to us it might seem like oppression because if somebody suddenly told us to wear it it would be opressive because we arent from that background and dont understand but maybe they see it as being protected from exploitation such as pornography and things like that
It is oppression. Im sorry, but you arent going to convince me that women in muslim countries arent oppressed. You arent going to tell me things like genital mutilation , honor killings, forced marriages, the denial of education to women, etc etc isnt oppression. Sure the veil is minor compared to those types of things, but its still a symbol of women's status in the muslim world. Just dismissing it as a cultural difference is ludicrous.
Now, I will say I dont agree with this law, because I dont think civilized nations should prohibit people from wearing what they want. But, I can at least understand where its coming from. There are some cultural differences, where one side is better than the other side. And the way women are treated is most certainly better in western society than in most Islamic societies.
It is oppression. Im sorry, but you arent going to convince me that women in muslim countries arent oppressed. You arent going to tell me things like genital mutilation , honor killings, forced marriages, the denial of education to women, etc etc isnt oppression. Sure the veil is minor compared to those types of things, but its still a symbol of women's status in the muslim world. Just dismissing it as a cultural difference is ludicrous.
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But what does genital mutilation,honor killings, forced marriages and denial of education to women have to do with islam to begin with? you sound as if they are muslim inventions. don't be so ignorant.
In america, women still don't even have full rights, and some guys too, the gay ones. they are still oppressed when you look at it.
yes, dismissing it as a cultural difference is ludicrous. Indeed.
But what does genital mutilation,honor killings, forced marriages and denial of education to women have to do with islam to begin with? you sound as if they are muslim inventions. don't be so ignorant.
In america, women still don't even have full rights, and some guys too, the gay ones. they are still oppressed when you look at it.
yes, dismissing it as a cultural difference is ludicrous. Indeed.
I dont really understand your point. The things I mentioned most certainly occur in many Islamic nations. It might not actually have to do with the Koran, or be from the teachings of Mohammed, but it most certainly happens in many Muslim countries. And I dont recall saying Islam invented anything, or that Muslims were the only people to ever act that way towards women, not really sure what ass you pulled that out of.
ANd yes, in America we still have sexism and racism and homophobia. I dont recall ever denying that either. But there is no way any honest person can possibly compare the levels of sexism, racism, homophobia, etc, in the US, to what goes on in say Saudia Arabia for example.
I dont really understand your point. The things I mentioned most certainly occur in many Islamic nations. It might not actually have to do with the Koran, or be from the teachings of Mohammed, but it most certainly happens in many Muslim countries. And I dont recall saying Islam invented anything, or that Muslims were the only people to ever act that way towards women, not really sure what ass you pulled that out of.
ANd yes, in America we still have sexism and racism and homophobia. I dont recall ever denying that either. But there is no way any honest person can possibly compare the levels of sexism, racism, homophobia, etc, in the US, to what goes on in say Saudia Arabia for example.
Yes but remember that america supports this saudi arabia, they support the royals, so imagine a country that would support such a country. say's alot about them I think.
So if you still want to compare levels.
all I was pointing out was that it's a myth that these things you name are more prevalent in arab countries.
Yes but remember that america supports this saudi arabia, they support the royals, so imagine a country that would support such a country. say's alot about them I think.
So if you still want to compare levels.
all I was pointing out was that it's a myth that these things you name are more prevalent in arab countries.
THey are certainly more prevalent than in western nations. You compared it to the US in your last post. I hope your not honestly saying that these things are just as prevalent in the US as in Muslim countries. If that isnt what you are saying then could you please clarify. And if that is what your saying then your simply wrong.
And yes, I agree that the US shouldnt support the Saudi regime. But because the US supports the Saudi's, doesnt make the humans rights violations and oppression the Saudi's impose right.
It is oppression. Im sorry, but you arent going to convince me that women in muslim countries arent oppressed. You arent going to tell me things like genital mutilation , honor killings, forced marriages, the denial of education to women, etc etc isnt oppression. Sure the veil is minor compared to those types of things, but its still a symbol of women's status in the muslim world. Just dismissing it as a cultural difference is ludicrous.
Now, I will say I dont agree with this law, because I dont think civilized nations should prohibit people from wearing what they want. But, I can at least understand where its coming from. There are some cultural differences, where one side is better than the other side. And the way women are treated is most certainly better in western society than in most Islamic societies.
okay all i was talking about were the burquas so if you could stop straying from the point
"If you remove the English army tomorrow and hoist the green flag over Dublin castle, unless you set about the organisation of the socialist republic then all of your efforts would have been in vain. England will still rule you through her capitalists ,landlords and commercial institutions"
THey are certainly more prevalent than in western nations. You compared it to the US in your last post. I hope your not honestly saying that these things are just as prevalent in the US as in Muslim countries. If that isnt what you are saying then could you please clarify. And if that is what your saying then your simply wrong.
And yes, I agree that the US shouldnt support the Saudi regime. But because the US supports the Saudi's, doesnt make the humans rights violations and oppression the Saudi's impose right.
I did'nt fully have your post in mind with my reply. I also never said or implied that because america supports the sauds that turns the sauds oppression right or makes the wrongs they do right, nevertheless again, if a country supports another country who they know does many things wrong, that's just as bad. i'm sorry bro, that's just how it is.
Is this law really about the burqa or is it about dissuading muslims from moving to Holland?
It's about the burqa. Western people show their face when walking down the street- if you want to live in a western country- get rid of the burqa (in public).
