save humanity and end the American empire

MrBrian

By Alireza Ronaghi
1 hour, 27 minutes ago

TEHRAN (Reuters) - Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez enveloped his Iranian counterpart Mahmoud Ahmadinejad in a bear hug on Sunday and the two men backed their anti-U.S. rhetoric with deals on everything from bicycles to oil.

In a typically verbose speech, robust ex-paratrooper Chavez lambasted their common enemy, Washington.

"If the U.S. empire succeeds in establishing its dominance, there will be no future for humanity. Therefore we should save humanity and end the American empire," Chavez told a crowd at the University of Tehran.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20060730/wl_nm/iran_venezuela_dc

audome25

"we should save humanity and end the American empire...." so that I (Hugo) can build an empire.

rightondude

MrBrian wrote:

By Alireza Ronaghi
1 hour, 27 minutes ago

TEHRAN (Reuters) - Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez enveloped his Iranian counterpart Mahmoud Ahmadinejad in a bear hug on Sunday and the two men backed their anti-U.S. rhetoric with deals on everything from bicycles to oil.

In a typically verbose speech, robust ex-paratrooper Chavez lambasted their common enemy, Washington.

"If the U.S. empire succeeds in establishing its dominance, there will be no future for humanity. Therefore we should save humanity and end the American empire," Chavez told a crowd at the University of Tehran.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20060730/wl_nm/iran_venezuela_dc

Hoo boy... :rolleyes:

rebornFixer

I think I just threw up in my mouth, a little.

In fact, this place should come with those airsickness bags, these days ...

thankyougrandma

reborncareerist wrote:

I think I just threw up in my mouth, a little.

In fact, this place should come with those airsickness bags, these days ...

damn right

rightondude

audome25 wrote:

"we should save humanity and end the American empire...." so that I can become an empire.

How long have you had this dream about baseball

MrBrian

of course one can't be too thrilled about the president of Iran and Venezuela trying to "save humanity"? Or thinking they'll be able to do it, nevertheless Chaves does make a good point (one that is fairly obvious) about america succeeding in it's ways not being a good thing for mankind/earth.

But we all know that once one empire ends another one comes up so it's cyclical. Can anyone offer any solutions? Reborn, dude, you got any?
Just saying you threw up in your mouth is not gonna help solve or create any debate for a better world.

rebornFixer

MrBrian wrote:

of course one can't be too thrilled about the president of Iran and Venezuela trying to "save humanity"? Or thinking they'll be able to do it, nevertheless Chaves does make a good point (one that is fairly obvious) about america succeeding in it's ways not being a good thing for mankind/earth.

But we all know that once one empire ends another one comes up so it's cyclical. Can anyone offer any solutions? Reborn, dude, you got any?

A laser-guided bomb aimed right at these two the next time they decide to have a hugfest?

Nah ... Just kidding. Sort of. I agree that Chavez, despite cuddling up to one of the most loathesome leaders currently on the world scene, has a point. The U.S. needs to change how it interacts with people in the Middle East, and perhaps South America as well. The perception that the U.S. is only in it for the oil needs to be changed, and the only way this will change is by the Americans BEHAVING differently that they have been. As much as I support Israel's right to defend itself from terrorism, I do feel that the U.S. needs to be more even-handed in the Middle East. Direct humanitarian aid to the Palestinians and to Lebanese civilians ... More aggressive work on Palestinian statehood ... Collaboration with Iran on non-military aspects of its nuclear program ... More needs to be done to foster goodwill, although these countries are also going to have to realize that the U.S. will not simply cut all aid to Israel. Nor should it, IMHO.

dkst0426

Dumb shits. Of course, as a great Jedi once said, "Who's more foolish? The fool, or the fool who follows the fool?"

MrBrian

reborncareerist wrote:

A laser-guided bomb aimed right at these two the next time they decide to have a hugfest?

