That's what I love... You spout out terms like "fair share", but you refuse to define it. You said it...back it up. I'll ask again..."Bob Smith" is 30 years old, single, and makes 50 thousand per year. What's his "fair share"?
???
Ok, I'll bite. Here is the calculator for both McCain and Obama's tax plan. It shows savings that a single man making 50K would expect.
This is $429.42 more than the $39.34 cut you will get from McCain.
Click here to run another calculation.
These numbers come directly from calculations by the independent, non-partisan Tax Policy Center. They estimate that your taxes in 2009 will change by -$468.76 under Barack Obama and -$39.34 under John McCain. Click here to see the relevant table for your filing status. Tax cuts for Obama and McCain are calculated by adding the changes in income tax and corporate tax estimated by the Tax Policy Center.
The Raw Numbers
Income Tax Corporate Tax
Obama -$502.00 $33.24
McCain $0.00 -$39.34
To calculate your tax cut in more detail, check out ElectionTaxes.com, a calculator made by Quantrix and the University of Southern Maine. The Obama campaign also has their own tax calculator, which also allows you to calculate the impact of your mortgage, retirement savings, and college expenses. The McCain campaign has no similar calculator."
So in summary I feel what Bob has been paying under Bush is fair, and what he would pay under McCain ($6,827 in 2009)
is fair, and what he will pay under Obama ($6,325 in 2009) is fair.
This is $429.42 more than the $39.34 cut you will get from McCain.
Click here to run another calculation.
These numbers come directly from calculations by the independent, non-partisan Tax Policy Center. They estimate that your taxes in 2009 will change by -$468.76 under Barack Obama and -$39.34 under John McCain. Click here to see the relevant table for your filing status. Tax cuts for Obama and McCain are calculated by adding the changes in income tax and corporate tax estimated by the Tax Policy Center.
The Raw Numbers
Income Tax Corporate Tax
Obama -$502.00 $33.24
McCain $0.00 -$39.34
To calculate your tax cut in more detail, check out ElectionTaxes.com, a calculator made by Quantrix and the University of Southern Maine. The Obama campaign also has their own tax calculator, which also allows you to calculate the impact of your mortgage, retirement savings, and college expenses. The McCain campaign has no similar calculator."
So in summary I feel what Bob has been paying under Bush is fair, and what he would pay under McCain ($6,827 in 2009)
is fair, and what he will pay under Obama ($6,325 in 2009) is fair.
It really isn't that different.
You do have a point here, right?
Fair enough, I appreciate the answer. Here's what I really want to know from you though. Let's say I'm taxed at 25 percent right now. If Obama upped that to 40 percent, would you consider that okay?
I'm not saying he will, I'm just trying to guage what percentage increase you think is "fair".
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That's what I love... You spout out terms like "fair share", but you refuse to define it. You said it...back it up. I'll ask again..."Bob Smith" is 30 years old, single, and makes 50 thousand per year. What's his "fair share"?
???
...
It all depends.
Does Bob own a house? (Pay a first home mortgage)
Does Bob have Health Care Insurance?
Does Bob give to non-profit charitable organizations?
...
I'm making a pretty comfortable living... I can write off the finance charges of my home mortgage... I have a Health Plan from work, so I cannot write off medical expenses (unless those expenses exceed my coverage... and in that case, I have bigger problems to concentrate on than my taxes)... I offset my taxes by giving to charitable organizations of my choosing (so my 'fair share' oftaxes are earmarked to those organizations of my choosing, not the governments). And the taxes I pay... I like to believe my tax dollars goes towards housing and food for the poorest Americans, where ever they live (because I belive that part of being American is the strong taking care of the weak)... towards the soldiers in my armed forces... towards upgrades to the Air Traffic Control systems... towards airport security upgrades... towards interstate highway maintenance.
Allen Fieldhouse, home of the 2008 NCAA men's Basketball Champions! Go Jayhawks!
Hail, Hail!!!
0
unsung
I stopped by on March 7 2024. First time in many years, had to update payment info. Hope all is well. Politicians suck. Bye. Posts: 9,487
Good to see you cheating America through your loopholes and fraud. Time to pay your fair share.
Corporations have been given too much and now they will give a small amount back. That really is a heart breaker. Allow me to shed you a tear.
If I were you I would seriously be careful what you accuse someone of. I have numerous deductions because of my line of work and what I OWN and PAID for by working.
