Please.......you are obviously completely oblivious to the real threat of terrorist organizations like Hezbollah. It doesn't matter if you are black or white, christian, muslim, or an atheist. They want to kill everyone. It was right for Israel to stand up to Hezbollah. It is a shame no one has in the past. If you want to PEACE, like all you liberals make a fuss about, you MUST defeat terrorism.
Please.......you are obviously completely oblivious to the real threat of terrorist organizations like Hezbollah. It doesn't matter if you are black or white, christian, muslim, or an atheist. They want to kill everyone. It was right for Israel to stand up to Hezbollah. It is a shame no one has in the past. If you want to PEACE, like all you liberals make a fuss about, you MUST defeat terrorism.
Peace will not come by the death of any group. Peace will come from the death of that idealogy.
If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
The media should never be believed. They are never impartial as they would like you to believe. The only thing worse than a muslim is a reporter. They ignore the whole mideast to bring us the Jon Benet Ramsey case over and over and over and over and over and over again. Who really cares anymore? Murder happens in everywhere all over the world and the media focuses in on this one 10 years after the fact. Sounds like the media is not reporting on something significant that is happening. Wait how can anyone be against bombing Iran. If they develop a nuclear bomb they will use it! Israel will be the first to get hit then us.
How was it necessary, what did it accomplish, how are we safer? Do you only care for American lives? Over 10x as many Iraqi civilians (innocent) have been killled as a result of that bitch Bushs actions. Do you not care about that? That means there are as 10x as many people who feel it is right to come kill us, just like you feel "what we've done is necessary". Bin Ladin is still out there and it will be a matter of time before he kills more people. "Those fuckers" how come their still out running about; while the people of Iraq are suffering from our "necessary" actions?
so, the Iraq citizens being killed by Iranian trained soldiers as well is okay, or its Bush's fault? Anything not Bush's fault? They really have you guys trained well, focus on blaming bush, so you don't notice whats really coming at you. GG>
so, the Iraq citizens being killed by Iranian trained soldiers as well is okay, or its Bush's fault? Anything not Bush's fault? They really have you guys trained well, focus on blaming bush, so you don't notice whats really coming at you. GG>
interesting...and proabbly true-that Iran is arming factions in Iraq. But also I think its fairly obvious the US is playing the same game. If you look at history-and you don't really have to go back too far-its seems obvious (to me anyway) that Iraq has been turned into the familiar template of a state post US invasion.
Yugoslavia was broken up...now ruled by pro-US authority, Afghanistan was the same. And Iraq is fitting that mold as well, along with at least a dozen or so others going back as far as 1970.
They divide and rule..allowing corporations access to the readily available resources labored out by the very oppresses majority of most of these countries. And its happened so often the patterns are obvcius, and every journalist in the US is failing in their duty to their country and the people by not reporting this very obvious pattern.
Iraq may have been a bit more than they expected to get into, and only someone as brutal as Saddam could really keep them all from degenerating into civil war...bu then again maybe not...now its Iran and Syria trying to keepo a pro-US gov't out of their backyard while the US tries violently to install just such an authority. And it wouldn't surpise me if Chinese funding has somehow reached its way into the region, to oppose US interests, though that is pure speculation.
We can be sure the US is arming certain factions in Iraq while Iran is doing the same, and the majority of the people in Iraq are being caught in the middle of this game, paying with their lives.
If you do your homework, Sharon was reported to have told the UN and the EU (arent they one in the same) that if they did not handle the iran nuke problem by March that they would. Sharon went into a coma and Israel changed leadership. With an August 31 deadline coming on iran to disarm, removing Hezbollah missiles from israeli borders makes sense if the attack is coming Is there a reason why the world continues to think it ok that Jews should just accept casualties hand over fist while Europeans and Americans sit without hostile missles 20 miles from their cities? So did Israel and the US coordinate? Absolutely. Israel did this with Bush Administration running interference at the UN. Unfortunately Israel did not get the job done and it emboldened Iran. So should we just wait for a known enemy with missile capacity and militias who are not bound by international accords to receive long range missles that will eventually be Nuclear tipped if we do nothing?
