Matt Gonzalez-Barack Obama, The Establishment's Candidate

El_Kabong

my2hands wrote:

i say give me a call when Nader comes up with a new platform, the whole "attack the democrats" platform is pretty old and stale


and they still NEVER mention McCain :rolleyes:


they are typical politicians, attack the most popular candidate to get attention for themselves

give me a call when you can address the points raised

typical my2hands, complain about the person instead of discussing the points made

if nader and gonzalez are typical politicians what does that make obama?

Anon

El_Kabong wrote:

i doubt i will ever waste my vote on another corporate whore politician whatever party they are, obama included

do you believe that if it's between mccain and obama, that mccain will be the better option?

i'm only asking because its clear you are not an obama fan and that's quite ok, but it's only really obama that you ever criticize constantly.

there's a recent thread here about john mccain, and thoughts on whether or not he should be president. it's 15 pages long. i'm just curious as to why you would not participate in that thread too.

Abookamongstthemany

Pj_Gurl wrote:

do you believe that if it's between mccain and obama, that mccain will be the better option?

i'm only asking because its clear you are not an obama fan and that's quite ok, but it's only really obama that you ever criticize constantly.

there's a recent thread here about john mccain, and thoughts on whether or not he should be president. it's 15 pages long. i'm just curious as to why you would not participate in that thread too.

Because there's hardly any McCain supporters here. I can't even name 3. Why preach to the choir?

Anon

Abookamongstthemany wrote:

Because there's hardly any McCain supporters here. I can't even name 3. Why preach to the choir?

because if you are debating politics and sharing your view on why you see your candidate as the best choice, wouldn't every vote that you could switch to your side count? Every seed of doubt that you could cast would count? Wouldn't you be talking about your dislikes of all the other candidates, not just one? You don't know how many people read these posts. The mccain one alone had over 2000 views.

Power of one person = one vote.

Abookamongstthemany

Pj_Gurl wrote:

because if you are debating politics and sharing your view on why you see your candidate as the best choice, wouldn't every vote that you could switch to your side count? Every seed of doubt that you could cast would count? Wouldn't you be talking about your dislikes of all the other candidates, not just one? You don't know how many people read these posts. The mccain one alone had over 2000 views.

Power of one person = one vote.

There have been plenty of pro Nader threads for that. And honestly, of the 3 or so people here actually supporting McCain, I don't see a hardcore rightie that would vote McCain in the first place switching over to a very lefty Nader. It just doesn't make a lot of sense to waste time replying to those threads. Even the conservatives on here are constantly saying how they don't really care for him. I prefer not to waste my time stating the obvious.

my2hands

Abookamongstthemany wrote:

Because there's hardly any McCain supporters here. I can't even name 3. Why preach to the choir?

bullshit.. you "preached to the choir" about Bush for the last 5 years... everyone here is against the war, that hasnt stopped you from "preaching to the choir"


nice try

my2hands

Pj_Gurl wrote:

do you believe that if it's between mccain and obama, that mccain will be the better option?

i'm only asking because its clear you are not an obama fan and that's quite ok, but it's only really obama that you ever criticize constantly.

there's a recent thread here about john mccain, and thoughts on whether or not he should be president. it's 15 pages long. i'm just curious as to why you would not participate in that thread too.

hahahahaha... at least some others notice

Abookamongstthemany

my2hands wrote:

bullshit.. you "preached to the choir" about Bush for the last 5 years... everyone here is against the war, that hasnt stopped you from "preaching to the choir"


nice try

from here on out....discuss the topic and not me.


thank you, kindly

my2hands

Abookamongstthemany wrote:

And now smaller movements are a joke??

Jeez, you have changed.

i have not changed... i am simply pointing out that some "online movements" are a joke and that the peopel do not follow through. i bet he has 10,000 myspace supporters and lots of cool blogs about him. but where did that go when it came time to move from the computer screen to the ballot box?

he was a fool, and had plenty of fools buying into his shit. fools that only took their support as far as their keyboard would let them

my2hands

Abookamongstthemany wrote:

from here on out....discuss the topic and not me.


thank you, kindly

just what i thought

Abookamongstthemany

my2hands wrote:

just what i thought

works fine for me. I could do without hearing how tired and lame you think I am. And I'll be sure to keep any insults about you to myself, as well.

