Ahmadinejad unwavering @ Columbia -- "We don't have homosexuals"

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Comments

  • Tom K wrote:
    Bollinger's opening remarks are disgusting.

    I agree with you. There was no reason for Bollinger to make such comments about Ahmadinejad, especially after he himself and his university invited the Iranian president to come speak. It is an educational insitution, and because of that reason, he should of kept an open mind and seen Ahmadinejad as a fellow professor. To be honest, I loved the speech, it was focused on education (truely appropriate), and although Ahmadinejad was bull shitting and making Iran sound so much better than what it really is, it was amazing. When do we here in America get to hear one of our greatest enemies speak to us in such a calm manner? He was prepared to do what he does best, teach. I have much more respect for him after hearing him speak. Maybe Bollinger should learn a thing or two from him.
    Don't let the world bring you down, not everyone here is that fucked up and cold. Remember why you came and while you're alive, experience the warmth before you grow old.

    Best two days of my life: Oasis at MSG and Pearl Jam at the Gorge.
  • PearlsGirl wrote:
    I agree with you. There was no reason for Bollinger to make such comments about Ahmadinejad, especially after he himself and his university invited the Iranian president to come speak. It is an educational insitution, and because of that reason, he should of kept an open mind and seen Ahmadinejad as a fellow professor. To be honest, I loved the speech, it was focused on education (truely appropriate), and although Ahmadinejad was bull shitting and making Iran sound so much better than what it really is, it was amazing. When do we here in America get to hear one of our greatest enemies speak to us in such a calm manner? He was prepared to do what he does best, teach. I have much more respect for him after hearing him speak. Maybe Bollinger should learn a thing or two from him.


    Just curious, as I didnt see the speech, and have only read bits and pieces. But how do you have more respect for him after that speech, though you admit he was bullshitting? I can kind of see having an issue with Bollinger's approach, but I cant possibly see how you have more respect for a guy that you admit was bullshitting.
  • g under pg under p Surfing The far side of THE Sombrero Galaxy Posts: 18,200
    In a speech at Columbia University, Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad
    defended Iran's right to nuclear power but denied Iran was seeking to build
    nuclear weapons. Ahmadinejad's appearance sparked widespread protests at
    Columbia. We speak with Trita Parsi, author of "Treacherous Alliance: The
    Secret Dealings of Israel, Iran and the United States" and Baruch professor
    Ervand Abrahamian, co-author of "Targeting Iran."

    Listen/Watch/Read about
    Ahmadinejad's speech
    AMY GOODMAN: Does this remind you of Saddam Hussein before the war?

    ERVAND ABRAHAMIAN: It does. In fact, Ahmadinejad didn't say it last night -- yesterday, but his policy is that there is no likelihood of war, because no one in their right senses would think of invading or attacking Iran. And that's the premise he works on, which is, I think, a completely wrong premise, because he doesn't seem to understand American politics, the same people who gave us the war on Iraq, the same people who are running foreign policy now. But he begins from the premise that no one in their right senses would think of attacking Iran.


    Something of a must read.

    Peace
    *We CAN bomb the World to pieces, but we CAN'T bomb it into PEACE*...Michael Franti

    *MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
    .....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti

    *The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)


  • dg1979us wrote:
    Just curious, as I didnt see the speech, and have only read bits and pieces. But how do you have more respect for him after that speech, though you admit he was bullshitting? I can kind of see having an issue with Bollinger's approach, but I cant possibly see how you have more respect for a guy that you admit was bullshitting.

    Because of the way he presented himself after being bashed. It is truely rare to see a politician take on criticism the way he took it. He didn't get angry, but let it slide and go on to give his speech. I haven't seen someone give a speech so well in a while, I believe the last one was probably.... President Clinton? Maybe even Musharaff. These people are extremely passionate about what they do - this makes them people pleasers. Reagan was a people pleaser, he got away with so much, it was pretty disgusting.
    Don't let the world bring you down, not everyone here is that fucked up and cold. Remember why you came and while you're alive, experience the warmth before you grow old.

    Best two days of my life: Oasis at MSG and Pearl Jam at the Gorge.
  • fuckfuck Posts: 4,069
    It's amazing how a university dean like Bollinger would misquote Ahmadinejad even after talking of how he supports getting the "correct information."

