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neil young/skynyrd bash

DiRtyFranK38DiRtyFranK38 Posts: 3,131
edited August 2007 in Other Music
i think neil young is a great musician.
never liked skynyrd at all.

just out of curiosity though, how come in the dreadful 'sweet home alabama' that is on the radio 24/7, there is the line "well i heard ol' neil put her down. well i hope neil young will remember, a southern man don't need him around, anyhow" or something like that. what happened between the two? or what did uncle neil do to piss of skynyrd?
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  • normnorm Posts: 31,146
    "Sweet Home Alabama" was an answer to two controversial songs, "Southern Man" and "Alabama" by Neil Young, which were critical of social conditions in the South. "We thought Neil was shooting all the ducks in order to kill one or two," said Ronnie Van Zant at the time (Dupree 1974).
    Van Zant's musical response, however, was equally controversial, with references to Alabama Governor George Wallace and the Watergate scandal. Despite (or perhaps because of) the debate, the song has become one of the most popular examples of Southern rock. It reached the top ten of the US charts in 1974 and was the band's second hit single

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sweet_Home_Alabama_%28song%29
  • DiRtyFranK38DiRtyFranK38 Posts: 3,131
    cutback wrote:
    "Sweet Home Alabama" was an answer to two controversial songs, "Southern Man" and "Alabama" by Neil Young, which were critical of social conditions in the South. "We thought Neil was shooting all the ducks in order to kill one or two," said Ronnie Van Zant at the time (Dupree 1974).
    Van Zant's musical response, however, was equally controversial, with references to Alabama Governor George Wallace and the Watergate scandal. Despite (or perhaps because of) the debate, the song has become one of the most popular examples of Southern rock. It reached the top ten of the US charts in 1974 and was the band's second hit single

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sweet_Home_Alabama_%28song%29

    thanks for letting me know.

    neil is miles better of a writer. he truly is a poet. and he's a beast at the guitar. never liked skynyrd and that song just iritates me.
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  • PissBottleManPissBottleMan Posts: 4,154
    Comments from Patterson Hood (of DBT): "I wrote this song to tell of the misunderstood friendship between Ronnie VanZant and Neil Young, who were widely believed to be bitter adversaries, but were in truth very good friends and mutual admirers."

    Ronnie & Neil:

    "Church blew up in Birmingham
    Four little black girls killed for no goddamn good reason
    All this hate and violence can't come to no good end
    A stain on the good name.
    A whole lot of good people dragged threw the blood and glass
    Blood stains on their good names and all of us take the blame

    Meanwhile in North Alabama, Wilson Pickett comes to town
    To record that sweet soul music, to get that Muscle Shoals sound

    Meanwhile in North Alabama, Aretha Franklin comes to town
    To record that sweet soul music, to get that Muscle Shoals sound

    And out in California, a rock star from Canada writes a couple of great songs about the
    Bad shit that went down
    "Southern Man" and "Alabama" certainly told some truth
    But there were a lot of good folks down here and Neil Young wasn't around

    Meanwhile in North Alabama, Lynyrd Skynyrd came to town
    To record with Jimmy Johnson at Muscle Shoals Sound
    And they met some real good people, not racist pieces of shit
    And they wrote a song about it and that song became a hit

    Ronnie and Neil Ronnie and Neil
    Rock stars today ain't half as real
    Speaking there minds on how they feel
    Let them guitars blast for Ronnie and Neil

    Now Ronnie and Neil became good friends their feud was just in song
    Skynyrd was a bunch of Neil Young fans and Neil he loved that song
    So He wrote "Powderfinger" for Skynyrd to record
    But Ronnie ended up singing "Sweet Home Alabama" to the lord

    And Neil helped carry Ronnie in his casket to the ground
    And to my way of thinking, us southern men need both of them around

    Ronnie and Neil Ronnie and Neil
    Rock stars today ain't half as real
    Speaking their minds on how they feel
    Let them guitars blast for Ronnie and Neil"

