Bail out passes :(

mammasan

http://money.cnn.com/2008/10/03/news/economy/house_friday_bailout/index.htm?postversion=2008100309

yoke

with some added pork... yay America

decides2dream

you're surprised?
i'm not. i expected it to from the get-go.
sadly i think we as a country make far too many rash decisions instead of investing the time into finding the BEST choice of the varying options to solve our woes. let's hope it actually 'works'...although i believe, long-term, it won't. from much of what i've read...it's a VERY costly short-term fix that in the long-run, will fix nothing. :(

teskeinc

Democrats are stroking their own cocks now taking credit. Even Pelosi!

RolandTD20Kdrummer

that's fuckt...

QuestionAuthority

I can hear the champagne bottles popping as I type... yeah for the super rich of America.. I bet it put's their mind at rest that they dont have to sell the yacht or the home in Jackson Hole..

mammasan

decides2dream wrote:

you're surprised?
i'm not. i expected it to from the get-go.
sadly i think we as a country make far too many rash decisions instead of investing the time into finding the BEST choice of the varying options to solve our woes. let's hope it actually 'works'...although i believe, long-term, it won't. from much of what i've read...it's a VERY costly short-term fix that in the long-run, will fix nothing. :(

I couldn't agree more. Instead of fixing the root cause they decided to go with the short-term fix.

MrBrian

As expected it did.

But hey, at least this will prove one thing for Obama, that he's for sure not a muslim. Because a mulsim would probably never endorse something with so much pork in it.

blackredyellow

mammasan wrote:

I couldn't agree more. Instead of fixing the root cause they decided to go with the short-term fix.

Can you remember the last time our government didn't go with the short-term fix instead of fixing the root cause?


Me neither...

meme

Can someone give me a link to the individual votes?

I cannot for the love of me imagine how someone could defend shifting their position, especially Republicans.

norm

meme wrote:

Can someone give me a link to the individual votes?

I cannot for the love of me imagine how someone could defend shifting their position, especially Republicans.

http://clerk.house.gov/evs/2008/roll681.xml

VINNY GOOMBA

This is utter fuckin bullshit.

http://clerk.house.gov/evs/2008/roll681.xml

If your congressperson voted for this, VOTE THEM OUT.

It's that simple.

Stone Is God

decides2dream wrote:

sadly i think we as a country make far too many rash decisions instead of investing the time into finding the BEST choice of the varying options to solve our woes. (

That would take a miracle. The people in Congress don't give a shit about the American people. All the hollow promises from these losers is unreal.

T-Bone 82

I think the bailout will provide short-term stability to the financial markets, which is good for everyone from CEO's to lower level employees. However, the government's argument that they can hold onto what they've described as 'toxic' securities until they eventually rebound and increase in value is flawed. They will likely never sell them (or sell them for pennies on the dollar) and it will be the taxpayers that foot the bill.

The bottom line is that we all messed up big time. Wall street, Mortgage lenders, and consumers. Mortgage lenders were making loans to people that should have been turned down, people were gettting into mortgages that they couldn't afford, and Wall Street was backing securities with these risky mortgages. There is a lot of blame to go around. Government surely dropped the ball when they didn't address this issue and provide some more regulation. But why would they? Everybody was getting rich and trying to slow that down would be unpopular. A politician's main goal is to get elected and re-elected.

In the long-term, there needs to be more regulation in trading mortgage securities. I think it should be considered to do away with it altogether. People need to start thinking about their home as a place to live, rather than an investment. If they do trade mortgage-backed securities again, they should only be as good as the people who are paying them. In other words, they would only be able to trade mortgages of homeowners with 'A' credit.

I do worry about the haste in which this was passed. I hope it wasn't fear-mongering like the Patriot Act and the War in Iraq. I don't think it was because I do believe there would be severe consequences in the short-term, but we'll see...

Stone Is God

T-Bone 82 wrote:

People need to start thinking about their home as a place to live, rather than an investment.

Or an ATM machine, which a lot of people treated their homes as for a long time.

inmytree

I guess we've been saved from a depression...:rolleyes:

checking the rollcall, I'm happy to see my congressmen voted "no"...

It fucks me off the Obama and Biden voted for this bullshit...I'm not surprised, just pissed off...

T-Bone 82

Or an ATM machine, which a lot of people treated their homes as for a long time.

Very true. They wound up w/ more in home equity loans then their house was worth. People just assumed home prices would increase forever and they could sell their's for a huge gain if they got in over their heads.

PrlJmr10

QuestionAuthority wrote:

I can hear the champagne bottles popping as I type... yeah for the super rich of America.. I bet it put's their mind at rest that they dont have to sell the yacht or the home in Jackson Hole..

Yeah...and I'm so sure this woman (and many more like her) will be helped by the "bail out".

