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Surfing The far side of THE Sombrero Galaxy Posts: 18,200
Why do I get a strange feeling GWBush will bend over backwards to help Obama in his transition. Even though that's what he's suppose to do.
I hope this will be true
Peace
*We CAN bomb the World to pieces, but we CAN'T bomb it into PEACE*...Michael Franti
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
Why do I get a strange feeling GWBush will bend over backwards to help Obama in his transition. Even though that's what he's suppose to do.
I hope this will be true
Peace
I'm sure you're right. He never looked comfortable as "the decider", and probably hated all of that responsibility (although loved the power). He is a slacker by nature, and I'm sure is very relieved to be heading back to the ranch. I'm thinking he'll be happy to turn the keys and the problems over to Obama, and get the hell out of town as quickly as possible.
"I'll use the magic word - let's just shut the fuck up, please." EV, 04/13/08
I'm sure you're right. He never looked comfortable as "the decider", and probably hated all of that responsibility (although loved the power). He is a slacker by nature, and I'm sure is very relieved to be heading back to the ranch. I'm thinking he'll be happy to turn the keys and the problems over to Obama, and get the hell out of town as quickly as possible.
wouldnt blame him either, i would dislike being president over America...ungrateful citizens
i wonder if Obama realizes instead of acting like a president he actually has to do something other than being a rockstar?
Seriously? Gays, abortion, creationism, Dr. Dobson...
I've got no problem with being "conservative." The Republicans need to kick the ultra conservatives to the curb. IMHO, these are not issues on which to run a campaign. Fuck the FAR right. If they can't live with a 21st century, all-denominational worldview, let 'em start their own party!
I actually think last night's ass-kicking will be a good thing for the Republican party .
Again - what policies cater specifically to the religious right?
The gay marriage amendment was shot down in one of the most liberal states in the U.S. by a popular vote. What did the republicans have to do with that?
The only people we should try to get even with...
...are those who've helped us.
Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
Again - what policies cater specifically to the religious right?
The gay marriage amendment was shot down in one of the most liberal states in the U.S. by a popular vote. What did the republicans have to do with that?
Look, I don't think you're going to be happy with any observations, or acknowledge their validity, but I'll add a little something to my rant.
A little over 2 decades ago I was a Republican and pretty active in the party. Then the Robertson assholes did a great job organizing at the grassroots level, and took over the party. You couldn't get traditional republicans to be delegates to the district/county/state/national conventions. They would bring in their slate of delegates, and would bring numbers. The delegates would stand, talk about being born again, talk about their pro-life stance, talk about loving Jesus, and they'd get elected. Some of us would talk about our desire for small gov't, limited spending, increasing personal liberties and would not be elected as delegates. The delegates then go on to the conventions to draft platforms and select candidates.
I said fuck that noise, and became a libertarian. I have spend the last 2 decades watching the party of my grandparents and parents implode. Republicans would put up unelectable (but pro-life!!!!) candidates and get hammered by Democrats. I voted for my first Democrat in a governor's race because the Republicans put up an inept born-again loony who got completely smoked in the election.
This year, McCain ran a pretty shitty campaign, and probably wouldn't have won anyway, but in order to try to capture the whack-a-mole religionists of the party, they selected Palin to be his running mate. She was completely unelectable, virtually unvetted, and ended up being a huge anchor being drug along the campaign trail.
So it isn't just policy that we're talking about. It is candidates, and party decisions. Again, you may not like to hear it, but that's what I lived through. Ultimately I'm glad I left a couple of decades ago, because I'd hate to have been even remotely associated with W's horrid 8 years, but I miss the old Republican party.
"I'll use the magic word - let's just shut the fuck up, please." EV, 04/13/08
Watching Fox News today...partially to see the despair, partially to avoid the 24 hour stream of black people crying on national television (I mean, seriously, when does this start to become a little exploitative? It's almost kind of condescending, but that's a discussion for another time), but mostly to hear some answers to this question.
What I've heard so far is a lot of the talking heads saying things along the lines of stopping with earmarks they would have strangled Clinton over, responsible spending, return to small government--in short, the Republican party needs to start acting like the Republican Party. While I'm glad Obama was elected over McCain, one of the reasons is that it forces the conservative right to re-access the last 8 years in a more objective and honest context while realizing how far from their roots they have grown.
The party seems very divided today right now. There's the religious, lunatic, legislate-my-moral-view points, and then there's the more rational pre-Robertson party that has been discussed. One will be the party Sarah Palin-type party, and the other will likely move away from that.