I did'nt fully have your post in mind with my reply. I also never said or implied that because america supports the sauds that turns the sauds oppression right or makes the wrongs they do right, nevertheless again, if a country supports another country who they know does many things wrong, that's just as bad. i'm sorry bro, that's just how it is.
I dont disagree with that, like I just said. Not sure why you are directing this argument to me, when I quite clearly stated that the US shouldnt support the Saudi regime. But that doesnt let the Saudi's off the hook. The US and the Saudi's are business partners. But the US isnt forcing or pressuring the Saudi government to treat its women in the manner they do. So while yes, I agree that the US shouldnt support them, its kind of a cop out on your part to not address the issue at hand, and instead turn it into an anti- US thing. I still honestly dont know your impression of Saudi oppression because you have only tried to turn it around on the US,, and earlier said it was just as bad in other countries. You havent even really addressed the issue at hand which is Saudi oppression, or any radical Muslim government that oppresses its people.
But what does genital mutilation,honor killings, forced marriages and denial of education to women have to do with islam to begin with? you sound as if they are muslim inventions. don't be so ignorant.
In america, women still don't even have full rights, and some guys too, the gay ones. they are still oppressed when you look at it.
yes, dismissing it as a cultural difference is ludicrous. Indeed.
Women have as many rights as men in this country. No question. None. I repeat, no question. Democrats accuse Republicans of using the fear card with terrorism. Well, Democrats use it too with this bullshit. They also like to scare you into thinking your vote won't get counted. But wait! The Dems won the election, so alas, no high profile voting issues. No write-up in Rolling Stone.
It is oppression. Im sorry, but you arent going to convince me that women in muslim countries arent oppressed. You arent going to tell me things like genital mutilation , honor killings, forced marriages, the denial of education to women, etc etc isnt oppression. Sure the veil is minor compared to those types of things, but its still a symbol of women's status in the muslim world. Just dismissing it as a cultural difference is ludicrous.
Now, I will say I dont agree with this law, because I dont think civilized nations should prohibit people from wearing what they want. But, I can at least understand where its coming from. There are some cultural differences, where one side is better than the other side. And the way women are treated is most certainly better in western society than in most Islamic societies.
Comments
It is oppression. Im sorry, but you arent going to convince me that women in muslim countries arent oppressed. You arent going to tell me things like genital mutilation , honor killings, forced marriages, the denial of education to women, etc etc isnt oppression. Sure the veil is minor compared to those types of things, but its still a symbol of women's status in the muslim world. Just dismissing it as a cultural difference is ludicrous.
Now, I will say I dont agree with this law, because I dont think civilized nations should prohibit people from wearing what they want. But, I can at least understand where its coming from. There are some cultural differences, where one side is better than the other side. And the way women are treated is most certainly better in western society than in most Islamic societies.
But what does genital mutilation,honor killings, forced marriages and denial of education to women have to do with islam to begin with? you sound as if they are muslim inventions. don't be so ignorant.
In america, women still don't even have full rights, and some guys too, the gay ones. they are still oppressed when you look at it.
yes, dismissing it as a cultural difference is ludicrous. Indeed.
I dont really understand your point. The things I mentioned most certainly occur in many Islamic nations. It might not actually have to do with the Koran, or be from the teachings of Mohammed, but it most certainly happens in many Muslim countries. And I dont recall saying Islam invented anything, or that Muslims were the only people to ever act that way towards women, not really sure what ass you pulled that out of.
ANd yes, in America we still have sexism and racism and homophobia. I dont recall ever denying that either. But there is no way any honest person can possibly compare the levels of sexism, racism, homophobia, etc, in the US, to what goes on in say Saudia Arabia for example.
Yes but remember that america supports this saudi arabia, they support the royals, so imagine a country that would support such a country. say's alot about them I think.
So if you still want to compare levels.
all I was pointing out was that it's a myth that these things you name are more prevalent in arab countries.
THey are certainly more prevalent than in western nations. You compared it to the US in your last post. I hope your not honestly saying that these things are just as prevalent in the US as in Muslim countries. If that isnt what you are saying then could you please clarify. And if that is what your saying then your simply wrong.
And yes, I agree that the US shouldnt support the Saudi regime. But because the US supports the Saudi's, doesnt make the humans rights violations and oppression the Saudi's impose right.
I did'nt fully have your post in mind with my reply. I also never said or implied that because america supports the sauds that turns the sauds oppression right or makes the wrongs they do right, nevertheless again, if a country supports another country who they know does many things wrong, that's just as bad. i'm sorry bro, that's just how it is.
It's about the burqa. Western people show their face when walking down the street- if you want to live in a western country- get rid of the burqa (in public).
Assimilate.
I dont disagree with that, like I just said. Not sure why you are directing this argument to me, when I quite clearly stated that the US shouldnt support the Saudi regime. But that doesnt let the Saudi's off the hook. The US and the Saudi's are business partners. But the US isnt forcing or pressuring the Saudi government to treat its women in the manner they do. So while yes, I agree that the US shouldnt support them, its kind of a cop out on your part to not address the issue at hand, and instead turn it into an anti- US thing. I still honestly dont know your impression of Saudi oppression because you have only tried to turn it around on the US,, and earlier said it was just as bad in other countries. You havent even really addressed the issue at hand which is Saudi oppression, or any radical Muslim government that oppresses its people.
Women have as many rights as men in this country. No question. None. I repeat, no question. Democrats accuse Republicans of using the fear card with terrorism. Well, Democrats use it too with this bullshit. They also like to scare you into thinking your vote won't get counted. But wait! The Dems won the election, so alas, no high profile voting issues. No write-up in Rolling Stone.
Agreed.