Nah ... Just kidding. Sort of. I agree that Chavez, despite cuddling up to one of the most loathesome leaders currently on the world scene, has a point. The U.S. needs to change how it interacts with people in the Middle East, and perhaps South America as well. The perception that the U.S. is only in it for the oil needs to be changed, and the only way this will change is by the Americans BEHAVING differently that they have been. As much as I support Israel's right to defend itself from terrorism, I do feel that the U.S. needs to be more even-handed in the Middle East. Direct humanitarian aid to the Palestinians and to Lebanese civilians ... More aggressive work on Palestinian statehood ... Collaboration with Iran on non-military aspects of its nuclear program ... More needs to be done to foster goodwill, although these countries are also going to have to realize that the U.S. will not simply cut all aid to Israel. Nor should it, IMHO.

Now that's better.

---

Why should'nt The US cut israeli aid (mainly weapons) when israel is constantly breaking international laws with it? if I was supplying a guy guns and he was shooting people with it, do you not think I should cut my gun supply to this person? In the same sense look at what israel is doing, how can you feel that America should continue giving Them these bombs and bullets?

I don't know how to get americans to "behave differently", Of course that's what they need to do but look at her history, she's always been the same, it's not like america was ever really this amazing place that helped all nations and did'nt cause trouble.

also, I agree that the US is not only in it for oil but what else do you think they are in it for? please don't tell me world peace.

rebornFixer

MrBrian wrote:

Now that's better.

---

Why should'nt The US cut israeli aid (mainly weapons) when israel is constantly breaking international laws with it? if I was supplying a guy guns and he was shooting people with it, do you not think I should cut my gun supply to this person? In the same sense look at what israel is doing, how can you feel that America should continue giving Them these bombs and bullets?

I don't know how to get americans to "behave differently", Of course that's what they need to do but look at her history, she's always been the same, it's not like america was ever really this amazing place that helped all nations and did'nt cause trouble.

also, I agree that the US is not only in it for oil but what else do you think they are in it for? please don't tell me world peace.

Israel actually manufactures a lot of its own weapons now, including small arms. Yes, it still gets many of its avoinics and aerial weapons systems from the U.S.
Second, your statement about history could probably describe almost any nation. History tends to repeat itself the world over.
As for your last question ... What else is America "in it" for? Hmmm ... $$? Of course, oil is just an example of that. Some sort of political ideal? Someone posted a very interesting definition of "neo-con" a while back. Basically, the post argued that there is an ideology behind so-called neo-con actions in the world ... The belief that the U.S. is a good place to live because of the fundamental freedoms and democracy, combined with a second belief: That this way of life should be spread throughout regions of the world that are less free. This spreading, however, needs not always involve military action. In fact, many neo-cons think that invasion is a very poor way to spread democracy. Honestly? I think Bush's invasion of Iraq was probably motivated more by $$ and personal gain, and less by true "neo-conservative" ideals.

MrBrian

reborncareerist wrote:

Israel actually manufactures a lot of its own weapons now, including small arms. Yes, it still gets many of its avoinics and aerial weapons systems from the U.S.
Second, your statement about history could probably describe almost any nation. History tends to repeat itself the world over.
As for your last question ... What else is America "in it" for? Hmmm ... $$? Of course, oil is just an example of that. Some sort of political ideal? Someone posted a very interesting definition of "neo-con" a while back. Basically, the post argued that there is an ideology behind so-called neo-con actions in the world ... The belief that the U.S. is a good place to live because of the fundamental freedoms and democracy, combined with a second belief: That this way of life should be spread throughout regions of the world that are less free. This spreading, however, needs not always involve military action. In fact, many neo-cons think that invasion is a very poor way to spread democracy. Honestly? I think Bush's invasion of Iraq was probably motivated more by $$ and personal gain, and less by true "neo-conservative" ideals.

I am aware that Israel does manufacture some if it's own weapons but (I'm pretty sure) most/large part of the weapons israel is using agains lebanon are american made so just by that fact alone america has the ability to stop what israel is doing by cutting off the supply (America recently rushed some "smart" bombs to israel for her little leabanese excursion)

I mentioned in an earlier post about empires, it's cyclical one goes another one comes.

Now I would understand the passion to spread "fundamental freedoms and democracy" but when the country trying to do it lacks these things itself I don't see how they go around trying to spread it.

