Wesley Snipes Accquited Of ALL FELONY TAX CHARGES! The People Are Waking Up !??!

DriftingByTheStorm

This is awesome!
They got him on 3 counts of failure to file,
but he was ACCQUITED on all Federal felony charges -- fraud & conspiracy.

I can't wait to see more news, since this is 1 minute after the story broke ...

but it sounds like Snipe's defense convinced the jury that something is fishy.

Because his actions (the Irwin Schiff method of tax evasion, by doctoring up the income tax form and indicating that you believe it all to be bullshit, bascialy) certainly should have proved him guilty of fraud and conpiracy to evade tax.

AND YET THEY FOUND HIM NOT GUILTY.

So.

???

godpt3

he could (and should) still be sentenced to 3 years prison of the misdemeanors, though.

blackredyellow

godpt3 wrote:

he could (and should) still be sentenced to 3 years prison of the misdemeanors, though.

I read the AP story too (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080201/ap_en_ce/snipes_tax_trial_4), but it's not clear (at least to me)... Does he still owe the back taxes?

dharma69

The guy gives vampire slayers a bad name.

MasterFramer

He still has to pay the back taxes... this is not some victory for people who don't want to pay income taxes.

blackredyellow

MasterFramer wrote:

He still has to pay the back taxes... this is not some victory for people who don't want to pay income taxes.

That's what I thought too... But according to DriftingByTheStorm, spending up to 3 years in prison and still owing millions of dollars is some sort of victory against the government.

theroachman

blackredyellow wrote:

That's what I thought too... But according to DriftingByTheStorm, spending up to 3 years in prison and still owing millions of dollars is some sort of victory against the government.

It is a victory if your a Freeman from Montana


He still owes back taxes. If he was a poor slob like me who tried to get away with what he did I would be in jail for years. He has the money to pull court room tricks not avaiable to most people in the USA plain and simple.

DriftingByTheStorm

MasterFramer wrote:

He still has to pay the back taxes... this is not some victory for people who don't want to pay income taxes.

Agreed...
sadly.

I was responding to this in depth last night, but then, instead of closing one of the tabs i was using as research, i -- being tired since it was 5 AM! -- accidentaly CLOSED THE WHOLE BROWSER. :(

Anyhow, minus blackredyellow being a total ass about it,
it is true, Wesley will still get a bill from the IRS.

Apparently, even if you are found 100% NOT Guilty, like Tom Cryer, you STILL have to pay taxes.

It is ridiculous actualy.

BUT I WANT TO DRAW YOUR ATTENTION TO THIS:

The NY TIMES wrote:

Mr. Snipes had become an unlikely public face for the tax-denier movement, whose members maintain that Americans are not obligated to pay income taxes and that the government extracts taxes from its citizens illegally.

Two co-defendants — Eddie Ray Kahn, a promoter of tax denial, and Douglas Rosile, a disbarred accountant — were convicted on separate felony counts.

“The verdict shows that promoters face serious jail time” but clients who follow their advice will face a lesser but still-serious risk, said JJ MacNab, a Maryland insurance analyst who attended the trial and is writing a book about tax deniers.

-[url=-New York Times

DOES THAT RAISE RED FLAGS FOR ANYONE !?!

The government is saying, with this case and MANY others, if you TRY TO TELL PEOPLE ABOUT OUR SCAM, we will prosecute the shit out of you. Why? Because WE say that what the law says is that you are LIABLE for income tax (although CLEARLY the law DOES NOT SAY YOU ARE LIABLE! prove me wrong, i fucking dare you to try. IT DOES NOT!) ...

... but IF YOU ACTUALY STOP PAYING YOUR TAX, well goddamnit ... JURYS KEEP FINDING PEOPLE NOT GUILTY. Read the Cryer transcripts!

WHY ARE THEY FINDING PEOPLE NOT GUILTY !?!

And why is the government better able to prosecute people for condoning \ aiding & abetting alleged criminal activity, and yet it fails to get solid verdicts on the actual crimes themselves.

WHY DID THE IRS DROP ALL FELONY CHARGES against Tom Cryer BEFORE the trial date !!??!!

I know why.
If you read up on it, YOU will know why too.

Blackredyellow, you are the one that is clueless on this.

How much of Title 26 have YOU read?
I've read all of it, and NO WHERE are you held liable.

I recommend trying get through all of Theft By Deception ... and let me know how you feel about the Income Tax after watching that!

:cool:

DriftingByTheStorm

theroachman wrote:

It is a victory if your a Freeman from Montana


He still owes back taxes. If he was a poor slob like me who tried to get away with what he did I would be in jail for years. He has the money to pull court room tricks not avaiable to most people in the USA plain and simple.

Not true.

Tom Cryer got a NOT Guilty conviction of failure to file, and the government made him broke in the process.

Just becaues he is a rich celebrity doesn't mean he is on the wrong side of the moral aisle here, folks.

Wesley is actualy A PATRIOT, STANDING UP FOR YOUR LIBERTY.

macgyver06

godpt3 wrote:

he could (and should) still be sentenced to 3 years prison of the misdemeanors, though.

you are ridiculous

first YOU THINK HE IS GOING TO JAIL FOR 3 YEARS ON A MISDEMEANOR?
have you been under a rock!?

and he should go to jail??

