Sorry. Mine was meant to be a little funny, too...ya know...leaf cancer.
Anyway, too much of anything is bad for a person. The sun can kill you if you lay out in it for days, of course. Anyway, sorry if I started anything. :(
No problem, Forestbrain! I got it!
So today I'm contributing to global cooling by changing my time zone to 5 hours later so that will help the Earth cool even earlier today.
And as far as sun is concerned, I'm off to London today, and I looked at the weather:
Sun?
haha,,,, well, I guess I better go buy an umbrella!
If anyone's going to London, see you there!
Be kind, man
Don't be mankind. ~Captain Beefheart
__________________________________
Ok, and today I came up with the multi billion dollar invention, patent pending,,,, the shower curtain that comes on a roll. so when it's funky you pull it and rip it off to expose new curtain material just like the roll of paper on the doctor's table!
OMG!!!!!!!! You're awesome! Can I be the first to buy one? Sorry, I don't mean to take away from the topic at hand.
Toronto II 2006/Lollapolooza 2007/MSG I 2008/MSG II 2008/Cleveland 2010/Buffalo 2010
EV Solo Montreal I/EV Solo Toronto I
I have recently concluded that daylight savings time is directly contributing to global warming.
Has anyone noticed our unusually warm spring this year? It started in my area RIGHT after we set the clocks forward. Daylight savings time started almost a month earlier than it did in prior years.
Setting the clocks forward has caused an extra hour of daylight which, of course, has a direct effect on the heating of the Earth.
I think that we can still help prevent further damage can still be prevented by setting the clocks BACK a month early in order to create an extra hour of darkness.
Thank you all for reading and I hope you write to your congressman!
This message brought to you by the makers of the painkillers I’m taking for my smucked up ankle.
daylight savings time also gave you an extra hour of darkness in the morning. the soltice is giving you longer hours of light; but don't fret. starting thursday; the hours of light per day will start decreasing. there's still 24 hours to a day. daylight savings time just trades an hour of darkness for an hour of light in the evenings. in the summer people tend to be outside enjoying the summer. we set the clocks back in fall so the sun rises earlier and begins to warm things sooner.
most people don't know what global warming really is. it was inproperly named and the general public doesn't have a clue.
I don't believe it because the sun is just as necessary as water. Just as important as dirt.
Can dirt cause cancer? Can water cause cancer? No. It's a crock. Do you know what happens to a person if they never get sun?
Why don't freakin plants get ...uh...what would you call it? leaf cancer? Did you ever stop to think that maybe it's something else that is causing the skin cancer?
i take it you're young. the sun wasn't a big problem until we blew a hole in the ozone layer which protected us from the radiation. man did that. it also seems you know nothing about global warming.
i take it you're young. the sun wasn't a big problem until we blew a hole in the ozone layer which protected us from the radiation. man did that. it also seems you know nothing about global warming.
Man did that? When exactly did we blow a hole in the ozone layer? I totally disagree. How long was the hole in the ozone layer before we created a tool to see and measure it? That hole could have been there for 300 million years but as soon as we were able to see it, it became a huge issue. Maybe that hole is a naturally occuring regulator intended to relieve the planet of excess heat or pollution (volcanoes have been erupting since the beginning of time, and they cause a little more pollution than we do).
We've been on earth for a tiny fraction in the timeline of the history of this planet. To suggest that humanity's activity over the last 150 years is the cause of climate change is absurd.
I expect to be crucified for having this opinion but the generally accepted party line really doesn't make any sense to me.
#==(o )
You are not your job.
You are not how much money you have in the bank.
You are not the car you drive.
You are not the contents of your wallet.
You are not your fucking khakis.
Man did that? When exactly did we blow a hole in the ozone layer? I totally disagree. How long was the hole in the ozone layer before we created a tool to see and measure it? That hole could have been there for 300 million years but as soon as we were able to see it, it became a huge issue. Maybe that hole is a naturally occuring regulator intended to relieve the planet of excess heat or pollution (volcanoes have been erupting since the beginning of time, and they cause a little more pollution than we do).
We've been on earth for a tiny fraction in the timeline of the history of this planet. To suggest that humanity's activity over the last 150 years is the cause of climate change is absurd.
I expect to be crucified for having this opinion but the generally accepted party line really doesn't make any sense to me.
why would you be crucified for not knowing any better? the hole in the ozone was caused by florocarbons released into the atmosphere. man is the sole reason for the hole because nothing occuring naturally could have made the hole. we were also able to measure the speed at which the hole was growing and based on that; a timeline was established which led to finding the cause.
you're right that man has only been here a short time compared to the life of the earth; but naturally occuring disasters have never been unreversable as the pollution man created has. when you think about how man has destroyed such a beautiful planet in such a short time; how can you not believe it was us?
why would you be crucified for not knowing any better? the hole in the ozone was caused by florocarbons released into the atmosphere. man is the sole reason for the hole because nothing occuring naturally could have made the hole. we were also able to measure the speed at which the hole was growing and based on that; a timeline was established which led to finding the cause.
you're right that man has only been here a short time compared to the life of the earth; but naturally occuring disasters have never been unreversable as the pollution man created has. when you think about how man has destroyed such a beautiful planet in such a short time; how can you not believe it was us?
I meant I'd be crucufied for having an unpopular opinion (like i have in the past), not specifically by you. Sorry if that's the way you took that...
Anyway, consider this...we got this "ozone layer hole measurer" turned on, we found this huge hole right over the north pole. We looked at it over a period of (I have no idea what the number is...) 10 - 25 years? We found that during this period that the hole was growing, so we applied some formulas and projected the findings over the next "X" number of years and concluded that based on the rate of expansion, if you went backwards in time, there must have been no hole "X" number of years ago. Like I said earlier, what if the hole has been there since the beginning of time? What if it goes through a 2000 year cycle of expansion and contraction, and we just happened to turn our cameras on to this hole during part of the expansion phase of the cycle?
