The Charter of Allah: The Platform of the Islamic Resistance Movement (Hamas)
“In the Name of Allah, the Merciful, the Compassionate You are the best community that has been raised up for mankind. Ye enjoin right conduct and forbid indecency; and ye believe in Allah. And if the People of the Scripture had believed, it had been better for them. Some of them are believers; but most of them are evil-doers. They will not harm you save a trifling hurt, and if they fight against you they will turn and flee. And afterward they will not be helped. Ignominy shall be their portion wheresoever they are found save [where they grasp] a rope from Allah and a rope from man. They have incurred anger from their Lord, and wretchedness is laid upon them. That is because they used to disbelieve the revelations of Allah, and slew the Prophets wrongfully. That is because they were rebellious and used to transgress.” Surat Al-Imran (III), verses 109-111 Israel will rise and will remain erect until Islam eliminates it as it had eliminated its predecessors. The Islamic World is burning. It is incumbent upon each one of us to pour some water, little as it may be, with a view of extinguishing as much of the fire as he can, without awaiting action by the others.
you are flat out wrong
Hamas does not equal Palestine. And I fully believe the people of Palestine wouldn't rely on Hamas for protection if we actually showed interest in a peace process and not more of the policy of arming and funding the aggression against them. How much would stock would you put in me wanting peace with you if I kept arming the guy who is shooting at you? You have to see their side, as well. I believe both sets of people want peace. But those in power want more conflict. You don't stabilize a situation by dousing the fire with gasoline.
If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
I wish you were right but your not. right now Hamas DOES equal palestine. they call the shots, they are the head government in charge. you knew that right?
And I fully believe the people of Palestine wouldn't rely on Hamas for protection if we actually showed interest in a peace process and not more of the policy of arming and funding the aggression against them. How much would stock would you put in me wanting peace with you if I kept arming the guy who is shooting at you? You have to see their side, as well. I believe both sets of people want peace. But those in power want more conflict. You don't stabilize a situation by dousing the fire with gasoline.
and you dont bring peace by electing a government that wants Israel destroyed. if Hamas wasnt in power, peace would have a chance no matter how many weapons Israel has.
I wish you were right but your not. right now Hamas DOES equal palestine. they call the shots, they are the head government in charge. you knew that right?
and you dont bring peace by electing a government that wants Israel destroyed. if Hamas wasnt in power, peace would have a chance no matter how many weapons Israel has.
So you don't see the destruction and death Israel has caused onto the Palestinian people? If you claim Israel is innocent in this and not equally as guilty then you are choosing to see only one side while ignoring the other.
If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
So you don't see the destruction and death Israel has caused onto the Palestinian people? If you claim Israel is innocent in this and not equally as guilty then you are choosing to see only one side while ignoring the other.
yes I do see the Israel has done wrong. but if they really wanted to, they could destroy all of palestine in a day. but they dont. Israel does not have a stated purpose of destroying palestine. in most cases they are defending themselves from militants launching rockets into civilians areas.
both sides do wrong. yes BOTH. but Hamas is the one preventing peace.
yes I do see the Israel has done wrong. but if they really wanted to, they could destroy all of palestine in a day. but they dont. Israel does not have a stated purpose of destroying palestine. in most cases they are defending themselves from militants launching rockets into civilians areas.
both sides do wrong. yes BOTH. but Hamas is the one preventing peace.
They are both preventing peace. If Israel wasn't involved in any violence towards Palestine then you'd have a leg to stand on. But Israel isn't acting any more peaceful than Hamas at the moment.
If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
They are both preventing peace. If Israel wasn't involved in any violence towards Palestine then you'd have a leg to stand on. But Israel isn't acting any more peaceful than Hamas at the moment.
And perhaps if the palestinian people had enough money to build schools and hospitals themselves they would not need hamas to do it for them.
Hamas is the only protection the people have against israel. also long before hamas, the palestinians had peace groups and such they were still being attacked by israel. years before the suicide bomber was created.
And perhaps if the palestinian people had enough money to build schools and hospitals themselves they would not need hamas to do it for them.
Hamas is the only protection the people have against israel. also long before hamas, the palestinians had peace groups and such they were still being attacked by israel. years before the suicide bomber was created.
if Hamas recognizes Israel's right to exist problems would be solved. or least there would be a chance. why are you people failing to realize or even fucking admit that hamas wants to destroy Israel.
dont tell me that Israel wants to destroy palestine. if they wanted to, they would.