Look I am no fan of Geroge W but some of you people need to wake up and look around. On this one we cannot wait. We need to take out Iran now. I for one would gladly go to the recruiting office on this one.
______________
Irvine 1992, Las Vegas 1993, Mountain View 1994, San Diego 1995, Los Angeles 1996, Los Angeles 1998, Moutain View 1999, San Bernadino 2000, Los Angeles 2000, Irvine 2003, Irvine 2003, Moutain View 2003, Santa Barbara 2003, San Diego 2006, Los Angeles 2006, Santa Barbara 2006
Look I am no fan of Geroge W but some of you people need to wake up and look around. On this one we cannot wait. We need to take out Iran now. I for one would gladly go to the recruiting office on this one.
Would you like a list of recruiting locations? I'll quickly google it for yeah if you want. I really don't mind.
Would you like a list of recruiting locations? I'll quickly google it for yeah if you want. I really don't mind.
or would you miss too many desperate housewives episodes?
______________
Irvine 1992, Las Vegas 1993, Mountain View 1994, San Diego 1995, Los Angeles 1996, Los Angeles 1998, Moutain View 1999, San Bernadino 2000, Los Angeles 2000, Irvine 2003, Irvine 2003, Moutain View 2003, Santa Barbara 2003, San Diego 2006, Los Angeles 2006, Santa Barbara 2006
Yugoslavia was broken up...now ruled by pro-US authority, Afghanistan was the same. And Iraq is fitting that mold as well, along with at least a dozen or so others going back as far as 1970.
I dont think Yugoslavia is a good example. There the US was pretty reluctant to interfere from the outset. It did step in, because european nations asked very nicely if it wouldn't, as they were nervous about such a conflict so close to home. Now if you consider US and EU two sides of the same coin, then I guess. But remember that Yugoslavia was definitely an agressor, and was taking steps towards ethnic cleansing. Lucky for the albanians, that Europe won't sit idly by when it happens literally on their doorstep. But had this happened in Africa, they wouldn't have given a fuck about it, make no mistake.
But actually, Yugoslavia and Somalia in the 90s, are two attempts, as I see it, at more genuine peace-keeping missions, as none of them were directly related to US interests in any way. After Somalia, it seems the americans won't bother to do that again, unless there's something in it for them.
The US are behind a lot of bad, but not all the bad.
(edit) as for US and Israel planning wars, they do so all the time. Especially the US. I believe Pentagon are developing plans for just about any contingency to be on the safe side. Fair enough, a plan is not an intention to use. However, existence of plans may influence actions in wrong ways. The same way existence of plans and large militaries paved the way for WW1. Germany attacked France, because Russia was mobilizing, and they didn't want a 2-front war. they knew they had 2-3 weeks until Russia was ready because of their poor infrastructure so they had a window there. They failed, got the 2-front war and the trenches. So plans does not imply usage in itself, but the existence of plans do increase their probability of being executed, as those making them know about them.
Peace
Dan
"YOU [humans] NEED TO BELIEVE IN THINGS THAT AREN'T TRUE. HOW ELSE CAN THEY BECOME?" - Death
"Every judgment teeters on the brink of error. To claim absolute knowledge is to become monstrous. Knowledge is an unending adventure at the edge of uncertainty." - Frank Herbert, Dune, 1965
How you can pretend to know me or anyone else based on a few sentences on a Pearl Jam politcal forum is disturbing. You just used the words " cheer on a war you are afraid to take part in " dumb statement. Re-Think your position on that one. You know nothing about me. Your mind is obviously closed. I have no stiffy for bloodshed - but I do have a stiffy for this country. Whether you want to believe it or not, what attacked this country was not merely a tall man with a long beard. The roots are deeper than that.
I believe that our military should've been unleashed on the Middle East , yes.
War is not pretty, I have children about the age of the son you speak of, and understand all of the risks that go along with it. But, my personal view is that war is necessary at times. If you disagree with that, more power to you.
I would not judge your position or pretend to know what brought you to your conclusions. I would only ask that you extend the same courtesy -
Where exactly is your prove that the middle east had anything to with 9/11? Oh your goverment told you so, so it must be true, and of course it is every single person and country in the middle east that planned the attack. So we should just go in and wipe them out.