Not only do I have a good accountant, ME and TURBO TAX, but I actually have an even better attorney. He doesn't take libel and slander lightly.
If I were you I would seriously be careful what you accuse someone of. I have numerous deductions because of my line of work and what I OWN and PAID for by working.
Not only do I have a good accountant, ME and TURBO TAX, but I actually have an even better attorney. He doesn't take libel and slander lightly.
...
Tell your lawyer that I hate lawyers.
Allen Fieldhouse, home of the 2008 NCAA men's Basketball Champions! Go Jayhawks!
Hail, Hail!!!
Fair enough, I appreciate the answer. Here's what I really want to know from you though. Let's say I'm taxed at 25 percent right now. If Obama upped that to 40 percent, would you consider that okay?
I'm not saying he will, I'm just trying to guage what percentage increase you think is "fair".
And find the loopholes and deceptive ways that earnings are hidden to be unacceptable.
I feel that the current administration has allowed corporations to get away with too much, well basically starting with Reagan. So if Obama is going to make them pay more of a fair share I'm ok with that.
3% doesn't trouble me, and because so much earnings are hidden and written off, that 3% will only get them closer to what they should be paying anyway. IMO.
AND just for the record I am not for distributing the wealth to the lazy, have-nots. I don't think it is good for our society and it is not good for anyone, especially the ones getting the hand outs that enable them to remain lazy.
Let everyone work hard, and if there is no hand out then people are forced to work hard.
With that said I would rather welfare (if there must be such a thing) go to needy people rather than to Wall Street and Big Banking. Yikes!
0
unsung
I stopped by on March 7 2024. First time in many years, had to update payment info. Hope all is well. Politicians suck. Bye. Posts: 9,487
If I were you I would seriously be careful what you accuse someone of. I have numerous deductions because of my line of work and what I OWN and PAID for by working.
Not only do I have a good accountant, ME and TURBO TAX, but I actually have an even better attorney. He doesn't take libel and slander lightly.
...
Because the 'Left'... will hold Obama responsible for his actions.
If we continue on this same old, fucked up path... I know that you (and I) will continue our rants because we don't care about bullshit political parties. We care about America... and her place in the world.
Am I right?
Allen Fieldhouse, home of the 2008 NCAA men's Basketball Champions! Go Jayhawks!
Hail, Hail!!!
If I were you I would seriously be careful what you accuse someone of. I have numerous deductions because of my line of work and what I OWN and PAID for by working.
Not only do I have a good accountant, ME and TURBO TAX, but I actually have an even better attorney. He doesn't take libel and slander lightly.
Good luck with that.
I don't know you and I certainly don't think YOU personally are committing any type of fraud. When you start talking about taxes going up and you comment that "I have a very good accountant", you are implying that you/and your accountant are good at keeping your taxes lower than they might be.
That is the American way and it has been encouraged by our Government officials.
But it is going to hurt anyway. Society's leeches have won. Oh well I have a very good accountant. It does make me sick that illegal aliens are going to get what they want now. Now we are going to have to pay for their college, even though our own citizens have trouble making it through school because of finances. McCain was not much better.
I predict a few years from now we look back and see how big of a mistake this is.
As for now I'm going to buy more guns and ammo.
Seriously, its not Obama's ideas that will fuck things up. It's your fucking level of optimism.
holy fuckin shit... someone else around here besides me GETS IT. what did we expect getting on a Pearl Jam messageboard and thinking it's members would understand?
what happened? Did your - did your balls drop off? Hmm?
Want me to call the waaambulance for you?
0
unsung
I stopped by on March 7 2024. First time in many years, had to update payment info. Hope all is well. Politicians suck. Bye. Posts: 9,487
...
Because the 'Left'... will hold Obama responsible for his actions.
If we continue on this same old, fucked up path... I know that you (and I) will continue our rants because we don't care about bullshit political parties. We care about America... and her place in the world.
Am I right?
I hope that is the case. I do think there are some positive things he can do, but I also find quite an amount that I'm afraid of.