All of the information that is reported to us is divided into two distinct categories, the first being raw data - for example - "there is a hole in the ozone layer" or "global temperatures are rising" or "global CO2 levels are higher than they have ever been." This data is fact and cannot be disputed. I'm not even disputing those facts, but...the second category is the assumptions and general consensus among A PORTION (albeit a large portion) of the scientific community. They take the real data, plug it into a super computer and project a scenario. The problem is that the data they are basing their projections on is so limited there's no way they can paint an accurate picture of what we can expect. As I posted earlier, Mars is getting warmer, and the only explanation we've got so far is that the sun is the cause (it's getting hotter). We know so little and assume so much. In the 70's we were convinced that we were on the verge of an ice age. I'm not sure if you knew that. Granted, we have better tools today than we had 30 years ago, but who can say that 30 years from now the tools we will have won't be better still, and maybe we'll find a hole in the ocean (that may have been there forever) and all of a sudden, that's the new fear being fed to us?
Politicians based their campaigns on how they were going to do their part to save the planet from the ice age. Now, 30 years later we're looking at things from the opposite side. I'm not saying you're wrong, and I wouldn't argue to death to prove I'm right, I just think (based on admittedly limited research) that we are not being told the whole story.
#==(o )
You are not your job.
You are not how much money you have in the bank.
You are not the car you drive.
You are not the contents of your wallet.
You are not your fucking khakis.
I meant I'd be crucufied for having an unpopular opinion (like i have in the past), not specifically by you. Sorry if that's the way you took that...
Anyway, consider this...we got this "ozone layer hole measurer" turned on, we found this huge hole right over the north pole. We looked at it over a period of (I have no idea what the number is...) 10 - 25 years? We found that during this period that the hole was growing, so we applied some formulas and projected the findings over the next "X" number of years and concluded that based on the rate of expansion, if you went backwards in time, there must have been no hole "X" number of years ago. Like I said earlier, what if the hole has been there since the beginning of time? What if it goes through a 2000 year cycle of expansion and contraction, and we just happened to turn our cameras on to this hole during part of the expansion phase of the cycle?
All of the information that is reported to us is divided into two distinct categories, the first being raw data - for example - "there is a hole in the ozone layer" or "global temperatures are rising" or "global CO2 levels are higher than they have ever been." This data is fact and cannot be disputed. I'm not even disputing those facts, but...the second category is the assumptions and general consensus among A PORTION (albeit a large portion) of the scientific community. They take the real data, plug it into a super computer and project a scenario. The problem is that the data they are basing their projections on is so limited there's no way they can paint an accurate picture of what we can expect. As I posted earlier, Mars is getting warmer, and the only explanation we've got so far is that the sun is the cause (it's getting hotter). We know so little and assume so much. In the 70's we were convinced that we were on the verge of an ice age. I'm not sure if you knew that. Granted, we have better tools today than we had 30 years ago, but who can say that 30 years from now the tools we will have won't be better still, and maybe we'll find a hole in the ocean (that may have been there forever) and all of a sudden, that's the new fear being fed to us?
Politicians based their campaigns on how they were going to do their part to save the planet from the ice age. Now, 30 years later we're looking at things from the opposite side. I'm not saying you're wrong, and I wouldn't argue to death to prove I'm right, I just think (based on admittedly limited research) that we are not being told the whole story.
i didn't take it that way at all. i just meant that everyone is entitled to their own opinion and you shouldn't be crucified for expressing it.
from what i remember; when the hole was discovered; it was quite small. it grew increasingly bigger each year. then spiro agnew came up with this plan to take the performance out of automobiles.
anyway; we ARE headed into an ice age. it's because of the earths eliptical orbit around the sun. we are moving farther from the sun and thus we are cooling. sounds like i'm full of sh**; right? this is where most people get confused. the earth is cooling and we're moving further from the sun so our atmosphere is cooling too. if temperatures stayed the same we'd have cause for concern. all indications point towards cooler temps yet we're staying the same. but we're getting warmer. a couple degrees don't seem like much but when we complete the "back side" of our orbit and start moving closer to the sun and thus our warming cycle; those couple degrees turn to several degrees.
i've completed my model of what's to come but i too won't devulge it because i know i'll be crucified. i think our cooling period is masking the true extent of the problem and that's why people boo-hoo global warming. i'll leave it at that.
i've completed my model of what's to come but i too won't devulge it because i know i'll be crucified. i think our cooling period is masking the true extent of the problem and that's why people boo-hoo global warming. i'll leave it at that.
OK, so then I guess that's the end of that...
#==(o )
You are not your job.
You are not how much money you have in the bank.
You are not the car you drive.
You are not the contents of your wallet.
You are not your fucking khakis.
I hear ya. It really is too bad that the "reasoned debate" part of the posting guidelines is ignored by so many people. This could have been fun and informative.
Oh well, off to argue about something else that I don't know a lot about but have an opinion on anyway...
#==(o )
You are not your job.
You are not how much money you have in the bank.
You are not the car you drive.
You are not the contents of your wallet.
You are not your fucking khakis.
I hear ya. It really is too bad that the "reasoned debate" part of the posting guidelines is ignored by so many people. This could have been fun and informative.
Oh well, off to argue about something else that I don't know a lot about but have an opinion on anyway...
if you're up for it; i'll do it. it'll have to be tomorrow when i have more time. it turns out the earth heals itself. it's really interesting. i'm willing to give it a go if a few reasonable people want to discuss it. you can't reason with an unreasonable person so we'll have to ignore a few posts.