CNN) -- A 90-year-old Akron, Ohio, woman who shot herself as sheriff's deputies tried to evict her from her foreclosed home became a symbol of the nation's home mortgage crisis Friday.
Addie Polk is being treated at Akron General Medical Center after shooting herself at least twice in the upper body Wednesday afternoon, her city councilman said.
U.S. Rep. Dennis Kucinich, D-Ohio, mentioned Polk on the House floor Friday during debate over the latest economic rescue proposal.
"This bill does nothing for the Addie Polks of the world," Kucinich said after telling her story. "This bill fails to address the fact that millions of homeowners are facing foreclosure, are facing the loss of their home. This bill will take care of Wall Street, and the market may go up for a few days, but democracy is going downhill."
Neighbor Robert Dillon used a ladder to enter a second-story window of Polk's home after he and the deputies heard bangs inside, Dillon told CNN affiliate WEWS-TV in Cleveland, Ohio.
"I just thought she may have fell or couldn't get up or something," he told WEWS. "I didn't know [she had shot herself] until I got in there. And even when I got there, she was breathing, but she wasn't saying anything to me. I knew she needed help then."
Dillon said he saw blood when he put his hand on Polk's shoulder.
"There's a lot of people like Miss Polk right now. That's the sad thing about it," said Akron City Council President Marco Sommerville, who had met Polk before and rushed to the scene when contacted by police. "They might not be as old as her, some could be as old as her. This is just a major problem."
In 2004, Polk took out a 30-year, 6.375 percent mortgage for $45,620 with a Countrywide Home Loan office in Cuyahoga Falls, Ohio. The same day, she also took out an $11,380 line of credit.
Over the next couple of years Polk missed payments on the 101-year-old home and in 2007 Fannie Mae assumed the mortgage and later filed for foreclosure.
Deputies had tried to serve Polk's eviction notice more than 30 times before Wednesday's incident, Sommerville said. She never came to the door, but the notes the deputies left would always disappear, so they knew she was inside and ambulatory, he said.
The city is creating programs to help people keep their homes, Sommerville said.
"But what do you do when there's just so many people out there and the economy is in the shape that it's in?"
Many businesses and individuals have called since Wednesday offering to help Polk, Sommerville said.
"We're going to do an evaluation to see what's best for her," he said. "If she's strong enough and can go home, I think we should work with her to where she goes back home. If not, we need to find another place for her to live where she won't have to worry about this ever again."
He said that by the time people call for help with an impending foreclosure, it's usually too late.
"I'm glad it's not too late for Miss Polk, because she could have taken her life," Sommerville said. "Miss Polk will probably end up on her feet. But I'm not sure if anybody else will."

decides2dream

mammasan wrote:

I couldn't agree more. Instead of fixing the root cause they decided to go with the short-term fix.

that was kinda my point in that other discussion on this topic in that other thread. hell if i know what the 'right' choice would be, but hell, there are a lot of smart people out there...people who know a lot about this topic....i just think it would be wise to figure it out FIRST, and not go for the quick-fix. i mean, isn't the whole 'instant gratification' issue a BIG part of what got us in this mes in the first place?


those who do not learn from their mistakes are doomed to repeat them.



it's almost like a national mantra nowadays. :(
sadly, it should not be a point of pride, but shame.

Lesbelges

PrlJmr10 wrote:

Yeah...and I'm so sure this woman (and many more like her) will be helped by the "bail out".

CNN) -- A 90-year-old Akron, Ohio, woman who shot herself as sheriff's deputies tried to evict her from her foreclosed home became a symbol of the nation's home mortgage crisis Friday.
Addie Polk is being treated at Akron General Medical Center after shooting herself at least twice in the upper body Wednesday afternoon, her city councilman said.
U.S. Rep. Dennis Kucinich, D-Ohio, mentioned Polk on the House floor Friday during debate over the latest economic rescue proposal.
"This bill does nothing for the Addie Polks of the world," Kucinich said after telling her story. "This bill fails to address the fact that millions of homeowners are facing foreclosure, are facing the loss of their home. This bill will take care of Wall Street, and the market may go up for a few days, but democracy is going downhill."
Neighbor Robert Dillon used a ladder to enter a second-story window of Polk's home after he and the deputies heard bangs inside, Dillon told CNN affiliate WEWS-TV in Cleveland, Ohio.
"I just thought she may have fell or couldn't get up or something," he told WEWS. "I didn't know [she had shot herself] until I got in there. And even when I got there, she was breathing, but she wasn't saying anything to me. I knew she needed help then."
Dillon said he saw blood when he put his hand on Polk's shoulder.
"There's a lot of people like Miss Polk right now. That's the sad thing about it," said Akron City Council President Marco Sommerville, who had met Polk before and rushed to the scene when contacted by police. "They might not be as old as her, some could be as old as her. This is just a major problem."
In 2004, Polk took out a 30-year, 6.375 percent mortgage for $45,620 with a Countrywide Home Loan office in Cuyahoga Falls, Ohio. The same day, she also took out an $11,380 line of credit.
Over the next couple of years Polk missed payments on the 101-year-old home and in 2007 Fannie Mae assumed the mortgage and later filed for foreclosure.
Deputies had tried to serve Polk's eviction notice more than 30 times before Wednesday's incident, Sommerville said. She never came to the door, but the notes the deputies left would always disappear, so they knew she was inside and ambulatory, he said.
The city is creating programs to help people keep their homes, Sommerville said.
"But what do you do when there's just so many people out there and the economy is in the shape that it's in?"
Many businesses and individuals have called since Wednesday offering to help Polk, Sommerville said.
"We're going to do an evaluation to see what's best for her," he said. "If she's strong enough and can go home, I think we should work with her to where she goes back home. If not, we need to find another place for her to live where she won't have to worry about this ever again."
He said that by the time people call for help with an impending foreclosure, it's usually too late.
"I'm glad it's not too late for Miss Polk, because she could have taken her life," Sommerville said. "Miss Polk will probably end up on her feet. But I'm not sure if anybody else will."

Wow that's a sad story.

But what about the fact that when she was 86 she took out a 30 year loan on a house and a credit line which she could not afford. Clearly she wasn't planning on paying it all back. Unless she was hoping to live till 124 or winning the lottery.

That's not to say that the lenders are not at fault. They should not have lent her money for a house.

It's definitely a shitty situation, but both are at fault.

Commy

This is just one of a thousand examples of the failure of capitalism. IT cannot exist without massive gov't intervention. Laissez-faire no longer applies.