I'm disappointed...
meme
Posts: 4,695
And please everyone, be mindful of the implications of giving money to moveon as opposed to the campaign itself.
Obama opts out of public campaign finance system
By JIM KUHNHENN, Associated Press Writer
12 minutes ago
WASHINGTON - Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama said Thursday he'll bypass the federal public financing system in the general election, abandoning an earlier commitment to take the money if his Republican rival did as well.
Obama, who set records raising money in the primary election, will forgo more than $84 million that would have been available to him in the general election. He would be the first candidate to do so since Congress passed 1970s post-Watergate campaign finance laws. Sen. John McCain, the Republican nominee in waiting, has taken steps to accept the public funds in the general election.
Obama officials said they decided to take that route because McCain is already spending privately raised funds toward the general election campaign. Obama has vastly outraised McCain, however, and would likely retain that advantage as McCain said he would most likely remain under the limits of the federal financing plan but had not made a final decision.
"It's not an easy decision, and especially because I support a robust system of public financing of elections," Obama told supporters in a video message Thursday. "But the public financing of presidential elections as it exists today is broken, and we face opponents who've become masters at gaming this broken system."
Shortly after revealing the decision, Obama's campaign announced his first television ad of the general election campaign — a 60-second commercial to air in 18 states. The ad, called "Country I Love," is a biographical portrait that aims to reintroduce Obama to voters by stressing his mother's family's roots.
Obama has shattered presidential campaign fundraising records, raking in more than $265 million as of the end of April. Of that, nearly $10 million was for the general election. McCain, on the other hand had raised nearly $115 million by the end of May,
But Obama's clear financial advantage over McCain is offset in part by the resources of the Republican National Committee, which has far more money in the bank than the Democratic National Committee. Both national parties can spend money on behalf of the presidential candidates.
In Iowa, McCain criticized his rival for backtracking, reminding reporters that Obama "said he would stick to his word. He didn't." The Republican candidate added, "This election is about a lot of things. It's also about trust. It's about keeping your word."
Obama said McCain and the Republican National Committee are fueled by contributions from Washington lobbyists and political action committees.
"And we've already seen that he's not going to stop the smears and attacks from his allies running so-called 527 groups, who will spend millions and millions of dollars in unlimited donations," Obama said.
Obama campaign lawyer Robert Bauer said he had met with McCain lawyers to discuss terms for both campaigns operating in the public financing system, but he said they could not agree on how to limit spending by the campaigns and outside groups heading into the late summer party conventions.
He said McCain has had an advantage because he has been running unopposed since he secured the Republican nomination early this year. "The important thing is that John McCain has been running a privately financed campaign for the general election since February," Bauer said. "The problem from our perspective is that the horse is long gone from the barn here."
Despite Obama's claim that outside groups allied with McCain will spend millions of dollars against him, few Republican-leaning groups have weighed into the presidential contest so far. In fact, Obama allies such as MoveOn.org are the ones have been spending money on advertising against McCain.
McCain and Obama both declined public financing in the primary contests, thus avoiding the spending limits that come attached to the money. McCain had initially applied for the money, however, and has been in a dispute with the Federal Election Commission over whether he needs commission approval to decline the primary election funds. The FEC insists that he does, but has not had a quorum to act because four of its six seats have been vacant pending Senate confirmation of presidential nominees. McCain lawyers have disputed the need for FEC approval.
Fred Wertheimer, president of the campaign finance watchdog group Democracy 21, said he was "disappointed" in Obama's decision. "We do not agree with Senator Obama's rationale for opting out of the system," he said. "Senator Obama knew the circumstances surrounding the presidential general election when he made his public pledge to use the system."
The public finance system is paid for with the $3 contributions that taxpayers can make to the presidential fund in their tax returns.
Last year, both Obama and McCain indicated in separate commitments that they would participate in the public system for the general election, as long as both candidates agreed.
In response to a questionnaire in November from the Midwest Democracy Network, which is made up of nonpartisan government oversight groups, Obama said: "Senator John McCain has already pledged to accept this fundraising pledge. If I am the Democratic nominee, I will aggressively pursue an agreement with the Republican nominee to preserve a publicly financed general election."
While presidential candidates have rejected public financing in primaries, no major party candidate has bypassed the system in the general election.
McCain has already aired two general election ads in at least 11 states, spending about $2 million a week over the past three weeks.
Obama's new ad is his first and expands the field of potential battleground states to include states that have reliably voted for Republican presidential candidates in the past several elections, including Alaska, Colorado, Georgia, North Carolina, Virginia, Indiana, Montana, and North Dakota.
