatnikoff composer, dies at 73
1981 Wouter Paap composer, dies at 73
1988 Billy Daniels singer, dies of cancer at 73
1990 J Teengs Gerritsen resistance fighter, dies
John "Cat" Thompson basketball hall of famer, dies at 84
1991 Leo Durocher baseball coach/manager (Dodgers, Giants), dies at 86
1992 Allan Bloom author (Closing of American Mind), dies at 62
Ed Blackwell US jazz drummer (Quartet), dies
1993 Agnes de Mille choreographer (Oklahoma!, Rodeo), dies at 88
Cyril Cusack actor (Fahrenheit 451), dies of neuron disease at 82
Kenneth Nelson US/English actor (Boys in the Band), dies at 63
1994 Niels Kaj Jerne Danish immunologist (Nobel prize 1984), dies
Paul Swift US actor (Egg Man in Pink Flamingo), dies of AIDS at 60
Holidays Which Occur October 7:
Fiji Deed of Cession (1874)
German Dem Rep Foundation of German Democratic Republic (1949)
Libya Evacuation Day Religious Observances on October 7:
RC Sweden St Birgitta of Sweden, Swedish monastery founder
RC Justina, martyr/patron of Padua/Venice
RC Memorial of Our Lady of Rosary
RC Pope Mark
RC Wolfgang, bishop of Regensburg
290 ORC SS Bacchus & Sergius, roman soldier/martyr
700 Christian Commemoration of St Osith, Saxon virgin/martyr
1787 Luth Commemoration of Henry M?hlenberg, missionary to America Things to
Remember for October 7:
Flowers-calendula, cosmos & hops Gem-opal & tourmaline
Hispanic Heritage Month
National Lupus Month-Eggtober-Computer Learning Month
National Restaurant-Car Maintance Month-Rocktober-Octoberfess
1 Day Harvest Moon Days (full moon closest to equinox)
15 Days Astrological sign: Libra
[Ancient Rome] Nonae October
[Sweden] Birgitta name day Highlights in History Which Occur October 7:
336 St Mark ends his reign as Catholic Pope
1506 Pope Julius II & France occupy Bologna
1520 1st public burning of books in Netherlands
1571 Battle at Lepanto: Saint League destroys Turkish fleet
and Turkish fleet defeated by Spanish & Italians in Battle of Lepanto
1579 English royal marriage of queen Elizabeth I to duke of Anjou
1637 Prince Frederik Henry occupies Breda
1690 English attack Quebec under Louis de Buade
1702 English/Dutch troops under Marlborough occupy Roermond
1714 People riot due to beer tax
1737 40 foot waves sink 20,000 small craft & kill 300,000 (Bengal, India)
1763 Great-Britain puts firm boundaries on North American colonization
1765 Stamp Act Congress convenes in NY
1777 Americans beat Brits in 2nd Battle of Saratoga & Battle of Bemis Hts
1780 British defeated by American militia near Kings Mountain, SC
1816 1st double decked steamboat, Washington, arrives in New Orleans

ccRyderzz

radiohead33 wrote:

I make no bones about my dislike of obama and that i will not vote for him.

However the stuff going around now seems so outrageous one has to wonder where it stops, and whats the end result?

It seems from the Youtube interviews of Mccain supporters and just the whole "fox news" mentality is this: Obama is a muslim and a terrorist supporter. That he is a radical.

To these people, thats a fact. No one can prove them wrong because they believe these are facts.

Thats why I dont think Obama will win. There are thousands maybe millions of people who think obama is a muslim and a terrorist supporter. Millions more who are racist and will not vote for him, solely on the fact his skin tone is dark.

I think also, if he does get elected, as I stated in previous threads and posts, sadly alot of people, will want him dead.

If people are shouting "kill" "bomb" and "off with his head", and people are "scared" of a obama presidency, just think the mayhem that will ensue if he gets into the white house.

As I said, I dont support obama, he isnt a candidate I like. That said he isnt a muslim, or terrorist lover.

Memorial for longtime state worker at Capitol
Saturday, August 30, 2008
The Oregonian
SALEM -- A public memorial service for Marc "Ted" Winters, an aide to two
governors and husband of state Sen. Jackie Winters, will be at 2 p.m.
Friday, Sept. 5, in the Senate chambers at the Oregon Capitol.

Winters died Tuesday at age 84.

Winters worked for state government for 15 years, including seven years as
staff to former Govs. Tom McCall and Bob Straub.

Advertisement






During the McCall administration, he served as director of the state
Economic Opportunity Office. He helped to establish the Housing Division,
which later became the Oregon Housing and Community Services Department.

As a private citizen, he founded MAJAC Institute and New Life Christian
Network Inc., a post-prison ministry. Along with his wife, Winters fed
"Jackie's Ribs" in their restaurants and at cook-offs.

