The US and War

polaris

there is too much money to be made in war ... times of peace are bad for the economy ... nothing like a good ole arms race to profit from ... when will people finally put all the pieces together (failure in afghanistan; fraud war in iraq; abandoning world treaties or various arms; backing out of the nuclear proliferation treaty; etc...) ... the evidence is overwhelming ...

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http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20070531/ts_nm/russia_usa_missile_dc_2;_ylt=ArRynPAadGmftCqTNmx29JH7kPUI

MOSCOW (Reuters) - Russia's test firing of an intercontinental ballistic missile on Tuesday was in response to U.S. steps that have sparked an arms race and undermined world security, Russian President Vladimir Putin said on Thursday.

"Our American partners have left the ABM (Anti-Ballistic Missile) Treaty. We have warned them then that we will come out with a response to maintain the strategic balance in the world," Putin told a news conference.

"We conducted a test of a new strategic ballistic missile with multiple warheads, and of a new cruise missile, and will continue to improve our resources."

"We are not the initiators of this new round of the arms race," said Putin. "(Our partners) are stuffing eastern Europe with new weapons. A new base in Bulgaria, another in Romania, a site in Poland, radar in the Czech Republic . . . what are we supposed to do? We cannot just observe all this."

Russia test-fired a new intercontinental ballistic missile on Tuesday featuring multiple warheads that senior officials said could pierce any missile defense system, including the planned U.S. shield in Europe.

Russia says the U.S. missile defense shield is a threat to its security and will change the strategic balance in Europe, but Washington dismisses such fears, saying the shield is intended to counter "rogue states."

even flow?

Now that the States has showed them how to create billionaires in the old Russia, it will be hard for them to starve them out again.

I wonder when the rhetoric that goes hand in hand with Iran will start about Russia. Oh wait, they can do something about it.

jlew24asu

polaris wrote:

... times of peace are bad for the economy ...

could be the most ignorant economic statement I have ever heard.


:applauds:

polaris

jlew24asu wrote:

could be the most ignorant economic statement I have ever heard.


:applauds:

let me know if it is indeed the most ignorant ...

i actually meant to type times of peace are bad for business although there are definitely theories associated with wars and their ties to economic prosperity ... so, to some thinkers - not actually far from the truth ...

let us know if you have anything to add to this escalation in the arms race around the world led by your homeland ...

jlew24asu

polaris wrote:

let me know if it is indeed the most ignorant ...

i actually meant to type times of peace are bad for business although there are definitely theories associated with wars and their ties to economic prosperity ... so, to some thinkers - not actually far from the truth ...

I'd love to read it. show me.

polaris wrote:

let us know if you have anything to add to this escalation in the arms race around the world led by your homeland ...

what arms race?

polaris

jlew24asu wrote:

I'd love to read it. show me.

http://www.rediff.com/money/2005/jul/14perfin.htm

jlew24asu wrote:

what arms race?

did you read the article?

"We are not the initiators of this new round of the arms race," said Putin

rebornFixer

Putin is full of shit. He's creating the notion of an arms race. Russia is not directly threatened by the U.S. He's just got an inferiority complex, like many world leaders, and is using a handy excuse to develop better weapons.

polaris

reborncareerist wrote:

Putin is full of shit. He's creating the notion of an arms race. Russia is not directly threatened by the U.S. He's just got an inferiority complex, like many world leaders, and is using a handy excuse to develop better weapons.

uhhh ... pentagon spending has skyrocketed ... not just in iraq ... in all aspects ... they've pulled out of all the arms treaties ... the US are developing more nukes and they are building bases everywhere ...

Collin

What rogue states will the US counter from the Czech Republic and Poland?

Milestone

polaris wrote:

there is too much money to be made in war ... times of peace are bad for the economy ... nothing like a good ole arms race to profit from ... when will people finally put all the pieces together (failure in afghanistan; fraud war in iraq; abandoning world treaties or various arms; backing out of the nuclear proliferation treaty; etc...) ... the evidence is overwhelming ...