You'll get worms, that's what! Or at least that's what my grandmother used to say whenever I tried to eat something while I had dirt under my fingernails. It was a traumatizing thought!
Don't stay in your car too long, we could use the comic relief around here.
if you're up for it; i'll do it. it'll have to be tomorrow when i have more time. it turns out the earth heals itself. it's really interesting. i'm willing to give it a go if a few reasonable people want to discuss it. you can't reason with an unreasonable person so we'll have to ignore a few posts.
The earth healing itself sounds pretty cool. I'm sure you can tell at this point that I don't want to fight, I just like to discuss and question the popular opinion. Go for it if you have the time. I think we may agree on more than I originally thought.
#==(o )
You are not your job.
You are not how much money you have in the bank.
You are not the car you drive.
You are not the contents of your wallet.
You are not your fucking khakis.
about how the earth will heal itself. I have heard that this global warming pattern occurs approximately every 3,000 years. It's part of expansion process...Unfortunately, before the last century, earth had a better chance becasue there werent as many carcinogenes and other contributing factors to interfere with processes.
all insanity:
a derivitive of nature.
nature is god
god is love
love is light
I don't believe it because the sun is just as necessary as water. Just as important as dirt.
Can dirt cause cancer? Can water cause cancer? No. It's a crock. Do you know what happens to a person if they never get sun?
Why don't freakin plants get ...uh...what would you call it? leaf cancer? Did you ever stop to think that maybe it's something else that is causing the skin cancer?
TRust me dude, I'm sitting in a skin cancer clinic, it's the sun !!
You are right though, that teh correct amout of sun is important. apparently 25% of babies being bornm in Australia have Vit D dediceincy, adn it is well described in women under wraps and folk in institutsions that never get taken out.
The earth healing itself sounds pretty cool. I'm sure you can tell at this point that I don't want to fight, I just like to discuss and question the popular opinion. Go for it if you have the time. I think we may agree on more than I originally thought.
first; i want to say that if man is cutting down trees; he's interfering with the natural process of conversion of CO2 into O2. second; if man emitts ANY CO2 into the atmosphere; he is interfering with the natural process thus no man can say that humans don't have an impact and responsability.
in my model; the the meltwater is still cold; but when the ice cover melts and we can't reflect heat back into space; we will warm and so will the excess water. this will (some) evaporate into humidity. this puts us in a high humidity situation at first but the humidity will turn to clouds; thus leading into a rain pattern or era. the clouds will be able to replenish themselves as they rain so i see many years of constant rains. this will block the sun thus cooling the earth.
the problem here is that the ice cover controls the winds aloft and the landscape will change. where corn grew before; may be desert. i expect the midwest between the mississippi and the rockies to be under water. some desert areas will then support corn and other crops.
i know it sounds like something man will survive but i believe only a small percentage will survive. those who saw what was coming and prepare for it.
i'll take questions now.
about how the earth will heal itself. I have heard that this global warming pattern occurs approximately every 3,000 years. It's part of expansion process...Unfortunately, before the last century, earth had a better chance becasue there werent as many carcinogenes and other contributing factors to interfere with processes.
you are so right. this pattern is caused by the earths eliptical orbit around the sun. when our orbit moves closer to the sun; we have a warming cycle. the emergency here is that our orbit is moving into a cooling period. we should be getting cooler instead of warmer at this time.
OMG!!!!!!!! You're awesome! Can I be the first to buy one? Sorry, I don't mean to take away from the topic at hand.
You'll get the signed original copy!
Take away from the topic at hand? Haha,,, no problem. The topic was a joke anyway, and also, if you know me, I'm not a great topic sticker to-er anyway!
Be kind, man
Don't be mankind. ~Captain Beefheart
__________________________________
daylight savings time also gave you an extra hour of darkness in the morning. the soltice is giving you longer hours of light; but don't fret. starting thursday; the hours of light per day will start decreasing. there's still 24 hours to a day. daylight savings time just trades an hour of darkness for an hour of light in the evenings. in the summer people tend to be outside enjoying the summer. we set the clocks back in fall so the sun rises earlier and begins to warm things sooner.
most people don't know what global warming really is. it was inproperly named and the general public doesn't have a clue.
Hmm.
My original post was a joke, but I think I have just scientifically proven my original post.
I just got back from a week in London. The time difference is 5 hours later than here in Wilmington, Delaware.
Ok, so that means that daylight is finished 5 hours earlier than here. THe sun goes down much earlier, thusly resulting in the proven fact that it's quite cool in London and now after arriving home, it's very hot!
I KNEW there was a reason I got an Enviromental Science degree!
Ok, maybe there just were a lot of pints involved over there and I'm jetlagged as hell, but it SEEMS like a cut and dried closed case!
Be kind, man
Don't be mankind. ~Captain Beefheart
__________________________________
I heard that there are glaciers in Scandinavia, Northern Asia, South America and the less famous "other side" of the south pole that are expanding and will compensate for the melt water in the regions that are warming. Is this true?
Is it true that Siberia has had some of its coldest winters of all time in the last 20 years? If so, could that not gradually compensate for darkening melting areas of the planet. If it's snowy/icy there for longer and longer every year, won't that make up for the sun's rays that are being absorbed by the dark pools in the melty areas?
Doesn't the amount of CO2 constantly being released by the ever-turbulent oceans, active volcanos, decaying organic matter (the amazon, The African Jungles, farm land around the world), natural gas vents, and other naturally occurring ways dwarf the amount of CO2 released by humans?
Is it possible that as the sun heats up the earth due to increased solar activity, CO2 levels rise as a result, not the other way around?