    PBM
    "We paced ourselves and we didn't rush through it and we tried to be as creative as our collective minds would let us be over some course of time instead of just trying to rush through a record"

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  • scot88scot88 Posts: 217
    DiRtyFranK38 wrote:
    thanks for letting me know.

    neil is miles better of a writer. he truly is a poet. and he's a beast at the guitar. never liked skynyrd and that song just iritates me.
    hahaha, dude, the guitar solos and riffs in most skynyrd songs shit all over neil's playing. just listen to the freebird solo, and the lead guitar in that smell. neil simply cannot compare.

    i enjoy both, but i have to say, i like skynyrd a hell of a lot more than neil.
  • tybirdtybird Posts: 17,388
    PissBottleMan wrote:
    Comments from Patterson Hood (of DBT): "I wrote this song to tell of the misunderstood friendship between Ronnie VanZant and Neil Young, who were widely believed to be bitter adversaries, but were in truth very good friends and mutual admirers."

    Ronnie & Neil:

    "Church blew up in Birmingham
    Four little black girls killed for no goddamn good reason
    All this hate and violence can't come to no good end
    A stain on the good name.
    A whole lot of good people dragged threw the blood and glass
    Blood stains on their good names and all of us take the blame

    Meanwhile in North Alabama, Wilson Pickett comes to town
    To record that sweet soul music, to get that Muscle Shoals sound

    Meanwhile in North Alabama, Aretha Franklin comes to town
    To record that sweet soul music, to get that Muscle Shoals sound

    And out in California, a rock star from Canada writes a couple of great songs about the
    Bad shit that went down
    "Southern Man" and "Alabama" certainly told some truth
    But there were a lot of good folks down here and Neil Young wasn't around

    Meanwhile in North Alabama, Lynyrd Skynyrd came to town
    To record with Jimmy Johnson at Muscle Shoals Sound
    And they met some real good people, not racist pieces of shit
    And they wrote a song about it and that song became a hit

    Ronnie and Neil Ronnie and Neil
    Rock stars today ain't half as real
    Speaking there minds on how they feel
    Let them guitars blast for Ronnie and Neil

    Now Ronnie and Neil became good friends their feud was just in song
    Skynyrd was a bunch of Neil Young fans and Neil he loved that song
    So He wrote "Powderfinger" for Skynyrd to record
    But Ronnie ended up singing "Sweet Home Alabama" to the lord

    And Neil helped carry Ronnie in his casket to the ground
    And to my way of thinking, us southern men need both of them around

    Ronnie and Neil Ronnie and Neil
    Rock stars today ain't half as real
    Speaking their minds on how they feel
    Let them guitars blast for Ronnie and Neil"

    PBM
    Beat me to it. :D
    All the world will be your enemy, Prince with a thousand enemies, and whenever they catch you, they will kill you. But first they must catch you, digger, listener, runner, prince with the swift warning. Be cunning and full of tricks and your people shall never be destroyed.
  • DiRtyFranK38DiRtyFranK38 Posts: 3,131
    PissBottleMan wrote:
    Comments from Patterson Hood (of DBT): "I wrote this song to tell of the misunderstood friendship between Ronnie VanZant and Neil Young, who were widely believed to be bitter adversaries, but were in truth very good friends and mutual admirers."

    Ronnie & Neil:

    "Church blew up in Birmingham
    Four little black girls killed for no goddamn good reason
    All this hate and violence can't come to no good end
    A stain on the good name.
    A whole lot of good people dragged threw the blood and glass
    Blood stains on their good names and all of us take the blame

    Meanwhile in North Alabama, Wilson Pickett comes to town
    To record that sweet soul music, to get that Muscle Shoals sound

    Meanwhile in North Alabama, Aretha Franklin comes to town
    To record that sweet soul music, to get that Muscle Shoals sound

    And out in California, a rock star from Canada writes a couple of great songs about the
    Bad shit that went down
    "Southern Man" and "Alabama" certainly told some truth
    But there were a lot of good folks down here and Neil Young wasn't around