In lieu of flowers, the family requests donations to Family Building Blocks
or the Yatima Group Fund, both nonprofits in Salem.

-- Michelle Cole

Anon

ccRyderzz wrote:

and Simon Carmiggelt journalist (The Slogan)
1914 Alfred Drake [Capurro], Brooklyn NY, singer/actor (Kiss Me Kate)
and Sarah Churchill London, actress (All Over Town, Royal Wedding)
1915 Margarita J Aliger Russian poet (Zoja) [NS]
and Roman Padlewski composer
1916 Walt W Rostow economist (Politics & Stages of Growth)
1917 Helmut Dantine Vienna Austria, actor (Shadow of the Cloak)
and June Allyson Bronx, actress (Till the Clouds Roll By, Vegas)
1919 Erik Elms"ter Sweden, 1st to compete in summer & winter Oly (1948)
and Gabriel Dell Barbados, actor (Steve Allen Show)
1920 Georg Leber German politician (SPD)
1921 John A G Gere English art historian (Pre-Raphaelite painter)
1922 Martha Stewart Bardwell Ky, singer/actress (Daisy Kenyon, Doll Face)
and Reina Princeen Geerligs [Leentjes Vandendriesch], antifascist
1926 Diana Lynn LA CA, actress (Annapolis Story, Easy Come Easy Go)
and Ivan Jirko composer
and Marcello Abbado composer
1927 Al Martino Phila, singer (Here in My Heart)/actor (Godfather)
and Ronald Laing British psychiatrist (anti-psychiatrist)
1931 Desmond Tutu Anglican Archbishop of S Afr (Nobel Peace Prize 1982)
1932 Joannes M G~sen Bishop of Roermond
1933 Paul B Price Cataret NJ, actor (Busting Loose)
1934 Imamu Amiri Baraka [Everett Leroi Jones], US, poet/writer
and Ulrike Meinhof lead German Red Army
and Willie Naulls NBA star (NY Knicks)
and [Everett] LeRoi Jones [Amiri Baraka], US writer (Black Music)
1935 Thomas M Keneally Australia, novelist (Blood Red Sister Rose)
1936 G M Kolesnikov cosmonaut
1938 Robert Drivas Chi, actor (Cool Hand Luke, Illustrated Man) [or 11/21]
1939 Colin Cooper rocker
1940 Bruce F Vento (Rep-D-Minnesota, 1977- )
and Dino Valenti rocker
and Richard H Stallings (Rep-D-ID, 1985- )
1941 Martin Murray, London England, rocker (Honeycombs)
and Tony Sylvester rocker (Main Ingredient)
1943 Oliver L North US colonel (Irangate)
1945 Kevin Godley Manchester England, rock vocalist (10cc)
1949 Dave Hope rock bassist (Kansas)
and Kieran Kane Queens NY, singer (O'Kanes-Daddies Need to Grow Up Too)
1950 Maartje van Weegen [Walet], Dutch TV hostess
1951 Carmen R "Tata" Vega US soul singer (Color Purple soundtrack)
and John Cougar Mellencamp Seymour Indiana, rocker (Jack & Diane)
1952 Ludmila Tourischeva USSR, gymnist (Olympic-gold-1972)
1953 Christopher Norris NYC, actress (Summer of '42, Eat My Dust)
and Tico Torres rock drummer (Bon Jovi-Always)
1954 Victor Manuel Mar wrestler (AAA/NJPW, Black Cat)
1955 Yo-Yo Ma Paris France, world famous Chinese cellist
1956 James Van Patten Bkln NY, actor (Bo-Chisholms)
and Julio Pezua jockey
1957 Jayne Torvill England, ice skater (Torvill & Dean, Oly-gold-84)
1958 Kim Morris San Diego Ca, playmate (Mar, 1986)
1961 Judy Landers Phila, actress (Vega$, BJ & the Bear, Madame's Place)
1964 Ann Curless singer (Expos,-What You Don't Know)
and Sam Brown English singer/songwriter (Stop!)
1965 Juul Ellerman soccer player (PSV, FC Twente)
1968 Randy Bartz Roseville Minn, short track skater (Olympics-1994)
and Toni Braxton singer (You Mean the World to Me)
1974 Alexander Polinsky SF Calif, actor (Adam-Charles in Charge) Deaths
Which Occured October 7:
290 Sergius roman soldier/martyred saint, decapitated
336 Marcus bishop of Rome (336), dies
929 Charles III the Plain, King of France (893-929), dies
1488 Andrea del Verrochio sculptor/painter/goldsmith, dies at about 52
1571 Ali Pasha Turkish fleet commander, dies in battle
1612 Menso Alting reformed vicar/theologist, dies at 70
1639 John I Pontanus physicist/historian (Amsterdam), dies at 68
1660 Paul Scarron French, stagewriter (Le Roman Comique), dies at 50
1681 Nicolaas Heinsius philological/diplomat, dies at 61
1766 Andre Cheron composer, dies at 71
1777 Simon Fraser English general, dies in battle
1780 Patrick Ferguson English major in SC, dies in battle
1800 Gabriel slave revolt leader (Virginia), hanged
1811 August R van Hekeren of Suideras orangist, dies at 68