I love your argument, because Israel is able to destroy all of palestine but have not done it yet. Infact, what do you call shooting school kids? cutting off water and food supply? is it not destruction? maybe it's art work?
btw, you know what mossads tag is? "By way of deception, thou shalt do war"
I love your argument, because Israel is able to destroy all of palestine but have not done it yet. Infact, what do you call shooting school kids? cutting off water and food supply? is it not destruction? maybe it's art work?
btw, you know what mossads tag is? "By way of deception, thou shalt do war"
and I love your argument.....Hamas doesnt want to destroy Israel.
looks like palli has been munching some serious Israeliomerican boomstick
Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
over specific principles, goals, and policies.
you have to be kidding me. you use google images to prove your point? you are smarter then that. dont embarrass yourself. look abook if we can agree that both are in the wrong, and both need to make concessions in order for peace to happen, then thats good enough for me
you have to be kidding me. you use google images to prove your point? you are smarter then that. dont embarrass yourself. look abook if we can agree that both are in the wrong, and both need to make concessions in order for peace to happen, then thats good enough for me
No, I'm not kidding. It's a damn good point. Israel looks like a beautiful and flourishing country and Palestine looks like heaps of rubble all over the place, bombed out buildings and houses and ones that have been bulldozed down also. That's the reality of it. You keep talking about destruction and the only destruction I see is the complete devastation of Palestine. Sorry if it doesn't seem smart to you to actually have to look at what our policy causes. I guess it's smart to just talk about these things without having to reference the actual shit that's there for us all to see.
I've been saying both sides are wrong. You are the one saying how Israel isn't in the wrong and how we should continue to supply them with weapons and aid while we leave the Plaestinian people to pick through the rubble of their homes trying to find pieces of their lives left undestroyed.
If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
I wonder if Obama likes Doritos, plain, or salt and vinegar. I wonder what he watches on TV and eats for dinner...I wonder what his shit looks like...my god it's all so fucking fascinating.
What would Obama do?
foreign policy is the one of the main factors in determining who gets my vote as president.
And perhaps if the palestinian people had enough money to build schools and hospitals themselves they would not need hamas to do it for them.
Hamas is the only protection the people have against israel. also long before hamas, the palestinians had peace groups and such they were still being attacked by israel. years before the suicide bomber was created.
actually, the u.s gave millions and millions of dollars to the palestinian people so taht they could build schools, hospitals, etc, where did that money go you ask? well, their long time leader, arafat, stole it to create palaces for himself, the palestinians were kept in poverty by their own leader, while he lead a life of luxury. and what are you talking about 'years before the suicide bomber was created', the suicide bomber is as old as time.
I don't care how many times you repeat it, it doesn't make it true. Israel has don't nothing but destroy Palestine. Those people have nothing left.
actually, israel has done many things for palestinians. since arafat stole from his own people, israel has looked after them, that's right, you heard what i said, where do you think palestinians go to see doctors? israel. schools? israel. work? israel. don't believe everything that you see on cnn, israelis and palestinians are living side by side, shopping at the same markets, going to the same schools, living the same lifestyles
i have one more question for you, if a terrorist came into your backyard and killed your parents, your children, your brother, your freinds, all your loved ones, would you sit back and say 'oh, we should love them, we should give them more land'? wait, no, that's right, your country would sit around and think about it for a year, make up a phoney excuse, and go attack a completly different country. and this is when the threat is on the other side of an ocean, yet when israelis have to deal with terrorists sitting on the bus with them, and blowing themselves up on a daily basis you would have them do nothing, actually, no, you'd have them build special hospitals just for them, in addition to building homes and schools.
every palestinian leader has called for the death of israel, and i quote "we shall not rest until all israelis have been pushed into the sea" - arafat
and hamas is even worse.
please, tell me what you would do? last time the jews didn't take a threat seriously 6 million were burned, gased, tortured, and starved to death, i think that israel has good reason to believe the various palestinian leaders who have called for their extermination.
No problem can be solved from the same consciousness that created it.
Albert Einstein
what i find amusing about these pictures, is that they are mainly of the dome of the rock, see that big gold building prominently featured at the center of all of your pictures? look closely, what do you see, a crescent on top! see the jews praying at the wall? that's the wall of a temple that used to stand at that place that was destroyed by muslims, on top of the destroyed temple, a mosque was built. you need to learn your history.
jerusalem is also divided into quarters, the jewish, muslim, chistian, and armenian quarters. that's right, in that beautiful city that you showed pictures of, palestinians are living.
please, stop the propaganda, and if you're trying to use random pictures of places that you've never been to spin a point, at least learn about the content of the pictures first!
No problem can be solved from the same consciousness that created it.
Albert Einstein
what i find amusing about these pictures, is that they are mainly of the dome of the rock, see that big gold building prominently featured at the center of all of your pictures? look closely, what do you see, a crescent on top! see the jews praying at the wall? that's the wall of a temple that used to stand at that place that was destroyed by muslims, on top of the destroyed temple, a mosque was built. you need to learn your history.
jerusalem is also divided into quarters, the jewish, muslim, chistian, and armenian quarters. that's right, in that beautiful city that you showed pictures of, palestinians are living.
please, stop the propaganda, and if you're trying to use random pictures of places that you've never been to spin a point, at least learn about the content of the pictures first!