It should be interesting. Just as I think the Democratic party has moved its focus more toward the middle to succeed, I think the Republican party will do the same.
MICHAEL TOMASKY: Well, my first thought on the election is that obviously it was an amazing night and a really, really thrilling thing to see.
As for the Republicans, I’m really glad this isn’t my problem, because they’ve got a big one, and—excuse me. They’re going to have some very serious internal arguments about why everything went so wrong here. They first argument they’re going to have is, can we get away with just saying, well, this was a bad candidate and a badly run campaign, and if we’d had a better candidate who had run a better campaign, everything would have been fine; or do they have to look a little harder in the mirror and say there are more serious and deeper structural problems here with the way we’re presenting ourselves to the American people that we have to grapple with? And some people will try to say the former. I was a participant or a front-row seat audience member for some of these similar conversations in 2004, 2005, after John Kerry lost. So I have an idea of how they go. So some people will try to say it was just tactical errors that were made in the campaign.
But I think there is a pretty big consensus, something close to a consensus, among a lot of conservatives, that their movement is out of steam intellectually, a little bit out of touch, maybe a more than a little bit out of touch, and that they have some serious questions to ask themselves, particularly with regard to two very dominant and powerful constituencies inside that party: one, the neoconservatives, who control Republican foreign policy—and, you know, I think it’s pretty clear that this election was a rejection of George Bush’s foreign policy—and the second, the hard-right social conservatives, who are the shock troops of the party and have a whole lot of power and influence in that party and who obviously aren’t translating very well to voters in the middle. So they’ve got a lot of questions to deal with over there.
Peace
*We CAN bomb the World to pieces, but we CAN'T bomb it into PEACE*...Michael Franti
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
i was listening to the rightwing radio cancers on my long drive home, and they were saying that McCain and Bush werent real republicans anyway, and that they should be even more socially conservative than ever before to win next time. i thought, "have fun in irrelevent-extremist-land, assholes".
i was listening to the rightwing radio cancers on my long drive home, and they were saying that McCain and Bush werent real republicans anyway, and that they should be even more socially conservative than ever before to win next time. i thought, "have fun in irrelevent-extremist-land, assholes".
Yeah, that's not going to help them win. Never mind how I feel about the issues, I don't see that being a productive strategy for the Republicans.
they come to the middle or go away, the days of the right nutjobs running the asylum are over.
hopefully we'll see a strong moderate, inclusive republican party in the future, that would be a good thing, and in many a person's opinion a pipe dream, lol
"Music, for me, was fucking heroin." eV (nothing Ed has said is more true for me personally than this quote)
the republicans have to convince me they will cut spending, and it will be pretty hard to do that, considering they had years to do it and refused.
Me too.
But even if they are not as fiscally conservative as I want them to be (they never will be) I still wouldn't vote for the other party which we KNOW won't be fiscally conservative.
And I'm not saying you did do that.
The only people we should try to get even with...
...are those who've helped us.
Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
Very true...they should be happy. It could've been like 2000, where the results of the election were in doubt. At least here they got creamed, so there could be no such confusion.
Look, I don't think you're going to be happy with any observations, or acknowledge their validity, but I'll add a little something to my rant.
A little over 2 decades ago I was a Republican and pretty active in the party. Then the Robertson assholes did a great job organizing at the grassroots level, and took over the party. You couldn't get traditional republicans to be delegates to the district/county/state/national conventions. They would bring in their slate of delegates, and would bring numbers. The delegates would stand, talk about being born again, talk about their pro-life stance, talk about loving Jesus, and they'd get elected. Some of us would talk about our desire for small gov't, limited spending, increasing personal liberties and would not be elected as delegates. The delegates then go on to the conventions to draft platforms and select candidates.
I said fuck that noise, and became a libertarian. I have spend the last 2 decades watching the party of my grandparents and parents implode. Republicans would put up unelectable (but pro-life!!!!) candidates and get hammered by Democrats. I voted for my first Democrat in a governor's race because the Republicans put up an inept born-again loony who got completely smoked in the election.
This year, McCain ran a pretty shitty campaign, and probably wouldn't have won anyway, but in order to try to capture the whack-a-mole religionists of the party, they selected Palin to be his running mate. She was completely unelectable, virtually unvetted, and ended up being a huge anchor being drug along the campaign trail.