"I was raised by a single mom and my grandparents," Obama says in the ad. "We didn't have much money, but they taught me values straight from the Kansas heartland where they grew up. I'll never forget those values, and if I have the honor of taking the oath of office as President, it will be with a deep and abiding faith in the country I love."
Obama opts out of public campaign finance system
By JIM KUHNHENN, Associated Press Writer
12 minutes ago
WASHINGTON - Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama said Thursday he'll bypass the federal public financing system in the general election, abandoning an earlier commitment to take the money if his Republican rival did as well.
Obama, who set records raising money in the primary election, will forgo more than $84 million that would have been available to him in the general election. He would be the first candidate to do so since Congress passed 1970s post-Watergate campaign finance laws. Sen. John McCain, the Republican nominee in waiting, has taken steps to accept the public funds in the general election.
Obama officials said they decided to take that route because McCain is already spending privately raised funds toward the general election campaign. Obama has vastly outraised McCain, however, and would likely retain that advantage as McCain said he would most likely remain under the limits of the federal financing plan but had not made a final decision.
"It's not an easy decision, and especially because I support a robust system of public financing of elections," Obama told supporters in a video message Thursday. "But the public financing of presidential elections as it exists today is broken, and we face opponents who've become masters at gaming this broken system."
Shortly after revealing the decision, Obama's campaign announced his first television ad of the general election campaign — a 60-second commercial to air in 18 states. The ad, called "Country I Love," is a biographical portrait that aims to reintroduce Obama to voters by stressing his mother's family's roots.
Obama has shattered presidential campaign fundraising records, raking in more than $265 million as of the end of April. Of that, nearly $10 million was for the general election. McCain, on the other hand had raised nearly $115 million by the end of May,
But Obama's clear financial advantage over McCain is offset in part by the resources of the Republican National Committee, which has far more money in the bank than the Democratic National Committee. Both national parties can spend money on behalf of the presidential candidates.
In Iowa, McCain criticized his rival for backtracking, reminding reporters that Obama "said he would stick to his word. He didn't." The Republican candidate added, "This election is about a lot of things. It's also about trust. It's about keeping your word."
Obama said McCain and the Republican National Committee are fueled by contributions from Washington lobbyists and political action committees.
"And we've already seen that he's not going to stop the smears and attacks from his allies running so-called 527 groups, who will spend millions and millions of dollars in unlimited donations," Obama said.
Obama campaign lawyer Robert Bauer said he had met with McCain lawyers to discuss terms for both campaigns operating in the public financing system, but he said they could not agree on how to limit spending by the campaigns and outside groups heading into the late summer party conventions.
He said McCain has had an advantage because he has been running unopposed since he secured the Republican nomination early this year. "The important thing is that John McCain has been running a privately financed campaign for the general election since February," Bauer said. "The problem from our perspective is that the horse is long gone from the barn here."
Despite Obama's claim that outside groups allied with McCain will spend millions of dollars against him, few Republican-leaning groups have weighed into the presidential contest so far. In fact, Obama allies such as MoveOn.org are the ones have been spending money on advertising against McCain.
McCain and Obama both declined public financing in the primary contests, thus avoiding the spending limits that come attached to the money. McCain had initially applied for the money, however, and has been in a dispute with the Federal Election Commission over whether he needs commission approval to decline the primary election funds. The FEC insists that he does, but has not had a quorum to act because four of its six seats have been vacant pending Senate confirmation of presidential nominees. McCain lawyers have disputed the need for FEC approval.
Fred Wertheimer, president of the campaign finance watchdog group Democracy 21, said he was "disappointed" in Obama's decision. "We do not agree with Senator Obama's rationale for opting out of the system," he said. "Senator Obama knew the circumstances surrounding the presidential general election when he made his public pledge to use the system."
The public finance system is paid for with the $3 contributions that taxpayers can make to the presidential fund in their tax returns.
Last year, both Obama and McCain indicated in separate commitments that they would participate in the public system for the general election, as long as both candidates agreed.
In response to a questionnaire in November from the Midwest Democracy Network, which is made up of nonpartisan government oversight groups, Obama said: "Senator John McCain has already pledged to accept this fundraising pledge. If I am the Democratic nominee, I will aggressively pursue an agreement with the Republican nominee to preserve a publicly financed general election."
While presidential candidates have rejected public financing in primaries, no major party candidate has bypassed the system in the general election.
McCain has already aired two general election ads in at least 11 states, spending about $2 million a week over the past three weeks.
Obama's new ad is his first and expands the field of potential battleground states to include states that have reliably voted for Republican presidential candidates in the past several elections, including Alaska, Colorado, Georgia, North Carolina, Virginia, Indiana, Montana, and North Dakota.