No, I already knew that. And as I've said throughout this thread, both sides hold the guilt. But if we're going to stress on Hamas wanting to destroy Israel then I think we should look at which side in living in a destruction filled country and which one is enjoying much more prosperity. If you have pictures of a properous Palestine then please share. Almost all the video and pics I've seen on the place look horrible. I'm not trying to use proganda, I'm trying to show the consequences of our policy and why we should drop it for a more peaceful, productive one. You can't go on and on about people calling for Israel's destrution when it's only Palestine that appears destroyed. It's not just random pics and articles, it's FACT. And going to a place doesn't mean you're an expert on their policy. I live in the US and am surrounded daily by people who don't have a fucking clue what's going on.
actually, the u.s gave millions and millions of dollars to the palestinian people so taht they could build schools, hospitals, etc, where did that money go you ask? well, their long time leader, arafat, stole it to create palaces for himself, the palestinians were kept in poverty by their own leader, while he lead a life of luxury. and what are you talking about 'years before the suicide bomber was created', the suicide bomber is as old as time.
actually, israel has done many things for palestinians. since arafat stole from his own people, israel has looked after them, that's right, you heard what i said, where do you think palestinians go to see doctors? israel. schools? israel. work? israel. don't believe everything that you see on cnn, israelis and palestinians are living side by side, shopping at the same markets, going to the same schools, living the same lifestyles
i have one more question for you, if a terrorist came into your backyard and killed your parents, your children, your brother, your freinds, all your loved ones, would you sit back and say 'oh, we should love them, we should give them more land'? wait, no, that's right, your country would sit around and think about it for a year, make up a phoney excuse, and go attack a completly different country. and this is when the threat is on the other side of an ocean, yet when israelis have to deal with terrorists sitting on the bus with them, and blowing themselves up on a daily basis you would have them do nothing, actually, no, you'd have them build special hospitals just for them, in addition to building homes and schools.
every palestinian leader has called for the death of israel, and i quote "we shall not rest until all israelis have been pushed into the sea" - arafat
and hamas is even worse.
please, tell me what you would do? last time the jews didn't take a threat seriously 6 million were burned, gased, tortured, and starved to death, i think that israel has good reason to believe the various palestinian leaders who have called for their extermination.
if you want i can post the report on how a majority of palestinian children suffere from severe malnutrition b/c of the checkpoints and whatnot imposed by israel.
or i can post the video of the idf attacking and beating peaceful protestors over the idf bulldozing down their olive trees (then when the ambulance comes to pick the injured up the idf throw smoke grenades or teargas inside the ambulance)
or the video of israeli kids (in an illegal settlement) throwing rocks at muslim kids and women while the idf just stand around
there's another site from an occupied territory w/ video of israelis attacking muslims just for walking down the street and a lot of nice quotes about how they need to just kill them all and they should receive medals when they kill a palestinian
everyone knows arafat stole money, so you should punish them more for that happening to them??
to act like israel is this innocent victim and palestinians are the big, bad bully that israel tries sooooo hard to love is ridiculous
standin above the crowd
he had a voice that was strong and loud and
i swallowed his facade cos i'm so
eager to identify with
someone above the crowd
someone who seemed to feel the same
someone prepared to lead the way
are you ok, upset, or indifferent about Hamas wanting Israel destroyed?
you seem to be upset about america's one sided support, but fail to see why its like that.
So you justify America's unilateral betrayal of any chance of a two-state solution, whilst supporting Israeli terror? Until Israel complies with International law and withdraws to the 1967 borders then it has no right to expect recognition by Hamas or by anyone else.
yes I do see the Israel has done wrong. but if they really wanted to, they could destroy all of palestine in a day. but they dont. Israel does not have a stated purpose of destroying palestine. in most cases they are defending themselves from militants launching rockets into civilians areas.
both sides do wrong. yes BOTH. but Hamas is the one preventing peace.
So in your opinion because Israel can destroy Palestine in a day but chooses not to we should congratulate them on their peace-loving, reserved, and compassionate nature? So Israel does not have a stated purpose of destroying Palestine? So the fact that they have been slowly but surely destroying Palestine and continue to defy international law by continuing the illegal occupation and continued creation of illegal settlements becomes irrelevant. Israel not stating it's intentions means that what we see them doing is a mirage? What fantasy world are you living in?
'There was no effort to conceal the fact that Gaza disengagement was in reality West Bank expansion. The official plan for disengagement stated that Israel will permanently take over major population centers, cities, towns and villages, security areas and other places of special interest to Israel in the West Bank. That was endorsed by the U.S. ambassador, as it had been by the President, breaking sharply with U.S. policy.
Along with the disengagement plan, Israel announced investment of tens of millions of dollars in West Bank settlements. Prime Minister Sharon immediately approved new housing units in the town of Maale Adumim--that's to the east of Jerusalem--the core of the salient that divides the southern from the central Bantustan, to use Benvenisti's term, and also announced other expansion plans.