Keep on rockin in the free world!!!!
The economy has polarized to the point where the wealthiest 10% now own 85% of the nation’s wealth. Never before have the bottom 90% been so highly indebted, so dependent on the wealthy.
wow, so the country that had been getting attacked by missles had a plan to fight back. what assholes.
You're missing the point; it's not to defend themselves, it was preparation to attack yet another country. For this, all those women and children were killed or have we already forgotten them?
Edit: Same concept of attacking Iraq to make the US safer...complete BS.
You're missing the point; it's not to defend themselves, it was preparation to attack yet another country. For this, all those women and children were killed or have we already forgotten them?
Edit: Same concept of attacking Iraq to make the US safer...complete BS.
Yup. Complete BS. There were no rockets aimed at Israeli cities. There was no terrorist organization sitting right on Israel's northern border whose stated goal is the destruction of Israel. Shall I keep on posting lies to bolster your point?
Yup. Complete BS. There were no rockets aimed at Israeli cities. There was no terrorist organization sitting right on Israel's northern border whose stated goal is the destruction of Israel. Shall I keep on posting lies to bolster your point?
are there any israeli rockets pointed at anyone?
standin above the crowd
he had a voice that was strong and loud and
i swallowed his facade cos i'm so
eager to identify with
someone above the crowd
someone who seemed to feel the same
someone prepared to lead the way
The media should never be believed. They are never impartial as they would like you to believe. The only thing worse than a muslim is a reporter. They ignore the whole mideast to bring us the Jon Benet Ramsey case over and over and over and over and over and over again. Who really cares anymore? Murder happens in everywhere all over the world and the media focuses in on this one 10 years after the fact. Sounds like the media is not reporting on something significant that is happening. Wait how can anyone be against bombing Iran. If they develop a nuclear bomb they will use it! Israel will be the first to get hit then us.
To sound like people from the countries you just mentioned. Who fucking cares if they get hit, it ain't me. And I am much more important than you!
I dont think Yugoslavia is a good example. There the US was pretty reluctant to interfere from the outset. It did step in, because european nations asked very nicely if it wouldn't, as they were nervous about such a conflict so close to home. Now if you consider US and EU two sides of the same coin, then I guess. But remember that Yugoslavia was definitely an agressor, and was taking steps towards ethnic cleansing. Lucky for the albanians, that Europe won't sit idly by when it happens literally on their doorstep. But had this happened in Africa, they wouldn't have given a fuck about it, make no mistake.
But actually, Yugoslavia and Somalia in the 90s, are two attempts, as I see it, at more genuine peace-keeping missions, as none of them were directly related to US interests in any way. After Somalia, it seems the americans won't bother to do that again, unless there's something in it for them.
The US are behind a lot of bad, but not all the bad.
Peace
Dan
not sure about yugoslavia, but somalia was just under the guise of "peace keeping", america had no intention to help the situation. I'll do a search for the info on that.
I know you like to take the middle ground, that's fine, but it's very hard to find any good the US has done, mainly because they hardly have ever done any, that's just simple fact.
What america does is, stab you, then pull the blade out a few inches and calls it "helping".
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Options
Kat
There's a lot to be said for nowhere. Posts: 4,776
Discuss the issue and not each other.................
Am I the only one who thinks this whole kidnapped soldier bit is a lot like past CIA opperations to force countries into war so that we can get involved. Plans like this happened in the Gulf of Tonkin to get us into Vietnam, and got us to overthrow Irans democratically elected government of the early 80's
not sure about yugoslavia, but somalia was just under the guise of "peace keeping", america had no intention to help the situation. I'll do a search for the info on that.
I know you like to take the middle ground, that's fine, but it's very hard to find any good the US has done, mainly because they hardly have ever done any, that's just simple fact.
What america does is, stab you, then pull the blade out a few inches and calls it "helping".
Well, that's one perspective. The US does do a lot of shitty things, but not evrything they do is. I feel those two cases were the US trying to do the right thing somewhat without there being a direct gain for their own interests. That Somalia blew up in their faces, and it didn't work, is another matter.