#==(o )
You are not your job.
You are not how much money you have in the bank.
You are not the car you drive.
You are not the contents of your wallet.
You are not your fucking khakis.
My original post was a joke, but I think I have just scientifically proven my original post.
Oh, thank the sweet baby Jesus! There's no way someone older than 5 possibly thinks that. I once had a friend who insisted that when you were driving, no matter which way you were going, the front of the car was pointing north. Turns out his compass was broken. Also turns out he was too stupid to be my friend anymore.
Either way, you managed to spark up a pretty good discussion.
#==(o )
You are not your job.
You are not how much money you have in the bank.
You are not the car you drive.
You are not the contents of your wallet.
You are not your fucking khakis.
TRust me dude, I'm sitting in a skin cancer clinic, it's the sun !!
You are right though, that teh correct amout of sun is important. apparently 25% of babies being bornm in Australia have Vit D dediceincy, adn it is well described in women under wraps and folk in institutsions that never get taken out.
I haev my backgoround tan !!
I was Stage IV Metastatic Melanoma, and am one of the only survivors of it for 5 years thanks to the Aussie docs in NewCastle. It had spread from skin to my liver, kidney and stomach and I had to go there to get treatment because of the lack of a fast track clinical trial program in the US. It cost me pretty much everything I owned because I had to pay for it myself because my insurance wouldn't pay for it. I got Autologous Vaccine Therapy and I've been clear for about 2 years now. haha,,, I'm healthy as hell now, too.
The major thing I learned when I was researcing sun and skin cancer and such was that, yes, there IS a hole in the ozone layer down there, but the major reasons that skin cancer is on such an upswing is that life and styles have changed.
One of the major reasons that more and more people have it is that it's stylish to HAVE a tan now whereas before the late 20's people used to cover up more in the sun and a lot of the reason for this was one person:
Coco Chanel! She came back from a vacation sunburnt and it was national fashion news, and suddenly it became the rage to GET a tan.
That coupled with the fact that more people travel and get outside on vacation than years past is the major cause.
That pasty white New York tan was the style, and a dark tan was considered something that only laborers would have.
Be kind, man
Don't be mankind. ~Captain Beefheart
__________________________________
Oh, thank the sweet baby Jesus! There's no way someone older than 5 possibly thinks that. I once had a friend who insisted that when you were driving, no matter which way you were going, the front of the car was pointing north. Turns out his compass was broken. Also turns out he was too stupid to be my friend anymore.
Either way, you managed to spark up a pretty good discussion.
Thanks!
Haha,,, and now that I sat on a plane yesterday for 4 hours of delay, 7 hours flight and circling New York for a couple of hours due to a thunderstorm, I have been working on my new invention:
Crying baby spray! (Patent Pending)
Just spray the baby, Ok, 10+ babies last night on the plane, and Voila!!!,,, they go to sleep for a while!
Be kind, man
Don't be mankind. ~Captain Beefheart
__________________________________
I heard that there are glaciers in Scandinavia, Northern Asia, South America and the less famous "other side" of the south pole that are expanding and will compensate for the melt water in the regions that are warming. Is this true?
Is it true that Siberia has had some of its coldest winters of all time in the last 20 years? If so, could that not gradually compensate for darkening melting areas of the planet. If it's snowy/icy there for longer and longer every year, won't that make up for the sun's rays that are being absorbed by the dark pools in the melty areas?
Doesn't the amount of CO2 constantly being released by the ever-turbulent oceans, active volcanos, decaying organic matter (the amazon, The African Jungles, farm land around the world), natural gas vents, and other naturally occurring ways dwarf the amount of CO2 released by humans?
Is it possible that as the sun heats up the earth due to increased solar activity, CO2 levels rise as a result, not the other way around?
there are no glaciers expanding. moving yes; getting thinner; yes. what looks like expansion is meltwater refreezing making it look bigger; but here's the problem: if you take 2 gallons of water. freeze one into a block and the other into a sheet. now put both outside. the sheet will melt several times faster then the block.
as to siberia; put ice in a cooler and close the top. go back in a bit and you'll see the ice is melting. but look what happened. the AIR got colder. when ice melts it "releases" the cold into the surrounding air.
CO2 isn't MADE by the sun. increased temperatures cause faster decomosition of organic matter which produces CO2 as a byproduct.
the CO2 released by "other than human" is compensated for in the balance of nature. that CO2 is inhaled by plants which expell O2. the problem is that we cut down the trees that filter the atmosphere and the earth can't compensate for that inbalance. add the CO2 emitted by human sources; and we have a greenhouse effect. we also filled the atmosphere with sulfur dioxide which when mixed with rain; becomes sulfuric acid. this acid rain is changing the PH of soil and killing the plants it rains on.
I was Stage IV Metastatic Melanoma, and am one of the only survivors of it for 5 years thanks to the Aussie docs in NewCastle. It had spread from skin to my liver, kidney and stomach and I had to go there to get treatment because of the lack of a fast track clinical trial program in the US. It cost me pretty much everything I owned because I had to pay for it myself because my insurance wouldn't pay for it. I got Autologous Vaccine Therapy and I've been clear for about 2 years now. haha,,, I'm healthy as hell now, too.
The major thing I learned when I was researcing sun and skin cancer and such was that, yes, there IS a hole in the ozone layer down there, but the major reasons that skin cancer is on such an upswing is that life and styles have changed.
One of the major reasons that more and more people have it is that it's stylish to HAVE a tan now whereas before the late 20's people used to cover up more in the sun and a lot of the reason for this was one person:
Coco Chanel! She came back from a vacation sunburnt and it was national fashion news, and suddenly it became the rage to GET a tan.