1849 Edgar Allen Poe poet (Raven), dies in Balt at 40
1864 Alexander Gardiner US Union brig-general, dies in battle
John Gregg US judge/Confederate brig-general, dies in battle at 36
1887 George James Webb composer, dies at 84
1890 John Hill Hewitt composer, dies at 89
1902 Mascha [Willemina JH] Van de Weene dancer/ballerina, dies
1915 Samuel Prowse Warren composer, dies at 74
1918 C Hubert H Parry Engl musicologist/composer (Jerusalem), dies at 70
Sir Charles Hubert Hastings Parry composer, dies at 70
1924 Clemens Baeumker German historian (Christian Philosophy), dies
1925 Hubert Platt Main composer, dies at 86
1939 Harvey (William) Cushing US neurologist, dies at 70
1951 Anton F Philips CEO (Philips), dies at 77
1959 Mario Lanza opera singer, dies at 38 of a heart attack
PM Kassem of Iraq assassinated
1962 Mauritius Dekker [Boris Robazki], writer (Boots in Jail), dies at 66
1963 Grace Darmond silent screen actress (Below the Surface), dies at 69
Gustaf Gr?ndgens actor/director/theatre director (M), dies at 63
1964 Eugen Varga Hungarian/Russian economist/politician, dies at 84
1966 Johnny Kidd rocker (Johnny Kidd & Pirates), dies at 26 in a car crash
Smiley Lewis [Overton Amos Lemons], rocker, dies at 46
1967 Norman Angell (Lane) English journalist/pacifist (Nobel 1933), dies
1969 Wim of Nuland [Willem C M"hlmann], priest/writer (Doorstep), dies
1976 Nikolai Lopatnikoff composer, dies at 73
1981 Wouter Paap composer, dies at 73
1988 Billy Daniels singer, dies of cancer at 73
1990 J Teengs Gerritsen resistance fighter, dies
John "Cat" Thompson basketball hall of famer, dies at 84
1991 Leo Durocher baseball coach/manager (Dodgers, Giants), dies at 86
1992 Allan Bloom author (Closing of American Mind), dies at 62
Ed Blackwell US jazz drummer (Quartet), dies
1993 Agnes de Mille choreographer (Oklahoma!, Rodeo), dies at 88
Cyril Cusack actor (Fahrenheit 451), dies of neuron disease at 82
Kenneth Nelson US/English actor (Boys in the Band), dies at 63
1994 Niels Kaj Jerne Danish immunologist (Nobel prize 1984), dies
Paul Swift US actor (Egg Man in Pink Flamingo), dies of AIDS at 60
Holidays Which Occur October 7:
Fiji Deed of Cession (1874)
German Dem Rep Foundation of German Democratic Republic (1949)
Libya Evacuation Day Religious Observances on October 7:
RC Sweden St Birgitta of Sweden, Swedish monastery founder
RC Justina, martyr/patron of Padua/Venice
RC Memorial of Our Lady of Rosary
RC Pope Mark
RC Wolfgang, bishop of Regensburg
290 ORC SS Bacchus & Sergius, roman soldier/martyr
700 Christian Commemoration of St Osith, Saxon virgin/martyr
1787 Luth Commemoration of Henry M?hlenberg, missionary to America Things to
Remember for October 7:
Flowers-calendula, cosmos & hops Gem-opal & tourmaline
Hispanic Heritage Month
National Lupus Month-Eggtober-Computer Learning Month
National Restaurant-Car Maintance Month-Rocktober-Octoberfess
1 Day Harvest Moon Days (full moon closest to equinox)
15 Days Astrological sign: Libra
[Ancient Rome] Nonae October
[Sweden] Birgitta name day Highlights in History Which Occur October 7:
336 St Mark ends his reign as Catholic Pope
1506 Pope Julius II & France occupy Bologna
1520 1st public burning of books in Netherlands
1571 Battle at Lepanto: Saint League destroys Turkish fleet
and Turkish fleet defeated by Spanish & Italians in Battle of Lepanto
1579 English royal marriage of queen Elizabeth I to duke of Anjou
1637 Prince Frederik Henry occupies Breda
1690 English attack Quebec under Louis de Buade
1702 English/Dutch troops under Marlborough occupy Roermond
1714 People riot due to beer tax
1737 40 foot waves sink 20,000 small craft & kill 300,000 (Bengal, India)
1763 Great-Britain puts firm boundaries on North American colonization
1765 Stamp Act Congress convenes in NY
1777 Americans beat Brits in 2nd Battle of Saratoga & Battle of Bemis Hts
1780 British defeated by American militia near Kings Mountain, SC
1816 1st double decked steamboat, Washington, arrives in New Orleans

Just replying cause you quoted me
Ok, so the 7th of October is the thing in common. I get that.