Please explain how Kanada (a peaceful nation) is doing so well economically?

inmytree

reborncareerist wrote:

Putin is full of shit. He's creating the notion of an arms race. Russia is not directly threatened by the U.S. He's just got an inferiority complex, like many world leaders, and is using a handy excuse to develop better weapons.

which is exactly what bushy and the war machine has done...

El_Kabong

reborncareerist wrote:

Putin is full of shit. He's creating the notion of an arms race. Russia is not directly threatened by the U.S. He's just got an inferiority complex, like many world leaders, and is using a handy excuse to develop better weapons.

maybe he sees us militarizing space and doesn't want just our weapons poitning down at everybody?

what was this administration's excuse for breaking the nuclear non-proliferation treaty and the ucbm treaty as well as being against the nuke test ban, chemical and biological weapons ban.....?

rebornFixer

Oh, sorry ... Did you guys say something? I was just busy basking in the radiant glow of a bunch of liberals defending both increased militarization and the actions of a man responsible for eroding democracy in one of the world's big powers.

Carry on ...

rebornFixer

"If you hate something, don't you do it too ..."


What?

polaris

Milestone wrote:

Please explain how Kanada (a peaceful nation) is doing so well economically?

oil is how many bucks a barrel?

if you follow the thread - the crux of the issue isn't that war is good for the economy ... which i don't necessarily agree with (typo as mentioned earlier) ... rather that there is a lot of money to be made in war for certain interest groups and it plays in their favour when foreign policy advocates instability in regions and the supposed requirement to proliferate new weaponry ...

polaris

reborncareerist wrote:

"If you hate something, don't you do it too ..."


What?

uhhh ... who's saying what putin is doing is a good thing??

El_Kabong

reborncareerist wrote:

Oh, sorry ... Did you guys say something? I was just busy basking in the radiant glow of a bunch of liberals defending both increased militarization and the actions of a man responsible for eroding democracy in one of the world's big powers.

Carry on ...

who was defending it?

rebornFixer

"I really hate Bush ... He's eroded democracy in the U.S., he's a war monger ... Just look at Iraq!, he's increased military spending".

"Putin? Oh yeah. He's eroded democracy in Russia, he's a war monger ... Just look at Chechnya!, he's increased military spending ..."

"Still though, its all Bush's fault. I only disapprove when its Americans doing this sort of thing. ... The Russians? I mean really now. What do you expect?"

El_Kabong

reborncareerist wrote:

"I really hate Bush ... He's eroded democracy in the U.S., he's a war monger ... Just look at Iraq!, he's increased military spending".

"Putin? Oh yeah. He's eroded democracy in Russia, he's a war monger ... Just look at Chechnya!, he's increased military spending ..."

"Still though, its all Bush's fault. I only disapprove when its Americans doing this sort of thing. ... The Russians? I mean really now. What do you expect?"

yes, putin is a horrible person, especially what they did in chechnya and that theatre....and i disapprove of what he's doing...but how can you tell someone no when you are doing it at a far larger scale?

seems a bit hypocritical, is all

but hey, he's got terrorism to balme now, he doesn't need to falsify intel like reagan did in the 80's w/ russia to get more military funding

surferdude

polaris wrote:

let me know if it is indeed the most ignorant ...

i actually meant to type times of peace are bad for business although there are definitely theories associated with wars and their ties to economic prosperity ... so, to some thinkers - not actually far from the truth ...

let us know if you have anything to add to this escalation in the arms race around the world led by your homeland ...

I'd say a 100 years ago or so it was thought that war was good for the economy as England, the US and Canada were manufacturing based economies. But with the change in economies from manufacturing to knowledge base I don't think this holds true anymore.

surferdude

polaris wrote:

oil is how many bucks a barrel?

if you follow the thread - the crux of the issue isn't that war is good for the economy ... which i don't necessarily agree with (typo as mentioned earlier) ... rather that there is a lot of money to be made in war for certain interest groups and it plays in their favour when foreign policy advocates instability in regions and the supposed requirement to proliferate new weaponry ...

This is true but there are businesses that only thrive during peace time, or famines, or whatever world event you can represent. I just don't think that the defence industry is the tail that wags the dog anymore. I believe the next industry to wag the dog is going to be the whole enviro industry. We already have the greed (carbon trading) and fear mongering required for it to be a substantial and long-term industry.