That coupled with the fact that more people travel and get outside on vacation than years past is the major cause.
That pasty white New York tan was the style, and a dark tan was considered something that only laborers would have.
polio brought the biggest change. people thought sun caused polio and everyone stayed out of the sun. with the vaccine people went back into the sun with a vengence. getting all the sun they could after being kept in the shade for so long. the beaches became crowded and thus came the change of lifestyle.
Take away from the topic at hand? Haha,,, no problem. The topic was a joke anyway, and also, if you know me, I'm not a great topic sticker to-er anyway!
HAHAHAHA!!!!! Me neither.
Ok but you need to hurry, my shower cutain needs to be changed.
Toronto II 2006/Lollapolooza 2007/MSG I 2008/MSG II 2008/Cleveland 2010/Buffalo 2010
EV Solo Montreal I/EV Solo Toronto I
there are no glaciers expanding. moving yes; getting thinner; yes. what looks like expansion is meltwater refreezing making it look bigger; but here's the problem: if you take 2 gallons of water. freeze one into a block and the other into a sheet. now put both outside. the sheet will melt several times faster then the block.
as to siberia; put ice in a cooler and close the top. go back in a bit and you'll see the ice is melting. but look what happened. the AIR got colder. when ice melts it "releases" the cold into the surrounding air.
CO2 isn't MADE by the sun. increased temperatures cause faster decomosition of organic matter which produces CO2 as a byproduct.
the CO2 released by "other than human" is compensated for in the balance of nature. that CO2 is inhaled by plants which expell O2. the problem is that we cut down the trees that filter the atmosphere and the earth can't compensate for that inbalance. add the CO2 emitted by human sources; and we have a greenhouse effect. we also filled the atmosphere with sulfur dioxide which when mixed with rain; becomes sulfuric acid. this acid rain is changing the PH of soil and killing the plants it rains on.
So I guess we will have to agree to disagree on whether or not glaciers are expanding. I should add that I'm not claiming that all glaciers are expanding. It is obvious that some are definitely melting away, but some are in fact growing, or better still, melting in some parts and growing in other parts. Maybe this has something to do with the shift in the earth's orbit and not humans.
In fact, these glaciers that are melting have been melting in some cases for the last 150 years. So before you point out that the melt has been faster in recent years, based on your 2 gallons in the cooler, what happens in the final stage of the block of ice melting? Doesn't it melt at a faster rate than it did at the start? Of course it does because it's sitting in "warm" water, even if the air is cooled. So the recent rapid increase in melting glaciers COULD be attributed to the fact that there is more and more fresh water surrounding those glaciers, and has been for the last 150 years.
As far as the sun creating CO2, I think you may have misunderstood my point. I'll spin your words around (and throw a few of my own in) if you don't mind. The SUN increases temperatures which in turn cause faster decomposition of organic matter, creating more and more CO2 as a byproduct.
As far as cutting down trees...you got me. There's nothing good that can come of that. Nothing good at all...except for maybe a nice guitar here and there. (By the way, my guitar is made by a Canadian company that uses fallen trees rather than cutting them down to make their guitars - Godin...brilliant!)
Just for the record once again...global warming is real...there IS a hole in the ozone layer, shit is happening and it's bad. I just am not able (read:willing?) to accept the scientific consensus that we are to blame. We can use extreme situations to support our arguments such as Hurricane Katrina and use that as a scase study to look at the damage caused by global warming. What happened in 2006? No hurricanes made landfall. Did global warming take the year off? Of course not. My point is that scientific consensus is being grossly misinterpereted as fact. Just because there's no other explanation, and the majority agrees that "factor X" is the cause, doesn't make it fact. It simply doesn't. So just because MOST of the people working on climate change THINK human activity is to blame, until there is formal proof, I don't buy it.
#==(o )
You are not your job.
You are not how much money you have in the bank.
You are not the car you drive.
You are not the contents of your wallet.
You are not your fucking khakis.
So this thread went to a few interesting directions! Kind of like my brain!
One of the most significant turns in it is that there are two Royals32's :cool:
Onelongsong, I've not heard that polio link between sun and skin cancer/ melanoma and can't find anything on it.
I'm actually writing a book or article on how cancer affects the victims' lives, and the lives of all the people around them, so if you have any info, I'd appreciate it. I know that in general, people started heading to the beaches in the 1930's when tanning was more of a style than the pasty white New York tan. The East Coast beaches used to be pretty crowded then. The polio vaccine was invented in 1952.
I haven't found any links to this yet, so any info you have would be much appreciated. I keep getting links to polio and the Chicago sun newspaper!
Re: Global warming and greenhouse gas. Decomposition of matter puts out CO2 when it's being worked on by aerobic bacteria, but methane gas gets generated when anerobic bacteria and no oxygen is present. Methane is a MUCH more intense greenhouse gas.
Some is natural, from termites, general decomposition, etc. Humans help generate a lot of it, too! Cattle, landfills, coal mining etc. The landfills problems are starting to be addressed by capping them and using or burning off the gas, which would produce CO2, a less intense greenhouse gas.
It was interesting when I was doing research that the biggest cause of manmade methane is rice production because it's grown in water/ lowlands, and when the paddies aren't drained occasionally, methane (swamp gas) is generated.
I also fully agree that deforestation is a huge concern. We produce CO2 and methane at huge rates, and also lose the ability to scrub it out of the atmosphere when deforestation occurs.
I still maintain that turning the clocks back will help cool the earth!
And Abook!!! Don't forget to clean your gutters!
Be kind, man
Don't be mankind. ~Captain Beefheart
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Comments
No problem, Forestbrain! I got it!
