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before we go making judgements about the kidnapped brits...

El_KabongEl_Kabong Posts: 4,141
edited March 2007 in A Moving Train
they say they were in international waters...they say they were in iranian waters...we shouldn't believe either just 'because they said so!', they have radar, their coordinates are recorded, why don't we wait until we see those before we use it as any justification for anything silly....

take, for example, this...

http://forums.pearljam.com/showthread.php?t=214683

in 1988 we shot down an iranian CIVILIAN airliner killing everyone...then:
we say we were in international waters and thought it was a tomcat, we tried radioing it but it didn't reply so we reacted...which is a L I E

we were in iranian waters, we did radio it, but on a military frequency, not a civilian airliner frequency...the plane was on a known flight path, it's transponder was working correctly....

we did this during trying to get a reaction from them...we bush, sr stated publicly that he refused to apologize for our action (and then gave the ppl medals for it)
standin above the crowd
he had a voice that was strong and loud and
i swallowed his facade cos i'm so
eager to identify with
someone above the crowd
someone who seemed to feel the same
someone prepared to lead the way
Post edited by Unknown User on
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Comments

  • gue_bariumgue_barium Posts: 5,515
    El_Kabong wrote:
    they say they were in international waters...they say they were in iranian waters...we shouldn't believe either just 'because they said so!', they have radar, their coordinates are recorded, why don't we wait until we see those before we use it as any justification for anything silly....

    take, for example, this...

    http://forums.pearljam.com/showthread.php?t=214683

    in 1988 we shot down an iranian CIVILIAN airliner killing everyone...then:
    we say we were in international waters and thought it was a tomcat, we tried radioing it but it didn't reply so we reacted...which is a L I E

    we were in iranian waters, we did radio it, but on a military frequency, not a civilian airliner frequency...the plane was on a known flight path, it's transponder was working correctly....

    we did this during trying to get a reaction from them...we bush, sr stated publicly that he refused to apologize for our action (and then gave the ppl medals for it)

    It just goes to show that the world's oceans and airspaces are sick, sick, sick.
    all posts by ©gue_barium are protected under US copyright law and are not to be reproduced, exchanged or sold
    except by express written permission of ©gue_barium, the author.
  • Purple HawkPurple Hawk Posts: 1,300
    El_Kabong wrote:
    they say they were in international waters...they say they were in iranian waters...we shouldn't believe either just 'because they said so!', they have radar, their coordinates are recorded, why don't we wait until we see those before we use it as any justification for anything silly....

    take, for example, this...

    http://forums.pearljam.com/showthread.php?t=214683

    in 1988 we shot down an iranian CIVILIAN airliner killing everyone...then:
    we say we were in international waters and thought it was a tomcat, we tried radioing it but it didn't reply so we reacted...which is a L I E

    we were in iranian waters, we did radio it, but on a military frequency, not a civilian airliner frequency...the plane was on a known flight path, it's transponder was working correctly....

    we did this during trying to get a reaction from them...we bush, sr stated publicly that he refused to apologize for our action (and then gave the ppl medals for it)


    Dude, I'm so with you....the UK is so out of line. President Tom is a good man...he is. He desparately wants peace, his actions and words say so...or maybe they don't...but western socialists interpret his action and words and such...and heck..that's good enough for me...bravo...and DAMNED those corporations...and karl rove...gonzales...the lies...impeachment! damnit...impeachment!!!
    And you ask me what I want this year
    And I try to make this kind and clear
    Just a chance that maybe we'll find better days
    Cuz I don't need boxes wrapped in strings
    And desire and love and empty things
    Just a chance that maybe we'll find better days
  • RolandTD20KdrummerRolandTD20Kdrummer Posts: 13,066
    Valerie Plame is a 10?

    Not only is that visibly impossible but a tad concerning on the womanly exposure area thing...
    Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
    and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
    over specific principles, goals, and policies.

    http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg

    (\__/)
    ( o.O)
    (")_(")
  • Purple HawkPurple Hawk Posts: 1,300
    RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:
    Valerie Plame is a 10?