    Meanwhile in North Alabama, Lynyrd Skynyrd came to town
    To record with Jimmy Johnson at Muscle Shoals Sound
    And they met some real good people, not racist pieces of shit
    And they wrote a song about it and that song became a hit

    Ronnie and Neil Ronnie and Neil
    Rock stars today ain't half as real
    Speaking there minds on how they feel
    Let them guitars blast for Ronnie and Neil

    Now Ronnie and Neil became good friends their feud was just in song
    Skynyrd was a bunch of Neil Young fans and Neil he loved that song
    So He wrote "Powderfinger" for Skynyrd to record
    But Ronnie ended up singing "Sweet Home Alabama" to the lord

    And Neil helped carry Ronnie in his casket to the ground
    And to my way of thinking, us southern men need both of them around

    Ronnie and Neil Ronnie and Neil
    Rock stars today ain't half as real
    Speaking their minds on how they feel
    Let them guitars blast for Ronnie and Neil"

    PBM

    interesting. then why would they say something dissing neil though.
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  • tybirdtybird Posts: 17,388
    DiRtyFranK38 wrote:
    interesting. then why would they say something dissing neil though.
    Have you never dissed a friend in jest? You know....yanked their chain??

    BTW, this fine state, Alabama, is not full of racist pieces of shit or KKK members or church bombers or stupid rednecks. A few apples made the whole barrel look bad.
    All the world will be your enemy, Prince with a thousand enemies, and whenever they catch you, they will kill you. But first they must catch you, digger, listener, runner, prince with the swift warning. Be cunning and full of tricks and your people shall never be destroyed.
  • PissBottleManPissBottleMan Posts: 4,154
    It's that duality of the Southern Thing. ;)

    PBM
    "We paced ourselves and we didn't rush through it and we tried to be as creative as our collective minds would let us be over some course of time instead of just trying to rush through a record"

    Wishlist Foundation: http://wishlistfoundation.org
  • waves roll inwaves roll in Posts: 159
    Like it was said before Ronnie thought Neil was putting down everyone in the south, as opposed to just the evil ones. They eventually become good friends and Neil says that Sweet Home Alabama is one of his all-time favorite songs. Like PBM was saying DBT especially on the Southern Rock Opera album go into their relationship a lot. I am a huge Neil Young fan as well as a huge Lynyrd Skynyrd fan. You should look into Ronnie's lyrics more on other songs not just Sweet Home Alabama. He is truly a poet as is Neil. This new Tribute band they call Lynryd Skynyrd that plays now is terrible in my opinion and it makes the original Skynyrd from the past look bad. They should not use the Skynyrd name with I believe it has one surviving member from the original band. The original Skynyrd from the 70's was magical. Anyways I digress...
  • JOEJOEJOEJOEJOEJOE Posts: 10,483
    This was a precursor to the east coast / west coast rap feud!
  • merkinballmerkinball Posts: 2,262
    It's covered in this podcast too:

    http://www.lyricsundercover.com/

    Episode 65 (the top one) looks at Southern Man & Sweet Home Alabama

    And Neil did tag the chorus to Sweet Home Alabama onto the end of Southern Man on his show on 11/12/77 too, as a nod to Ronnie's passing.
    "You're no help," he told the lime. This was unfair. It was only a lime; there was nothing special about it at all. It was doing the best it could.

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  • tybirdtybird Posts: 17,388
    ....and other parts of the song are also tongue in cheek......Birmingham and its county (Jefferson) were never carried by Wallace in any of his gubernatorial races...except maybe 1982 when he had 90%+ of the black vote statewide. Birmingham would have been a majority black city by then, but not the entire county.
    All the world will be your enemy, Prince with a thousand enemies, and whenever they catch you, they will kill you. But first they must catch you, digger, listener, runner, prince with the swift warning. Be cunning and full of tricks and your people shall never be destroyed.
  • merkinballmerkinball Posts: 2,262
    And there's also this from the great analysis on this subject over at Thrashers Wheat:

    So were Neil and Skynyrd were really friends or foes? If you look closely at the cover photo of the last Lynyrd Skynyrd album "Street Survivors", you can see Ronnie Van Zant wearing a Neil Young "Tonight's the Night" album cover t-shirt.