Not only do I have a good accountant, ME and TURBO TAX, but I actually have an even better attorney. He doesn't take libel and slander lightly.
i bet he does... i bet he thinks if you went into his office and said some message pit dude said you were 'cheating' the govt out of taxes he'd take it quite lightly... in fact he'd probably laugh... or he might rub his hands and think 'woo-hoo yet another one willing to pay their money to me so i can chase a faceless internet guy who said you were 'cheating'
if i had to sue everyone on here who called me names i'd be richer than Bill Gates.. i would also have lost a shitload in lawsuits against me though.
point is... lighten up... you got beat
oh scary... 40000 morbidly obese christians wearing fanny packs invading europe is probably the least scariest thing since I watched an edited version of The Care Bears movie in an extremely brightly lit cinema.
You could always buy another gun. That's what fearful americans do.
Oh wait. You already did that.
i once read that when Nasa said that a meteor might hit the earth and wipe out the planet, gun sales rose 1738%... actually i just made that up... but i bet thats what would happen... or when the doctor said to one guy.. you have vertigo.. its a fear of heights... and the guy said "uh, well i better buy me some more guns then"
only thing i'm scared of is a scared idiot with a gun.
oh scary... 40000 morbidly obese christians wearing fanny packs invading europe is probably the least scariest thing since I watched an edited version of The Care Bears movie in an extremely brightly lit cinema.
i once read that when Nasa said that a meteor might hit the earth and wipe out the planet, gun sales rose 1738%... actually i just made that up... but i bet thats what would happen... or when the doctor said to one guy.. you have vertigo.. its a fear of heights... and the guy said "uh, well i better buy me some more guns then"
But it is going to hurt anyway. Society's leeches have won. Oh well I have a very good accountant. It does make me sick that illegal aliens are going to get what they want now. Now we are going to have to pay for their college, even though our own citizens have trouble making it through school because of finances. McCain was not much better.
I predict a few years from now we look back and see how big of a mistake this is.
As for now I'm going to buy more guns and ammo.
So the rich get richer and the poor get poorer. Money is the root of all evil. I'm sure the Bible will tell you that too. Recall the story of the old woman giving her only money away? Yes I went to a catholic school but I'm a proud socialist and liberal. Its only fair that everone should have equal oppourtunities in life.
What's your problem? 25-35 percent isn't "fair share" enough for you?!?! How about you send me 50 percent of your next pay check. Yeah...I'll be sure that goes directly to helping some disadvantaged kid...just like I'm SURE your hero Barack is going to do.
You seem to want to cheat America through higher taxation and stealing from hard working business owners. What makes you any better?
Like the trillions that were spent on this war? You're ok with that? Money used to kill innocent people, yeah lets pay for that... How does this reasoning work?
Agreed!! It's about time the corporate whores (sadly I work for one, don't like it) pay some more money, instead of get some, it won't hurt them at all. A week ago my company gave us all a letter stating how "one parties" tax plan will make our company have to pay extra taxes and how all of us need to figure out how to help save. FUCK THAT, how bout the rich VP's and execs figure that out, that's why they get paid numerous times what I do!!
They're going to figure it out by cutting your job and raising prices on everything.
"If you love someone, set them free... if someone loves you, don't fuck up" - EV
Does anyone truly believe that the tax plans of either of these men was going to settle the economy?
Every newspaper outside of the unites states (I'm living in Shanghai now, so that's what I get) has referred to the problems as "The Global Financial Crisis" - Iceland, the Ukraine, and Hungary are all getting desperate bailouts from the IMF...(I know these are heavy hitters ) But it is nonetheless a sign that something is happening in the USA and the rest of the world simultaneously.
There has been a foundational and fundamental shift in the way economies have become intertwined and companies do business and profit around the world. The systems that we've created to leverage liquidity and debt and currency volatility (The Bretton Woods Agreement) date back to the mid-1940's.
It is not just George Bush's Tax Policies, or the War on Iraq, or Corporate Spending alone, though these seem like insurmountable economic fallacies, that have created the GLOBAL financial strains happening now.
It is also pretty apparent (and seems to have been mentioned a few times in the last couple of days) that Americans for the most part are and have been living well beyond their means. We lower interest rates like a cheap parlor trick for people to get suckered into accumulating more debt with huge purchases while blinded to the volatility in stock and job markets in their backyard.
Government spending is not really what put most American citizens in dire straits, personal spending did. 501K's are not a bank vault, you ran the risks when you put your money in them.
The economy is not going make a miraculous comeback on the back of any legislation, no matter how well intentioned or far sighted, because it is the entire balance of capital between all companies and nations in the world that needs to find the time and means to readjust itself.