    Not only is that visibly impossible but a tad concerning on the womanly exposure area thing...

    Dude, she's hot :)
    And you ask me what I want this year
    And I try to make this kind and clear
    Just a chance that maybe we'll find better days
    Cuz I don't need boxes wrapped in strings
    And desire and love and empty things
    Just a chance that maybe we'll find better days
  • RolandTD20KdrummerRolandTD20Kdrummer Posts: 13,066
    Purple Hawk wrote:
    Dude, she's hot :)

    You must be over 60
    Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
    and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
    over specific principles, goals, and policies.

    http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg

    (\__/)
    ( o.O)
    (")_(")
  • Purple HawkPurple Hawk Posts: 1,300
    RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:
    You must be over 60

    partisanship aside brah, she's hot!
    And you ask me what I want this year
    And I try to make this kind and clear
    Just a chance that maybe we'll find better days
    Cuz I don't need boxes wrapped in strings
    And desire and love and empty things
    Just a chance that maybe we'll find better days
  • RolandTD20KdrummerRolandTD20Kdrummer Posts: 13,066
    Purple Hawk wrote:
    partisanship aside brah, she's hot!

    OK now you're starting to scare me. :D
    Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
    and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
    over specific principles, goals, and policies.

    http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg

    (\__/)
    ( o.O)
    (")_(")
  • El_KabongEl_Kabong Posts: 4,141
    Purple Hawk wrote:
    Dude, I'm so with you....the UK is so out of line. President Tom is a good man...he is. He desparately wants peace, his actions and words say so...or maybe they don't...but western socialists interpret his action and words and such...and heck..that's good enough for me...bravo...and DAMNED those corporations...and karl rove...gonzales...the lies...impeachment! damnit...impeachment!!!


    uhhh...i think you posted this in the wrong thread...nowhere did i say president 'tom' (btw, good one, glenn beck would be proud knowing you mimick him so, bet you'd buy the same toilet paper as him if ya only knew...;) ) being a good man...nor did i say anything about corporations, karl rove, gonzalesm, impeachment....

    all i said was some ppl are saying they were at a certain location, others say different...it is documented where that vessel was when they were taken, so what is wrong w/ saying let's not jump to any conclusions or reactions until we see where they actually were?

    or is that a problem b/c glenn beck and rush never actually address points so you don't know what they would say?
    standin above the crowd
    he had a voice that was strong and loud and
    i swallowed his facade cos i'm so
    eager to identify with
    someone above the crowd
    someone who seemed to feel the same
    someone prepared to lead the way
  • RushlimboRushlimbo Posts: 832
    El_Kabong wrote:
    uhhh...i think you posted this in the wrong thread...nowhere did i say president 'tom' (btw, good one, glenn beck would be proud knowing you mimick him so, bet you'd buy the same toilet paper as him if ya only knew...;) ) being a good man...nor did i say anything about corporations, karl rove, gonzalesm, impeachment....

    all i said was some ppl are saying they were at a certain location, others say different...it is documented where that vessel was when they were taken, so what is wrong w/ saying let's not jump to any conclusions or reactions until we see where they actually were?

    or is that a problem b/c glenn beck and rush never actually address points so you don't know what they would say?

    Dittoheads unite. Dont think about scenarios. Jump to conclusions and let your hate takeover. Bomb Iran ! Bomb Iran !!
    War is Peace
    Freedom is Slavery
    Ignorance is Strength
  • RolandTD20KdrummerRolandTD20Kdrummer Posts: 13,066
    I think it's f-in hilarious to think there's still people who just have no clue, or refuse to finally accept the reality of Bush and his goon squad's underhanded run for power and domination.
    Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
    and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
    over specific principles, goals, and policies.