There is near unanimity that all of this violates international law. The consensus was expressed by U.S. Judge Buergenthal in his separate declaration attached to the World Court judgment, ruling that the separation wall is illegal. In Buergenthal's words, "The Fourth Geneva Convention and International Human Rights Law are applicable to the occupied Palestinian territory and must therefore be fully complied with by Israel. Accordingly, the segments of the wall being built by Israel to protect the settlements are ipso facto in violation of international humanitarian law," which happens to mean about 80% of the wall...
Keeping to the diplomatic record, the first -- both sides, of course, rejected 242. The first important step forward was in 1971, when president Sadat of Egypt offered a full peace treaty to Israel in return for Israeli withdrawal from the Occupied Territories. That would have ended the international conflict. Israel rejected the offer, choosing expansion over security. In this case, expansion into the Egyptian Sinai, where General Sharon's forces had driven thousands of farmers into the desert to clear the land for the all-Jewish city of Yamit. The U.S. backed Israel's stand.
Those decisions led to the 1973 war, a near disaster for Israel. The U.S. and Israel then recognized that Egypt could not be dismissed and finally accepted Sadat's 1971 offer at Camp David in 1979. But by then, the agreement included the demand for a Palestinian state, which had reached the international agenda.
In 1976, the major Arab states introduced a resolution to the U.N. Security Council calling for a peace settlement on the international border, based on U.N. 242, but now adding a Palestinian state in the Occupied Territories. That's Syria, Egypt, Jordan and every other relevant state. The U.S. vetoed the resolution again in 1980. The General Assembly passed similar resolutions year after year with the United States and Israel opposed.
The matter reached a head in 1988, when the PLO moved from tacit approval to formal acceptance of the two-state consensus. Israel responded with a declaration that there can be no, as they put it, "additional Palestinian state between Jordan and the sea," Jordan already being a Palestinian state -- that's Shimon Peres and Yitzhak Shamir -- and also that the status of the territories must be settled according to Israeli guidelines. The U.S. endorsed Israel's stand. I can only add what I wrote at the time: "It's as if someone were to argue the Jews don't need a second homeland in Israel, because they already have New York."
In May 1997, for the first time, Peres's Labour Party agreed not to rule out the establishment of a Palestinian state with limited sovereignty in areas excluding major Jewish settlement blocks, that is, the three cantons that were being constructed with U.S. support. The highest rate of post-Oslo settlement was in 2000, the final year of Clinton's term and Prime Minister Barak's.
Maps of the U.S.-Israel proposals at Camp David show a salient, east of Jerusalem, bisecting the West Bank, and a northern salient virtually dividing the northern from the central canton. I have the maps if you want them. The current map considerably extends these salients and the isolation of East Jerusalem. My maps are from the leading Israeli scholars, Ron Pundak, the Director of the Shimon Peres Center. The crucial issue at Camp David was territorial, not the refugee issue, for which Arafat agreed to a pragmatic solution, as Pundak, the leading scholar, reveals. No Palestinian could accept the cantonization, including the U.S. favorite, Mahmoud Abbas.
Clinton -- we don't have to debate it, because Clinton recognized that Palestinian objections had validity, and in December 2000 proposed his parameters, which went some way toward satisfying Palestinian rights. In Clinton's words, "Barak and Arafat had both accepted these parameters as the basis for further efforts. Both have expressed some reservations."
The reservations were addressed at a high level meeting in Taba, which made considerable progress and might have led to a settlement, but Israel called them off. That one week at Taba is the only break in 30 years of U.S.-Israeli rejectionism. High-level informal negotiations continued, leading to the Geneva Accord of December of 2002, welcomed by virtually the entire world, rejected by Israel, dismissed by Washington. That could have been the basis for a just peace. It still can. By then, however, Bush-Sharon bulldozers were demolishing any basis for it.
Every sane Israeli hawk understood that it was absurd for Israel to leave 8,000 settlers in Gaza, protected by a large part of the army, while taking over scarce water resources and arable land. The same conclusion was to withdraw from Gaza while expanding through the West Bank, and that will continue as long as Washington insists on marching on the road to catastrophe by rejecting minimal Palestinian rights. I'm quoting the warning of the four former heads of Israel's Shin Bet Security Service. "There are clear alternatives, and if that march to catastrophe continues, we will have only ourselves to blame."