WOWWWWWWWWWW

just what we need a non violent good actor in prison because he didnt want to pay taxes...


you are unbelievable

DriftingByTheStorm

macgyver06 wrote:

you are ridiculous

first YOU THINK HE IS GOING TO JAIL FOR 3 YEARS ON A MISDEMEANOR?
have you been under a rock!?

and he should go to jail??

WOWWWWWWWWWW

just what we need a non violent good actor in prison because he didnt want to pay taxes...


you are unbelievable

Not to mention, he actualy did not violate any law.
Unfortuantely the court system wont let you how the law in court.
You can only talk about what you saw, and why that means you believed there was no law.

But YOU CAN NOT SHOW THE LAWS in a court case.

Title 26, Subtitle A, Chapter 1 -- WHERE AM I HELD "LIABLE"?

:rolleyes:

theroachman

So a fifth degree black belt vs. Richard Dean Anderson? Hmm?


But you are right macgyver06, Wesley Snipes will not see a day in jail for this and the back taxes will be paid by April 15th

blackredyellow

DriftingByTheStorm wrote:

Wesley is actualy A PATRIOT, STANDING UP FOR YOUR LIBERTY.

Do you honestly believe that he is doing it for any other reason than to protect his own money?

jeffbr

blackredyellow wrote:

Do you honestly believe that he is doing it for any other reason than to protect his own money?

I don't believe anyone does anything altruistically. They always do things in their own self-interest. But in the process of doing so, others can be helped.

And while he may "owe" back taxes, due to the govt's loss in this case they are going to have to sue him to collect the taxes. I do believe there was some celebrity worship by the jury though. This isn't necessarily a tax patriot victory. The other guys who advised Snips were convicted of felonies for their parts, and will serve real time. If this had been a true tax patriot victory, they all would have walked on felonies.

So to sum up - I'm happy for Snipes, I don't think he's a tax patriot but is bringing awareness to the issue, and I don't think this was a victory for tax patriots.

Kel Varnsen

DriftingByTheStorm wrote:

Wesley is actualy A PATRIOT, STANDING UP FOR YOUR LIBERTY.

Why is he a patriot? I read an interview with him a few months ago and the only reason he did this was because his crooked accountant told him it was a good idea, and he believed him. He wasn't trying to be any kind of a revoulationary he was just trying to make more money.

DriftingByTheStorm

Kel Varnsen wrote:

Why is he a patriot? I read an interview with him a few months ago and the only reason he did this was because his crooked accountant told him it was a good idea, and he believed him. He wasn't trying to be any kind of a revoulationary he was just trying to make more money.

I think he is a patriot, because, whether Wesley truly understands the legalities that his "crooked" accountant explained to him or not, the PRINCIPLES on which he is fighting are those of liberty.

Namely, the original defense he used while FILING his taxes was a "tax protestor" argument, that, imho is 100% VALID.

And that is, THERE IS NO LAW HOLDING YOU LIABLE.

The tax was written as a VOLUNTARY tax, and you and i have been duped for ages in to paying it, believing we are truly liable.

And the courts and the IRS enforce it like we are LIABLE. And in fact the IRS has no jurisdiction in the states ... and in fact, even if they did, there is no law for them to enforce. There is no liability on your end.

And about his "crooked" accountant, unless you know something about his dealings that truly were illegal ... best i can tell his counsel is being prosecuted soley for advising clients of "illegal" "tax shelter" schemes ...

But if i say i'm not violating the law, and i can NOT find the law ... and yet you still convict me for it.

Am i a criminal, or is the system criminal?

So far no one on here, OR ANYWHERE IN AMERICA, has been able to show us the law.

Have you seen: this?

Don't you find his answer a bit strange?
He COMPLETELY avoids the question.

And HER answer is no better.
She refers you to is this IRS "official" publication" which has NO MARKINGS, NO SIGNATURES, NO OFFICIAL STATUS, NO control number, NO AUTHORITY, and is simply a FAQ

AND ... AND AND AND ...

The ONLY "tax evasion" argument it DOES NOT ADDRESS is the ONLY ONE which is VALID ... and that is, regardless of constitutionality, OMB numbers etc ... the real truth is TITLE 26 DOES NOT HOLD YOU LIABLE!

MasterFramer

Yeah I'm sure Mr. Snipes was telling his accountants, "Don't pay my taxes! Its wrong... its not a law and I'm standing up for our country and the good working class person that pays unjustly!... call me Patriot Snipes!" Please... dude was just tired of being bent over and the government taking close to half his income. That whole "tax cut" for the wealthy Bush is responsible for? It doesn't make much of a difference to people that make this kind of money, they still get bent the fuck over.

DriftingByTheStorm

MasterFramer wrote:

Yeah I'm sure Mr. Snipes was telling his accountants, "Don't pay my taxes! Its wrong... its not a law and I'm standing up for our country and the good working class person that pays unjustly!... call me Patriot Snipes!" Please... dude was just tired of being bent over and the government taking close to half his income. That whole "tax cut" for the wealthy Bush is responsible for? It doesn't make much of a difference to people that make this kind of money, they still get bent the fuck over.