So it isn't just policy that we're talking about. It is candidates, and party decisions. Again, you may not like to hear it, but that's what I lived through. Ultimately I'm glad I left a couple of decades ago, because I'd hate to have been even remotely associated with W's horrid 8 years, but I miss the old Republican party.
What a great and honest rant jeffbr. You have had a wealth of first hand experience. It would be great if a few here would take to heart and mind your wise observations.
i saw RELIGULOUS tonight and it reminded me of what has happened to the rep party.
the world has changed. they are killing themselves by not changing with it.
i'm not saying turn Dem. but their party needs a serious overhaul.
*~Pearl Jam will be blasted from speakers until morale improves~*
In my opinion, our society is completely miscontruing this election result. This election is more a reflection of people being fed up with the Bush administrations failures, more than a specific and solid backing of the Dems or Obama. This is not the last we've seen of Reaganomics or radical-rightwing politians using fear and religion to win approval or get in power. Over the course of the last 4yrs, people wanted to go in a different direction because this current administration wasn't showing results and only digging a deeper hole. Fear politics will always have a place in our system, but this current election and these circumstances we face and the candidates didn't provide the correct or right setting or atmosphere to work in practice and win power. It's not the last of it by any means. If you think I'm wrong, just think back to the 04' election. The Bush and Republican administration was far worse off in terms of the economy, price of goods/oil, Katrina disaster and the failures in Iraq, yet still won the election. That says a lot about people's tolerance for inefficiency and lack of responsibility and their general malaise to fall back into line to buy into religious and fear politics in society.
As for the future of the Republican party, I believe the reaction to their recent standing as right-wing radicals compared to their prior basis of conservatism will shift back. Who knows who will represent that shift, but I think they will do so and if Obama and the Dems show signs of failure or inefficiency, they will use it against them and claim they're back to their original roots of conservatism and traditionalism. If they go in any other direction, they really have poor strategists and haven't learned their lessons from what wins elections - illusions of what they represent, not necessarily what you do. McCain lost because of this - he couldn't separate himself enough from Bush-like policies and politics and it cost him. It is very refreshing that our society voted in a black president and shows progress, but I think at the end of the day, we could have just as easily be sitting here discussing the first woman president in Hillary because it's more a reflection of Republican failures and lack of changing their image compared to people really loving Obama and what the Dems offer in comparison.
Just my 2 cents.
CONservative governMENt
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
Weren't we asking these same questions about the Democratic party after the 2004 election?
Politics are like a pendulum ... one party is in charge, ultimately abuses its power and pisses people off, then the other party gets a shot.
All the Republicans generally have to do is sit around and wait for the Democrats to piss off most of middle America -- which might happen sooner, rather than later, given that the Dems also control both houses of Congress -- and then they'll be back in power again. For a while, anyway.
everybody wants the most they can possibly get
for the least they could possibly do
Comments
I hope this will be true
Peace
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
I'm sure you're right. He never looked comfortable as "the decider", and probably hated all of that responsibility (although loved the power). He is a slacker by nature, and I'm sure is very relieved to be heading back to the ranch. I'm thinking he'll be happy to turn the keys and the problems over to Obama, and get the hell out of town as quickly as possible.
wouldnt blame him either, i would dislike being president over America...ungrateful citizens
i wonder if Obama realizes instead of acting like a president he actually has to do something other than being a rockstar?
Again - what policies cater specifically to the religious right?
The gay marriage amendment was shot down in one of the most liberal states in the U.S. by a popular vote. What did the republicans have to do with that?
...are those who've helped us.
Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
Look, I don't think you're going to be happy with any observations, or acknowledge their validity, but I'll add a little something to my rant.
A little over 2 decades ago I was a Republican and pretty active in the party. Then the Robertson assholes did a great job organizing at the grassroots level, and took over the party. You couldn't get traditional republicans to be delegates to the district/county/state/national conventions. They would bring in their slate of delegates, and would bring numbers. The delegates would stand, talk about being born again, talk about their pro-life stance, talk about loving Jesus, and they'd get elected. Some of us would talk about our desire for small gov't, limited spending, increasing personal liberties and would not be elected as delegates. The delegates then go on to the conventions to draft platforms and select candidates.
I said fuck that noise, and became a libertarian. I have spend the last 2 decades watching the party of my grandparents and parents implode. Republicans would put up unelectable (but pro-life!!!!) candidates and get hammered by Democrats. I voted for my first Democrat in a governor's race because the Republicans put up an inept born-again loony who got completely smoked in the election.