No, I already knew that. And as I've said throughout this thread, both sides hold the guilt. But if we're going to stress on Hamas wanting to destroy Israel then I think we should look at which side in living in a destruction filled country and which one is enjoying much more prosperity. If you have pictures of a properous Palestine then please share. Almost all the video and pics I've seen on the place look horrible. I'm not trying to use proganda, I'm trying to show the consequences of our policy and why we should drop it for a more peaceful, productive one. You can't go on and on about people calling for Israel's destrution when it's only Palestine that appears destroyed. It's not just random pics and articles, it's FACT. And going to a place doesn't mean you're an expert on their policy. I live in the US and am surrounded daily by people who don't have a fucking clue what's going on.
count yourself among the people that don't have a fucking clue what's going on. here's a novel idea: sometimes arabs are actually responsible for their situation. nobody but the arabs rejected every partition plan from the 1920's through the 1940's. nobody but the arab league issued the "3 no's" in the wake of the 6-day war at the khartoum conference of the arab league. (that's no negotiations, no recognition, and no peace with israel.)
nobody but arafat walked away from negotiations in 2000 without so much as a counter-proposal. yet no one thinks there should be any consequences for the arabs. every time there is a war and they don't achieve their goals militarily, they expect to resume negotiations as if nothing had happened.
i see people saying "hamas isn't palestine, hamas is just the extremists" and then they reflexively say that most palestinians want peace. all the while all of the people who always say this never provide a single example from which to infer, a single statistic with which to support, the notion that most palestinians are any less extreme in their rejection of coexistance than hamas.
the problem isn't about settlements or borders, since arabs started attacking jews in the 1920's. (before any land was being 'stolen', so save your breath if you want to find a way to justify, for example, the arabs murdering 60 jewish residents of hebron, a community that existed there uninterrupted for thousands of years until 1929 when they were dragged from their homes and hacked to death by their neighbors).
as long as they want everything, they will have nothing. and as golda meir once said "there will be peace when they love their children more than they hate us."
as long as they want everything, they will have nothing. and as golda meir once said "there will be peace when they love their children more than they hate us."
just a few titles from a google search of 'isreal rejects peace plan'
'Israel rejects Mideast peace plan'
'Isreal rejects Palestinian Unity govt'
'Saudi Arabia calls on Israel to accept the peace initiative'
'Israel rejects European draft for Middle East peace initiative'
'Israel rejects Mideast peace plan'
'Israel rejects Franco-Spanish peace initiative'
'Israel Rejects Peace Offer'
'Israel Rejects Arab Peace Plan Endorsed at Beirut Arab Summit'
'Livni rejects Arab League's 2002 plan | Jerusalem Post'
at least we can admit both sides are wrong....then there's ppl like you who are heavily biased and want to appear as some innocent victim....maybe if israel didn't keep them under the heel of their boots they wouldn't be so angry?
standin above the crowd
he had a voice that was strong and loud and
i swallowed his facade cos i'm so
eager to identify with
someone above the crowd
someone who seemed to feel the same
someone prepared to lead the way
Comments
Hamas does not equal Palestine. And I fully believe the people of Palestine wouldn't rely on Hamas for protection if we actually showed interest in a peace process and not more of the policy of arming and funding the aggression against them. How much would stock would you put in me wanting peace with you if I kept arming the guy who is shooting at you? You have to see their side, as well. I believe both sets of people want peace. But those in power want more conflict. You don't stabilize a situation by dousing the fire with gasoline.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
and you dont bring peace by electing a government that wants Israel destroyed. if Hamas wasnt in power, peace would have a chance no matter how many weapons Israel has.
So you don't see the destruction and death Israel has caused onto the Palestinian people? If you claim Israel is innocent in this and not equally as guilty then you are choosing to see only one side while ignoring the other.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
yes I do see the Israel has done wrong. but if they really wanted to, they could destroy all of palestine in a day. but they dont. Israel does not have a stated purpose of destroying palestine. in most cases they are defending themselves from militants launching rockets into civilians areas.
both sides do wrong. yes BOTH. but Hamas is the one preventing peace.
They are both preventing peace. If Israel wasn't involved in any violence towards Palestine then you'd have a leg to stand on. But Israel isn't acting any more peaceful than Hamas at the moment.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
thats because hamas wants to destroy them
Hamas is the only protection the people have against israel. also long before hamas, the palestinians had peace groups and such they were still being attacked by israel. years before the suicide bomber was created.
it goes both ways
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
if Hamas recognizes Israel's right to exist problems would be solved. or least there would be a chance. why are you people failing to realize or even fucking admit that hamas wants to destroy Israel.
dont tell me that Israel wants to destroy palestine. if they wanted to, they would.
no it doesnt. Israel does not want to destroy palestine. hamas does. how many times do I need to repeat this.