"I was raised by a single mom and my grandparents," Obama says in the ad. "We didn't have much money, but they taught me values straight from the Kansas heartland where they grew up. I'll never forget those values, and if I have the honor of taking the oath of office as President, it will be with a deep and abiding faith in the country I love."
... and the will to show I will always be better than before.
Post edited by Unknown User on
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Comments
i understand your disappointment, but i also understand that one can, in time, realize they need to take a different route to get where they want to go. i think seeing the funds and knowing what he's up against.....he realizes he needs the funds more to fight to win. if mccain does indeed have a lot more $$$ support thru the republican party than obama would have through the dems, i think he is being pragmatic and realizes that mccain still would have a financial advantage, even if they got matching public funds. it is ridiculous that so much comes down to money.....but that's the game, isn't it?
Let's just breathe...
I am myself like you somehow
what do you all think about this from the article? VERY INTERESTING?
- Soren Aabye Kierkegaard (1813-1855)
If you haven't got anything nice to say about anybody, come sit next to me."
- Alice Roosevelt Longworth (1884-1980)
i think b/c they haven't had to....yet. obama just got the nod, NOW the real race begins. up until this point, NO one knew for certain who mccain would be up against, so why lay out the $$$ until ya do? now that the candidates are set.....game-time i would imagine. just my thought process on it in any case.
Let's just breathe...
I am myself like you somehow
I just think that's it's VERY early... and unless I am missing something, the only moveon ad that I've seen so far is that one with the mother and baby about the McCain's 100 year war. So it's not like they have been spending a bunch of money.
We'll see the 527 attacks from both sides, but I really don't expect to see them until around/after convention time... hell, Obama has only been the "presumptive" nominee for like 3 weeks.
These political groups don't have tons of money, so blowing it all now on an ad that people will forget about in a month is a big waste of money.
was like a picture
of a sunny day
“We can complain because rose bushes have thorns, or rejoice because thorn bushes have roses.”
― Abraham Lincoln
I agree with you but it seems that if Obama believes that they have been gunning for him already i would be afraid later on when the race really starts
- Soren Aabye Kierkegaard (1813-1855)
If you haven't got anything nice to say about anybody, come sit next to me."
- Alice Roosevelt Longworth (1884-1980)
oh god, i hate that comm. it so spinned its bad. i feel like telling the mom that if her son signs up for the army that it really is his fault. just for teh record McCain nver said that we would be fighting in Iraq for 100 years.
- Soren Aabye Kierkegaard (1813-1855)
If you haven't got anything nice to say about anybody, come sit next to me."
- Alice Roosevelt Longworth (1884-1980)
McCains cheif financial advisor is Phil freakin Graham, the same guy who wrtoe the laws that allowed the Enron Scandal, the Housing crisis, and the current price gouging in the oil markets. i think it's quite clear who's lobbied up and who is taking a different approach.
Enron- they create an energy trading arm of the company, withhold supply, artificially inflate the price with the tradign company, and then sell at the higher price. Sound familiar? It's Basically what's going on right now with oil. Graham also rewrote the laws governing investment banks to allow lending institutions to lend money based on stated income, and then sell those loans to an investment bank. thay way, the traders make a bundle and when the bubble bursts, the loans at that ponit belong to the investment bank and the losses get passed on to us in the form of tax payer bailouts of firms like Bear Stern. I know i'm on a tangent, but there's a major difference between these guys, I can't see how anyone could vote for McCain. I just can't. If McCain becomes president, Phil graham will be in his cabinet and if you think you're getting raped now, you aint seen nothin yet.
"Beer is living proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy."
- Ben Franklin
the quote you posted clearly states he thinks they WILL BE, not that they are now. i agree, good to have the forethought now, realize what's in the best interest of your campaign if you truly want to get elected to affect change. i can't nor won't guess at what he might be thinking.....just what my own thoughts are, and what i iamgine would be possible scenarios to consider.
edit
the quote:
"Despite Obama's claim that outside groups allied with McCain will spend millions of dollars against him, few Republican-leaning groups have weighed into the presidential contest so far."
so doesn't mean they ARE, or that he thinks the are, right now.....but that he thinks they will. i'd have to agree with that thought process too. he's only now become the dem nom, so makes sense it wouldn't have started, yet.
Let's just breathe...
I am myself like you somehow
Yeah, the commercial is bad... it's relying entirely on emotion instead of actual thinking.