Of course it was a money issue for america, but I believe it was also fought on behalf of israel, something you probably sorta agree with?
Looking at the many many many many many times america and israel end up side by side on issues and you'll see what I mean.

I posted a thread once about the abusive relationship america and israel share with one another. I'll see if I can dig it up.

NMyTree

If comments like this out of Chavez don't tip you guys off, to exactly what these guys have been scheming and planning, for years now; then you're not paying attention.

America can not continue to proceed with it's current or past policies and it's disregard for humans and the environment. Things must change!

But, neither of those two clowns offer a better solution or way of life.

Chavez has hung his people and their infrastructure....out to dry. He hasn't done squat to help them. He takes...takes....takes, and gives very little (if any at all) back to his people.

No need to go into the whackjob in Iran. An Islamic Planet is out of the question.

They can all kiss my ass and go fuck themselves.

The changes this country needs to make would have to be made slowly and carefully.

I'll think about the issues and check back in later.

rebornFixer

MrBrian wrote:

Of course it was a money issue for america, but I believe it was also fought on behalf of israel, something you probably sorta agree with?
Looking at the many many many many many times america and israel end up side by side on issues and you'll see what I mean.

I posted a thread once about the abusive relationship america and israel share with one another. I'll see if I can dig it up.

Yes, I agree, perhaps. I would be curious to get your thoughts on why America and Israel have this relationship. I think some of it relates to population demographics in the U.S. itself ... A cynic or conspiracy theorist would say that these American Jews pull strings and the U.S. government dances. I think that's a bit too strong to have much of a factual basis, although I don't doubt that Jewish groups in America do exert some political pressure.
More important is the fact that Israel represents America's only surefire foothold in the region. Sure, some of the Arab states' governments are friendly, but today's ally could easily be tomorrow's dire enemy, assuming that more of these countries become theocracies. Isreal is America's "in", an "in" into a region that yes, contains a lot of oil. Isreal also constitutes proof that real democracy can exist in this region. I don't know ... On the one hand, Israel is America's posterboy ... On the other hand, America does NOT intervene directly when Israel is threatened. Have you noticed? Ever since Isreal's inception, America has provided financial aid, and military equipment, but never direct involvement. Which is more than we can say for the Soviets in the late 60s/early 70s (helping the Arab side). Its all political and "behind the scenes".

miller8966

MrBrian wrote:

I am aware that Israel does manufacture some if it's own weapons but (I'm pretty sure) most/large part of the weapons israel is using agains lebanon are american made so just by that fact alone america has the ability to stop what israel is doing by cutting off the supply (America recently rushed some "smart" bombs to israel for her little leabanese excursion)

I mentioned in an earlier post about empires, it's cyclical one goes another one comes.

Now I would understand the passion to spread "fundamental freedoms and democracy" but when the country trying to do it lacks these things itself I don't see how they go around trying to spread it.

Of course it was a money issue for america, but I believe it was also fought on behalf of israel, something you probably sorta agree with?
Looking at the many many many many many times america and israel end up side by side on issues and you'll see what I mean.

I posted a thread once about the abusive relationship america and israel share with one another. I'll see if I can dig it up.

WHy should we stop israel? They are our partners and our friends

rebornFixer

NMyTree wrote:

But, neither of those two clowns offer a better solution or way of life.

Exactly the problem ... How is a "mad empire" supposed to follow the advice of people who are even worse?

MrBrian

reborncareerist wrote:

Yes, I agree, perhaps. I would be curious to get your thoughts on why America and Israel have this relationship. I think some of it relates to population demographics in the U.S. itself ... A cynic or conspiracy theorist would say that these American Jews pull strings and the U.S. government dances. I think that's a bit too strong to have much of a factual basis, although I don't doubt that Jewish groups in America do exert some political pressure.
More important is the fact that Israel represents America's only surefire foothold in the region. Sure, some of the Arab states' governments are friendly, but today's ally could easily be tomorrow's dire enemy, assuming that more of these countries become theocracies. Isreal is America's "in", an "in" into a region that yes, contains a lot of oil. Isreal also constitutes proof that real democracy can exist in this region. I don't know ... On the one hand, Israel is America's posterboy ... On the other hand, America does NOT intervene directly when Israel is threatened. Have you noticed? Ever since Isreal's inception, America has provided financial aid, and military equipment, but never direct involvement. Which is more than we can say for the Soviets in the late 60s/early 70s (helping the Arab side). Its all political and "behind the scenes".