I don't care how many times you repeat it, it doesn't make it true. Israel has don't nothing but destroy Palestine. Those people have nothing left.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
btw, you know what mossads tag is? "By way of deception, thou shalt do war"
and I love your argument.....Hamas doesnt want to destroy Israel.
http://pd.cpim.org/2006/0903/palestine-ph.jpg
http://www.palestine-forum.org/image/HP_top_photo2.jpg
http://www.casafree.com/modules/xcgal/albums/userpics/14079/normal_tank%20palestine%20-3.jpg
http://www.france-palestine.org/IMG/jpg/Qabatyah_27_9_2005.jpg
http://www.mpjc.org/images/palestine.jpg
Israel:
http://www.midwinter.com/~koreth/israel/wwall.jpg
http://www.geraldbrimacombe.com/Israel/Israel%20-%20Jerusalem%20sunset.jpg
http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.geraldbrimacombe.com/Israel/Israel%2520-%2520Jerusalem%2520sunset.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.geraldbrimacombe.com/Israel.htm&h=377&w=576&sz=312&hl=en&start=45&tbnid=H2fTGuGXE6M9SM:&tbnh=88&tbnw=134&prev=/images%3Fq%3Disrael%26start%3D36%26ndsp%3D18%26svnum%3D10%26hl%3Den%26rlz%3D1T4GGLR_enUS210US210%26sa%3DN
http://www.picturesfree.org/israel/100-0090_img.jpg
http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.picturesfree.org/israel/100-0090_img.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.picturesfree.org/israel/album1.html&h=1536&w=2048&sz=595&hl=en&start=60&tbnid=uhpeEt-IE3Qr9M:&tbnh=113&tbnw=150&prev=/images%3Fq%3Disrael%26start%3D54%26ndsp%3D18%26svnum%3D10%26hl%3Den%26rlz%3D1T4GGLR_enUS210US210%26sa%3DN
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
over specific principles, goals, and policies.
http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg
(\__/)
( o.O)
(")_(")
you understand why huh? maybe you should join the cause then.
you have to be kidding me. you use google images to prove your point? you are smarter then that. dont embarrass yourself. look abook if we can agree that both are in the wrong, and both need to make concessions in order for peace to happen, then thats good enough for me
No, I'm not kidding. It's a damn good point. Israel looks like a beautiful and flourishing country and Palestine looks like heaps of rubble all over the place, bombed out buildings and houses and ones that have been bulldozed down also. That's the reality of it. You keep talking about destruction and the only destruction I see is the complete devastation of Palestine. Sorry if it doesn't seem smart to you to actually have to look at what our policy causes. I guess it's smart to just talk about these things without having to reference the actual shit that's there for us all to see.
I've been saying both sides are wrong. You are the one saying how Israel isn't in the wrong and how we should continue to supply them with weapons and aid while we leave the Plaestinian people to pick through the rubble of their homes trying to find pieces of their lives left undestroyed.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
froget it, you are just too silly.
actually, the u.s gave millions and millions of dollars to the palestinian people so taht they could build schools, hospitals, etc, where did that money go you ask? well, their long time leader, arafat, stole it to create palaces for himself, the palestinians were kept in poverty by their own leader, while he lead a life of luxury. and what are you talking about 'years before the suicide bomber was created', the suicide bomber is as old as time.
actually, israel has done many things for palestinians. since arafat stole from his own people, israel has looked after them, that's right, you heard what i said, where do you think palestinians go to see doctors? israel. schools? israel. work? israel. don't believe everything that you see on cnn, israelis and palestinians are living side by side, shopping at the same markets, going to the same schools, living the same lifestyles
i have one more question for you, if a terrorist came into your backyard and killed your parents, your children, your brother, your freinds, all your loved ones, would you sit back and say 'oh, we should love them, we should give them more land'? wait, no, that's right, your country would sit around and think about it for a year, make up a phoney excuse, and go attack a completly different country. and this is when the threat is on the other side of an ocean, yet when israelis have to deal with terrorists sitting on the bus with them, and blowing themselves up on a daily basis you would have them do nothing, actually, no, you'd have them build special hospitals just for them, in addition to building homes and schools.
every palestinian leader has called for the death of israel, and i quote "we shall not rest until all israelis have been pushed into the sea" - arafat
and hamas is even worse.
please, tell me what you would do? last time the jews didn't take a threat seriously 6 million were burned, gased, tortured, and starved to death, i think that israel has good reason to believe the various palestinian leaders who have called for their extermination.
Albert Einstein
what i find amusing about these pictures, is that they are mainly of the dome of the rock, see that big gold building prominently featured at the center of all of your pictures? look closely, what do you see, a crescent on top! see the jews praying at the wall? that's the wall of a temple that used to stand at that place that was destroyed by muslims, on top of the destroyed temple, a mosque was built. you need to learn your history.
jerusalem is also divided into quarters, the jewish, muslim, chistian, and armenian quarters. that's right, in that beautiful city that you showed pictures of, palestinians are living.
please, stop the propaganda, and if you're trying to use random pictures of places that you've never been to spin a point, at least learn about the content of the pictures first!