This should work out nicely.

my2hands

Abookamongstthemany wrote:

I could do without hearing how tired and lame you think I am.

not you personaly, at all, just the constant anti obama propaganda... that is lame and tired


your cool in my book, as is kabong

Abookamongstthemany

my2hands wrote:

not you personaly, at all, just the constant anti obama propaganda... that is lame and tired


your cool in my book, as is kabong

that's good to know.

Im just asking, especially after what you just posted in the other thread, to lay off remarks about how tired, unfunny, lame or whatever other adjective you have used and simply address the topic or ignore it since that's what you wish us to do towards you also. Because we are going to post what we wanna and you will continue to post what you wanna. I can think you're pro-obama threads are lame, tired, getting old...what have you but I will address the content of your threads if I disagree and not insult you for posting it.

El_Kabong

my2hands wrote:

bullshit.. you "preached to the choir" about Bush for the last 5 years... everyone here is against the war, that hasnt stopped you from "preaching to the choir"


nice try

bullshit, there used to be a lot of conservatives here who supported the war...but as teh war fell apart and became a collossal waste they left, went to other sections, stopped supporting bush....

and are there even any mccain supporters here?

we see wrong as wrong, it's not dependent on party affiliation

my2hands

Abookamongstthemany wrote:

I can think you're pro-obama threads are lame, tired, getting old...

i have posted 1, months ago...

rebornFixer

I'd say he pretty much hit the mark ...

Cosmo

I'm bumping this like Misty May... only because I like Misty May's butt. She really has a nice round, VERY Womanesque butt.

my2hands

Abookamongstthemany wrote:

How do you feel about his votes for the Patriot Act?

he was not in federal office, so he did not vote for the first version which john mccain and hillary both did. he voted for the edited version. which i am still not a fan of obviously, however i am not a us senator that is responsible for helping provide security to a nation of 300 million 4 years after a devstating terrorist attack. so, however i may disagree with the patriot act, in nearly any form, i can understand the reality of the situation and the tremendous burden and concern for safety

How do you feel about his votes to fund the war and prolong it instead of urging withdrawl?

i have gone over the voting for funds for the war. he has consistently urged withdrawl voted yes on votes for withdrawl that were VETO'd by Bush. the house didnt have enough votes to even get it back to the senate to try and over turn the veto

How do you feel about his vote for the CAFA?

i have no problem with it at all really... i dont have that big of a problem with the biull. all it does really is say that a federal judge will preside over class action suits over $5 million or where plaintiffs are from different states. i see no problem with that. i dont want a state judging deciding a $300 million dollar case, and believe me i know state judges.

How do you feel about HR 676 Single Payer National Insurance and Obama's non support of it?

i like the idea of SPNI... but i am not dead set against other ideas and forms of universal healthcare/insurance. i actually like Obama's quasi mix of the current system mixed with universal to meet the needs of everyone, WITHOUT MANDATES. i do believe at one time he was a fan of single payer, but faced with the reality if the current system he may have moved slightly, tinkering, to come up with a plan for universal coverage. for instance, i have great insurance provided by my employer. that is part of my benefits package, which i enjoy. so i dont NEED that to be changed currently. down the road i would like to see a complete single payer system, but i do believe that this will take some time and we need to get headed in that general direction. which i believe that is what Obamas plan does. a major shift in direction, without doing a complete u-turn in one spin of the wheel. which in this country, may be the ONLY damn way to get something done. everyone thinks their way is the only way, and we end up where we are. polarized.