Yeah I think it's too simple just to say that israel pulls americas strings, America by her own will and the american people by theirs support israel, reasons are many, lack of a true understand of current and past events and history is a main reason for that.

As you said, jewsish groups in america do have a huge amount of influence when it comes to american politics and are able to exert pressure, just look at americas top politicians, how many are jewish? not many but they (the top christian politicians) often are supporters of israel.

But I would however consider america giving aid/weapons to israel as "direct involvement". Not really behind the scenes, america supplying afghan rebels to fight the soviets I think is more of america fighting behind the scenes.

When it comes to israel, america is always upfront with israel against most of the world.

Now, why do they share this close relationship? I think at the end, they are just using one another, america needs israel and israel needs america.

How did the relationship between the two really start I think is the greater question?

miller8966

MrBrian wrote:

Yeah I think it's too simple just to say that israel pulls americas strings, America by her own will and the american people by theirs support israel, reasons are many, lack of a true understand of current and past events and history is a main reason for that.

As you said, jewsish groups in america do have a huge amount of influence when it comes to american politics and are able to exert pressure, just look at americas top politicians, how many are jewish? not many but they (the top christian politicians) often are supporters of israel.

But I would however consider america giving aid/weapons to israel as "direct involvement". Not really behind the scenes, america supplying afghan rebels to fight the soviets I think is more of america fighting behind the scenes.

When it comes to israel, america is always upfront with israel against most of the world.

Now, why do they share this close relationship? I think at the end, they are just using one another, america needs israel and israel needs america.

How did the relationship between the two really start I think is the greater question?

Its a beautiful relationship that i hope never ends. THink about all the things the jews have given us americans...our entertainment industry is practically run by them. ANd ask yourself what have the arabs done for us besides been a problem in our side..theyve done nothing.

PaperPlates

miller8966 wrote:

Its a beautiful relationship that i hope never ends. THink about all the things the jews have given us americans...our entertainment industry is practically run by them. ANd ask yourself what have the arabs done for us besides been a problem in our side..theyve done nothing.

And idnt it quite maddening that the "Jewish owned Hollywood" and the "Jewish owned legislature" somehow manage to be on the opposite ends of so many core beliefs?

breakmarysfall

MrBrian wrote:

But we all know that once one empire ends another one comes up so it's cyclical. Can anyone offer any solutions? .

... so Chavez might dream of his own empire... and hoping the time of the US empire is soon over (after 60 years of leadership).

The problem is only, that the US is ruling the world by force,
and, hence, it is difficult to do anything about it when you like life.

dunno a solution cause looking at myself, I realize that I like my life the way it is and I wanna keep it that way.

If I see already those egoistic symptoms within myself (although I do not have a rich life),
what about the big heads, the really rich folks with real power that run the whole system since a while (the CIOs of corporations, the Hip Hoppers with blinking diamonds, the Hiltons and Bushs of our society)?

Too many Humans love power and influence and will work hard to keep it!!!
so the US want things this way so they will use their extreme force further to guarantee the leadership...

a solution will only come from every single person within the mass. If we change and do choose the things to support carefully
and if we show humanity to our neighbours and ALSO to the third world
and if we vote for other ways and get together in public interest circles,
we can bring any empire down from within.

To implement a change, every one of us (in the rich, privileged world) needs to change and step back in the living standard but care for others instead,
I think.

if this change is not occuring... no change til the end of times will happen.

...my2cents right now.

Puck78

miller8966 wrote:

Its a beautiful relationship that i hope never ends. THink about all the things the jews have given us americans...our entertainment industry is practically run by them. ANd ask yourself what have the arabs done for us besides been a problem in our side..theyve done nothing.

as a start you ride a bicycle, right?