Off on a tangent... I know what McCain was saying with the 100 years thing, but I just think he's delusional to think that Iraq will be so stable that we can leave american forces there, and they won't be targets. Just the thought that a handful of years after an invasion, and a propped up gov't, that we will be able to undo to hundreds of years of tension and ethnic warfare in the middle east and safely keep troops there.
was like a picture
of a sunny day
“We can complain because rose bushes have thorns, or rejoice because thorn bushes have roses.”
― Abraham Lincoln
Well, I just unsubscribed from moveon's list. I think they did a great job in the past few years and I worked with them in 2004. That was a different time though. I really think now they are distraction.
dream, I understand what you are saying. I just feel reneging on one's word because "the system is broken" puts Obama on a slippery slope I wish he had stayed away from.
Get McCain locked into a limit before becoming the clear dem candidate meanwhile continue to rake in record numbers in donations. Then when it's time to cap the spending, well...
I hope this doesn't mean we're in store for a whole lotta of playing dumb and the-situation-changed-so-I-had-to-adapt-my-policy sort of speeches.
No, we are. And people will continue to buy his shit. It's gonna be like waiting for the girlfriend with the charming but shitty boyfriend to finally see the light. :cool:
***********************
"We've laid the groundwork. It's like planting the seeds. And next year, it's spring." - Nader
***********************
Prepare for tending to your garden, America.
"Buy his shit?" again, look how lobbied up Mccain is and look who's funding Obamas campaign- namely us. regular hard working people. You can't see the stark differece? It's the difference between a guy who goes into office owing favors to big oil, big pharaceuticals, Insurance industry, etc. and a guy who goes into office owing no favors to such groups and is interested in creating transparency and accountability in government. i suppose you just think he's ful of shit, but i think you're just being cynical.
This was a smart and pragmatic decision. Just because the RNC hasn't flooded the tube with ads yet doesn't man anything. they know the attention span of Americans, they'll do an all out blitz from August on. The only way he can compete is to keep raising money on his own because he can raise a hell of a lot more than 84 mil. And there's nothing wrong with the way he's raising money. He's said repeatedly that he is for a fair public funding system but that involved reinnig in the 527s too, and right now, with public financing as it stands, he's making the smart decision by continuing to raise money from millions of small donations. McCain will have the RNC fundign 527's to the tuner of $250 million dollars as they have stated, and Obama will raise his own money, which can probably match the $250 Mil.
Will Moveon.org do their ads? yes, and as long as they don't go below the belt and make unsupported insinuations i don't have a problme with it. et's get real. The Ads coming from the right will have zero substance and will basically be attacks on his Wife, taking the "pride" comment out of context, they'll Rev. Wright, etc. all insinuations and guilt by association stuff but no real substance. I seriosuly doubt you'll see that kind of thing cxomign from Obama or moveon for that matter. they don't need to. There's plenty of legitimate stuff you can attack McCain on wtihout having to get dirty.
Nader people kill me. If Nader is so virtuous and principled, then why is it that we only hear from the guy every 4 years? Where is he busting his balls in the intervening years to really help create a viable thrid party? I don't see it.
"Beer is living proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy."
- Ben Franklin
sounds like a perfectly reasonable and plausible explanation. i have no problem with it.
"Obama's main opponent in this election on November 4th (was) not John McCain, it (was) ignorance."~Michael Moore
"i'm feeling kinda righteous right now. with my badass motherfuckin' ukulele!"
~ed, 8/7
"Beer is living proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy."
- Ben Franklin
I don't know, sounds like "everybody does it so..."
In this thread Obama is excused because that is just how the game is played, unfortunately. In the thread about the Muslim women not being part of the photo op it was excused because that is how the game is played. Unfortunately, it sounds like he wants to be a great player of the game rather than an principled leader. Too bad. I think principles are much more important that gamesmanship.
"Beer is living proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy."
- Ben Franklin
i don't 'excuse' anyone of anything.....i simply prefer to see the 'big picture' and for those who say they see the big picture and think differently, so be it. point is, one has to play the game to get IN the game....to BE a principled leader. we all have to 'play the game' in life to a certain extent and i don't think it at all interferes with my principles in the least. life is not black and white, i sure as shit don't expect campaigning/politicking to be either. and i am not even speaking of obama her per se....but in general. we all have differing viewpoints, bot for me.....you don't GET the opportunity to be leader - principled or not - if you don't play the game in our current system. yes the system does need changing.....but right NOW, this is where we are at, take it on from there.....
meme - as i said, i hear ya...and i agree.....but, it is what it is. it's unfortunate, but one has to best strategize as they can.
Let's just breathe...