Albert Einstein
No, I already knew that. And as I've said throughout this thread, both sides hold the guilt. But if we're going to stress on Hamas wanting to destroy Israel then I think we should look at which side in living in a destruction filled country and which one is enjoying much more prosperity. If you have pictures of a properous Palestine then please share. Almost all the video and pics I've seen on the place look horrible. I'm not trying to use proganda, I'm trying to show the consequences of our policy and why we should drop it for a more peaceful, productive one. You can't go on and on about people calling for Israel's destrution when it's only Palestine that appears destroyed. It's not just random pics and articles, it's FACT. And going to a place doesn't mean you're an expert on their policy. I live in the US and am surrounded daily by people who don't have a fucking clue what's going on.
http://www.palestinemonitor.org/new_web/conditions_worsen_palestinians_United_nations.htm
http://english.people.com.cn/200702/06/eng20070206_347858.html
vs.
http://www.isrealli.org/
http://www.masaisrael.org/masa/english/
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
if you want i can post the report on how a majority of palestinian children suffere from severe malnutrition b/c of the checkpoints and whatnot imposed by israel.
or i can post the video of the idf attacking and beating peaceful protestors over the idf bulldozing down their olive trees (then when the ambulance comes to pick the injured up the idf throw smoke grenades or teargas inside the ambulance)
or the video of israeli kids (in an illegal settlement) throwing rocks at muslim kids and women while the idf just stand around
there's another site from an occupied territory w/ video of israelis attacking muslims just for walking down the street and a lot of nice quotes about how they need to just kill them all and they should receive medals when they kill a palestinian
everyone knows arafat stole money, so you should punish them more for that happening to them??
to act like israel is this innocent victim and palestinians are the big, bad bully that israel tries sooooo hard to love is ridiculous
he had a voice that was strong and loud and
i swallowed his facade cos i'm so
eager to identify with
someone above the crowd
someone who seemed to feel the same
someone prepared to lead the way
So you justify America's unilateral betrayal of any chance of a two-state solution, whilst supporting Israeli terror? Until Israel complies with International law and withdraws to the 1967 borders then it has no right to expect recognition by Hamas or by anyone else.
So in your opinion because Israel can destroy Palestine in a day but chooses not to we should congratulate them on their peace-loving, reserved, and compassionate nature? So Israel does not have a stated purpose of destroying Palestine? So the fact that they have been slowly but surely destroying Palestine and continue to defy international law by continuing the illegal occupation and continued creation of illegal settlements becomes irrelevant. Israel not stating it's intentions means that what we see them doing is a mirage? What fantasy world are you living in?
http://www.chomsky.info/debates/20051129.htm
'There was no effort to conceal the fact that Gaza disengagement was in reality West Bank expansion. The official plan for disengagement stated that Israel will permanently take over major population centers, cities, towns and villages, security areas and other places of special interest to Israel in the West Bank. That was endorsed by the U.S. ambassador, as it had been by the President, breaking sharply with U.S. policy.
Along with the disengagement plan, Israel announced investment of tens of millions of dollars in West Bank settlements. Prime Minister Sharon immediately approved new housing units in the town of Maale Adumim--that's to the east of Jerusalem--the core of the salient that divides the southern from the central Bantustan, to use Benvenisti's term, and also announced other expansion plans.
There is near unanimity that all of this violates international law. The consensus was expressed by U.S. Judge Buergenthal in his separate declaration attached to the World Court judgment, ruling that the separation wall is illegal. In Buergenthal's words, "The Fourth Geneva Convention and International Human Rights Law are applicable to the occupied Palestinian territory and must therefore be fully complied with by Israel. Accordingly, the segments of the wall being built by Israel to protect the settlements are ipso facto in violation of international humanitarian law," which happens to mean about 80% of the wall...
Keeping to the diplomatic record, the first -- both sides, of course, rejected 242. The first important step forward was in 1971, when president Sadat of Egypt offered a full peace treaty to Israel in return for Israeli withdrawal from the Occupied Territories. That would have ended the international conflict. Israel rejected the offer, choosing expansion over security. In this case, expansion into the Egyptian Sinai, where General Sharon's forces had driven thousands of farmers into the desert to clear the land for the all-Jewish city of Yamit. The U.S. backed Israel's stand.
Those decisions led to the 1973 war, a near disaster for Israel. The U.S. and Israel then recognized that Egypt could not be dismissed and finally accepted Sadat's 1971 offer at Camp David in 1979. But by then, the agreement included the demand for a Palestinian state, which had reached the international agenda.
In 1976, the major Arab states introduced a resolution to the U.N. Security Council calling for a peace settlement on the international border, based on U.N. 242, but now adding a Palestinian state in the Occupied Territories. That's Syria, Egypt, Jordan and every other relevant state. The U.S. vetoed the resolution again in 1980. The General Assembly passed similar resolutions year after year with the United States and Israel opposed.
The matter reached a head in 1988, when the PLO moved from tacit approval to formal acceptance of the two-state consensus. Israel responded with a declaration that there can be no, as they put it, "additional Palestinian state between Jordan and the sea," Jordan already being a Palestinian state -- that's Shimon Peres and Yitzhak Shamir -- and also that the status of the territories must be settled according to Israeli guidelines. The U.S. endorsed Israel's stand. I can only add what I wrote at the time: "It's as if someone were to argue the Jews don't need a second homeland in Israel, because they already have New York."