    http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg

    (\__/)
    ( o.O)
    (")_(")
  • Purple HawkPurple Hawk Posts: 1,300
    Rushlimbo wrote:
    Dittoheads unite. Dont think about scenarios. Jump to conclusions and let your hate takeover. Bomb Iran ! Bomb Iran !!

    let's see...so I question the topic at hand, and I want to bomb Iran...

    yeah, that sounds about right for you people...dissent and we want death to everyone that doesn't look like us...

    yeah, you are REALLY in touch with regular people.

    and yeah, I like Glenn's nickname...so obviously I'm a zombie...and a dittohead...have no rational thoughts of my own...So i'm gonna go read some howard zinn and be a little depressed :)
    And you ask me what I want this year
    And I try to make this kind and clear
    Just a chance that maybe we'll find better days
    Cuz I don't need boxes wrapped in strings
    And desire and love and empty things
    Just a chance that maybe we'll find better days
  • catefrancescatefrances Posts: 29,003
    i heard tony blair on the radio this morning say the brits were in iraqi waters. i believe him. afterall he wouldnt lie, would he? what would he have to gain from that? :p:D
    hear my name
    take a good look
    this could be the day
    hold my hand
    lie beside me
    i just need to say
  • Purple HawkPurple Hawk Posts: 1,300
    catefrances wrote:
    i heard tony blair on the radio this morning say the brits were in iraqi waters. i believe him. afterall he wouldnt lie, would he? what would he have to gain from that? :p:D

    tony blair v president tom?

    yeah, i choose the latter as well. i mean, president tom wouldn't lie, would he? what would he have to gain from that? :p:D
    And you ask me what I want this year
    And I try to make this kind and clear
    Just a chance that maybe we'll find better days
    Cuz I don't need boxes wrapped in strings
    And desire and love and empty things
    Just a chance that maybe we'll find better days
  • catefrancescatefrances Posts: 29,003
    Purple Hawk wrote:
    tony blair v president tom?

    yeah, i choose the latter as well. i mean, president tom wouldn't lie, would he? what would he have to gain from that? :p:D


    i didn't say i believed the iranians. i just choose to have a healthy scepticism of anything that comes from the mouth of a man who sent his country off to war under false pretences.
    hear my name
    take a good look
    this could be the day
    hold my hand
    lie beside me
    i just need to say
  • Purple HawkPurple Hawk Posts: 1,300
    catefrances wrote:
    i didn't say i believed the iranians. i just choose to have a healthy scepticism of anything that comes from the mouth of a man who sent his country off to war under false pretences.

    and i have a healthy scepticism of anything that comes from the mouth of a man who preaches that the halocaust never happened.

    and as far as blair goes, they weren't false pretenses, and we all know it so why perpetuate the lie that bush and blair lied? nobody but bitter, angry, self-loathing, anti-capitalists believe that they lied. do you really think it's going to catch on?
    And you ask me what I want this year
    And I try to make this kind and clear
    Just a chance that maybe we'll find better days
    Cuz I don't need boxes wrapped in strings
    And desire and love and empty things
    Just a chance that maybe we'll find better days
  • AbookamongstthemanyAbookamongstthemany Posts: 8,209
    Purple Hawk wrote:
    and i have a healthy scepticism of anything that comes from the mouth of a man who preaches that the halocaust never happened.

    and as far as blair goes, they weren't false pretenses, and we all know it so why perpetuate the lie that bush and blair lied? nobody but bitter, angry, self-loathing, anti-capitalists believe that they lied. do you really think it's going to catch on?

    http://www.pollingreport.com/BushJob.htm

    What exactly are people disapproving of then?

    http://www.cnn.com/2006/POLITICS/03/13/bush.poll/index.html

    "The latest poll found 51 percent of Americans believed the administration deliberately misled the public about whether Iraq had weapons of mass destruction, while 46 percent disagreed. That question had a sampling error of 4.5 percentage points as well."
    If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.

    Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
    -Oscar Wilde
  • Purple HawkPurple Hawk Posts: 1,300
    Abookamongstthemany wrote:
    http://www.pollingreport.com/BushJob.htm

    What exactly are people disapproving of then?

    http://www.cnn.com/2006/POLITICS/03/13/bush.poll/index.html

    "The latest poll found 51 percent of Americans believed the administration deliberately misled the public about whether Iraq had weapons of mass destruction, while 46 percent disagreed. That question had a sampling error of 4.5 percentage points as well."

    how is this relevant? why does every discussion have to center around why bush sucks...oh b/c that's the only common ground you people have.

    Bush lied, everyone died...very insightful. thanks for the polling numbers, but guess what, Bush DIDN'T lie about ANYTHING, so give it up.

    try to focus...we are talking about president tom, hate to break it to you sweatums, but he's a lot badder than bush and his oil buddies.
    And you ask me what I want this year
    And I try to make this kind and clear
    Just a chance that maybe we'll find better days
    Cuz I don't need boxes wrapped in strings
    And desire and love and empty things
    Just a chance that maybe we'll find better days
  • AbookamongstthemanyAbookamongstthemany Posts: 8,209
    Purple Hawk wrote:
    how is this relevant? why does every discussion have to center around why bush sucks...oh b/c that's the only common ground you people have.

    try to focus...we are talking about president tom, hate to break it to you sweatums, but he's a lot badder than bush and his oil buddies.


    More people think Bush is liar than you think. And who is the biggest boogey man whom we need to be fearing next is a matter of perspective...perspectives that mostly form from whatever line is the one all the major networks are hyping at the moment.
    If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.

    Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
    -Oscar Wilde
  • AbookamongstthemanyAbookamongstthemany Posts: 8,209
    Purple Hawk wrote:
    try to focus...we are talking about president tom, hate to break it to you sweatums, but he's a lot badder than bush and his oil buddies.

    How is he worse?
    If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.

    Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
    -Oscar Wilde
  • Purple HawkPurple Hawk Posts: 1,300
    Abookamongstthemany wrote:
    More people think Bush is liar than you think. And who is the biggest boogey man whom we need to be fearing next is a matter of perspective...perspectives that mostly form from whatever line is the one all the major networks are hyping at the moment.

    i don't care if everyone in the world except me and george w bush thought that he lied.

    he didn't

    i don't give a damned about anything other than what I think is right.

    as far as perspectives go, yeah, we are obviously coming from different ones. funny that we both loathe the major networks (except fox, i think they have it down right :))
    And you ask me what I want this year
    And I try to make this kind and clear
    Just a chance that maybe we'll find better days
    Cuz I don't need boxes wrapped in strings
    And desire and love and empty things
    Just a chance that maybe we'll find better days
  • AbookamongstthemanyAbookamongstthemany Posts: 8,209
    Purple Hawk wrote:
    i don't care if everyone in the world except me and george w bush thought that he lied.

    he didn't

    i don't give a damned about anything other than what I think is right.

    as far as perspectives go, yeah, we are obviously coming from different ones. funny that we both loathe the major networks (except fox, i think they have it down right :))

    I think you it might do you some good to reconsider some of these stances that you think are so 'right'.
    If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.

    Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
    -Oscar Wilde
  • Purple HawkPurple Hawk Posts: 1,300
    Abookamongstthemany wrote:
    I think you it might do you some good to reconsider some of these stances that you think are so 'right'.

    I could say the same to you...but i think deep down, we all know what is "right" :) To speak otherwise would be irresponsible.
    And you ask me what I want this year
    And I try to make this kind and clear
    Just a chance that maybe we'll find better days
    Cuz I don't need boxes wrapped in strings
    And desire and love and empty things
    Just a chance that maybe we'll find better days
  • El_KabongEl_Kabong Posts: 4,141
    Purple Hawk wrote:
    i don't care if everyone in the world except me and george w bush thought that he lied.

    he didn't

    i don't give a damned about anything other than what I think is right.