I feel Yugoslavia was justified somewhat. Not all of their targets I feel was legitimate, like bombing tv-networks and so on. But their intention was fair enough, and invited by european nations that wanted to contain this on their doorstep. And it ended ok enough, from a shitty situation to start with.
Peace
Dan
"YOU [humans] NEED TO BELIEVE IN THINGS THAT AREN'T TRUE. HOW ELSE CAN THEY BECOME?" - Death
"Every judgment teeters on the brink of error. To claim absolute knowledge is to become monstrous. Knowledge is an unending adventure at the edge of uncertainty." - Frank Herbert, Dune, 1965
so, the Iraq citizens being killed by Iranian trained soldiers as well is okay, or its Bush's fault? Anything not Bush's fault? They really have you guys trained well, focus on blaming bush, so you don't notice whats really coming at you. GG>
Are u seriously kidding me???? You really think the Iraqi civilian deaths everyday is not our fault? Trained?? It doesnt take training to see the truth; it takes acceptance of ones own faults. Think about that real hard. Do you really think there were 30-70 civilians a day being killed before we went in? To even taKe it further, the Bush admin boasts about lets fight them there, instead of here. What do u think that means? It has nothing to do w/ car bombs going off here; if we had stayed in Afghanistan and gotten to bin ladin and spent the money we used in Iraq, to protect our borders we would be SAFE and innocent Iraqi's would be ALIVE. Think about that too.
Comments
Peace will not come by the death of any group. Peace will come from the death of that idealogy.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
so, the Iraq citizens being killed by Iranian trained soldiers as well is okay, or its Bush's fault? Anything not Bush's fault? They really have you guys trained well, focus on blaming bush, so you don't notice whats really coming at you. GG>
www.myspace.com/jensvad
interesting...and proabbly true-that Iran is arming factions in Iraq. But also I think its fairly obvious the US is playing the same game. If you look at history-and you don't really have to go back too far-its seems obvious (to me anyway) that Iraq has been turned into the familiar template of a state post US invasion.
Yugoslavia was broken up...now ruled by pro-US authority, Afghanistan was the same. And Iraq is fitting that mold as well, along with at least a dozen or so others going back as far as 1970.
They divide and rule..allowing corporations access to the readily available resources labored out by the very oppresses majority of most of these countries. And its happened so often the patterns are obvcius, and every journalist in the US is failing in their duty to their country and the people by not reporting this very obvious pattern.
Iraq may have been a bit more than they expected to get into, and only someone as brutal as Saddam could really keep them all from degenerating into civil war...bu then again maybe not...now its Iran and Syria trying to keepo a pro-US gov't out of their backyard while the US tries violently to install just such an authority. And it wouldn't surpise me if Chinese funding has somehow reached its way into the region, to oppose US interests, though that is pure speculation.
We can be sure the US is arming certain factions in Iraq while Iran is doing the same, and the majority of the people in Iraq are being caught in the middle of this game, paying with their lives.
Look I am no fan of Geroge W but some of you people need to wake up and look around. On this one we cannot wait. We need to take out Iran now. I for one would gladly go to the recruiting office on this one.
Irvine 1992, Las Vegas 1993, Mountain View 1994, San Diego 1995, Los Angeles 1996, Los Angeles 1998, Moutain View 1999, San Bernadino 2000, Los Angeles 2000, Irvine 2003, Irvine 2003, Moutain View 2003, Santa Barbara 2003, San Diego 2006, Los Angeles 2006, Santa Barbara 2006
Would you like a list of recruiting locations? I'll quickly google it for yeah if you want. I really don't mind.
Irvine 1992, Las Vegas 1993, Mountain View 1994, San Diego 1995, Los Angeles 1996, Los Angeles 1998, Moutain View 1999, San Bernadino 2000, Los Angeles 2000, Irvine 2003, Irvine 2003, Moutain View 2003, Santa Barbara 2003, San Diego 2006, Los Angeles 2006, Santa Barbara 2006
I dont think Yugoslavia is a good example. There the US was pretty reluctant to interfere from the outset. It did step in, because european nations asked very nicely if it wouldn't, as they were nervous about such a conflict so close to home. Now if you consider US and EU two sides of the same coin, then I guess. But remember that Yugoslavia was definitely an agressor, and was taking steps towards ethnic cleansing. Lucky for the albanians, that Europe won't sit idly by when it happens literally on their doorstep. But had this happened in Africa, they wouldn't have given a fuck about it, make no mistake.