    Also, Ahmadinejad raises a good point. If everyone is talking about supporting freedom of speech in the west, why are people getting locked up for questioning or asking more research about the holocaust?

    I also really appreciate such a big political figurehead talking about the palestinians like that. it's about time someone did it.

    also, someone here said "does bush send people into your homes?"

    actually, yes he does. not directly from him, but this government has been sending fbi agents into thousands of innocent people's homes, especially since 9/11, and arresting them and taking them to jail for years. Also, look at Guantanamo because that is certainly not the work of a democratic leader.

    Also, I'm really getting annoyed and pissed off about people outright saying "Iran is searching for nuclear weapons" when there is clearly no proof of such a thing. Another thing that's annoying is people talking about Iran executing like 200 people this year. Not saying I support this if it were true, but can we take a look at our own countries' problems before demonizing another country? How much blood is on our countries' hands? How many innocent people are sent to death row each year? How many innocent people have been arrested and held in jail for years--sometimes life?

    Our country has done far worse things in a year, than Iran has done in 25 years. Tell me-- who is the real "Hitler?" A guy who sends billions of dollars to a country that has been killing for 60 years, who sends army into other countries killing well over 100,000 people and imprisoning so many people? Or a guy who just gets up and speaks about what he thinks-- maybe questioning a couple things.

    Wow, this post was much longer than I thought it would be.
  • PearlsGirl wrote:
    Because of the way he presented himself after being bashed. It is truely rare to see a politician take on criticism the way he took it. He didn't get angry, but let it slide and go on to give his speech. I haven't seen someone give a speech so well in a while, I believe the last one was probably.... President Clinton? Maybe even Musharaff. These people are extremely passionate about what they do - this makes them people pleasers. Reagan was a people pleaser, he got away with so much, it was pretty disgusting.


    He may have taken on criticism well, but he also fed us a bunch of crap. Im sorry, we must have different standards when it comes to respecting politicians and leaders. But to each their own.
  • The JugglerThe Juggler Posts: 49,240
    spiral out wrote:
    I couldn't agree more with you, as far as i can see he has said nothing wrong, but then some of us have actually taken the time to read his entire speech and not just belived the twisted media propaganda.


    come on...he didnt say it YESTERDAY...but has said it many other times in the past. this country would be amazed to learn of all the things he says over in iran that never get any play over here...we should have arrested his ass as soon as he got off the plan.

    on another note---it was wonderfull to see him get laughed at on stage! probably the first time that's happened to him. what a fraud.
    www.myspace.com
  • polarispolaris Posts: 3,527
    come on...he didnt say it YESTERDAY...but has said it many other times in the past. this country would be amazed to learn of all the things he says over in iran that never get any play over here...we should have arrested his ass as soon as he got off the plan.

    on another note---it was wonderfull to see him get laughed at on stage! probably the first time that's happened to him. what a fraud.

    what do you really know of iran?
  • mammasanmammasan Posts: 5,656
    No matter what I am just glad they did not let this person visit ground zero

    Why? Last time I checked Saudi royals have visited the site and the Saudi government funds and supports the religious schools that indoctrinate the radicals that carry out attacks like 9/11. Also I don't remember any Iranians on the list of 19 hijackers from 9/11.
    "When one gets in bed with government, one must expect the diseases it spreads." - Ron Paul
  • hippiemomhippiemom Posts: 3,326
    spiral out wrote:
    I couldn't agree more with you, as far as i can see he has said nothing wrong, but then some of us have actually taken the time to read his entire speech and not just belived the twisted media propaganda.
    When a guy says things like "Women in Iran enjoy the highest levels of freedom," and "In Iran, we don't have homosexuals, like in your country," that doesn't exactly motivate me to spend time digging for his other pearls of wisdom. He's clearly nothing more than a propagandist (as are most world leaders) and his words mean little to me.
    "Nothing in the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity." ~ MLK, 1963
  • jlew24asujlew24asu Posts: 10,118
    spiral out wrote:
    I couldn't agree more with you, as far as i can see he has said nothing wrong, but then some of us have actually taken the time to read his entire speech and not just belived the twisted media propaganda.

    amazing how you defend this guy. he said nothing wrong? so I guess there really are no gays in Iran. I could go on but its a waste of time. you're hopeless.
  • jeffbrjeffbr Seattle Posts: 7,177
    hippiemom wrote:
    When a guy says things like "Women in Iran enjoy the highest levels of freedom," and "In Iran, we don't have homosexuals, like in your country," that doesn't exactly motivate me to spend time digging for his other pearls of wisdom. He's clearly nothing more than a propagandist (as are most world leaders) and his words mean little to me.