So today I'm contributing to global cooling by changing my time zone to 5 hours later so that will help the Earth cool even earlier today.
And as far as sun is concerned, I'm off to London today, and I looked at the weather:
Sun?
haha,,,, well, I guess I better go buy an umbrella!
If anyone's going to London, see you there!
Don't be mankind. ~Captain Beefheart
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OMG!!!!!!!! You're awesome! Can I be the first to buy one? Sorry, I don't mean to take away from the topic at hand.
EV Solo Montreal I/EV Solo Toronto I
daylight savings time also gave you an extra hour of darkness in the morning. the soltice is giving you longer hours of light; but don't fret. starting thursday; the hours of light per day will start decreasing. there's still 24 hours to a day. daylight savings time just trades an hour of darkness for an hour of light in the evenings. in the summer people tend to be outside enjoying the summer. we set the clocks back in fall so the sun rises earlier and begins to warm things sooner.
most people don't know what global warming really is. it was inproperly named and the general public doesn't have a clue.
i take it you're young. the sun wasn't a big problem until we blew a hole in the ozone layer which protected us from the radiation. man did that. it also seems you know nothing about global warming.
Man did that? When exactly did we blow a hole in the ozone layer? I totally disagree. How long was the hole in the ozone layer before we created a tool to see and measure it? That hole could have been there for 300 million years but as soon as we were able to see it, it became a huge issue. Maybe that hole is a naturally occuring regulator intended to relieve the planet of excess heat or pollution (volcanoes have been erupting since the beginning of time, and they cause a little more pollution than we do).
We've been on earth for a tiny fraction in the timeline of the history of this planet. To suggest that humanity's activity over the last 150 years is the cause of climate change is absurd.
I expect to be crucified for having this opinion but the generally accepted party line really doesn't make any sense to me.
You are not your job.
You are not how much money you have in the bank.
You are not the car you drive.
You are not the contents of your wallet.
You are not your fucking khakis.
why would you be crucified for not knowing any better? the hole in the ozone was caused by florocarbons released into the atmosphere. man is the sole reason for the hole because nothing occuring naturally could have made the hole. we were also able to measure the speed at which the hole was growing and based on that; a timeline was established which led to finding the cause.
you're right that man has only been here a short time compared to the life of the earth; but naturally occuring disasters have never been unreversable as the pollution man created has. when you think about how man has destroyed such a beautiful planet in such a short time; how can you not believe it was us?
I meant I'd be crucufied for having an unpopular opinion (like i have in the past), not specifically by you. Sorry if that's the way you took that...
Anyway, consider this...we got this "ozone layer hole measurer" turned on, we found this huge hole right over the north pole. We looked at it over a period of (I have no idea what the number is...) 10 - 25 years? We found that during this period that the hole was growing, so we applied some formulas and projected the findings over the next "X" number of years and concluded that based on the rate of expansion, if you went backwards in time, there must have been no hole "X" number of years ago. Like I said earlier, what if the hole has been there since the beginning of time? What if it goes through a 2000 year cycle of expansion and contraction, and we just happened to turn our cameras on to this hole during part of the expansion phase of the cycle?
All of the information that is reported to us is divided into two distinct categories, the first being raw data - for example - "there is a hole in the ozone layer" or "global temperatures are rising" or "global CO2 levels are higher than they have ever been." This data is fact and cannot be disputed. I'm not even disputing those facts, but...the second category is the assumptions and general consensus among A PORTION (albeit a large portion) of the scientific community. They take the real data, plug it into a super computer and project a scenario. The problem is that the data they are basing their projections on is so limited there's no way they can paint an accurate picture of what we can expect. As I posted earlier, Mars is getting warmer, and the only explanation we've got so far is that the sun is the cause (it's getting hotter). We know so little and assume so much. In the 70's we were convinced that we were on the verge of an ice age. I'm not sure if you knew that. Granted, we have better tools today than we had 30 years ago, but who can say that 30 years from now the tools we will have won't be better still, and maybe we'll find a hole in the ocean (that may have been there forever) and all of a sudden, that's the new fear being fed to us?
Politicians based their campaigns on how they were going to do their part to save the planet from the ice age. Now, 30 years later we're looking at things from the opposite side. I'm not saying you're wrong, and I wouldn't argue to death to prove I'm right, I just think (based on admittedly limited research) that we are not being told the whole story.
You are not your job.
You are not how much money you have in the bank.
You are not the car you drive.
You are not the contents of your wallet.
You are not your fucking khakis.
i didn't take it that way at all. i just meant that everyone is entitled to their own opinion and you shouldn't be crucified for expressing it.
from what i remember; when the hole was discovered; it was quite small. it grew increasingly bigger each year. then spiro agnew came up with this plan to take the performance out of automobiles.
anyway; we ARE headed into an ice age. it's because of the earths eliptical orbit around the sun. we are moving farther from the sun and thus we are cooling. sounds like i'm full of sh**; right? this is where most people get confused. the earth is cooling and we're moving further from the sun so our atmosphere is cooling too. if temperatures stayed the same we'd have cause for concern. all indications point towards cooler temps yet we're staying the same. but we're getting warmer. a couple degrees don't seem like much but when we complete the "back side" of our orbit and start moving closer to the sun and thus our warming cycle; those couple degrees turn to several degrees.
i've completed my model of what's to come but i too won't devulge it because i know i'll be crucified. i think our cooling period is masking the true extent of the problem and that's why people boo-hoo global warming. i'll leave it at that.
OK, so then I guess that's the end of that...
You are not your job.
You are not how much money you have in the bank.
You are not the car you drive.
You are not the contents of your wallet.
You are not your fucking khakis.
it's quite extensive and complete and i can't see spending the time to type it out here only to be attacked.