But actually, Yugoslavia and Somalia in the 90s, are two attempts, as I see it, at more genuine peace-keeping missions, as none of them were directly related to US interests in any way. After Somalia, it seems the americans won't bother to do that again, unless there's something in it for them.
The US are behind a lot of bad, but not all the bad.
(edit) as for US and Israel planning wars, they do so all the time. Especially the US. I believe Pentagon are developing plans for just about any contingency to be on the safe side. Fair enough, a plan is not an intention to use. However, existence of plans may influence actions in wrong ways. The same way existence of plans and large militaries paved the way for WW1. Germany attacked France, because Russia was mobilizing, and they didn't want a 2-front war. they knew they had 2-3 weeks until Russia was ready because of their poor infrastructure so they had a window there. They failed, got the 2-front war and the trenches. So plans does not imply usage in itself, but the existence of plans do increase their probability of being executed, as those making them know about them.
Peace
Dan
"Every judgment teeters on the brink of error. To claim absolute knowledge is to become monstrous. Knowledge is an unending adventure at the edge of uncertainty." - Frank Herbert, Dune, 1965
Where exactly is your prove that the middle east had anything to with 9/11? Oh your goverment told you so, so it must be true, and of course it is every single person and country in the middle east that planned the attack. So we should just go in and wipe them out.
The economy has polarized to the point where the wealthiest 10% now own 85% of the nation’s wealth. Never before have the bottom 90% been so highly indebted, so dependent on the wealthy.
You're missing the point; it's not to defend themselves, it was preparation to attack yet another country. For this, all those women and children were killed or have we already forgotten them?
Edit: Same concept of attacking Iraq to make the US safer...complete BS.
Yup. Complete BS. There were no rockets aimed at Israeli cities. There was no terrorist organization sitting right on Israel's northern border whose stated goal is the destruction of Israel. Shall I keep on posting lies to bolster your point?
are there any israeli rockets pointed at anyone?
he had a voice that was strong and loud and
i swallowed his facade cos i'm so
eager to identify with
someone above the crowd
someone who seemed to feel the same
someone prepared to lead the way
To sound like people from the countries you just mentioned. Who fucking cares if they get hit, it ain't me. And I am much more important than you!
not sure about yugoslavia, but somalia was just under the guise of "peace keeping", america had no intention to help the situation. I'll do a search for the info on that.
I know you like to take the middle ground, that's fine, but it's very hard to find any good the US has done, mainly because they hardly have ever done any, that's just simple fact.
What america does is, stab you, then pull the blade out a few inches and calls it "helping".
Do not go down that path again please.
Admin
http://www.reverbnation.com/brianzilm
Well, that's one perspective. The US does do a lot of shitty things, but not evrything they do is. I feel those two cases were the US trying to do the right thing somewhat without there being a direct gain for their own interests. That Somalia blew up in their faces, and it didn't work, is another matter.
I feel Yugoslavia was justified somewhat. Not all of their targets I feel was legitimate, like bombing tv-networks and so on. But their intention was fair enough, and invited by european nations that wanted to contain this on their doorstep. And it ended ok enough, from a shitty situation to start with.
Peace
Dan
"Every judgment teeters on the brink of error. To claim absolute knowledge is to become monstrous. Knowledge is an unending adventure at the edge of uncertainty." - Frank Herbert, Dune, 1965
Are u seriously kidding me???? You really think the Iraqi civilian deaths everyday is not our fault? Trained?? It doesnt take training to see the truth; it takes acceptance of ones own faults. Think about that real hard. Do you really think there were 30-70 civilians a day being killed before we went in? To even taKe it further, the Bush admin boasts about lets fight them there, instead of here. What do u think that means? It has nothing to do w/ car bombs going off here; if we had stayed in Afghanistan and gotten to bin ladin and spent the money we used in Iraq, to protect our borders we would be SAFE and innocent Iraqi's would be ALIVE. Think about that too.