    Brilliant. Perfectly said. There is no reason to demonize him or his nation. I'd rather dismiss his ideas and his words as irrelevant.
    "I'll use the magic word - let's just shut the fuck up, please." EV, 04/13/08
  • gue_bariumgue_barium Posts: 5,515
    jeffbr wrote:
    Brilliant. Perfectly said. There is no reason to demonize him or his nation. I'd rather dismiss his ideas and his words as irrelevant.

    The American war machine doesn't.

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  • hippiemomhippiemom Posts: 3,326
    gue_barium wrote:
    The American war machine doesn't.
    I am 100% certain that the American war machine doesn't take his public statements to a bunch of Columbia students at face value.
    "Nothing in the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity." ~ MLK, 1963
  • fanch75fanch75 Posts: 3,734
    PearlsGirl wrote:
    I agree with you. There was no reason for Bollinger to make such comments about Ahmadinejad, especially after he himself and his university invited the Iranian president to come speak. It is an educational insitution, and because of that reason, he should of kept an open mind and seen Ahmadinejad as a fellow professor. To be honest, I loved the speech, it was focused on education (truely appropriate), and although Ahmadinejad was bull shitting and making Iran sound so much better than what it really is, it was amazing. When do we here in America get to hear one of our greatest enemies speak to us in such a calm manner? He was prepared to do what he does best, teach. I have much more respect for him after hearing him speak. Maybe Bollinger should learn a thing or two from him.

    I'm sorry I have to say this, but I gotta let out a big "Nigga puhleaze!!" over this anger at Bollinger.

    Let me axe you somethin' - and be honest - Would you have had the same reaction if Bush had went to speak in Iran and he had a similar introduction? Maybe you (PearlsGirl) would, but I bet most folk jeering Bollinger for this would be cheering the hypothetical "Bollinger" in my illustration.

    For the record, I have no problem with the University inviting him to speak. If he's a bad guy, it's going to come through in an open dialogue; I mean it was 700-1 in that auditorium, so I'd speculate that it was hardly a friendly environment.

    I have not heard the Iranian President's full speech (just blurbs here and there), but I won't comment on that until I hear it all.
    Do you remember Rock & Roll Radio?
  • even flow?even flow? Posts: 8,066
    fanch75 wrote:
    I'm sorry I have to say this, but I gotta let out a big "Nigga puhleaze!!" over this anger at Bollinger.

    Let me axe you somethin' - and be honest - Would you have had the same reaction if Bush had went to speak in Iran and he had a similar introduction? Maybe you (PearlsGirl) would, but I bet most folk jeering Bollinger for this would be cheering the hypothetical "Bollinger" in my illustration.

    For the record, I have no problem with the University inviting him to speak. If he's a bad guy, it's going to come through in an open dialogue; I mean it was 700-1 in that auditorium, so I'd speculate that it was hardly a friendly environment.

    I have not heard the Iranian President's full speech (just blurbs here and there), but I won't comment on that until I hear it all.


    Wuzzzzzzzz Up??? :)

    I would applaud any leader who takes what he took and I would give kudos to the people sticking it to em. I think a little more taste from the dean would have been nice though. Should have ripped him in question form.
    You've changed your place in this world!
  • fanch75fanch75 Posts: 3,734
    That's certainly fair, playa. Fo shizzle.