    Or, as Fred Mills puts it in his book review of Lynyrd Skynyrd: Remembering The Free Birds Of Southern Rock by Gene Odom, "[Ronnie Van Zant would] just as soon go onstage wearing one of several Neil Young T-shirts that he owned in order to fuck with any yahoos in the crowd who missed the humor and irony of the “Sweet Home Alabama” lyrics."

    And Kenny C. posted on the comments another interesting t-shirt observation: In the concert film "Rust Never Sleeps", Billy Talbot, the Crazy Horse bass player, is wearing a Lynyrd Skynyrd t-shirt! It's the Skynyrd shirt that looks like a Jack Daniels whiskey label. Just something else to ponder...


    It seems that whatever grudges Lynyrd Skynyrd had for Neil's music may have been resolved - if there ever was any feud to begin with. From an interview with Ronnie Van Zant:

    "We wrote Alabama as a joke. We didn't even think about it - the words just came out that way. We just laughed like hell, and said 'Ain't that funny'... We love Neil Young, we love his music..."

    http://www.thrasherswheat.org/jammin/lynyrd.htm
    "You're no help," he told the lime. This was unfair. It was only a lime; there was nothing special about it at all. It was doing the best it could.

    http://www.last.fm/user/merkinball/
    spotify:user:merkinball
  • Scratchin a LetterScratchin a Letter Posts: 2,303
    merkinball wrote:
    If you look closely at the cover photo of the last Lynyrd Skynyrd album "Street Survivors", you can see Ronnie Van Zant wearing a Neil Young "Tonight's the Night" album cover t-shirt.
    That's right.. it's rumoured that van Zant was buried in it.
  • brain of cbrain of c Posts: 5,213
    scot88 wrote:
    hahaha, dude, the guitar solos and riffs in most skynyrd songs shit all over neil's playing. just listen to the freebird solo, and the lead guitar in that smell. neil simply cannot compare.

    i enjoy both, but i have to say, i like skynyrd a hell of a lot more than neil.


    redneck.
    d'oh!!!!!!

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  • tybirdtybird Posts: 17,388
    brain of c wrote:
    redneck.
    Hater
    All the world will be your enemy, Prince with a thousand enemies, and whenever they catch you, they will kill you. But first they must catch you, digger, listener, runner, prince with the swift warning. Be cunning and full of tricks and your people shall never be destroyed.
  • intodeepintodeep Posts: 7,228
    merkinball wrote:
    And there's also this from the great analysis on this subject over at Thrashers Wheat:

    So were Neil and Skynyrd were really friends or foes? If you look closely at the cover photo of the last Lynyrd Skynyrd album "Street Survivors", you can see Ronnie Van Zant wearing a Neil Young "Tonight's the Night" album cover t-shirt.

    Or, as Fred Mills puts it in his book review of Lynyrd Skynyrd: Remembering The Free Birds Of Southern Rock by Gene Odom, "[Ronnie Van Zant would] just as soon go onstage wearing one of several Neil Young T-shirts that he owned in order to fuck with any yahoos in the crowd who missed the humor and irony of the “Sweet Home Alabama” lyrics."

    And Kenny C. posted on the comments another interesting t-shirt observation: In the concert film "Rust Never Sleeps", Billy Talbot, the Crazy Horse bass player, is wearing a Lynyrd Skynyrd t-shirt! It's the Skynyrd shirt that looks like a Jack Daniels whiskey label. Just something else to ponder...


    It seems that whatever grudges Lynyrd Skynyrd had for Neil's music may have been resolved - if there ever was any feud to begin with. From an interview with Ronnie Van Zant:

    "We wrote Alabama as a joke. We didn't even think about it - the words just came out that way. We just laughed like hell, and said 'Ain't that funny'... We love Neil Young, we love his music..."

    http://www.thrasherswheat.org/jammin/lynyrd.htm

    you beat me to it i was about to pull up this page and put the same shit on here.