    as far as perspectives go, yeah, we are obviously coming from different ones. funny that we both loathe the major networks (except fox, i think they have it down right :))


    how about when he said in a speech that the iaea issued a report saying iraq was 6 months away from having a nuke, a report the iaea never issued, in fact they said not only do they not have the capabilities or materials they didn't even have a nuke program!?

    that's not a lie?
    standin above the crowd
    he had a voice that was strong and loud and
    i swallowed his facade cos i'm so
    eager to identify with
    someone above the crowd
    someone who seemed to feel the same
    someone prepared to lead the way
  • YourBuddyYourBuddy Posts: 59
    Whether or not bush lied is irrelevant, we are at war and will be for some time. The problem on hand is that the Brittish sailors were taken prisoner by Iran. No matter who is right or wrong, this could be the spark to set off a war with Iran and perpetuate A huge war.

    On the sailors i believe that that someone made a mistake, and this should be resolved immediately. Otherwise i see the SAS going in to get the sailors in a non-peaceful manner witch would probably start the aforementioned war which would be bad thing.
  • even flow?even flow? Posts: 8,066
    Bush to Blair: "Come on Tony, be the second country to ever use those weapons. It will solve some of the immediate problems for a very long time."
    You've changed your place in this world!
  • NOCODE#1NOCODE#1 Posts: 1,477
    El_Kabong wrote:
    they say they were in international waters...they say they were in iranian waters...we shouldn't believe either just 'because they said so!', they have radar, their coordinates are recorded, why don't we wait until we see those before we use it as any justification for anything silly....
    wasnt this this plot for that horrible Bond movie Tomorrow never dies?
    Let's not be negative now. Thumper has spoken
  • El_KabongEl_Kabong Posts: 4,141
    El_Kabong wrote:
    how about when he said in a speech that the iaea issued a report saying iraq was 6 months away from having a nuke, a report the iaea never issued, in fact they said not only do they not have the capabilities or materials they didn't even have a nuke program!?

    that's not a lie?


    i'll take that as a 'yes, that was a ie'

    :D
    standin above the crowd
    he had a voice that was strong and loud and
    i swallowed his facade cos i'm so
    eager to identify with
    someone above the crowd
    someone who seemed to feel the same
    someone prepared to lead the way
  • chromiamchromiam Posts: 4,114
    El_Kabong wrote:
    they say they were in international waters...they say they were in iranian waters...we shouldn't believe either just 'because they said so!', they have radar, their coordinates are recorded, why don't we wait until we see those before we use it as any justification for anything silly....

    take, for example, this...

    http://forums.pearljam.com/showthread.php?t=214683

    in 1988 we shot down an iranian CIVILIAN airliner killing everyone...then:
    we say we were in international waters and thought it was a tomcat, we tried radioing it but it didn't reply so we reacted...which is a L I E

    we were in iranian waters, we did radio it, but on a military frequency, not a civilian airliner frequency...the plane was on a known flight path, it's transponder was working correctly....

    we did this during trying to get a reaction from them...we bush, sr stated publicly that he refused to apologize for our action (and then gave the ppl medals for it)

    so the GPS device showing that the British boats were in Iraqi territorial waters enough evidence for you????? or do want it shown to you via Google maps??
    This is your notice that there is a problem with your signature. Please remove it.

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  • El_KabongEl_Kabong Posts: 4,141
    chromiam wrote:
    so the GPS device showing that the British boats were in Iraqi territorial waters enough evidence for you????? or do want it shown to you via Google maps??

    well, i'd like the gps to be public, not just from their word
    standin above the crowd
    he had a voice that was strong and loud and
    i swallowed his facade cos i'm so
    eager to identify with
    someone above the crowd
    someone who seemed to feel the same
    someone prepared to lead the way
  • catefrancescatefrances Posts: 29,003
    for fuck's sake iran give britain back their sailors. give them the benefit of the doubt. it's not like there are borders painted on the ocean waters.
    hear my name
    take a good look
    this could be the day
    hold my hand
    lie beside me
    i just need to say
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