I am myself like you somehow
Honesty and straight talk can be strategic. We, as Pearl Jam nuts, know this.
absolutely.
thing is though...sometimes strategies need to change, and perhps it was unwise to commit to a plan without fully realizing the implications of such down the road? i personally believe that is the case. hindsight is 20/20 and all that. no excuses though......it is sad to see. however, i can accept it b/c i personally understand the rationale behind it.
Let's just breathe...
I am myself like you somehow
didn't he get over $77MILLION from donations larger than $2,300??? hasn't he received millions from ceo's like a couple hundred thousand from Exelon's execs? aren't some of his biggest contributors citigroup, goldman sachs and other financial instituitions?
i think so...no, i know so
http://blog.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=blog.view&friendID=3927316&blogID=406835625
he had a voice that was strong and loud and
i swallowed his facade cos i'm so
eager to identify with
someone above the crowd
someone who seemed to feel the same
someone prepared to lead the way
From the article:
McCain and Obama both declined public financing in the primary contests, thus avoiding the spending limits that come attached to the money. McCain had initially applied for the money, however, and has been in a dispute with the Federal Election Commission over whether he needs commission approval to decline the primary election funds. The FEC insists that he does, but has not had a quorum to act because four of its six seats have been vacant pending Senate confirmation of presidential nominees. McCain lawyers have disputed the need for FEC approval.
Fred Wertheimer, president of the campaign finance watchdog group Democracy 21, said he was "disappointed" in Obama's decision. "We do not agree with Senator Obama's rationale for opting out of the system," he said. "Senator Obama knew the circumstances surrounding the presidential general election when he made his public pledge to use the system."
The public finance system is paid for with the $3 contributions that taxpayers can make to the presidential fund in their tax returns.
Last year, both Obama and McCain indicated in separate commitments that they would participate in the public system for the general election, as long as both candidates agreed.
In response to a questionnaire in November from the Midwest Democracy Network, which is made up of nonpartisan government oversight groups, Obama said: "Senator John McCain has already pledged to accept this fundraising pledge. If I am the Democratic nominee, I will aggressively pursue an agreement with the Republican nominee to preserve a publicly financed general election."
*****************************************************
It reads to me like he's locked into using the general fund and is locked into the limits that come with it - at least for now. I'm sure he'll lawyer his way out. However, if Obama had kept his word, this would be a non-issue.
The rest reads to me like Obama changed his mind, turned on his word, adapted as the game changed :rolleyes:, lied, made a move typical of a politician, whatever....
To me Obama's just another politician. However, he speaks really well, so much of the public is completely enamored with him. This makes me feel like whatever happens, if he can come up with some sing-song reasoning for his actions the public will give him leeway without expecting any substantial accountability.
It's a waste of charisma. He could use it to persuade America into real progressive change. So far, from his platform, I don't see that happening.
***********************
"We've laid the groundwork. It's like planting the seeds. And next year, it's spring." - Nader
***********************
Prepare for tending to your garden, America.
My god, you're really focusing in on this one thing. I bet if you ask the average obama supporter if they care that he decided not to take public money, they would say, fine whetever helps him. He's not breakin rule s, he's makign a pregmatic decision thast will help him compete down the stetch. and he's not taking special interest money so why would people be upset about that? The only people ranting about the "principle" of it are right wingers tryin to muddle his message of change.
it's not like he flip flopped on an issue that impacts our lives. he's just changing the way he plans to fund his campaign, so freakin waht? you're still overloking the major thing which is that HE's CREATING A GRASS ROOTS MOVEMENT FREE OF SPECIAL INTEREST MONEY AND MCCAIN IS LOBBIED UP TO HIS TEETH!!! have you ever kbnown him to posture or do complete 180's on issues such as women's rights, torture, off-shore drilling, or a host of other issues like McCain has? come on. when you find the perfect politician who does and says everything perfectly, you let me know. you only have two choices here. if you want more of the same shit, then go vote for McCain.
"Beer is living proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy."
- Ben Franklin
From your last quote of and response to my first post, I assumed you knew I was a Nader supporter. Maybe my sig gave it away.
***********************
"We've laid the groundwork. It's like planting the seeds. And next year, it's spring." - Nader
***********************
Prepare for tending to your garden, America.
There are more than two candidates, you know.
"Beer is living proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy."
- Ben Franklin
"Beer is living proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy."
- Ben Franklin
If Nader has no chance of winning, it's because people prefer to support candidates who are so principled, they go back on their word about their campaign funding. Your point about Nader building a third party was addressed fairly thoroughly in a thread a few pages back.
"Beer is living proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy."
- Ben Franklin
I wonder if the people who excuse Obama changing his mind on this also excused Hilary for deciding to campaign in Florida? That was just strategy, right?