    I mean neil wrote powderfinger for them to do but it just did not work out that way so neil recorded it.
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  • intodeepintodeep Posts: 7,228
    scot88 wrote:
    hahaha, dude, the guitar solos and riffs in most skynyrd songs shit all over neil's playing. just listen to the freebird solo, and the lead guitar in that smell. neil simply cannot compare.

    i enjoy both, but i have to say, i like skynyrd a hell of a lot more than neil.

    Well hard to argue with a personal opinion, but my opinion differs greatly :)

    As for guitar playing their are many folks out there that have better chops then neil on guitar. That said those who love his playing generally love it for the feeling neil evokes with that playing. Neil really is good at setting a tone for his songs and his solo's can be simple one note solo's (cinnamon girl) but still sound awesome.

    I mean the feeling he evokes on songs like Cortez the Killer and Like a Hurricane are awesome to me.

    So yeah maybe the guys in Skynard can play "better" but neil plays with a purpose to me and that is what i love about him.

    As for lyrics... man it is not even close neil can pump out some lines that will just hit me right in the heart.

    Skynard.... not so much a couple songs maybe but i could name off the top of my head if i had to 20 neil songs that just are special to me.


    But i'm not downing your opinion i just disagree... A LOT :D
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  • scot88scot88 Posts: 217
    intodeep wrote:
    Well hard to argue with a personal opinion, but my opinion differs greatly :)

    As for guitar playing their are many folks out there that have better chops then neil on guitar. That said those who love his playing generally love it for the feeling neil evokes with that playing. Neil really is good at setting a tone for his songs and his solo's can be simple one note solo's (cinnamon girl) but still sound awesome.

    I mean the feeling he evokes on songs like Cortez the Killer and Like a Hurricane are awesome to me.

    So yeah maybe the guys in Skynard can play "better" but neil plays with a purpose to me and that is what i love about him.

    As for lyrics... man it is not even close neil can pump out some lines that will just hit me right in the heart.

    Skynard.... not so much a couple songs maybe but i could name off the top of my head if i had to 20 neil songs that just are special to me.


    But i'm not downing your opinion i just disagree... A LOT :D

    my post was in response to someone who said neil was a "beast at the guitar." sorry, but when i think of a "beast at the guitar", one note solos don't really cut it.

    different strokes i guess.
  • Oh, JimmyOh, Jimmy Posts: 957
    scot88 wrote:
    my post was in response to someone who said neil was a "beast at the guitar." sorry, but when i think of a "beast at the guitar", one note solos don't really cut it.

    different strokes i guess.

    He was a beast on the guitar. He would just bash the hell outta the thing, pouring his heart and soul into it. But no way could he stand with Skynyrd in that field. The way their parts interweave is just magical.

    Skynyrd and Neil rank about the same in my list of faves.
  • geniegenie Posts: 2,222
    DiRtyFranK38 wrote:
    thanks for letting me know.

    neil is miles better of a writer. he truly is a poet. and he's a beast at the guitar. never liked skynyrd and that song just iritates me.

    neil young hasn't got any good tunes, i don't care for his lyrics, the only song i like of neil young is " heart of gold"

    as for LYNYRD SKYNYRD THEY KICK ASS!!!!!!!!! don't you dare to put them down when i'm here!
  • waves roll inwaves roll in Posts: 159
    intodeep wrote:
    Well hard to argue with a personal opinion, but my opinion differs greatly :)

    As for guitar playing their are many folks out there that have better chops then neil on guitar. That said those who love his playing generally love it for the feeling neil evokes with that playing. Neil really is good at setting a tone for his songs and his solo's can be simple one note solo's (cinnamon girl) but still sound awesome.

    I mean the feeling he evokes on songs like Cortez the Killer and Like a Hurricane are awesome to me.

    So yeah maybe the guys in Skynard can play "better" but neil plays with a purpose to me and that is what i love about him.

    As for lyrics... man it is not even close neil can pump out some lines that will just hit me right in the heart.