How do you feel about his lobbyists in the nuclear power industry and his continued support of it?

i have no problem with his support of nucleaer power for energy purposes. have you fileld your tank lately? he is also not the champion of nuclear power either, that has been blown way out of proportion just like anything that comes up about him at this point. he has the worlds largest magnifying glass onhim at all times. but anyway,he has said that he is anti nuclear weapon and said that we must try and rid the planet of nuclear arms, including ours. that is a dymanic shift from the current administration. do i wish we could get rid of it and move to solar/wind tommorow. FUCK YES, but that tales time as well... so we need to utilize what we have available now, or everyone needs to radicly change their lifestyle. we can all turn off our computers if you want, but that means you have to do it too. i have no problem with his donations from the nuclear industry

How do you feel about his vote for the wall on the border and he new campaign stance of being against it?

illegal immigratiuon was allowed to become a problem under this administartion, for cheap domestic labor. understaffed and poorly executed border security has created a problem. i dont consider anyone "illegal", however i recognize the problems it causes. so the wall, i am typically against any kind of wall or barrier between people... but talk to the people that are on that border and they love it... so what the hell, who knows, i am an idealist... however he does suppprt "illegals" rights, drivers licenses for instance and medical care and education... how do you feel about his OPEN support of drivers licenses?

How do you feel about his vote against the credit card interest rate cap while his campaign has been so against predatory lending?

this is why senators are NEVER elected president... because they have a voting record... and if you dig enopugh you will find votes that don't seem right... thats why you have to be careful looking at particualr votes... looking at votes with a broader scope is probably the way to go, because when breaking it down to minute details you can find all kinds of weird votes, which i pointed out a few on kucinich's record which do not seem to line up with his stances and beliefs. there are all kinds of reasons to not vote for a bill or to vote for a bill. small things that we do not see when just glancing at it, or just read the title of the bill and jump to conclusions. do i think there should be a cap on interest rates, yes. do i think americans are to blame for using credit too much and living beyond their means, yes. am i going to base my support of Obama on this one bill, no. do i know why he voted the way he did, no. i have seen him explain this a few years ago and i beleiev he said there were things in the bill that he felt were worth voting for, even though he had concerns with some other things, he felt he had to vote for it to secure some of the positives that were bartered and in the bill. votes on senate bills is not always as cut and dry as some would like to make it out. thse bills are HUGE, with many provisions added and subtracted and toyed with to please enough people to get them passed. just remember, polarized hardliners get nothing done in this country and we make no progress whatsoever. you have to be able to compromise some things. it is easy to not compromise on our couch, but as a senator actually tryng to get things done i imagine it is different

How do you feel about him sponsering the National Medical Error Disclosure and Compensation Act of 2005?

he co-sponsored with clinton... but anyway, i see know problem wit this bill? what are your concerns?

How do you feel about his opposition to The Hardrock Mining and Reclamation Act of 2007 while having a key advisor in Nevada that is a Nevada-based lobbyist in the employ of various mining companies?

i have to be honest, i dont know anything about the bill. but i do think it passed? help me out a little, cliff notes version

How do you feel about his weak energy policy in a time of crisis?

"weak" is your opinion... maybe you want to refine that or point out your concerns...

How do you feel about his doublespeak on NAFTA brought up in this article?

"doublespeak" is your opinion... what article by the way?

How do you feel about his leanings towards supporting Israel?

he has also said he supports a palestinian state... thats one of those where the hardcore lefty's take an inch and make it a mile... even mentioning Israel makes you a war monger in some circles, or so it seems... which i am not in that crowd... i am looking for reasonable solutions to the problem, not hardliners on either side, frankly


thats the quick version

my2hands

i finally answer some questions, even thoug i know no matter waht i said i would be attacked... and you guys dont even respond?

why do i waste my time

Abookamongstthemany

my2hands wrote:

i finally answer some questions, even thoug i know no matter waht i said i would be attacked... and you guys dont even respond?

why do i waste my time

I've been talking to you about this through pm.

To be honest, I don't even like debating you on the board anymore because you lose your cool and start flipping out.

I think it's better for us to reply to one another in pm's from here on out....for now anyways.

peace