This year, McCain ran a pretty shitty campaign, and probably wouldn't have won anyway, but in order to try to capture the whack-a-mole religionists of the party, they selected Palin to be his running mate. She was completely unelectable, virtually unvetted, and ended up being a huge anchor being drug along the campaign trail.
So it isn't just policy that we're talking about. It is candidates, and party decisions. Again, you may not like to hear it, but that's what I lived through. Ultimately I'm glad I left a couple of decades ago, because I'd hate to have been even remotely associated with W's horrid 8 years, but I miss the old Republican party.
What I've heard so far is a lot of the talking heads saying things along the lines of stopping with earmarks they would have strangled Clinton over, responsible spending, return to small government--in short, the Republican party needs to start acting like the Republican Party. While I'm glad Obama was elected over McCain, one of the reasons is that it forces the conservative right to re-access the last 8 years in a more objective and honest context while realizing how far from their roots they have grown.
The party seems very divided today right now. There's the religious, lunatic, legislate-my-moral-view points, and then there's the more rational pre-Robertson party that has been discussed. One will be the party Sarah Palin-type party, and the other will likely move away from that.
It should be interesting. Just as I think the Democratic party has moved its focus more toward the middle to succeed, I think the Republican party will do the same.
At least, I hope they go away from the extreme right/culture war garbage. That is tearing our country apart.
Where Do Republicans Go from Here? Michael Tomasky on the Future of the GOP
Peace
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
Yeah, that's not going to help them win. Never mind how I feel about the issues, I don't see that being a productive strategy for the Republicans.
hopefully we'll see a strong moderate, inclusive republican party in the future, that would be a good thing, and in many a person's opinion a pipe dream, lol
Stop by:
http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=14678777351&ref=mf
bitter, party of one ......... now serving bitter, party of one
"I don't believe in damn curses. Wake up the damn Bambino and have me face him. Maybe I'll drill him in the ass." --- Pedro Martinez
Me too.
But even if they are not as fiscally conservative as I want them to be (they never will be) I still wouldn't vote for the other party which we KNOW won't be fiscally conservative.
And I'm not saying you did do that.
...are those who've helped us.
Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
Clickity click click
Very true...they should be happy. It could've been like 2000, where the results of the election were in doubt. At least here they got creamed, so there could be no such confusion.
hee hee hee hee
"I don't believe in damn curses. Wake up the damn Bambino and have me face him. Maybe I'll drill him in the ass." --- Pedro Martinez
the party has turned to nasty tactics and if they want to come back to the Reagan glory days they need to stop.
nasty isn't even the right word.
stop the lying
stop the coverups
stop behaving like bullies on the playground.
seriously, that's one reason why mcCain lost my vote.
i'm not saying Dems don't do it too, but the Reps have taken it to a whole new level.
What a great and honest rant jeffbr. You have had a wealth of first hand experience. It would be great if a few here would take to heart and mind your wise observations.
i saw RELIGULOUS tonight and it reminded me of what has happened to the rep party.
the world has changed. they are killing themselves by not changing with it.
i'm not saying turn Dem. but their party needs a serious overhaul.
As for the future of the Republican party, I believe the reaction to their recent standing as right-wing radicals compared to their prior basis of conservatism will shift back. Who knows who will represent that shift, but I think they will do so and if Obama and the Dems show signs of failure or inefficiency, they will use it against them and claim they're back to their original roots of conservatism and traditionalism. If they go in any other direction, they really have poor strategists and haven't learned their lessons from what wins elections - illusions of what they represent, not necessarily what you do. McCain lost because of this - he couldn't separate himself enough from Bush-like policies and politics and it cost him. It is very refreshing that our society voted in a black president and shows progress, but I think at the end of the day, we could have just as easily be sitting here discussing the first woman president in Hillary because it's more a reflection of Republican failures and lack of changing their image compared to people really loving Obama and what the Dems offer in comparison.
Just my 2 cents.
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
a better ticket could have won them this election.
http://www.myspace.com/brain_of_c
Politics are like a pendulum ... one party is in charge, ultimately abuses its power and pisses people off, then the other party gets a shot.
All the Republicans generally have to do is sit around and wait for the Democrats to piss off most of middle America -- which might happen sooner, rather than later, given that the Dems also control both houses of Congress -- and then they'll be back in power again. For a while, anyway.
for the least they could possibly do
P.S. Hi there! How are ya? Any new mishaps with mystery meds?