Oh well, off to argue about something else that I don't know a lot about but have an opinion on anyway...
You are not your job.
You are not how much money you have in the bank.
You are not the car you drive.
You are not the contents of your wallet.
You are not your fucking khakis.
if you're up for it; i'll do it. it'll have to be tomorrow when i have more time. it turns out the earth heals itself. it's really interesting. i'm willing to give it a go if a few reasonable people want to discuss it. you can't reason with an unreasonable person so we'll have to ignore a few posts.
http://www.thesensualimage.com/gallery/Top/default.htm
a derivitive of nature.
nature is god
god is love
love is light
The earth healing itself sounds pretty cool. I'm sure you can tell at this point that I don't want to fight, I just like to discuss and question the popular opinion. Go for it if you have the time. I think we may agree on more than I originally thought.
You are not your job.
You are not how much money you have in the bank.
You are not the car you drive.
You are not the contents of your wallet.
You are not your fucking khakis.
a derivitive of nature.
nature is god
god is love
love is light
TRust me dude, I'm sitting in a skin cancer clinic, it's the sun !!
You are right though, that teh correct amout of sun is important. apparently 25% of babies being bornm in Australia have Vit D dediceincy, adn it is well described in women under wraps and folk in institutsions that never get taken out.
I haev my backgoround tan !!
first; i want to say that if man is cutting down trees; he's interfering with the natural process of conversion of CO2 into O2. second; if man emitts ANY CO2 into the atmosphere; he is interfering with the natural process thus no man can say that humans don't have an impact and responsability.
in my model; the the meltwater is still cold; but when the ice cover melts and we can't reflect heat back into space; we will warm and so will the excess water. this will (some) evaporate into humidity. this puts us in a high humidity situation at first but the humidity will turn to clouds; thus leading into a rain pattern or era. the clouds will be able to replenish themselves as they rain so i see many years of constant rains. this will block the sun thus cooling the earth.
the problem here is that the ice cover controls the winds aloft and the landscape will change. where corn grew before; may be desert. i expect the midwest between the mississippi and the rockies to be under water. some desert areas will then support corn and other crops.
i know it sounds like something man will survive but i believe only a small percentage will survive. those who saw what was coming and prepare for it.
i'll take questions now.
you are so right. this pattern is caused by the earths eliptical orbit around the sun. when our orbit moves closer to the sun; we have a warming cycle. the emergency here is that our orbit is moving into a cooling period. we should be getting cooler instead of warmer at this time.
You'll get the signed original copy!
Take away from the topic at hand? Haha,,, no problem. The topic was a joke anyway, and also, if you know me, I'm not a great topic sticker to-er anyway!
Don't be mankind. ~Captain Beefheart
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Hmm.
My original post was a joke, but I think I have just scientifically proven my original post.
I just got back from a week in London. The time difference is 5 hours later than here in Wilmington, Delaware.
Ok, so that means that daylight is finished 5 hours earlier than here. THe sun goes down much earlier, thusly resulting in the proven fact that it's quite cool in London and now after arriving home, it's very hot!
I KNEW there was a reason I got an Enviromental Science degree!
Ok, maybe there just were a lot of pints involved over there and I'm jetlagged as hell, but it SEEMS like a cut and dried closed case!
Don't be mankind. ~Captain Beefheart
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OK, I'll bite. I have a few...
I heard that there are glaciers in Scandinavia, Northern Asia, South America and the less famous "other side" of the south pole that are expanding and will compensate for the melt water in the regions that are warming. Is this true?
Is it true that Siberia has had some of its coldest winters of all time in the last 20 years? If so, could that not gradually compensate for darkening melting areas of the planet. If it's snowy/icy there for longer and longer every year, won't that make up for the sun's rays that are being absorbed by the dark pools in the melty areas?
Doesn't the amount of CO2 constantly being released by the ever-turbulent oceans, active volcanos, decaying organic matter (the amazon, The African Jungles, farm land around the world), natural gas vents, and other naturally occurring ways dwarf the amount of CO2 released by humans?
Is it possible that as the sun heats up the earth due to increased solar activity, CO2 levels rise as a result, not the other way around?
You are not your job.
You are not how much money you have in the bank.
You are not the car you drive.
You are not the contents of your wallet.
You are not your fucking khakis.
Oh, thank the sweet baby Jesus! There's no way someone older than 5 possibly thinks that. I once had a friend who insisted that when you were driving, no matter which way you were going, the front of the car was pointing north. Turns out his compass was broken. Also turns out he was too stupid to be my friend anymore.
Either way, you managed to spark up a pretty good discussion.
You are not your job.
You are not how much money you have in the bank.
You are not the car you drive.
You are not the contents of your wallet.
You are not your fucking khakis.
I was Stage IV Metastatic Melanoma, and am one of the only survivors of it for 5 years thanks to the Aussie docs in NewCastle. It had spread from skin to my liver, kidney and stomach and I had to go there to get treatment because of the lack of a fast track clinical trial program in the US. It cost me pretty much everything I owned because I had to pay for it myself because my insurance wouldn't pay for it. I got Autologous Vaccine Therapy and I've been clear for about 2 years now. haha,,, I'm healthy as hell now, too.
The major thing I learned when I was researcing sun and skin cancer and such was that, yes, there IS a hole in the ozone layer down there, but the major reasons that skin cancer is on such an upswing is that life and styles have changed.
One of the major reasons that more and more people have it is that it's stylish to HAVE a tan now whereas before the late 20's people used to cover up more in the sun and a lot of the reason for this was one person:
Coco Chanel! She came back from a vacation sunburnt and it was national fashion news, and suddenly it became the rage to GET a tan.