Regardless of his personal motives,
Wesley Snipes was willing to stick HIS NECK OUT ON THE LINE to make a MORAL STAND on an ISSUE OF PRINCIPLE.

That is patriotic.

When the founding fathers started the revolution for a new country, guess what, THEY WERE JUST TIRED OF GETTING FUCKED OVER BY THE CROWN OF ENGLAND, and they WERE ACTING IN THEIR OWN BEST FUCKING INTEREST ... DUH ... but it was still helluva patriotic act, and it benefited all future americans.

Where is the disconnect?

Your anger is seemingly borne only out of the fact that Snipes has a lot of money.

Skitch Patterson

DriftingByTheStorm wrote:

Regardless of his personal motives,
Wesley Snipes was willing to stick HIS NECK OUT ON THE LINE to make a MORAL STAND on an ISSUE OF PRINCIPLE.

If you disregard Personal Motives, how can it be a "moral stand" and an "issue of principle"?

MasterFramer

DriftingByTheStorm wrote:

Regardless of his personal motives,
Wesley Snipes was willing to stick HIS NECK OUT ON THE LINE to make a MORAL STAND on an ISSUE OF PRINCIPLE.

That is patriotic.

When the founding fathers started the revolution for a new country, guess what, THEY WERE JUST TIRED OF GETTING FUCKED OVER BY THE CROWN OF ENGLAND, and they WERE ACTING IN THEIR OWN BEST FUCKING INTEREST ... DUH ... but it was still helluva patriotic act, and it benefited all future americans.

Where is the disconnect?

Your anger is seemingly borne only out of the fact that Snipes has a lot of money.

My anger? If I have any anger it is directed at the IRS who are at this moment auditing my mother and her business for the last 2 years. Fuck the IRS, she's already paid a shit load and they are going to want more. But I would really like you to describe how shit would be paid for if everyone stopped paying taxes, cause according to you, we are not required to.

Where has Mr. Snipes said ANYWHERE I am fighting for the good of the people? He was fighting cause he didn't want to go to fucking jail and pay EVEN more in penalties.

Mr Snipes makes some bucks but there are countless in silicon valley that have much more wealth than him, so Im not sure why you think I would be mad at anyone with money...

DriftingByTheStorm

MasterFramer wrote:

My anger? If I have any anger it is directed at the IRS who are at this moment auditing my mother and her business for the last 2 years. Fuck the IRS, she's already paid a shit load and they are going to want more. But I would really like you to describe how shit would be paid for if everyone stopped paying taxes, cause according to you, we are not required to.

Where has Mr. Snipes said ANYWHERE I am fighting for the good of the people? He was fighting cause he didn't want to go to fucking jail and pay EVEN more in penalties.

Mr Snipes makes some bucks but there are countless in silicon valley that have much more wealth than him, so Im not sure why you think I would be mad at anyone with money...

I guess i just don't think Wesley Snipes was stupid enough to think the IRS wouldn't come after him for NOT PAYING TAX.

From what was reported it sounds to me like what Wesley filed was of similar ilk to the Irwin Schiff Zero Income 1040 Form ... and if you read and understand any of that, you will see that it is all about the income tax NOT existing as described.

YOU DON'T FILE THAT, UNLESS YOU INTEND TO RED FLAG YOUR RETURN TO BE AUDITED!

I have no way of knowing for sure what Wesley was thinking, but either he is just a blooming idiot, or he was willing to go to court over it.

Perhaps as you say, he didn't pay his taxes for some other reason first, and then later found out that he could try this line of defense.

EITHER WAY, HE USED IT ... and it held up IN PART ... the FELONY part!
Look. Benjamin Franklin was an AVID supporter of the Crown of England for MOST OF HIS LIFE ... and in fact, when he DID move to the revolution for independence it was largely for PERSONAL MOTIVES! That doesn't make the man any less of a fucking patriot. Lets not get stuck arguing the politics of altruism. It is pointless. Mother Teresa was a selfish bitch too, right? She got off on helping people. Man, and they say she was a saint. She just got personal satisfaction out of helping people. And she got public acclaim etc etc etc ... ??? Whats the point of arguing this shit? Its all degrees of something.

So.
Man ... i dunno.

And i don't give a shit to talk about what we would do without the income tax. We got on fine without one for over a hundred years, and i have no reason to believe that we couldnt find our way, EVENTUALY, back to that constitutionaly restricted federal government.
The answer seems pretty obvious to me. The Federal government would have to MASSIVELY reduce its operating expenses, and stop promising the world to people.

Like i've said repeatedly, it ain't a fucking cake walk. Thats life.
But there comes a time when you can do whats right, no matter how hard it is, or you can be a fucking pussy and go along with the insidious status quo.

I think given our previous discussions, that we actualy agree on princple more than we disagree ... you just seem to want to ignore your princples and accept "fate", because to act on your princples is a hard fight.

So whats the deal?