0
unsung
I stopped by on March 7 2024. First time in many years, had to update payment info. Hope all is well. Politicians suck. Bye. Posts: 9,487
Nice attitude. :( I'm very glad I'm an optimist. Even if McCain had won, I sure wouldn't be espousing such nonsense.
exactly.
the doom and gloom crowd grossly overstate the issue imo as well. i do not think it will be nearly as bad as they imagine. beyond that, we are in a ridiculous HUGE financial mess, a deficit beyond any deficit of the past.....what should we do? we have to get back on track, incorporate some fiscal responsibility to our governemtn once more. and yes, our governement is funded by taxes. everything comes with a cost. personally, i find this 'cost' far more palatable and in the long-run, i think far more beneficial for the good of all.
Comments
Ok, I'll bite. Here is the calculator for both McCain and Obama's tax plan. It shows savings that a single man making 50K would expect.
http://alchemytoday.com/obamataxcut/
"The results are in...
Your Obama Tax Cut:
$468.76
This is $429.42 more than the $39.34 cut you will get from McCain.
Click here to run another calculation.
These numbers come directly from calculations by the independent, non-partisan Tax Policy Center. They estimate that your taxes in 2009 will change by -$468.76 under Barack Obama and -$39.34 under John McCain. Click here to see the relevant table for your filing status. Tax cuts for Obama and McCain are calculated by adding the changes in income tax and corporate tax estimated by the Tax Policy Center.
The Raw Numbers
Income Tax Corporate Tax
Obama -$502.00 $33.24
McCain $0.00 -$39.34
To calculate your tax cut in more detail, check out ElectionTaxes.com, a calculator made by Quantrix and the University of Southern Maine. The Obama campaign also has their own tax calculator, which also allows you to calculate the impact of your mortgage, retirement savings, and college expenses. The McCain campaign has no similar calculator."
So in summary I feel what Bob has been paying under Bush is fair, and what he would pay under McCain ($6,827 in 2009)
is fair, and what he will pay under Obama ($6,325 in 2009) is fair.
It really isn't that different.
You do have a point here, right?
Fair enough, I appreciate the answer. Here's what I really want to know from you though. Let's say I'm taxed at 25 percent right now. If Obama upped that to 40 percent, would you consider that okay?
I'm not saying he will, I'm just trying to guage what percentage increase you think is "fair".
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Low Traffic CIO MIW
Non Traffic ABC BAY FDU GBZ HNC NDP OEM ROV TMS ZWL
It all depends.
Does Bob own a house? (Pay a first home mortgage)
Does Bob have Health Care Insurance?
Does Bob give to non-profit charitable organizations?
...
I'm making a pretty comfortable living... I can write off the finance charges of my home mortgage... I have a Health Plan from work, so I cannot write off medical expenses (unless those expenses exceed my coverage... and in that case, I have bigger problems to concentrate on than my taxes)... I offset my taxes by giving to charitable organizations of my choosing (so my 'fair share' oftaxes are earmarked to those organizations of my choosing, not the governments). And the taxes I pay... I like to believe my tax dollars goes towards housing and food for the poorest Americans, where ever they live (because I belive that part of being American is the strong taking care of the weak)... towards the soldiers in my armed forces... towards upgrades to the Air Traffic Control systems... towards airport security upgrades... towards interstate highway maintenance.
Hail, Hail!!!
If I were you I would seriously be careful what you accuse someone of. I have numerous deductions because of my line of work and what I OWN and PAID for by working.
Not only do I have a good accountant, ME and TURBO TAX, but I actually have an even better attorney. He doesn't take libel and slander lightly.
Tell your lawyer that I hate lawyers.
Hail, Hail!!!
hopefully your attorney knows how to defend message board 'characters' in those libel/slander suits.....
http://www.myspace.com/illuminatta
Rhinocerous Surprise '08!!!
That would seem excessive.
I prefer something like this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flat_tax
And find the loopholes and deceptive ways that earnings are hidden to be unacceptable.
I feel that the current administration has allowed corporations to get away with too much, well basically starting with Reagan. So if Obama is going to make them pay more of a fair share I'm ok with that.
3% doesn't trouble me, and because so much earnings are hidden and written off, that 3% will only get them closer to what they should be paying anyway. IMO.
AND just for the record I am not for distributing the wealth to the lazy, have-nots. I don't think it is good for our society and it is not good for anyone, especially the ones getting the hand outs that enable them to remain lazy.
Let everyone work hard, and if there is no hand out then people are forced to work hard.