That coupled with the fact that more people travel and get outside on vacation than years past is the major cause.
That pasty white New York tan was the style, and a dark tan was considered something that only laborers would have.
Don't be mankind. ~Captain Beefheart
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Thanks!
Haha,,, and now that I sat on a plane yesterday for 4 hours of delay, 7 hours flight and circling New York for a couple of hours due to a thunderstorm, I have been working on my new invention:
Crying baby spray! (Patent Pending)
Just spray the baby, Ok, 10+ babies last night on the plane, and Voila!!!,,, they go to sleep for a while!
Don't be mankind. ~Captain Beefheart
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there are no glaciers expanding. moving yes; getting thinner; yes. what looks like expansion is meltwater refreezing making it look bigger; but here's the problem: if you take 2 gallons of water. freeze one into a block and the other into a sheet. now put both outside. the sheet will melt several times faster then the block.
as to siberia; put ice in a cooler and close the top. go back in a bit and you'll see the ice is melting. but look what happened. the AIR got colder. when ice melts it "releases" the cold into the surrounding air.
CO2 isn't MADE by the sun. increased temperatures cause faster decomosition of organic matter which produces CO2 as a byproduct.
the CO2 released by "other than human" is compensated for in the balance of nature. that CO2 is inhaled by plants which expell O2. the problem is that we cut down the trees that filter the atmosphere and the earth can't compensate for that inbalance. add the CO2 emitted by human sources; and we have a greenhouse effect. we also filled the atmosphere with sulfur dioxide which when mixed with rain; becomes sulfuric acid. this acid rain is changing the PH of soil and killing the plants it rains on.
polio brought the biggest change. people thought sun caused polio and everyone stayed out of the sun. with the vaccine people went back into the sun with a vengence. getting all the sun they could after being kept in the shade for so long. the beaches became crowded and thus came the change of lifestyle.
HAHAHAHA!!!!! Me neither.
Ok but you need to hurry, my shower cutain needs to be changed.
EV Solo Montreal I/EV Solo Toronto I
So I guess we will have to agree to disagree on whether or not glaciers are expanding. I should add that I'm not claiming that all glaciers are expanding. It is obvious that some are definitely melting away, but some are in fact growing, or better still, melting in some parts and growing in other parts. Maybe this has something to do with the shift in the earth's orbit and not humans.
In fact, these glaciers that are melting have been melting in some cases for the last 150 years. So before you point out that the melt has been faster in recent years, based on your 2 gallons in the cooler, what happens in the final stage of the block of ice melting? Doesn't it melt at a faster rate than it did at the start? Of course it does because it's sitting in "warm" water, even if the air is cooled. So the recent rapid increase in melting glaciers COULD be attributed to the fact that there is more and more fresh water surrounding those glaciers, and has been for the last 150 years.
As far as the sun creating CO2, I think you may have misunderstood my point. I'll spin your words around (and throw a few of my own in) if you don't mind. The SUN increases temperatures which in turn cause faster decomposition of organic matter, creating more and more CO2 as a byproduct.
As far as cutting down trees...you got me. There's nothing good that can come of that. Nothing good at all...except for maybe a nice guitar here and there. (By the way, my guitar is made by a Canadian company that uses fallen trees rather than cutting them down to make their guitars - Godin...brilliant!)
Just for the record once again...global warming is real...there IS a hole in the ozone layer, shit is happening and it's bad. I just am not able (read:willing?) to accept the scientific consensus that we are to blame. We can use extreme situations to support our arguments such as Hurricane Katrina and use that as a scase study to look at the damage caused by global warming. What happened in 2006? No hurricanes made landfall. Did global warming take the year off? Of course not. My point is that scientific consensus is being grossly misinterpereted as fact. Just because there's no other explanation, and the majority agrees that "factor X" is the cause, doesn't make it fact. It simply doesn't. So just because MOST of the people working on climate change THINK human activity is to blame, until there is formal proof, I don't buy it.
You are not your job.
You are not how much money you have in the bank.
You are not the car you drive.
You are not the contents of your wallet.
You are not your fucking khakis.
One of the most significant turns in it is that there are two Royals32's :cool:
Onelongsong, I've not heard that polio link between sun and skin cancer/ melanoma and can't find anything on it.
I'm actually writing a book or article on how cancer affects the victims' lives, and the lives of all the people around them, so if you have any info, I'd appreciate it. I know that in general, people started heading to the beaches in the 1930's when tanning was more of a style than the pasty white New York tan. The East Coast beaches used to be pretty crowded then. The polio vaccine was invented in 1952.
I haven't found any links to this yet, so any info you have would be much appreciated. I keep getting links to polio and the Chicago sun newspaper!
Re: Global warming and greenhouse gas. Decomposition of matter puts out CO2 when it's being worked on by aerobic bacteria, but methane gas gets generated when anerobic bacteria and no oxygen is present. Methane is a MUCH more intense greenhouse gas.
Some is natural, from termites, general decomposition, etc. Humans help generate a lot of it, too! Cattle, landfills, coal mining etc. The landfills problems are starting to be addressed by capping them and using or burning off the gas, which would produce CO2, a less intense greenhouse gas.
It was interesting when I was doing research that the biggest cause of manmade methane is rice production because it's grown in water/ lowlands, and when the paddies aren't drained occasionally, methane (swamp gas) is generated.
I also fully agree that deforestation is a huge concern. We produce CO2 and methane at huge rates, and also lose the ability to scrub it out of the atmosphere when deforestation occurs.
I still maintain that turning the clocks back will help cool the earth!
And Abook!!! Don't forget to clean your gutters!
Don't be mankind. ~Captain Beefheart
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