    I do see the point that it's not really customary to invite someone and then insult them in the greeting. Let the arena of ideas (the dialogue) sort it out. The bits i've heard about regarding women enjoying freedom in iran moreso than anywhere else, etc, coming from the President himself, carries more weight than what a Dean thinks of him.
    Do you remember Rock & Roll Radio?
  • g under p wrote:
    He's done basically the same thing just in a more subtle way. If he was just as obvious as Ahmadinejad the American people would or should rise up against him. However as it is we softly sit by and let him rule as more amd more of our rights fall by the wayside just in the this war on terror.

    Rights we'll never see coming back anytime soon no matter who's the next President.

    Peace

    What "rights" have been taken away from you? Your right to speech? Has someone come after you for an opinion or thought you've expressed? Has your right to life been taken away? Liberty? Pursuit of happiness? Right to bear arms? (well you're probably okay with that one being obliterated) What? Tell me. Give me a specific example of someone trampling on your rights. I seriously want to know. Making up conspiracies and stories to explain certain actions with little evidence—now that's the kind of thing a fascist state would do.
    So this life is sacrifice...
    6/30/98 Minneapolis, 10/8/00 East Troy (Brrrr!), 6/16/03 St. Paul, 6/27/06 St. Paul
  • NCfanNCfan Posts: 945
    jeffbr wrote:
    Brilliant. Perfectly said. There is no reason to demonize him or his nation. I'd rather dismiss his ideas and his words as irrelevant.

    It'd be cool and proper if you applied those same standards to your own country...
  • fuckfuck Posts: 4,069
    What "rights" have been taken away from you? Your right to speech? Has someone come after you for an opinion or thought you've expressed? Has your right to life been taken away? Liberty? Pursuit of happiness? Right to bear arms? (well you're probably okay with that one being obliterated) What? Tell me. Give me a specific example of someone trampling on your rights. I seriously want to know. Making up conspiracies and stories to explain certain actions with little evidence—now that's the kind of thing a fascist state would do.

    ...Thanks for blatantly ignoring my post...
  • NCfanNCfan Posts: 945
    Does it not strike anybody here that a sitting head of state publicly and deliberately denied that gay people live in his country? That they do not have that "phenomenon" there.

    Fuck everything else that happened that day. This is the most ludacris and brazen thing I have ever heard a world leader say in my lifetime.

    Just think about this. We are supposed to believe this guy when he says his country is not pursuing nuclear weapons when he has no problem lying through his teeth with the gay comment?

    This just shows me that nothing he says can be trusted... I don't want a war anymore than anybody else, but this guy isn't making it easy on any reasonable person to trust this guy.
  • fuckfuck Posts: 4,069
    Ok, then. Don't believe him when he says he's not pursuing nuclear weapons.

    Believe the IAEA.
  • polarispolaris Posts: 3,527
    NCfan wrote:
    Does it not strike anybody here that a sitting head of state publicly and deliberately denied that gay people live in his country? That they do not have that "phenomenon" there.

    Fuck everything else that happened that day. This is the most ludacris and brazen thing I have ever heard a world leader say in my lifetime.

    Just think about this. We are supposed to believe this guy when he says his country is not pursuing nuclear weapons when he has no problem lying through his teeth with the gay comment?

    This just shows me that nothing he says can be trusted... I don't want a war anymore than anybody else, but this guy isn't making it easy on any reasonable person to trust this guy.

    uhhh ... you have witnessed first hand a plethora of lies that have far greater consequences from your president ... it's interesting tho that in a speech where he poses questions such as:

    why should the palestinians bear the brunt of a tragedy occuriing in europe?

    that his comment on homosexuality should garner so much attention ... it falls in line with the whole "wipe israel off the map" thing ... it's easy to focus on that ... instead of actually really learning about what it's like living in iran ...
  • jeffbrjeffbr Seattle Posts: 7,177
    NCfan wrote:
    It'd be cool and proper if you applied those same standards to your own country...

    Please explain. I've never demonoized my country. In fact, I'm probably a little too nationalistic for most people's taste here, and tend to lash out at foreigners who demean my country. But I can't apply the "irrelevant" status to Bush, because he isn't. His administration directly affects my life and my country. Maybe I'm missing your point.
    "I'll use the magic word - let's just shut the fuck up, please." EV, 04/13/08
  • hippiemomhippiemom Posts: 3,326
    NCfan wrote:
    It'd be cool and proper if you applied those same standards to your own country...
    I did not mean to imply that Ahmadinejad himself is irrelevant, only that his speech to Columbia students was irrelevant. He's the president of a powerful nation, he is in no way irrelevant. If he actually believes the things he says, then he's a stark raving loony, and I think it's almost always wise to do everything possible to avoid going to war with powerful lunatics.