In May 1997, for the first time, Peres's Labour Party agreed not to rule out the establishment of a Palestinian state with limited sovereignty in areas excluding major Jewish settlement blocks, that is, the three cantons that were being constructed with U.S. support. The highest rate of post-Oslo settlement was in 2000, the final year of Clinton's term and Prime Minister Barak's.
Maps of the U.S.-Israel proposals at Camp David show a salient, east of Jerusalem, bisecting the West Bank, and a northern salient virtually dividing the northern from the central canton. I have the maps if you want them. The current map considerably extends these salients and the isolation of East Jerusalem. My maps are from the leading Israeli scholars, Ron Pundak, the Director of the Shimon Peres Center. The crucial issue at Camp David was territorial, not the refugee issue, for which Arafat agreed to a pragmatic solution, as Pundak, the leading scholar, reveals. No Palestinian could accept the cantonization, including the U.S. favorite, Mahmoud Abbas.
Clinton -- we don't have to debate it, because Clinton recognized that Palestinian objections had validity, and in December 2000 proposed his parameters, which went some way toward satisfying Palestinian rights. In Clinton's words, "Barak and Arafat had both accepted these parameters as the basis for further efforts. Both have expressed some reservations."
The reservations were addressed at a high level meeting in Taba, which made considerable progress and might have led to a settlement, but Israel called them off. That one week at Taba is the only break in 30 years of U.S.-Israeli rejectionism. High-level informal negotiations continued, leading to the Geneva Accord of December of 2002, welcomed by virtually the entire world, rejected by Israel, dismissed by Washington. That could have been the basis for a just peace. It still can. By then, however, Bush-Sharon bulldozers were demolishing any basis for it.
Every sane Israeli hawk understood that it was absurd for Israel to leave 8,000 settlers in Gaza, protected by a large part of the army, while taking over scarce water resources and arable land. The same conclusion was to withdraw from Gaza while expanding through the West Bank, and that will continue as long as Washington insists on marching on the road to catastrophe by rejecting minimal Palestinian rights. I'm quoting the warning of the four former heads of Israel's Shin Bet Security Service. "There are clear alternatives, and if that march to catastrophe continues, we will have only ourselves to blame."
count yourself among the people that don't have a fucking clue what's going on. here's a novel idea: sometimes arabs are actually responsible for their situation. nobody but the arabs rejected every partition plan from the 1920's through the 1940's. nobody but the arab league issued the "3 no's" in the wake of the 6-day war at the khartoum conference of the arab league. (that's no negotiations, no recognition, and no peace with israel.)
nobody but arafat walked away from negotiations in 2000 without so much as a counter-proposal. yet no one thinks there should be any consequences for the arabs. every time there is a war and they don't achieve their goals militarily, they expect to resume negotiations as if nothing had happened.
i see people saying "hamas isn't palestine, hamas is just the extremists" and then they reflexively say that most palestinians want peace. all the while all of the people who always say this never provide a single example from which to infer, a single statistic with which to support, the notion that most palestinians are any less extreme in their rejection of coexistance than hamas.
the problem isn't about settlements or borders, since arabs started attacking jews in the 1920's. (before any land was being 'stolen', so save your breath if you want to find a way to justify, for example, the arabs murdering 60 jewish residents of hebron, a community that existed there uninterrupted for thousands of years until 1929 when they were dragged from their homes and hacked to death by their neighbors).
as long as they want everything, they will have nothing. and as golda meir once said "there will be peace when they love their children more than they hate us."
http://www.memritv.org/search.asp?ACT=S9&P1=1398
Most antizionists are antisemites
http://forums.pearljam.com/showthread.php?t=211301&highlight=project
http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&ie=UTF-8&rlz=1T4GGLR_enUS210US210&q=israel+rejects+peace+plan
just a few titles from a google search of 'isreal rejects peace plan'
'Israel rejects Mideast peace plan'
'Isreal rejects Palestinian Unity govt'
'Saudi Arabia calls on Israel to accept the peace initiative'
'Israel rejects European draft for Middle East peace initiative'
'Israel rejects Mideast peace plan'
'Israel rejects Franco-Spanish peace initiative'
'Israel Rejects Peace Offer'
'Israel Rejects Arab Peace Plan Endorsed at Beirut Arab Summit'
'Livni rejects Arab League's 2002 plan | Jerusalem Post'
at least we can admit both sides are wrong....then there's ppl like you who are heavily biased and want to appear as some innocent victim....maybe if israel didn't keep them under the heel of their boots they wouldn't be so angry?
he had a voice that was strong and loud and
i swallowed his facade cos i'm so
eager to identify with
someone above the crowd
someone who seemed to feel the same
someone prepared to lead the way