    Skynard.... not so much a couple songs maybe but i could name off the top of my head if i had to 20 neil songs that just are special to me.


    But i'm not downing your opinion i just disagree... A LOT :D


    Well first of all it is spelled Skynyrd and not Skynard. Second of all the guitar players from Lynyrd Skynyrd play just as much from the heart. Ronnie's lyrics are incredibly deep as are Neil's. I am a huge fan of both but can't help getting a little worked up when people judge something but don't really open their minds and dig a little deeper. Skynyrd is more than just free bird and sweet home alabama. Ronnie's and Neil's lyrics and mindset are very similar as to living a simple life, anti-racism, etc. People sometimes just look at Skynyrd as some "redneck hillbilly" band but it is not the case at all. They were showing a completely different side of the south. A side I bet you would agree with. Saying that Neil is incredibly amazing as well and his songs are very very special.
  • geniegenie Posts: 2,222
    scot88 wrote:
    hahaha, dude, the guitar solos and riffs in most skynyrd songs shit all over neil's playing. just listen to the freebird solo, and the lead guitar in that smell. neil simply cannot compare.

    i enjoy both, but i have to say, i like skynyrd a hell of a lot more than neil.

    that's right bro! :D
  • intodeepintodeep Posts: 7,228
    Sorry for the spelling their name wrong.

    I never knew someone could feel that passionate about Lynard Skynyrd. Their songs never really resignated with me on a level that Neil's have.

    For the record i have listened to more then just the radio songs.

    They just don't do it for me. Oh well.
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  • Evacuation RulesEvacuation Rules Posts: 2,162
    genie wrote:
    neil young hasn't got any good tunes

    You're on crack.
  • geniegenie Posts: 2,222
    JWBusher wrote:
    You're on crack.

    haha, i wish
  • reversedarwinismreversedarwinism Posts: 1,151
    Skynard has a few good songs, but they are mostly goofy redneck rock anthems. Rednecks that are casual music listeners always claim to love Skynard, of course.

    Neil Young, on the other hand, is a beautiful musical force that has blessed our life time. Most people who get deep into music tend to go through a Neil period and it lives in you forever. HE IS A BEAST ON GUITAR, but it is the emotion he puts into it that makes his guitar so much more powerful. I submit that no one, no band has a music catalog as dense with truely beautiful songs. Seriously, there is no comparison I've ever been exposed too. I could go on and on, but this big-foot is as close to a musical god as we'll ever know.

    Don't get me wrong, Skynard is good. The rednecks that hail them for all the wrong reasons is annoying. They are good, but no comparison at all to Neil.
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  • Evacuation RulesEvacuation Rules Posts: 2,162
    genie wrote:
    haha, i wish

    I rest my case.
  • soulsingingsoulsinging Posts: 13,202
    DiRtyFranK38 wrote:
    interesting. then why would they say something dissing neil though.

    you never talked shit or argued politics with a friend?

    i prefer lynyrd skynyrd to neil by a mile. it's a shame their fans have to be such douchebags in many cases and give the band a bad name.
  • Oh, JimmyOh, Jimmy Posts: 957
    reversedarwinism wrote:
    Skynard has a few good songs, but they are mostly goofy redneck rock anthems. Rednecks that are casual music listeners always claim to love Skynard, of course.

    Neil Young, on the other hand, is a beautiful musical force that has blessed our life time. Most people who get deep into music tend to go through a Neil period and it lives in you forever. HE IS A BEAST ON GUITAR, but it is the emotion he puts into it that makes his guitar so much more powerful. I submit that no one, no band has a music catalog as dense with truely beautiful songs. Seriously, there is no comparison I've ever been exposed too. I could go on and on, but this big-foot is as close to a musical god as we'll ever know.

    Don't get me wrong, Skynard is good. The rednecks that hail them for all the wrong reasons is annoying. They are good, but no comparison at all to Neil.

    Most casual music fans like the Beatles and Zeppelin but you cant take that away from them. What does the kinda fan have to do with the music.


    Neil has put out tons of good music, but he has put out alotta shit too.
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