I'm lost. I want my phone call.

ccRyderzz

radiohead33 wrote:

I make no bones about my dislike of obama and that i will not vote for him.

However the stuff going around now seems so outrageous one has to wonder where it stops, and whats the end result?

It seems from the Youtube interviews of Mccain supporters and just the whole "fox news" mentality is this: Obama is a muslim and a terrorist supporter. That he is a radical.

To these people, thats a fact. No one can prove them wrong because they believe these are facts.

Thats why I dont think Obama will win. There are thousands maybe millions of people who think obama is a muslim and a terrorist supporter. Millions more who are racist and will not vote for him, solely on the fact his skin tone is dark.

I think also, if he does get elected, as I stated in previous threads and posts, sadly alot of people, will want him dead.

If people are shouting "kill" "bomb" and "off with his head", and people are "scared" of a obama presidency, just think the mayhem that will ensue if he gets into the white house.

As I said, I dont support obama, he isnt a candidate I like. That said he isnt a muslim, or terrorist lover.

Which individual human beings who are victims of military mind control
research do we already know? Harold Blauer, the tennis pro who was
killed. Frank Olson who was killed because he jumped through a window
because he took LSD mixed with Cointro by Sidney Gottlieb,
administrative Head of MKULTRA who I talked to on the telephone. When
was the Olson family compensated? He died in 1955 or something. They
were compensated by the President in 1977 I think it was. The reason the
wife and surviving children figured that in fact this was not a simple
suicide was they read the Rockefeller Report on CIA activities published
in 1975 in which the case was described without him being named. So,
they are reading the Rockefeller Report, and they realize their
husband/father was actually killed by experimental LSD and they are
compensated for 3/4 of a million dollars. One of the people who
testified at the Committee hearings at the S enate in 1975 was a
technician for Amadeo Morazzi who was the guy who w as the Head of
Edgeware Arsenal where Paul Hawk got his LSD and mescaline from who was
funded by the Air Force while he was at the University of Minnesota.
His research assistant whose name is Mary Ray(sp) was given a dose of
experimental LSD which resulted in an acute psychotic state for which
she was admitted to hospital for which I have her medical records, and I
am in contact with her lawyer and I am going to go up and get her story
in more detail. She talks about a room that was involved in the LSD
research called "The Leaf Room" so when you were on your LSD trip that
was administered by Amadeo Morazzi you were taken into the Leaf Room
which was a room where all surfaces of the room were totally covered
with leaves. This is weird stuff. She also was connected into a bunch
of other stuff. I am not going to go into all of it, because it is a
little weird, but it is two hops from Mary Ray to Iran Contra. So she is
a real person who exists. I know her lawyer. I talked to her lawyer on
the phone. I am going to fly up there. I am going to interview her. I
have her medical records. And the way this works is the stuff that is
happening now is not going to be declassified for 20 or 30 years.
Eventually we will have the names of people who were victims of
experiments in the 70's and 80's and 90's. We already have the names for
the 50's and 60's, not really into the 70's. We have the names of
specific people who were victims of the Tuscagee Syphilis Study and the
radiation experiments into the 70's. That's the way it goes. You are
just pushing back that curtain and there's always this lag time because
you are relying on the views of the Intelligence Community or public
apathy ... "it was back in the Cold War" "it's different now" "we joined
the boy scouts and we don't do that anymore". So there is always a
disinformation strategy for wh y it happened a long time ago and we
don't do it now and we are very regretful and we are so regretful that
we in fact agree to compensate these victims. In Oregon there was a
prison where men were paid to be subjects to participate in radiation
experiments. Their testicles had been irradiated so they would get paid
a certain fee to participate in the radiation of their testicles.
Special arrangements were made so Catholics couldn't participate in the
study because they couldn't use birth control so they might give birth
to genetically mutated children ... so it had to be only non-Catholic
participants. There was an extra fee, it was a little bit fatter, if you
would agree to testicle biopsy to see if the radiation was dropping the
sperm count. When 9 of these people pressed their case to the State
Legislature in Oregon in either the late 70's or early 80's, in its
magnanimity, the Legislature agreed to compensate them for a total of
$3000 for all nine subjects. So this is the way it goes in trying to
document this stuff and trying to make it public and identify the
specific individuals. IT'S A BIG SLOW JOB. And when you make Freedom of
Information requests it's like interacting with any Federal Bureaucracy.

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