With that said I would rather welfare (if there must be such a thing) go to needy people rather than to Wall Street and Big Banking. Yikes!
Not really, I expected it. However it is like being told you have cancer. One day you are going to die, it only hits home when you do.
Bring it.
Because the 'Left'... will hold Obama responsible for his actions.
If we continue on this same old, fucked up path... I know that you (and I) will continue our rants because we don't care about bullshit political parties. We care about America... and her place in the world.
Am I right?
Hail, Hail!!!
Good luck with that.
I don't know you and I certainly don't think YOU personally are committing any type of fraud. When you start talking about taxes going up and you comment that "I have a very good accountant", you are implying that you/and your accountant are good at keeping your taxes lower than they might be.
That is the American way and it has been encouraged by our Government officials.
I simply don't agree with those methods.
Relax "unsung"..... if that's your real name?
I'm glad you are an optimist! World needs more of um'! Attitude is everything and some just don't get it. Oh well ... one day!
Want me to call the waaambulance for you?
I hope that is the case. I do think there are some positive things he can do, but I also find quite an amount that I'm afraid of.
Oh wait. You already did that.
i bet he does... i bet he thinks if you went into his office and said some message pit dude said you were 'cheating' the govt out of taxes he'd take it quite lightly... in fact he'd probably laugh... or he might rub his hands and think 'woo-hoo yet another one willing to pay their money to me so i can chase a faceless internet guy who said you were 'cheating'
if i had to sue everyone on here who called me names i'd be richer than Bill Gates.. i would also have lost a shitload in lawsuits against me though.
point is... lighten up... you got beat
i once read that when Nasa said that a meteor might hit the earth and wipe out the planet, gun sales rose 1738%... actually i just made that up... but i bet thats what would happen... or when the doctor said to one guy.. you have vertigo.. its a fear of heights... and the guy said "uh, well i better buy me some more guns then"
only thing i'm scared of is a scared idiot with a gun.
So the rich get richer and the poor get poorer. Money is the root of all evil. I'm sure the Bible will tell you that too. Recall the story of the old woman giving her only money away? Yes I went to a catholic school but I'm a proud socialist and liberal. Its only fair that everone should have equal oppourtunities in life.
Like the trillions that were spent on this war? You're ok with that? Money used to kill innocent people, yeah lets pay for that... How does this reasoning work?
They're going to figure it out by cutting your job and raising prices on everything.
Every newspaper outside of the unites states (I'm living in Shanghai now, so that's what I get) has referred to the problems as "The Global Financial Crisis" - Iceland, the Ukraine, and Hungary are all getting desperate bailouts from the IMF...(I know these are heavy hitters
There has been a foundational and fundamental shift in the way economies have become intertwined and companies do business and profit around the world. The systems that we've created to leverage liquidity and debt and currency volatility (The Bretton Woods Agreement) date back to the mid-1940's.
It is not just George Bush's Tax Policies, or the War on Iraq, or Corporate Spending alone, though these seem like insurmountable economic fallacies, that have created the GLOBAL financial strains happening now.
It is also pretty apparent (and seems to have been mentioned a few times in the last couple of days) that Americans for the most part are and have been living well beyond their means. We lower interest rates like a cheap parlor trick for people to get suckered into accumulating more debt with huge purchases while blinded to the volatility in stock and job markets in their backyard.
Government spending is not really what put most American citizens in dire straits, personal spending did. 501K's are not a bank vault, you ran the risks when you put your money in them.
The economy is not going make a miraculous comeback on the back of any legislation, no matter how well intentioned or far sighted, because it is the entire balance of capital between all companies and nations in the world that needs to find the time and means to readjust itself.
I'm actually a tighter. :rolleyes:
Correction, multiple. But I buy them because I LIKE them and I don't like the government to take things from me.
exactly.
the doom and gloom crowd grossly overstate the issue imo as well. i do not think it will be nearly as bad as they imagine. beyond that, we are in a ridiculous HUGE financial mess, a deficit beyond any deficit of the past.....what should we do? we have to get back on track, incorporate some fiscal responsibility to our governemtn once more. and yes, our governement is funded by taxes. everything comes with a cost. personally, i find this 'cost' far more palatable and in the long-run, i think far more beneficial for the good of all.
Let's just breathe...
I am myself like you somehow
Now all that's left is to sue someone, which he is threatening to do as well...