    I apply exactly the same standards to my own country. When Bush says something that's just plain dumb and hilarious (and bless him, he does it every day), I laugh and laugh. When he says something of substance that I find alarming, I have a different response. Were it to happen, I would assume that his address to a class of graduating Iranians would be pure rubbish and I wouldn't expect anyone to take it seriously.
    "Nothing in the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity." ~ MLK, 1963
  • he's just a figurehead for the Supreme Leader. He is irrelevant. I don't know why he gets so much press when he's not even in charge...
  • i'm so enthused over the response this thread has gotten.
    this is some of the best rational debate and discourse i've seen here in some time.

    i'm not sure how much i have to add,
    except maybe that Iran really is a more "manly" country ...
    and they don't breed nancy boys over there?

    ;)
    If I was to smile and I held out my hand
    If I opened it now would you not understand?
  • CosmoCosmo Posts: 12,225
    The bottom line...
    This was a good thing. It shows an unfiltered looks at this guy and let's us form our own opinions, rather than based on official governemtn (a.k.a. we don't know if they are lying or telling the truth so we lean towards they're lying sacks of shit side) or media moguls looking to create ratings for their broadcasted Yellow Press.
    The guys a fucking idiot. He proved it himself. I say let him keep talking and dig himself deeper and deeper into his own bullshit.
    Allen Fieldhouse, home of the 2008 NCAA men's Basketball Champions! Go Jayhawks!
    Hail, Hail!!!
  • fanch75 wrote:
    I'm sorry I have to say this, but I gotta let out a big "Nigga puhleaze!!" over this anger at Bollinger.

    Let me axe you somethin' - and be honest - Would you have had the same reaction if Bush had went to speak in Iran and he had a similar introduction? Maybe you (PearlsGirl) would, but I bet most folk jeering Bollinger for this would be cheering the hypothetical "Bollinger" in my illustration.

    For the record, I have no problem with the University inviting him to speak. If he's a bad guy, it's going to come through in an open dialogue; I mean it was 700-1 in that auditorium, so I'd speculate that it was hardly a friendly environment.

    I have not heard the Iranian President's full speech (just blurbs here and there), but I won't comment on that until I hear it all.

    I would have the same sort of reaction if I thought Bush was someone who would speak intellectually about something, but the only thing Bush is passionate about is the conflict in Iraq and saying that people that alive are dead (Nelson Mandela, I saw the press conference on CSPAN and it was a bit ridiculous). Each to their own, I don't agree with Ahmadinejad in any way shape or form, but I thought he delivered an amazing speech. Bollinger I believe was making up for extreme criticism that he recieved for inviting Ahmadinejad.
    Don't let the world bring you down, not everyone here is that fucked up and cold. Remember why you came and while you're alive, experience the warmth before you grow old.

    Best two days of my life: Oasis at MSG and Pearl Jam at the Gorge.
  • g under pg under p Surfing The far side of THE Sombrero Galaxy Posts: 18,200
    What "rights" have been taken away from you? Your right to speech? Has someone come after you for an opinion or thought you've expressed? Has your right to life been taken away? Liberty? Pursuit of happiness? Right to bear arms? (well you're probably okay with that one being obliterated) What? Tell me. Give me a specific example of someone trampling on your rights. I seriously want to know. Making up conspiracies and stories to explain certain actions with little evidence—now that's the kind of thing a fascist state would do.

    All I'll say is Habeas Corpus.

    If this administration chooses to label myself or you an "enemy combatant" my right a a US citizen to representation is non exist-ant. I could held indefinately under that circumstance.

    However I'll let Keith Olberman explain further in these next 8 minutes on Habeas Corpus.

    Peace
    *We CAN bomb the World to pieces, but we CAN'T bomb it into PEACE*...Michael Franti

    *MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
    .....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti

    *The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)


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